Athlon xp 3000 or p4 2.6 (or maybe somethin bettr)

By sabenfox
Dec 17, 2003
Topic Status:
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  1. hey, after christmas i plan on building myself a new compuer. Right now i have a athlon xp 2000 with an 80gig (7200rpm) 256 megs of pc2100 and a g4 ti4200 (128 meg). Anyways i was looking at the different prices on pricewatch for a mobo and cpu combo and i couldn't figure out what to get. I was looking to spend somewhere around $200 dollars. This would either get me an athlon xp 3000 or a pentium 4 2.6. I read a review on toms hardware that didn't seem to appealing for the athlon xp. Plus i can't help but to think that the athlons are limited to the 400mhz fsb while the p4 is double that. So what do you guys think i should do ?
  2. sabenfox

    sabenfox Newcomer, in training Topic Starter Posts: 69

    ok i was just reading about pci express coming out around march of 2004, should i just wait till then before i decide to upgrade...

    I want a computer that will kill the games coming out in 2004, but all and all around a $1200 price tag...

    ..and i can build the system myself (since it comes out somtimes this way)
  3. Charles Hammond

    Charles Hammond Newcomer, in training Posts: 164

    The last time I went to www.intel.com they were predicting 2nd quarter 2004. I imagine there will be a pretty penny to pay for a new PCI express video card when they first come out.

    SATA drives are not even automatically recognized by motherboards at this point. I dought if new drives will work right for a completely new technology. Let someone else be a beta tester (Unless you want to send me free hardware to test - Hint Hint).
  4. Scol

    Scol Newcomer, in training Posts: 140

    What kind of hardware are you planning to put in there in terms of RAM? Are you just doing a facelift of your old system, or are you shopping to build a complete new system?

    Depending on your tastes (and your preference to volume and temperatures), you could go for a P4 2.4C @800FSB. I have heard good things about the overclockability of these to 3.2Ghz. A good ASUS board should suit you fine, unless you want to go top of the line in getting the ABIT IC7 or whatever it is.

    As for AMD, I see little value in getting a XP3000 or 3200. Though FSB and cache are a step up, you could go budget by getting an XP2500 and overclocking it 3200 speeds (2.2Ghz). As with all AMDs, you will have to consider your cooling solution (Heatsink/Fan and tower circulation). XP2500's go for about $80+. As for advisable motherboards, I'd go ASUS A7N8X deluxe or maybe ABIT... just as long as you go nForce2. Are you doing dual channel RAM? If not, get a cheaper KT600 board.

    If you have in mind another upgrade (since you're anticipating PCI-express), you might as well not go top of the line since you're going to be out of date within such a short matter of time. Don't expect PCI-express to become mainstream right away as it will take some time to seep into the market.


    Have fun shopping around for your options.
  5. sabenfox

    sabenfox Newcomer, in training Topic Starter Posts: 69

    ok, thank you for all the information you provided, i think i'll swing torwards the way of a p4. I'm thinking around a 2.6 with 512 megs of ddr
  6. Scol

    Scol Newcomer, in training Posts: 140

    Sounds good. What kind of case are you throwing it all in?
  7. Steg

    Steg Newcomer, in training Posts: 422

    bah heretic! you dare betray the name of AMD? for an intel?
    ok ok sorry
    just my $0.02 is that i would go with the AMD, the chips and mobos are generally cheaper and you always get greater bank for your buck. 2500+ overclock well, VERY well in some cases (3.0ghz with some monster water cooling) but they do require careful planning to cool properly

    Steg

    p.s. DO NOT be tempted by the devil that is intel. Stay with the light. Stay with the 'underdog'. Stay with AMD!

    p.p.s before anyone asks i have nothing actually BAD to say about intel - amd just seem better in more or less every way - apart from encoding videos....
  8. sabenfox

    sabenfox Newcomer, in training Topic Starter Posts: 69

    As far as the case goes i have a standard case that i'm going to use, it looks nice and has like a 400wat power supply in it. Maybe after a little bit of time i can save up for a nice Xaser case ;).

    And as far as the whole AMD VS Intel thing. I am swinging to intel not for the basis that they are like the top dog or anything, it is merely a matter of performance. I went to tomshardware and compared both of them, and the p4 seemed to me to be the better cpu. Also i can overclock the p4 2.6 to about a 3 gig too or so.

    Btw can anyone tell me what the difference is between a
    pentium 4 2.6 and a 2.6c

    If i don't get the c will i not be able to overclock or what ?
  9. CAG

    CAG Newcomer, in training

    As for AMD vs. Intel for gaming, you might want to read this http://the-inquirer.com/?article=13187 . But if you can wait until around March-April '04, Intel will be launching its Grantsdale and Alderwood chipsets with PCI Express, Matrix Raid (a combination of Raid 0 and Raid 1), DDR-II memory, and ICH6. By that time, 3.6GHz Prescotts should be around as well as a line of ATi graphics cards compatible with PCI Express. Personally, I'd wait because the whole computing landscape is going to change pretty drastically over the next 4-6 months.
  10. CAG

    CAG Newcomer, in training

    I have a P4 2.6C . The "C" denotes that it has 800 MHz FSB, uses DDR SDRAM memory @ 400MHz, and has Hyper Threading. The 2.4C, 2.6C, 2.8C, 3.0C, and 3.2C all use the i865P/i875P chipsets. Of the lot, the 2.4C is probably the most "over-clockable" and there's a guy over at the Intel forum here http://www.intelforums.net/index.php that's OC'd his 2.4C to 3.0GHz.

    The P4 2.6 is the older version which has 512 MHz FSB and no Hyper Threading. I don't know if it can OC'd.
  11. BrownPaper

    BrownPaper Newcomer, in training Posts: 467

    for i865 boards, the abit is7 is a very fast board. pretty cheap at around $100 USD. for 875p, the abit ic7 (my board) has PAT and registered memory if you need it. the is7 also has PAT, under the name GAT (other manufacturers have different names), that can be enabled in bios but it is unstable on most people's system. the bundle included with both abit boards kinda suck however.

    the asus offerings are good as well. almost every 875p and 865pe are good in their own right. you could hardly go wrong picking a board from the major name brand manufacturers if you are deciding to go intel.
  12. Vehementi

    Vehementi TechSpot Paladin Posts: 3,199

    OMG.

    Please, anyone reading this thread, do not take seriously ANY piece of information present in this thread. I have not read 1 unbiased opinion, and 70% of the "facts" in this thread are seriously messed up...

    At least you go the pricing down alright. The P4 2.6C is $20 cheaper than the 3000+.

    OK I guess I'll start here.

    1.) Yes, good job reccomending ASUS or ABIT! There are other good system board manufacturers, but ASUS and ABIT are a good start! :rolleyes:

    2.) The cache on the Athlon XPs and Pentium 4s are both the same, 512K. The FSBs on XPs and P4s are very different. The P4C is 800MHz and the original is 533MHz. How are either of those a step down from 266, 333, or 400MHz? Granted FSB is not an exact science with things like double, quadruple, pentruple etc. pumping, but still.

    3.) No matter how hard you try, you will never be able to get a 2500+ up to 3000+ speeds. That is an overclock of 400MHz, on an AMD. Possible with conventional means, but not one of you are capable enough to do so. I doubt any of you have any business overclocking anyway (read my Sticky thread in this forum)
  13. Vehementi

    Vehementi TechSpot Paladin Posts: 3,199

    OK, I kind of expected better. Fanaticism won't get you anywhere, especially when you've made it up that one processor manufacturer is just so much better than the other one you would run off and have a little tantrum because he's considering buying one over yours. Yes, Intel is the Devil and AMD is what, Jesus?
    No, you will never ever see a 1.8GHz AMD overclocked to 3GHz. Maybe 3000+ speeds, but not REAL 3GHz. I incredibly doubt it even with something like Vapochill or Prometeia.
    No processor is better than the other one, they each have their ups and downs.
    Then in your last little comment you try to back out and not support everything you just said. Probably because someone told you AMD was better, and you just assimilated that knowledge, and aren't sure of your knowledge of CPUs enough to stand up for what you believe in. I bet you have no substantial evidence to back it up too.
    Don't just tell someone something is better by insulting them and acting like your product is so much better than the other that it's blatantly obvious which to choose. Present both sides of the argument, show substantial proof to back it up, and reasonably reccomend one of them to someone.
    I suppose you're one of those people who believes where reason fails, volume more than makes up for it :rolleyes:
     
  14. Vehementi

    Vehementi TechSpot Paladin Posts: 3,199

    OH! OH! OH MY GOD!
    Any straight-shooting n00b who doesn't even know what

    But your information about the C notation in Pentium 4s seemed to be reasonably correct.

    That's all I'm picking on in this thread. Most of the other stuff is dumbfounded gibberish that only leaves me wondering at the source of, but I don't have the tolerance to comment.

    I just wish some of you n00bs would actually do some research before interjecting your opinion, since all you're doing is offering false information for those who really are trying to research and make a good decision.
  15. Mictlantecuhtli

    Mictlantecuhtli TechSpot Evangelist Posts: 4,916   +9

    By then there'll be other things coming after that, maybe you'll want those?

    If you just want to wait until the Next Big Thing™, you'll be waiting forever. The development isn't going to wait for you.
  16. Scol

    Scol Newcomer, in training Posts: 140

    I think you misread my post. The 2nd paragraph is entirely about AMDs. I don't compare AMD to Intel with that paragraph in terms of the FSB. I'm talking about the XPs at 333FSB compared to the XPs at 400FSB (XP2500 is 333, where 3000 and 3200 are at 400).

    I'm well aware that P4 is at 400, 533, and 800 FSB. I'm not that much of a noob with computers.


    As a matter of fact, I did overclock my AMD XP2500 to 2.2Ghz (XP3200 clock speed). Very simple. (200x11) and viola! Stable 2.2Ghz.

    You know instead of flaming people, why don't you just calmly and politely make corrections?
  17. sabenfox

    sabenfox Newcomer, in training Topic Starter Posts: 69

    ok now for my last question....
    I thought i posted this already but i tried to find it and couldn't.
    As far as motherboards go, i have two choices, they are..

    MSI 648F-Neo (AGP8x - DDR PC3200 - Audio - LAN)
    and
    ECS 648FX-A (AGP 8x - 3 DDR 3200/2700 - AC97 Audio - 4 USB - LAN - ATX)

    the msi is $20 dollars more, but if it's worth it i don't mind spending the extra 20.
  18. Scol

    Scol Newcomer, in training Posts: 140

    Hmmm... are those your only choices? How much are they priced at and where are you buying them? Retailer, or e-tailer?
  19. sabenfox

    sabenfox Newcomer, in training Topic Starter Posts: 69

    i'm getting them off of pricewatch. There isn't really another choice unless i want to spend more then the extra $20. This is the chart they ahve

    ECS 648FX-A (AGP 8x - 3 DDR 3200/2700 - AC97 Audio - 4 USB - LAN - ATX)

    ASUS P4P800 (8X/4X AGP - 4 DDR PC3200 DUAL CHANNEL - 6 CH AUD - LAN) [add $70.06]

    Abit IS7-E ( 8X/4X AGP - 4 DDR PC3200 DUAL CHANNEL - 6 CH AUD - LAN) [add $52.60]

    Asus P4S800 (AGP8x - 3 DDR3200/2700 - 6 CH Audio - LAN - 6 USB) [add $30.46]

    Abit IS-10 (Int. Video - 2DDR PC3200/2700 - 4 USB - LAN) [add $43.00]

    MSI 865 Neo2-LS (AGP8x - 4 DDR PC3200 - 6 Ch. Audio - LAN - ATX) [add $59.80]

    MSI 648F-Neo (AGP8x - DDR PC3200 - Audio - LAN) (Recommended) [add $19.39]

    The ECS board is the one that comes in the deal by default. I'd prefer if i didn't have to spend too much over the default mobo they have listed (as money is tight)
  20. farmer

    farmer Newcomer, in training Posts: 81

    Sabenfox, your talkin' about the heart and soul of your system here. A little bit of extra $ spent on a mainboard can make a big difference in setup, performance, and stability in general. The Asus and Abit are probably the most used solutions for the P4c's. You can find tons of support on the internet if you run into problems. Just my 2cents here...

    Vehementi, what is your thing with n00bs and OC'ing? Everyone is a n00b at some point, and should be encouraged, not ripped open and told how dumb they are. I say tell them the risks involved, and let them rip. Answering their questions isn't all that hard...

    :grinthumb
  21. Greeno

    Greeno Newcomer, in training Posts: 394

    Whoa?! Who took the jam out of your Doughnut Veh?

    I'm not saying your wrong, infact I quite agree with most of what you're saying, I just can't help but there is maybe is a right and wrong way of portraying our views.
  22. Charles Hammond

    Charles Hammond Newcomer, in training Posts: 164

    Everything does not boil down to just price. Be careful about any site that tells you add $999 for this or that. Often they charge more for the choices you make than what the choices are worth. This is because they want to lead you in a specific direction because they want everyone to order the some thing. They want to encourage their choice, because it makes them the most money. If you think about it, it only makes sense. If everyone can be sold the same thing, then by ordering in mass quantities they can get the price even lower.

    I have also met people who like to build computers with only Intel Motherboards for the P4 processor. Granted on average they are more expensive and can not be overclocked. However, they are designed to be more stable. They give up a little speed for this stability, but stability and quality are important qualities for a computer.
  23. Elcarion

    Elcarion TechSpot Paladin Posts: 188

    My $.02 worth. I have a P4 2.4c overclocked to 3.0Ghz. My wife's computer is an Athlon XP 2500+(Barton) overclocked to 2.2 Ghz (Athlon XP 3200+) speed. Both systems have Zalman heatsinks. The Barton is the clear bang-for-the-buck winner but the P4 is faster especially if you can take advantage of hyperthreading. I'd be happy with either one.

    My motherboard brands of choice are Abit (mine), Asus, MSI, and Gigabyte (hers).

    Vehementi - chill dude!
  24. Scol

    Scol Newcomer, in training Posts: 140

    So true... bundle deals aren't always the best deals.

    Depending how computer savvy you are, you could find refurbished goods at lower prices... like the motherboard. If you're willing to buy the cables and screws, you could get a refurbished P4 board for cheap and just download the drivers online (its not like the choices you currently have on your list will come with much of a software bundle)

    I would put in the extra money for quality if I could. I'd pricewatch around for individual and bundle deals for what you're looking for. www.newegg.com has a good selection in terms of refurbished products, as well as their regular products. Always watch for sales there. www.monarchcomputer.com has a moderate selection, but the prices seem a little higher for their refurbs.

    As I said, I would only recommend going for refurbs if you're a little more savvy in terms of computers, otherwise, go for the retail package.


    EDIT:

    Though pricier than your standard, other good board manufacturers are Soyo (rich in features), and if you're not gonna be doing much with your ish in terms of overclocking, you could go Intel.
  25. Steg

    Steg Newcomer, in training Posts: 422

    just defending my own name - indeed some guy DID get the 2500+ to 3.0Ghz - at about 2 volts with some serious watercooling - the benchmarks were quite incredeble.
    Yeh i admit fanatisim wont get me anywhere - i was in an odd mood - soz
    ok ok admitied the Intel P4'c's do overclock well and do a good job of totally outstripping the athlons

    Steg
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