ATI 9700 Radeon & MSI KT4V probs

By Mr.Fork
Jun 23, 2003
  1. I'm about 2 hours from throwing this piece of crap out the window and reinstalling my old GeForce 3 video card. I've NEVER had a problem with ANY GeForce card like I'm now having with this ATI piece of expensive sheit.

    I've just installed an ATI 9700 pro but it's not been a smooth transition. I'm running XP on an Athlon 1600+CPU, MSI KT4V with the VIA KT400 chipset. I'm getting Windows "Write Behind" errors with the latest ATI regular or CATALIST 3.5 drivers. I'm also using the latest VIA drivers, bios updated, and my coffee is now getting cold.

    Any idea WTF is happening? Not getting much help with google searches.
  2. Vehementi

    Vehementi TechSpot Paladin Posts: 2,704

    You probably didn't uninstall your old drivers correctly. This guide should help you out.
  3. acidosmosis

    acidosmosis TechSpot Chancellor Posts: 1,350

    Be patient. 99% of the time, literally, the problem is something very simple with the 9700 Pro. I know from personal experience and others experiences. Once you fix that one simple problem then you will have one of the most powerful video cards on the market at your disposal. That card outperforms almost every card out there right now so be proud that you have it. The problems are almost NEVER ATI's but rather your motherboard, AGP settings, Windows installation, etc.

    One large problem is AGP settings. Go into SmartGart under Display, and Advanced and turn AGP settings to off and fast write off. Reboot. Does the problem persist? If it is fixed then move the AGP settings up by one, reboot and try again. Use the highest setting possible. If your MB says it is 8X but you can't run SmartGart at 8x then the sad but true result is that your motherboard isnt correctly supporting 8X most likely.
  4. PreservedSwine

    PreservedSwine TS Rookie Posts: 325

    (2) different driver sets? What are the latest ATI "regular" drivers you've tried?:confused: :confused:
  5. Nic

    Nic TechSpot Paladin Posts: 1,549

    ATI 9700 is a pain in the but and causes more problems for users than any other graphics card out there. I've already returned one such card, though I'll probably try again with a 9800 sometime soon. If that doesn't work either, then I'll be giving ATI the boot.
  6. PreservedSwine

    PreservedSwine TS Rookie Posts: 325

    How much did you pay, I didn't think the R9700 was considered that expensive anymore, now that the R9800PRO256 and 5900Ultra are close to $500 bones. The Good old R9700 just perfoms like an expensive card, w/out costing as much as one:cool:

    As far as your problem, any chance you've been tweaking your system cache settings?

    What is the Large System Cache Tweak: Well if you press Windows Button + Pause/Break or right-click My computer and then properties or go to Control Panel/System.
    Here you select the Advance Tab, then in the performance square press settings. Here you select the Advance tab once again. Here you can se two squares. In the lower on it says something like: Adjust for best performance for either Programs or Systemcache. Change it to Systemcache, default is Programs.

    If you've been tweaking w/ this option, it may lead to a write behind error as well. Change it back to the default (Programs) seting.
  7. Mr.Fork

    Mr.Fork TS Rookie Topic Starter Posts: 26

    Thanks PSwine for that tip. It stopped the "write behind failure" errors but now my video card is resetting the computer when ever I try 3DMark03 or any taxing D3D game. ARGH!

    Ya know, I've NEVER had problems like this with any NVIDIA videocard. Resetting the computer - you gotta have real screwed up drivers to do that.

    Ok, what could possibly be causing the video card to reset the computer? Anyone have a guess? (It's not my powersupply. :) )
  8. PreservedSwine

    PreservedSwine TS Rookie Posts: 325

    I would try upping the AGP voltage a tenth of a volt in your BIOS. I usually don't think it's needed, but you may want to re-format and give yourself a fresh install as well. Most R9700 installs go quite smoothly. If it's not a hrdware problem, You may have some lingering files on your system that are cauing your issues.

    I doubt it a driver problem, ATI's drivers are top-notch these days. It seems to be the first thing people want to blame, but it's hardly ever the case. Good luck

  9. Mr.Fork

    Mr.Fork TS Rookie Topic Starter Posts: 26

    Hi PS. Sorry mate, that doesn't work. I've even tried using older versions of their drivers without luck. You are right, it's a driver issue, not a hardware one. But it's the driver that's not working with the hardware. :)

    The ATI drivers are NOT top-notch these days however. I've visited dozens of forums trying to find help on my isssues and I'm not alone unfortunately.

    To reformat my machine is like chopping off my arm to fix a cut on my finger. I've spend about 40 hours now trying to get this card to work right and I'm running out of patience.

    Problem is, this card should just WORK. Every NVIDIA card I've had did. Plug it in, load drivers. Go play games. Simple thinking right. With ATI it's, plug in drivers, experience hardware failes, spend hours fixing hardware failures from ATI card, play games, find new problems. Uninstall & reinstall drivers, different drivers, different card settings, change AGP settings, change voltage. I've had enough.

    As a result I'm selling my ATI card and will probably never buy another ATI product again as long as I own a computer. Pity, this card when it worked ROCKED. :(

    Thanks all for your help.

  10. Nic

    Nic TechSpot Paladin Posts: 1,549

    If you just bought your card, then you should be able to get a refund as it obviously isn't working as it should.

    Unfortunately I just bought a Radeon 9800 Pro, despite sending back a Radeon AIW 9700 Pro previously as it didn't work. If this new Radeon 9800 Pro gives me the same crap, I won't be buying ATI ever again, much like yourself.
  11. PreservedSwine

    PreservedSwine TS Rookie Posts: 325

    Bummer to hear that. But if you aren't willing to wipe the slate clean, maybe you should stick to consoles. Blankly blaming a companies drivers for your problems seems to miss the mark. The problem may well be some old Nvidia driver files you've been unable to rid your computer of, or some funky tweaking gone awry. Have you run some Det. Destroyer, and some other clean-up programs? Or any other video- card or help forums? If you're going to use different GPU hardware often, it would be a good idea to know how to fully remove many of the leftover .inf files both ATI and Nvidia leave behind.

    On another note- it sounds like you're woe-fully unprepared for a hard-drive crash. If re-formatting seems like too much of a pain now, and spending FORTY HOURS trying to get a video card working is a better option than re-formatting, I STRONGLY suggest you start making some back-ups. Your hard drive WILL crash, it's only a matter of when. Additionally, it makes re-formatting, and re-installing your programs and O/S a relative breeze. Better to be prepared for when it happens. And it will make cleaning out corrupted files a relative breeze.

    And, yes, there are still the uneducated masses who will still say ATI's drivers are not up to par, relying on truths of 2-3 years ago, but these are generally the same folks who wouldn't know an .inf from .dll, and beleived that the NV30 was going to handily outperform the R9700. Fact is, ATI's drivers for the R9700 are as good, and IMO much better than Nvidia's latest generation drivers. Of course, they should be, since the R3X core has been out nearly a year now, while Nvidia has not had much time w/ its Nv3x line-up.

    Anyway- do you need links to some good Nvidia driver removal programs, or have you alredy tried that?
  12. Mr.Fork

    Mr.Fork TS Rookie Topic Starter Posts: 26

    I got a few nice registry editing programs from another forum and followed a FAQ on how to remove my NVIDIA drivers (Det Destroyer doesn't work with XP). I checked the registry and directories for NVIDIA drivers.

    I am going to try two things. First, a larger power supply. Although my ENERMAX is a great power supply, 350 Watts may not be enough. I've got a blower, front case fan, hard drive fan, two hard drives, a burner, and a CD ROM running off the power supply. Throw in a power hungry video card, and a questionable MSI motherboard, and presto, reboots during power crunches.

    Second, try a clean install. If the issue is still there, I'll replace the motherboard.

    I am pretty sure this is not one issue, it's a combination of several. Poor power management from MSI, power hungry ATI, and ATI/VIA driver clashes.

    I guess I should look at it that this video card costs 3 X as much as my motherboard and above everything else, my motherboard should get the boot before my awesome video card. Thanks for your insight PS. I'll stick with the ATI for a little while longer.
  13. PreservedSwine

    PreservedSwine TS Rookie Posts: 325

    Have you tried running in AGP4x instead of AGP8x? I've heard the KT400 chipset can be a little touchy, and it seems to solve some stability issues for some. But I think you're on the right track by starting w/ a clean slate:)

    Good luck:grinthumb
  14. Mr.Fork

    Mr.Fork TS Rookie Topic Starter Posts: 26

    PS: I can do a lot of setting changes that reduce the rebooting issue. For example, turning off fast writes, use 3.4 catalist drivers, and use 4x: each reduces the rebooting issue by a certain amount.

    Turning down the clock speeds help too. It seems that the less that I tax the card the better it runs which points to a motherboard/powersupply problem.

    I think I'm going to try a larger power supply first, then a OS reformat.
  15. Dantrag

    Dantrag TS Enthusiast Posts: 135

    try checking your virtual memory or cach settings i've had the same problem with my geforce4mx440 and it was my virtual memory in windows. but the kt-4 is touchy so don't just blame ati i've had a lot of probs with nvidia.
  16. Mr.Fork

    Mr.Fork TS Rookie Topic Starter Posts: 26

    Hi all. Problem fixed.

    It wasn't the virtual memory settings. It wasn't the AGP port. It wasn't Direct X or the Catalist drivers. It wasn't the KT400 chipset, it wasn't the VIA drivers, and it wasn't the power supply.

    It was MICROSOFT'S FAULT. After reformatting my harddrive, I reinstalled XP, and PRESTO, card work like a charm.

    Bastiges! :)
  17. dani_17

    dani_17 TS Rookie Posts: 146

    Glad you fixed it. I bought a 9700 today. I didn't have any problems as you said. Maybe it's because the card I had installed before was a Radeon 8500. I just switched boards and start UT2003 . Awesome graphics and even better speed!!

    I almost bought the r9800 but the price difference is too much.
  18. petebelero

    petebelero TS Rookie

    I have the same setup

    PC with kt4v and 9700pro....

    I installed everything yesterday on a fresh WinXP install, but today I had 2 shutdowns in 1 hour... One ShutD 5 minutes after boot up and one while playing Dungeon Siege...

    Case and CPU temp : normal.... What the hell?

    Only the board is new; I bought it at the suggestion of a salesman, but now i have doubts! WinXP did not even register an abnormal shutdown and that too is weird.


    PS: I use a 420w PowerSupp, so thats not it either
  19. Mr.Fork

    Mr.Fork TS Rookie Topic Starter Posts: 26

    I solved my problem by returning the card RMA. It's a pain in the *** to loose your card for 2-3 weeks so try to return it to where you bought it.

    Here's what I tried to eliminate all possibilities:
    a. Try turning off FAST WRITES in the motherboard AND in the Control Panel
    b. Turn down the AGP to 4x in the control panel.
    c. Install OMEGA'S drivers instead of the standard ones from ATI.

    If A, B, and C doesn't fix your problem, then you're snafued.

    It sounds like you need to return your card. A shutting down of your computer is pointing to a bad GPU on the ATI card. The motherboard doesn't allow halting on errors in the bios anymore so you can't control it when it experiences a video card error. It'll shut down your computer.

    That's how I fixed my problem. Returned and replaced the forking card.

  20. petebelero

    petebelero TS Rookie


    :grinthumb I just tamed my Radeon 9700pro.:grinthumb

    For those of you who can't get the card to work correctly, I have a way. I underclocked my card by 25% and nothing ever blew up since. It's still running THREE times the Fps that my old Radeon 7500 does, and I gained top stability.

    I used the freeware Radeonator 2.0 (its hard to find but free, maybe ?) to underclock my Graphic card. You can set profiles (like hardware profiles in NT) so it adopts different speeds depending on what game or application you are running.

    Tha advantages are numerous; its a windows-based utility, it affects your card immidiately -dynamically-, you can set HardWare profiles, lock the screen size, and BEST of ALL.... You don't need to disable fast write or 8X (I PAID for that!) or play in the BIOS.

    Please tell me if this info helped any of you.:blush:
  21. turkey turner

    turkey turner TS Rookie

    raddy 9800pro and the kt4vl mobo

    hey all while not having any where near your level of difficulties with this combo i would like to ask a question. 1 what cpu's u run and 2 what are your 3mark2k1/2k3 scores. i use the kt4vl mobo a 2100+ amd @ 133fsb and a raddy 9800pro. im getting 12300/5276 respectively witgh the progs mentioned. i feel that the card is underperforming greatly in 2k1 i had my old raddy 8500le out performing my 9800pro in the 8.1games in high detail when the 8500 was clocked to about 300/300 the 9800 is 378/338 espectively (default) so what is going on it seems rediculous that the 8500 could beat the beast now residing in my pc.

    what do u guys think?

    o and any1 notice that when u first put the card in with the older drivers 1 the agp wasnt actice (but i still got 12200) 2. the agp rating under 2k1 was at 2x (when smartgart said 8x). now i have 3d2k3 in dx9.0b and the latest gpu drivers in its giving me 12,300 in 3dmark2k1 telling me agp is active (dxdiag) and reading at 8x in 2k1.

    i turn up quality settings on the control panel and see negligable performance drop same when i turn aa to 4x its like the card is running with 4xaa on regardless.
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