TechSpot

GeForce4 4400

By VoodooHellfire
Mar 19, 2002
  1. Okay all, didn't think this warranted news on the main page, but thought I'd let everyone know that I picked up a PNY Verto GeForce4 4400 over the weekend. Really great card. Couple of issues that I've seen so far.

    First, overall length of the card. I'm running an Asus A7V Motherboard and the end of the card actually rests on the ribbon cable coming out of one of my ATA100 controllers. Nvidia dogged 3dfx for the length of the V5 5500 (which I also owned) and now they are doing the same thing. Eh.

    Second, PNY bundles those 3d glasses with this card. Horrid hardware. Really bad strobing. There's no way I'd actually play a game with these things on!

    Other than that, well worth the $300(US) I paid for the card. My 3dmark scores are in the low 5000's though, but that probably has more to do with the fact that I'm running a Tbird 800 (200Mhz FSB).

    If anybody else picks up either the 4400 or the 4600, I strongly recommend downloading the tech demos that Nvidia has on their site. It will really show you what your card can do. Last thing. For some reason I'm topping out at about 70FPS in UT avg. Not sure if it's a CPU issue or Vsync or what. I've seen the topic floated before, but never saw a definite resolution. Any help or ideas would be cool.

    BTW, here's the specs on my system.
    ASUS A7V
    AMD Tbird 800 MHz (200FSB) (not OC'd)
    512 PC133 SDRAM
    3 Hard Drives, one on the ATA100 Controller (you don't want to know)
    SBLive! Value (Soon to be replaced with an Audigy)
    No modem installed (been using Cable for last 3 years)
    oh, and last but not least....PNY Verto GeForce4 4400 (stock)
     
  2. Arris

    Arris TS Evangelist Posts: 4,601   +110

    Welcome to 3ds 3ds Editor

    Reinstall UT for a start if you've switched video cards...

    Check out GeForce4 ti 4400 slow frame rate from further down the page ;)

    As we moderators like to say "Search feature is your friend"
    Check signature for details :)

    When are you planning to upgrade that Athlon 800? It will be limiting your GF4 something rotten. UT is quite CPU intensive so I don't know if you'll get much more fps out of your system as it is.

    Check out my post on this page of this thread. There is a graph linked in that shows the limitations of a GF2 with < 1300Mhz Athlons. Here I will post it here:Tomshardware Geforce2 scaling analysis article
     
  3. Didou

    Didou Bowtie extraordinair! Posts: 5,899

    You should definitly get a better CPU for that card. Its extra power over the GF3 & GF2 cards is definitly untapped with such a processor.
     
  4. uncleel

    uncleel TS Rookie Posts: 1,145

    :wave:Welcome & Hello VoodooHellFire:wave:

    Aren't you from the old 3Dfx forum?
     
  5. Arris

    Arris TS Evangelist Posts: 4,601   +110

    Possibly but he is also Tim, one of 3ds news editors :haha:
     
  6. VoodooHellfire

    VoodooHellfire TS Rookie Topic Starter Posts: 50

    Yes, I am one of the 3DS editors, and yes, I used to be on the 3dfx forum, stopped frequenting them when they became 3dfx vs Nvidia flame wars all the time. I went from a Voodoo (1?) to a Voodoo3 3000 to a Voodoo5 5500, upgraded to Win XP, which forced a dual-boot to 98 to be able to do any gaming on the Voodoo 5. A friend was nice enough to donate a GeForce 2 GTS to me and I just upgraded that to the GeForce4 4400. So, if anyone would like to donate an AMD XP Processor and compatible Mobo to my cause to get adequate performance, I would be grateful.:grinthumb

    Anyways, I saw the other posts about disabling Vsync and that doesn't seem to be the fix, so I thought I'd bring it up again. I seem to get around 90+FPS in Quake 3, but haven't figured out the whole demo thing so it's hard to get an average.

    Any help on that note would be appreciated too.

    Hellfire
     
  7. Arris

    Arris TS Evangelist Posts: 4,601   +110

  8. bslenter

    bslenter TS Rookie

    PNY 4400

    Good review VoodooHellfire. Recently I picked up the same card. I was equally impressed with the Nvidia tech demos, and was thrilled when they updated their website with the actual 3d demos instead of just the movie files. Did you try the GF3 demos as well (Zoltar, Chameleon)? They recently posted the real demos for those too. Zoltar is a huge download though... Chameleon is probably the most impressive, especially on a GF4 at high rez with Quincunx on...

    I've had mixed experiences with the 3d glassses. They work pretty good on that Nvidia logo demo which is launched from the 3d glasses control panel. I really tripped out when the Nvidia logo came about 6 inches out of my monitor towards my face. But it works *worse in games. Also it's a pain to get a good refresh rate in XP. Glasses work in Quake 3 for example, but there's all kinds of clipping errors. The only game it's worked well in so far is a Boarder Zone demo I have (that obscure snowboarding game from a few years back).

    Overall this card freakin rocks! All my games are cranked to very high rez, full color, all effects, and quincunx, and i'm getting 60 frames min.

    (*edited by mod)
    bslenter, You have elected not to recieve Private Messages or Email. Therefore this is your Public Notification not to use profanity.
     
  9. VoodooHellfire

    VoodooHellfire TS Rookie Topic Starter Posts: 50

    Okay, seeing as we're all in agreement that my CPU is holding back my GPU, I'm looking to upgrade just the CPU at the moment. I really don't feel like replacing CPU, Mobo and RAM simultaneously! Question is (and yes, this should probably be in the mobo section) will the A7V which does not have a 266FSB, only 200FSB, support a Tbird 1.4GHz 266FSB? I would assume it would be essentially underclocking (sort of), although the eventual clock speed would be the same, I'm not sure if the FSB set on the board can be 200MHz and then just multiply up from there and have the CPU support it. Any help would be appreciated.

    VoodooHellfire
     
  10. Arris

    Arris TS Evangelist Posts: 4,601   +110

    I think someone answered this recently. I think it was uncleel.
    You cannot run a 266fsb Thunderbird in a 200fsb motherboard, only the other way round i.e. 200fsb Thunderbird in a 266fsb motherboard.

    The only way your likely to get more out of that system is to get a 1Ghz AXIA or AYJHA stepping Thunderbird which can be overclocked to at least 1.3 with reasonable air cooling.

    Also your Asus motherboard has Frequency stepless selection so you could try a little fsb overclock. Depending on your components you should be able to get your 100 fsb (200 ddr) to 110 (220 ddr). I'm not sure if you can alter the clock multiplier via dip switches or the BIOS since my A7M266 has no way of doing this :(

    Check out www.overclockers.com , they have a good CPU database and have the Thunderbird 1Ghz AXIA listed at 1500Mhz with air cooling...
     
  11. Walker

    Walker TS Rookie

    Got it from Tim

    I got the GF2 ultra tim took out of his machine. Thing keeps rebooting my machine or locking it up..Grr..welp guees i need to figure it out...

    :(
     
     
  12. Arris

    Arris TS Evangelist Posts: 4,601   +110

    Wanna add your system specs and make this a thread on its own...?
    What did you have in your system before?
    Plug and Play is a bit of a falicy with Geforce cards. You really need to follow this guide
    Otherwise you can end up with very strange driver issues.
    But if you post your PC spec so all different issues with motherboard and PSU can be ruled out I will make this into a separate thread.
     
  13. Didou

    Didou Bowtie extraordinair! Posts: 5,899

    The Athlon 1.4 GHZ can be found with unlocked L1 bridges, allowing you to run it @ 1400 ( 14*100 ). Even with cut bridges, the pencil trick will work fine on it.

    The A7V ( which I had ) was based on the KT133 chipset, so there's no way it's gonna work with an FSB above 110.
     
  14. Arris

    Arris TS Evangelist Posts: 4,601   +110

    So why do you suggest the 1.4Ghz? Does it come in a 200fsb version?

    I again say that his best bet is a 1Ghz Thunderbird AXIA stepping and overclock it by multiplier. That way he will get the most out of his current system.
     
  15. uncleel

    uncleel TS Rookie Posts: 1,145

    Of course, Tim "VoodooHellFire" Baker, but sure took his sweet time posting 'eh ;)

    Knew that tag sounded familiar :D
     
  16. VoodooHellfire

    VoodooHellfire TS Rookie Topic Starter Posts: 50

    Oh, I see...it's "dog the editor":D Anyways, there are 200FSB versions of the Tbird 1.4 out there. They're listed on pricewatch and on Ebay, so I know they exist, just trying to get the most 'bang for the buck' without gutting the system and then rebuilding. I mean, a GeForce 4 4400 getting mid 5's in 3dMark2001SE is kinda sad.
     
  17. Arris

    Arris TS Evangelist Posts: 4,601   +110

    Its a dog eat dog world *groan*

    I wasn't aware of the availability of the 1.4 200fsb. Goes to show that no one knows everything ;)
    Good luck getting hold of one. My GF3 and 1.4Ghz@1.5Ghz(143fsb DDR) gives me 6511 in 3dmark2001 so you should get at least that or higher with any luck...
     
  18. SuperCheetah

    SuperCheetah TS Rookie Posts: 868

    Yes AMD does make a 200FSB for the 1.4G processor. The downside is that not many are made and the price is higher for one of these than it is for a 1.4 @ 266FSB. The prices are 85 dollars for a 266FSB and 95 dollars for a 200FSB from www.pricewatch.com or 3dspotlight.pricegrabber.com respectively.

    Only question is, does VoodooHellfire's mobo support such high processor speeds??? Hmm, after checking it seems like it only supports up to a 1G processor. Guess Arris was right about just getting a good stepping one and O/C that bad boy to the max!
     
  19. Arris

    Arris TS Evangelist Posts: 4,601   +110

    That said Asus have an awful habit of leaving their motherboard details out of date. For instance my A7M266 is listed as supporting ~1Ghz+ but mentions nothing about XP. But the BIOS update available says that it adds AMD XP support...
    Its maybe worth VoodooHellfire's while to put a post in the forum asking if anyone is running the A7V with > 1Ghz 200fsb processor...
    But if it can't be confirmed that it can take the 1.4 then the 1Ghz is the right choice as Supercheetah explains.
     
  20. VoodooHellfire

    VoodooHellfire TS Rookie Topic Starter Posts: 50

    "Hey, what's this search button do?" "Hey..that's pretty cool!!"

    I found by doing a search that Didou had posted a link to www.a7vtroubleshooting.com . According to that site, the a7v supports up to a 1.4Ghz FSB200MHz. Has to be jumpered, not through SoftBIOS.

    Also, not sure if anyone else has experienced this with Nvidia cards that are bundled with 3d glasses, but after installing the 3d glasses, quite a few of the 3d demos and screensavers off of Nvidia's site seem to crash or freeze the system. Seems as though those demos, although really nice in the "eye candy" department aren't coded for efficiency. They take forever to start and forever to let go of your system. Anyways..still very happy with the card.
     
  21. Walker

    Walker TS Rookie

    geesh

    Tim you of all people should know that its possible to put something over a 1g on that boeard. I have the same board and have a 1.1 @ 1.25 on it..Geesh..Anyways Dog the old man all you guys want he secretly like it when people Dog him... LOL:grinthumb
     
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