IEEE 1394 port can it support TCP/IP?

By kirock
Aug 30, 2005
  1. I was trying to set-up a home network so my second computer (upstairs) can access the network through ICS via my new gaming rig. My mobo is a MSI K8N Neo4 SLI Platinum with 2 LAN ports. On is Wavell LAN and other is 1394.

    The Wavell is working correctly and is currently connected to internet through my ISP cable modem. The 1394 will NOT configure for this because I get a Windows message saying TCP/IP not activated on this network connection.
    The properies window shows the TCP/IP protocol and it IS checked. I can set auto detect IP or I can set it to with subnet as instructed from web site about setting ICS network on the 1394, but it's like Windows doesn't recognize this.

    My OS is XP SP2. I've not used 1394 before so not sure if it supports TCP/IP.
    The two computers are connected via a cross-over cable. The upstaris computer (also XP, but no SP2 yet)is all set with the workgroup and set to auto detect IP etc.

    Any suggestions, or am I barking up the wrong tree with the 1394 port?
  2. jobeard

    jobeard TS Ambassador Posts: 9,151   +598

    IEEE 1394 (Firewire) requires a very special E X P E N S I V E cable and running it
    that distance will be prohibitive. Ethernet CAT5 cabling is typically ~$80/100 feet, and that's plenty enough.

    The easy (&cheap) solution is a router;
    modem-->router-->both PCs, both config'd to use DHCP.
  3. kirock

    kirock TS Rookie Topic Starter Posts: 1,221

    my stupid question

    Thanks Jobeard.

    I did learn after this post that 1394 is a data transmission protocol unto itself and therefore be definition can't be configured to TCP/IP.
    Sometimes I scare myself at how dumb I can be. :giddy:

    It would be nice to have a second firewire card in the comp upstairs and run cable but like you said very expense! That is why I don't want router/hub/switch, just something to have to buy.

    I do have a second ethernet card I can throw into my main computer and complete this little home network of mine.

    I'll close this thread tomorrow with how that went and if I learned anything.

    Cheers :wave:
  4. jobeard

    jobeard TS Ambassador Posts: 9,151   +598

    A wired connection would require a cable, NIC, and a router ($49).

    A wireless connection would require
    ... a wireless nic in the second pc
    ... and a wireless router (~$149)

    I would go with the latter.
  5. Nodsu

    Nodsu TS Rookie Posts: 5,837   +6

    Erm.. IP over FireWire is a well defined feature and quite widely used.. Even Windows will give you a IEEE1394 network device if you happen to have the thing on your computer.
  6. kirock

    kirock TS Rookie Topic Starter Posts: 1,221

    IP over Firewire?

    Nodsu, Jobeard,

    Explain the IP over Firewire please. My 1394 is part of mobo, " My network connections" see's the 1394 as a LAN and it enables the TCP/IP protocol. I can even go to properties and set it for IP etc.

    Then Windows XP Pro SP2 does it's magic and tells me TCP/IP is not set for this device. The property applet is "CHECKED" on.

    So at that point I had to figure it's its own protocol and not configurable to TCP/IP.

    Nodsu can you explain why I can't "activate" my 1394. Some stupid Windows thing or mobo drivers (which btw are brand new). I even looked into my BIOS to see if place to set there, but didn't find anything.

    I did get the whole ICS network thing running last night using an additional LAN card in the PCI port.

    Thanks guys for your help on this.

    Cheers :eek:
  7. Nodsu

    Nodsu TS Rookie Posts: 5,837   +6

    Something is wrong with your Windows settings. There is nothing special about the 1394 connection and it should behave just like any other netork interface.

    Have you set up any network bridges? Get rid of them. Better remove any ICS you set up too. You could try uninstalling the TCP/IP protocol and reinstalling it or reset the whole winsock system: . I suppose uninstalling the firewire device and reinstalling with latest drivers can't hurt either.

    Everything is a protocol. Even the electric signals in the wires on your motherboard are a protocol. The point is that different protocols operate on top of each other without caring what is above or below them.

    Ethernet is a protocol and you can run the IP protocol on top of it and you use TCP inside the IP protocol and you have HTTP messages going through the TCP connections and insite the HTTP packets you have a HTML document containing the protocol of royal funerals. And none of the other components care if you remove ethernet and replace it with firewire or a serial cable or whatever.
  8. jobeard

    jobeard TS Ambassador Posts: 9,151   +598

    1394 was intended as a FAST I/O channel for scanners and HDs. Kind of a
    replacement for SCSI and about 2x USB 2.0
  9. kirock

    kirock TS Rookie Topic Starter Posts: 1,221

    2X 1394 ports with IP, Doh

    Jobeard and Nodsu,

    I needed to have another 1394 on my computer upstairs!! I was trying to connect the 1394 port( downstairs comp) to the ethernet card on my upstairs comp. Sorry for the confusion, but thanks so much for your time and help. This explains why I could not "activate" the TCP/IP function, Windows knew it was not connected to another 1394 port!

    Below is from Microsoft site: :blackeye:

    Microsoft Windows Millennium Edition (Me) provides support for Internet Protocol (IP) networking over the IEEE 1394 bus. IP over IEEE 1394 does not require a network adapter, but can only be connected to other 1394 interfaces. You cannot directly connect a 1394 cable to an Ethernet hub.

    Windows Me requires an OHCI IEEE 1394 interface to enable IP over 1394. When the 1394 interface is installed, Windows Me installs the NDIS 1394 Net Adapter driver and is visible in Network Properties. This driver does not initialize until another IP-capable node is detected. An IP-capable node is any IEEE 1394 device that supports IP over 1394. When another IP-capable node is available on the 1394 bus, the driver is loaded and bound to TCP/IP. :unch:

    The following files provide IP over 1394 functionality:
    • Nic1394.sys

    Is an NDIS 5.0 miniport driver that is responsible for fragmentation and reassembly of data and performs input/output operations on virtual circuits. A virtual circuit is a connection to a memory address on a 1394 interface. There are three types of virtual circuits:

    • Channel VC (Broadcast)
    • Transmit VC
    • Receive VC

    • Arp1394.sys

    Provides Address Resolution Protocol (ARP), ARP caching, and Multicast Channel Allocation Protocol (MCAP), which facilitates multicast communication on the 1394 bus.

    • Enum1394.sys

    Is a WDM driver associated with IP-capable nodes. This file calls Nic1394.sys when the first IP-capable node becomes available on the 1394 bus. When the last IP-capable node is removed from the 1394 bus, Enum1394.sys initiates the shutdown of Nic1394.sys.

    • 1394bus.sys

    Is an IEEE 1394 WDM bus driver.


    Provides 1394 device enumeration.

    For more information on IP over IEEE 1394, refer to Request for Comments (RFC) 2734.

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