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Microsoft now blocks Windows 7 and 8.1 updates on Kaby Lake, Ryzen systems

By Scorpus · 187 replies
Mar 16, 2017
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  1. DAOWAce

    DAOWAce TS Booster Posts: 253   +38

    So.. this is illegal, right?

    Microsoft hasn't learned from their atrocious handling of forcing Windows 10 updates on people and keep doing atrocious shyte like this. I can't fathom what is going on in their corporate offices.

    The day I switch to Windows 10 is the day 7 is completely deprecated by software I use on a daily basis.. and that doesn't include games using a closed source graphics API. (Vulkan guys, use Vulkan instead, please)

    The OS is just a spy and adware infested nightmare with hardly any user control anymore. That's not what an operating system is.
     
    foxrox, Yynxs, DaveBG and 2 others like this.
  2. Squid Surprise

    Squid Surprise TS Evangelist Posts: 1,134   +430

    Well, this conversation is taking place on the Internet... So without some sort of link, anything stated is just someone's opinion.... If you're going to make outrageous claims, it would be nice if you could provide some sort of proof... Believing something posted on the Internet WITHOUT a supporting link would be even scarier I would think...
     
  3. Yynxs

    Yynxs TS Addict Posts: 202   +70

    Uh no. The concept in business is, in Professional Support, someone is making money off your product, you get to charge for that. The concept in Windows Pro is: You want more control of your operating system, you gotta pay for that.

    If your idea about Win Pro being designed for professional (read businesses) were true, then the game makers would have to include it in the cost of their games. The router and cable modem manufacturers would have to include it in the cost of their hardware and the cable companies and ISPs would have to capitalize the cost of upgrading everyone for security into the cost of their services.

    Windows Home has always been about getting the product out there for user acceptance. The same concept is used in Student copy of MS Office. After training the majority of the populace there is nothing else, then you start charging for 'enhanced' standard features.

    In business, there is a difference between Professional and Public. Windows does not follow that model.
     
    Raiderman likes this.
  4. DaveBG

    DaveBG TS Addict Posts: 251   +80

    Yet again the fact remains that the best windows is 7 installed from fresh ISO from 2013 and update service disabled. No spyware and not bummers like this one in this article.
     
    Raiderman, BSim500 and Yynxs like this.
  5. Yynxs

    Yynxs TS Addict Posts: 202   +70

    Not really. I'm expecting the hardware vendor to support the marketplace. In any normal business practice, the market is the driver, not the business partner.
    [​IMG]
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Operatingsystem_market_share.svg
    [​IMG] [​IMG]
    The 'billion' used by MS in their press releases is devices, not PCs and Win7 has a very very large part of the PC market because of it's standard interface, controllabiility, stability and usefulness.

    As I said in a previous post, this looks very much like unlawful monopolistic activity. I would love to see a State Attorney General quit kowtowing to the left's fascination with Trump's Tweets and get back to the law of the land, in this case, abuse of monopoly.
     
    Raiderman likes this.
  6. Yynxs

    Yynxs TS Addict Posts: 202   +70

    An odd thought just struck me. I wonder if the Russians are behind Microsoft's business practices? Before you go, "oh christ!" hear me out.

    Microsoft is very straightforwardly using the central government control of the product with government spying built in "for development information only, no personally identifiable information collected". Ostensibly, there is government approved disabling of that spying available for government approved organizations.

    Microsoft is running into all the problems central government control encounters.

    Microsoft is ignoring the normal and obvious solution to decentralize outside Microsoft because that relinquishes control to the masses.

    Microsoft is doubling down by blocking the previous uncontrolled users from improving their situation with new hardware and software that is not government approved through their application store.

    Has anyone checked Microsoft's internal network and emails to 'prove' the Russians aren't behind this. I think not.
     
    Raiderman likes this.
  7. Yynxs

    Yynxs TS Addict Posts: 202   +70

    Another thought as the caffeine titer rises....
    Didn't TSpot just indicate a desire for some staff?
    Didn't some of you make the CPUs indicated here work with Win7 and defeat the MBorg assimilation?
    Shouldn't one or more of you write an article of the step-by-step to achieve that?
    Maybe with some "legal department enhanced" editing TSpot would publish that article.?.
    Time for more coffee and I gotta phone my gtcomp.com to see if I can get a MB, CPU, RAM, GPU, PwrSup, and a couple of SSDs priced out to breadboard with when it's (hopefully) written.
     
    foxrox and Raiderman like this.
  8. Raiderman

    Raiderman TS Booster Posts: 67   +59

    That's the problem with kiddos these days. They don't appreciate good advice when they hear it. The addage, "who cares if it is collecting my data", will come back and bite you in the *** most assuredly. To simply ignore such an intrusion is mind boggling, as the desktop is the last best hope for true autonomy. Letting MS walk all over this is a horrible mistake by anyone.
     
    BSim500 and OldSchoolTech like this.
  9. OldSchoolTech

    OldSchoolTech TS Rookie

    Ryzen runs faster on windows 7 than on windows 10 right out of the gate. So much for the theory of being a better OS.....mythical better multicore support LOL. Those who just say move on I say yes, to a better OS which windows 10 definitely is not. Move on just because its new is just acting like sheep. Those who do so may have not the choice if you are operating any new mobile platform, but for desktop PCs the power user will always appreciate the freedom of customization and full control of this 9 yr old OS. Bottom line, windows 7 can run these new hardware fine but MS just refuses to permit that. That redefines what we all consider as support in terms of operating systems.

    Windows XP was not succeeded by Windows Vista because it was not a better OS and SP1 could not come soon enough. It was succeeded by Windows 7, the better OS in every way. Many of us are still waiting for the better OS to come because its sure not Windows 10.
     
    foxrox, BSim500 and Raiderman like this.
  10. OcelotRex

    OcelotRex TS Maniac Posts: 273   +151

    I have no idea what you are trying to say. What is true is that Windows has different software licenses for businesses, including Pro and an Enterprise Edition -

    https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windowsforbusiness/windows-product-home

    For home use users have 2 choices - Home and Pro. Pro allows control of updates so as it does not disrupt workflow. Home does not. Most people who complain of their render getting interrupted or their server restarting unexpectedly are running the wrong version - Home.
    Windows 7 had 6 different versions: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_7_editions
    • Starter
    • Home Basic
    • Home Premium
    • Professional
    • Enterprise
    • Ultimate.
    Your points are not valid and ignore the past.
     
  11. OcelotRex

    OcelotRex TS Maniac Posts: 273   +151

    So you fear your OS collecting data but to post here you're fine with Techspot, your email account, and your ISP collecting data on you...

    It's impossible to have an internet presence without having your data collected. Fear mongering over Windows 10 is laughable.
     
  12. Raiderman

    Raiderman TS Booster Posts: 67   +59

    I can guarantee having my email on techspot is not flowing data from my personal files or logging keystrokes. What a completey terrible analogy. What data does my ISP collect? The amount of traffic or data I use? Pffft
     
    foxrox and BSim500 like this.
  13. OcelotRex

    OcelotRex TS Maniac Posts: 273   +151

    I hope you don't use a Android or iOS device because they do the same thing - log your keystrokes. Your email and browser do as well from their default settings. You privacy concern is oddly specific against Windows and lax against everything else unless we're to believe you're some sort of luddite except with Microsoft Products.
     
  14. BSim500

    BSim500 TS Guru Posts: 256   +402

    Not all ISP's "collect data" (nor are data protection laws as weak in all countries as the USA), nor can they see encrypted stuff. Nor do ISP-provided non-advert funded e-mail accounts scan the contents of your communications. And unlike Windows, Techspot can only monitor pages viewed / comments made in your account (stuff you voluntarily make public), not act like a glorified keylogger for offline sensitive data / confidential documents (which a compromised by design OS like W10 certainly can).

    Now cue the usual "But... but... but... what about Android" to which the response is for many people, there's a BIG difference in expectation of behavior of production PC's vs consumption devices, ie, not having or wanting anything examine confidential medical / legal documents vs Google keeping track of how many cat video's the kids watch on a tablet. And even if they did, two wrongs don't make a right and a "race to the bottom" where everyone justifies ever worsening behaviour based on what someone else is doing is hardly in the long-term interest of the average consumer.

    The real "laughable" thing here is the mental acrobatics some people churn out to try and defend this cr*p with endless "whataboutery" diversion tactics that really don't work, plus the general inability to "see the forest for the trees" as to the general trend this is heading in.
     
    foxrox, Yynxs and Raiderman like this.
  15. Squid Surprise

    Squid Surprise TS Evangelist Posts: 1,134   +430

    Of course, you can go to Windows settings and disable all of this... I find it interesting that all you're interested in doing on these forums is spreading fear about Windows 10... I'll ask again - do you have any actual PROOF for your claims?

    Analogies between this and a car, by the way, are completely irrelevant... In the software/computer world, anything more than a few years old is generally obsolete - whether this is through artificial or natural means is besides the point. To hang onto an OS that is almost 8 years old is simply inane. Regardless of whether you "like it better", it will soon be obsolete and require you to upgrade - I suggest you do so while it's still free to do so (read up on the thread or use Google to see how).

    Yes, Windows 10's default settings enable it to gain a lot of your information - this is true of just about any modern OS on any platform... I once again refer you to Google to better protect yourself... On a brighter note, the soon-to-be-released Creator's Edition (AKA the new Windows 10 update or Windows 10.3) will reportedly make your information a little more private by default...
     
  16. OcelotRex

    OcelotRex TS Maniac Posts: 273   +151

    Well to prevent my ISP from collecting my usage data I need to purchase a commercial VPN or run my own. Turning off data collection in Windows 10 (the supposed keylogger) requires me to click a setting under privacy. That's some real "acrobatics" there.
     
    Squid Surprise likes this.
  17. Raiderman

    Raiderman TS Booster Posts: 67   +59

    Since you are so fond of links.
    https://www.google.com/amp/thehackernews.com/2016/02/microsoft-windows10-privacy.html?amp=1
     
    BSim500 likes this.
  18. BSim500

    BSim500 TS Guru Posts: 256   +402

    Only to see half of W10's privacy settings 'accidentally' auto-reenable on the next major update (witnessed it myself with Anniversary Update, as have others verified it). W10's privacy settings are unreliable by design and only the chronically naive believe it to be any different given MS's recent behavioral track record. And even if it weren't, yet again still two wrongs don't make a right regardless of how many other excuses of other businesses you can find. What your cr*ppy ISP does or doesn't do is utterly irrelevant as to nerfing core privacy in the OS itself. If someone wire-taps your phone, that's not an "open license" for everyone else to do whatever they please with your data.

    What I've noticed is that it seems to emotionally irritate W10 users more that a lot of people are "daring" to "defy" them and use something else, than it does those on W7 caring about the "I'm a low expectation consumer, therefore so must everyone else be" projection-based beliefs of a few technophile hyper-consumerist Forum Warriors who seem utterly obsessed with trying to live everyone else's lives for them...
     
    Yynxs and Raiderman like this.
  19. Squid Surprise

    Squid Surprise TS Evangelist Posts: 1,134   +430

    Lol... that was dated from February of LAST year!!

    Check your sources before you post... after receiving this flack about their OS, they released updates and allowed more control of your privacy settings... try some evidence from this year please :)

    Also... you might want to read the comments for your "source".... they kind of shoot it down pretty handily.... My favourite comes around halfway down and pretty much annihilates your article single-handedly :)
    ____________________

    [​IMG]
    Yannick Franssen
    ·
    Works at Greenyard Prepared Belgium
    I love how this is claiming that local network connections are telemetry-data related. Also, non of these "Port 80" connections are outgoing data. Windows can't do that by default, it will only receive data through port 80. And many of those others are just for DNS Teredo, the network status icon, activation services, etc. This test was literally manipulated so that Windows would make as much connections as possible in an as short time as possible. Honestly. If you don't activate Windows, it will go nuts trying to confirm the validity of your license causing it to try to connect with other IPs multiple times, many of the IPs in this list are just the activation servers. And there's nothing wrong with that. If I'm not sure, Windows performs a network connection test for the network icon in the system try at least every 30 seconds. So in the timespan of this "test", that on its own is already at least responsible for 960 connections over multiple IPs. And again, there is nothing wrong with that. The 94.245.121.253-IP, the #1 spot, is Teredo. Again nothing wrong with that.

    The laughs come around when you go to #3 and #4. When you get there, you should really be scratching your head to whether or not you should take this serious any further. The IP-addresses listed on #3 and #4 are respectively 192.168.1.1 and 192.168.1.255. Together making up for another 1232 connections in this test. Anyone with basic knowledge knows that this is just plain wrong (well, it's not wrong in that these connections where maid, it's wrong to what these connections are devoted). First of all, these are the first and last IPs within their range. Second of all, it's within the 192.168-range. That's a range for local networks. No internet required.

    Seriously, most of these connections can be reproduced on any other OS. Plenty of OS's connect with local connections, check for the network indicator, etc, etc. There's is absolutely nothing wrong with that.

    Not to mention that most of these connections that actually contain any serious data that is being send over secured connections.

    Not to mention that, unlike what this article claims, that Chees-guy did not changing anything about possible telemetry changes. He just performed a clean install.
     
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2017
  20. OcelotRex

    OcelotRex TS Maniac Posts: 273   +151

    Your that upset because of one known issue that required you to apply your preferences a second time? That's harsh considering that if we go back to the ISP issue any time your VPN fails in connection you are exposed. From my experience with Nord/KeepSolid/PIA this happens near daily, hence why I run it on individual machines and not at the router level. But your bias is clear - instead of preaching knowledge and privacy awareness you attack one company.
    That's a strong projection - you and your ilk are the emotional ones, spewing fear and misunderstanding. No one supporting Microsoft, Intel, or AMD is trying to tell you how to live your life. They're trying to explain how your level of entitlement has clouding your judgement into becoming the embodiment of petulance.
     
    Squid Surprise likes this.
  21. BSim500

    BSim500 TS Guru Posts: 256   +402

    As I said, what your cr*ppy ISP does is irrelevant. The fact you keep harping about "my ISP, my ISP, my ISP" like a one-trick pony shows you have no argument other than failed diversion tactics.

    You and Squid Surprise have posted what +20 posts each (over 40 between you over 6 pages), and have so far convinced absolutely no-one that they should stop caring about data privacy just because you are a "low expectation consumer" yourself. The more you continue to out-post almost everyone else combined, the more it looks like you're the ones with the real obsession... This is my 4th post here. You've done 20 (and regularly fill up almost every other W10 thread with the same "crusader" style of posting). Clearly my comment hit a raw nerve - I simply don't care that you run W10, yet it drives you berserk to see a lot of "people of our ilk" running W7, so really it isn't "my ilk" who has the unresolved anger issues as to how other people use their Personal Computers... ;)
     
    foxrox likes this.
  22. Squid Surprise

    Squid Surprise TS Evangelist Posts: 1,134   +430

    Except that this thread is about MS blocking updates on Kaby Lake and Ryzen.... it has nothing to do with privacy concerns... it's you and Raiderman who keep harping on it.... and have yet to provide a single shred of evidence to support your claims...

    It's amazing that we have to keep posting rebuttals to what is essentially a completely irrelevant topic change...
     
  23. OcelotRex

    OcelotRex TS Maniac Posts: 273   +151

    I continue to harp on it because it exposes your biases
    I run Windows 7, and 10, and FreeNAS, and Puppy Linux....Your worldview will not be confirmed.

    The crusade I am on is against fear mongering and ignorance. Citing privacy concerns in Windows 10 as a reason to not upgrade then dismissing every single other internet based service/software is a valid critique.

    Again I am not telling you how to use your personal computer. I am only shining light on your entitlement. Trying to criticize the number of posts I am making is sheer hypocrisy considering what you're projecting I am doing.

    As to why I post it's simple - I'm bored. I have a newborn and this is an easy outlet to relieve stress (that's right I am calm while you continue to get angrier). Once the weather improves and it gets warmer he'll go into the baby bjorn or stroller and then I'll be gone. [​IMG]
     
  24. cliffordcooley

    cliffordcooley TS Guardian Fighter Posts: 8,961   +3,151

    It's pretty easy to see that when Microsoft scans for processor information, of which has nothing to do with the said update being blocked from installation, that is a privacy violation whether anyone wants to disagree or not.
     
  25. Squid Surprise

    Squid Surprise TS Evangelist Posts: 1,134   +430

    Since when do you have the right to keep your CPU private? Especially when your CPU actually matters for your OS...
     

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