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NVIDIA/Futuremark statement re-issue

By TS | Thomas
Jun 18, 2003
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  1. Thanks to CorwinB over at beyond3d forums for this.

    Futuremark Statement

    For the first time in 6 months, FutureMark and NVIDIA have had detailed discussions on how to make the NV3x line of GPUs perform better than it should.

    After being bullied and strong-armed, Futuremark now has a deeper understanding of its interest, which is to let NVIDIA get away with cheating. In the light of this, Futuremark redefines "cheat" to "application specific optimization", but only as far as NVIDIA's drivers are concerned.

    Futuremark's perception of the world of 3D Graphics have changed dramatically with the latest cash incentive from NVIDIA. Just like for CPUs, each GPU maker has a different amount of cash available to buy independant benchmark makers. For example, if AMD gave us tons of cash, we would modify Futuremark's PCMark2002 to have Athlons run faster on it.

    3DMark03 was designed as as un-optimized DirectX test because we thought that was the only way to provide meaningful performance comparisons. Because NVIDIA couldn't produce quality hardware to save their life and cheated in our product instead, we felt obliged to update it instead of welcoming the cheating. Silly us !

    However, after threatening us with a lawsuit and offering us tons of cash to bend over and screw our end-users, NVIDIA suggested us that a different approach to game performance benchmarking might be needed, where NVIDIA-specific code path optimizations and clip-planes could be included directly in the code source, as opposed to having to be put in the Cheatonator drivers.

    NVIDIA Statement

    NVIDIA pays many developers to optimize games for GeForceFX, because its architecture can't compete without low-quality shaders and crap IQ. These optimizations (including lowering shader quality, arbitrary clipping plane and no Z-clearing) are the result of bribery and outright cheating and deception. This is the approach NVIDIA would have preferred also for 3DMark03.

    Joint NVIDIA-Futuremark Statement

    Both NVIDIA and Futuremark want to define 2 set of clear rules about benchmarks : one for NVIDIA, and one for the rest of the industry. We believe that those rules will prevent the kind of unfortunate situations where an NVIDIA crappy product is accurately described as such and will allow NVIDIA to further lie its way to the top.
     
  2. Steg

    Steg TS Rookie Posts: 269

    y is everyone making such a big fuss of this cheating thing? I seem to remember that when ATi pulled the same stunt there wasnt this much fuss - or this much piss taking

    I think that most people are just bitter - the nVidia can be chaught cheating and STILL lead the 3d market by a nice margin and it doesnt matter how much fuss they make ATi are still second....for the moment

    Steg
     
  3. TS | Thomas

    TS | Thomas TS Rookie Topic Starter Posts: 1,319

    Probably has been blown up a bit, but then again, 3D Mark is probably the most commonly used utility for benchmarking so it "is" a big deal when a company decides to misrepresent performance in it (& a 24% or so drop in performance after making some changes is certainly misrepresentative).

    Anyway, enough of that, I still think it's a hilarious post there.
     
  4. JackieChanIsGOD

    JackieChanIsGOD TS Rookie Posts: 61

    Yeah, that was really funny... hehe
    I've always liked ATi... one, they have great control over the card... two, they're from canada eh. My high school went to this technology thing in toronto and they gave us hats and stuff...
    Hats make the video cards perform better......
    :D:D

    uh... yeah... i don't like nVidia...plus, they're stupid for runining their relationship with MS... Now MS and Nintendo may have the same GPUs on the next systems, leaving nVidia in the shitter.... muhhahaha
     
  5. MrGaribaldi

    MrGaribaldi TechSpot Ambassador Posts: 2,512

    ROTFL!!!

    It took some time before I understood it was humour, (I started to compose a post in my head), but then it hit me...

    It's just great!

    In my own defense, I'll have to say I've had a couple of drinks :D

    Steg> Read up a bit on what has happened, and you'll see why some of us are " making such a big fuss of this cheating thing?"
    I've written some posts on my thoughts here on this board, and you'll find plenty of other posts over @ B3D by ppl much more knowledgeable than me...

    Basicly what I (and others) react to is the way Nvidia has no regard for it's customers, and that they stoop to cheat in a benchmark that does influence a lot of buyers...
    It also raises the question of whether it's only 3dmark, or if all the standard timedemos/benchmarks are being targeted in the same way...
    Just search for "shadermark" and "cheating" over at B3D for an example... (Or take a look at the plentiful threads concerning different aspects of this topic....)

    I think I'll stop now before I change this post into a rant...
     
  6. TS | Thomas

    TS | Thomas TS Rookie Topic Starter Posts: 1,319

    Actually, I noticed in Beyond3Ds latest review they renamed all game executables for benchmarking purposes to avoid the chances of this happening. I know I was saying to Julio over the past few weeks about doing the same thing.
     
  7. MrGaribaldi

    MrGaribaldi TechSpot Ambassador Posts: 2,512

    That sounds like a good idea...

    I know that B3D are creating custom timedemos too...
    That way they can test if there to see if there is any (big) difference between the original timedemos and their own...

    Dunno if they'll release the custom demos though...
     

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