I just managed to get my new system together:

http://www.anandtech.com/mysystemrig.html?rigid=21737

- I'm getting 62-69°C - using a AMD heatsink/cooler.....is this dangerously high?

I've got my 350W enermax on max, with its output fan just above the CPU - pumping out as much heat as possible.... is there anything I can do to bring the CPU temp down.. or is it alright as it is? :confused: :(

By AMD heatsink/cooler do you mean one that came with your CPU or one you already had or purchased afterward or is it just an AMD recommended fan? That sounds pretty hot too me:hotbounce

are those tempatures from the asus probe utility? there are some who say that asus reports 10 degrees higher than what the temps reallly are. regardless those temps are a bit on the high side.

try replacing the stock heatsink with a good copper core heatsink also are you relying on just the fans on the enermax for case cooling? if you are its a bad idea.

It is the AMD cooler that came with the cpu:

"AMD *Retail* Athlon XP 2100+ (1.73 GHz) with AMD H/S/F 3 Yrs Warranty"

I am using the ASUS mobo to record the temps.....


So, I've got the AMD cooler taking heat from the cpu, and the Enermax dual fan taking that hot air out - max speed.

I think your cooling system is a bit light, especially if it's a Palomino core.

Try adding an exhaust fan at the back of your case. You can get an Enermax 80*80 with manually adjustable speed, so you can tweak a little & find the best noise/performance ratio.

I had similar problem with asus probe.
I updated my bios and the temperature
reported droped abooout 10 degrees.

69*C isn't "dangerously high" for your CPU, but many components in your system (including your motherboard) are rated at around 65*C.. So if things are getting that hot on the CPU sensor, then your chip socket and what not are probaly feeling a bit stressed by the heat too.

Normal operating tempatures should NOT exceed 60*C in my experiences.

It is very important that you have AT LEAST 2 case fans, one intake and probably one exhaust in the back. Fresh air circulation is vital because blowing hot air on a CPU will only do so much to cool it down. Cooler air on the other hand... Case cooling is very important and often overlooked.

Ambient temperatures play an important role in all of this too. Is it very hot in your room? If you have the luxury, it might be worthwhile to keep your entire room cool.. It could lower your CPU temperature quite a bit to keep your room at 70*F instead of 85*F

The case has a fan at the front, but there are a lot of cables around - as the case isn't that big.

Total cooling:

Front Fan
AMD heatsink/fan on CPU
Enermax 2 Fan PSU:

http://www.enermax.com.tw/images/eg265p-ve-1.jpg
The side fan is sucking air from almost directly above the cpu


The case isn't exactly high quality - so there's no space for an extra case fan anyway - plus how would I connect it when there's only on cha_fan connector on the mobo?

Power supply fans are not really for case cooling.the double and triple fan power supplies are for the purpose of cooling the power supply and preventing it from radiating heat into the case not for cooling the case.

Like Rick said you need at Least two case fans one bringing air in and one drawing air out for proper airflow. I wont buy a case that doesnt have at least one 80cm case fan slot in the fromt and one in the back. and my preference is for TWO 80cm in front ( one in front of the hard drive bay ) and a 120cm case fan in the rear.

I've updated the bios - and the recorded temp has gone down a couple of degrees - to 60°C during normal windows operation.

I will be adding thermal paste/adding a better h/s/f/ and perhaps getting a better case - fan at front and back..
but not yet...I'm not loaded. Around February I'll have enough money - but not o/c until the above.

Originally posted by kyrocket
I had similar problem with asus probe.
I updated my bios and the temperature
reported droped abooout 10 degrees.

Thanks for the tip. I flashed mine as well, and Probe now reports the correct readings...which are usually under 30C for idle. And to think, for all this time, the 51C I idled at was actually 31C :eek:
And now I can turn my CPU fan down lower :D

Originally posted by hdmk
I've updated the bios - and the recorded temp has gone down a couple of degrees - to 60°C during normal windows operation.

I will be adding thermal paste/adding a better h/s/f/ and perhaps getting a better case - fan at front and back..
but not yet...I'm not loaded. Around February I'll have enough money - but not o/c until the above.

My temps are half yours - that's not right.

Arctic Silver 3 is like $5 now, you can't go wrong. Plus you can get an excellent Coolermaster budget heatsink at newegg for <$10. I would reccomend one of them. I had one with a 2100+, and it was really good, actually. Not quite as good as my $30 Volcano 9, but only about 5-10C behind. You really can't go wrong with Coolermaster, IMHO.

Plus you should get at least 2 fans for your case, one blowing in in the front and one exhausting, usually right next to the CPU HSF.

Arctic Silver 3 + Coolermaster HSF + 2 80mm fans really shouldn't down you that much! Maybe $30 or less. Getting a new case really shouldn't be necessary, you should be good off with your current one if you put some fans in. Think of it this way: your CPU fan is just blowing the same air it uses to radiate heat off the sink onto the sink again, your entire computer's air is at a standstill.

So yes, AS3, CM HSF, and case fans will solve your problem.

The temparature isn't threatning but it will lock up your system. I've had this problem, make sure you have the heatsink/fan on the right way, if you put it backwards the heatsink does not touch the precessor (like it's supposed to) leading to your heat "problem". An XP 2100+ should be around 40C-50C, any temp higher then 75C WILL damage your processor permantely. Hope this helps with your heat problem.

Originally posted by Maximus
heatsink/fan one the right way, if you put it backwards the heatsink does not touch the precessor (it's supposed to) leading to your heat "problem".

Correct. The pinnacle of the V your clip makes should be directly above the processor core. Failing to do so will most likely cause chipping or breakage if your machine is mishandled or jostled. This is entirely possible, but I didn't think this is what happened since your processor would probably be toast by now...

heatsink/fan one the right way, if you put it backwards the heatsink does not touch the precessor (it's supposed to) leading to your heat "problem".

Believe it or not, the CPU does make some contact with the HSF, although not enough. And your CPU won't fry right away because of this, but I'm sure your computer would "hang" from overheating in a matter of minutes. I've had some personal experience with this.

Thermal paste is a good idea! Please remember to apply sparingly. Paste is only meant to smooth out the imperfections in the metal surfaces of your CPU and heatsink, thereby increasing suface contact a small amount.. Too much paste can actually impede contact, raising your temps even higher.

If you are using a thermal pad on your heatsink, scrap that junk off! This was adequate about 5 years ago, but ever since HSF retention mechanisms have gotten so hard to put on and put so much pressure on the CPU, pads are worthless.

Your Enermax fan is very inadequate if used as an exhaust fan. I have the same PSU and the airflow is very poor and it is probably one of the least effective fans I've seen in one. The PSU is very good quality though and a good buy. :)

Your BIOS could be misreporting the temperatures.. It wouldn't be the first or last time I've heard of this. I would like to think flashing your BIOS to the newest version would fix this.

his temp readings probably are correct given he is running a 2100 witha stock heatsink and NO airflow in the case.

artic silver is great stuff I use it but be very carful applying it I have seen chips fried because people put to much on and when they powered up excess flowed and being conductive it shorted the chip frying it.

there is another heatsink at newegg I have tried it is called a speeze model 5R265B1H3 it is rated for AMD 2200+ has a copper core and microfins. it has gotten very good reviews and is considered adequate for even light over clocking. and it's only 8.00 USD I am using this on two of my amd machines one a 1600 and the other a 1800 I had a coolermaster on the 1800 before adn the temps were 46C idle and 56C under load with the speeze the temps are 38C idle and 45C under load. another thing I like about the speeze is it uses a three point attachment on both sides instead of the singe point that most heatsinks use.

I didn't bother to sift through the whole thread bu6t I read enough to seee that some of you have misleading and unfounded info here. to begin with, someone said the PSU fan isn't for case cooling...WRONG. The PSU fan is a key component in cooling the case, it exhausts the hot air from the case. I'd also like to address the side fan sucking air directly from the HSF. Unless your HSFan sucks air from the HS(most blow air onto it) then this can and will create "dead air". This is a situation where turbulence creates spots where the air doesn't move, it can be created when to directions of air cross and disturb the flow, or when the air is pulled or pushed in opposite directions. The proper airflow through the case should follow natural flow as closely as possible which is up. Hot air rises, so help it rise up and out. Your fans should intake cool air from the front(as close to the bottom as possible) and direct the air toward the back, the air is then sucked out the back at the top by the PSU fan(an additional fan near the PSU fan is also a good idea) Adding other fans can help if positioned correctly but you need to check the flow and amount of turbulence in order to maximize the cooling effect.

The only turbulent areas should be around any HSFs in the system, this includes those on the CPU, GFX card, chipset, etc...
The airflow in these areas should still move in the direction of flow although it is disturbed by the fans. Doing a "smoke test" can show you the airflow through the system. If you find problems, you can correct them by ducting and directing the air to correct the turbulence in the problem areas.

Another thing you might consider, the AMD HSF isn't very well made, you might need to finish the surface. I've seen some of those things that were pretty uneven on the surface that contacts the CPU. I'd recommend a better HSF but if nothing else you might want to make sure it has a smooth flat surface.

One more thing....Arctic silver is one of the best heat transfer compounds I've ever seen(there are some better but they are pretty much for industrial use only) Be careful when you use it, getting it across connections can fry something. No matter what anyone tells you, Arctic Silver is conductive and Will conduct electrically, although not well, it is enough to kill something. If you doubt that, just run a thick bead of it along a table and check each end with an Ohmmeter.

the purpose of fans on a power supply is to exhaust hot air from the power supply not the case. as power supplies have become more powerful and run even hotter many manufacturers have added another fan ( and in some cases two extra fans) good cooling requires good airflow one reason that better PSU's have two fans no just one. so in that sense PSU's do aid in case cooling but that is secondary to their design philosophy which is to cool the power supply. and a power supply with two fans or even three is not an adequate substitue for case fans.

Ok, then, so I want:

- New case with support for fan at front and back - ??? can anyone recommend a good, cheap ATX case - with plenty of room for a Asus A7V333 (12" by 9.6" [30.5 by 24.5cm]). I don't care what it looks like, I just want decent cooling - available from a uk shop or uk online shop please. Thanks :)

- Decent cpu heatsink/fan:
Coolermaster HSC-V62 Copper Socket A/P3/FCPGA Cooler Upto AMD 2600 (http://web6.scan.co.uk/Products/Info.asp?WPID=45904) - £15 - or would the be cheap £5 coolermaster (http://web6.scan.co.uk/Products/Info.asp?WPID=40835) be sufficient?

- Finally -
Coolermaster Premium Heat Sink Compound & app' Kit (http://web6.scan.co.uk/Products/Info.asp?WPID=9555)

What do you think? Can you recommend any cases? Thanks.

or instead of the thermal compound, I could have the much credited:

Arctic Silver III (OA-002-AC) (http://www.overclockers.co.uk/acatalog/Online_Catalogue_Thermal_Materials_27.html)


and I think I've found a suitable case :D:

Coolercase Tornado (CA-008-OC) (http://www.overclockers.co.uk/acatalog/Online_Catalogue_Coolercase_Cases_45.html)

Just what I want, though it would be better if I could get it slightly cheaper - maybe with less fans and a better "look". What do you think - of this and the above cpu heatsink/fans etc?

BTW - should I bother with rounded IDE cables - £9 ?
and rounded floppy cables - £4 ?

hdmk, that heatsink is EXCELLENT. That coupled with Arctic Silver should be excellently excellent. That with some airflow in your case, and your temps will probably be halved. At least a 20C drop. If you can afford it though, because that HSF will be very loud with a 60mm fan moving at almost 7000 RPM, I would reccomend getting a cooler with dimensions of 70x70 or even 80x80.

Round IDE cables are really erroneous, except for people like me who have an incredible amount of airflow in their case, especially between the hard drives, where a flat IDE cable would really get in the way. If you want, though, knock yourself out...

And that case should be great as well. A good buy, IMHO, especially with all those fans.

"Round IDE cables are really erroneous, except for people like me who have an incredible amount of airflow in their case, especially between the hard drives, where a flat IDE cable would really get in the way. If you want, though, knock yourself out... "

fess up Veh you got round cables cause you think they look cool
:eek:

Originally posted by iss
"Round IDE cables are really erroneous, except for people like me who have an incredible amount of airflow in their case, especially between the hard drives, where a flat IDE cable would really get in the way. If you want, though, knock yourself out... "

fess up Veh you got round cables cause you think they look cool
:eek:

Negative. It's too dark in my case to see them anyway especially since they're black...

Now if I had UV sensitive round cables, like I saw at Xoxide or somewhere, and a blacklight in my case, yeah I'd say they would look cool.

Then you shuld get purdy silver ones like I got:o

I use vantec rounded cables on my hard drive and floppy. I wanted shorter cables and the shortest ones I could find were the 10" rounded ones.

Ok, so go with the Coolermaster HSC-V62 Copper Socket A/P3/FCPGA Cooler Upto AMD 2600 (http://web6.scan.co.uk/Products/Info.asp?WPID=45904).

Would this: Coolermaster HAC-V81 Extreme Heat Sink Fan Delta with PCI Fan Control 2800+ (http://web6.scan.co.uk/Products/Info.asp?WPID=48008) be better though? (as in bigger fan - quieter - what would the difference in cooling be?

As for the case, does anyone know of any cheaper ATX cases - available online in the UK - with no psu and good (but obvioulsy not as good cooling) for less money?

I'm happy to stick with the case I've already shown - although I would like it slightly cheaper (and quieter ;) )

I think I've found a selection of nice cases at fashionpcs.com )the euro branch of colorcases.com)

e.g. "Moonlight (http://www.fashionpcs.com/cases/moonlight.html) ":

http://www.fashionpcs.com/cases/images/moonlight/moonlight01.jpg http://www.fashionpcs.com/cases/images/moonlight/moonlight00.jpg

It looks like good cooling (except no roof fan - but still good. Are the prices in Euros (?) - so this case costs £40 (inc VAT - converted at XE.com) What do you think?

anyone :( ?

don't leave me to think for myself! :p

other than looking like it was designed by some sci fi weenie it appears to be functional. I would ditch the generic power supply though.

I won't buy one with a PSU ... I've already got one. The trouble buying cases is that they all come with PSU's already.

It looks ok to me...but I may still go with the original - I know that's quality. Does anyone know of any quality (but cheap) cases - no psu, decent airflow?

Otherwise its a toss-up between the above 2 (maybe a different style from fashionpcs).

HDMK, that 2nd HSF you posted would do you alot better. Since it's designed for the XP's all the way up to the 2800+, having it for the 2100+ is overkill - which is great!

As for cases, it really is your aesthetic pick. Either of those two should be fine...really.

Ah and don't get a case with 60mm case fans - it really is a lesson in futility. Minimum of 4 80mm fans I'd say.

And remember that if you buy Moonlight, you're going to have to also buy 3 case fans for it. It doesn't include them. And that's going to cost you another £15-20. Just keep that in mind.

Originally posted by Vehementi
Minimum of 4 80mm fans I'd say.

4 case fans is a lot if you ask me. Not everyone needs such drastic cooling. 1 or 2 fans will lower the temps quite a lot allready & not increase the noise level too much.

Eh well that's my opinion. They're not loud if you get quiet fans, like the 5 2050RPM ones I have.

Airflow through the case is more important than having a bunch of fans. Having only an intake and exhaust would be better than if you had 10 fans in there that were working against eachother.

The number of them isn't as important as being able to get cool air in and cold air out while directing that air toward the hotspots. All the while keeping a good even flow of air through the case.

Check out pics of the case (proposed - from fashionpcs.com): here (http://members.lycos.co.uk/ftpman02/case_cooling/)

The front two fans will suck in, the other too will be drawing air out- if I can figure out how you attatch a fan to that back vent.... :rolleyes:

I'm planning to attatch 4: YS-TECH FD8125 80mm Fan - 3 Pin (http://www.overclockers.co.uk/acatalog/Online_Catalogue_YS_Tech_Fans_60.html)
» Speed - 3000RPM
» Output - 45.2CFM
» Decibels - 34.2dBA
» Dimensions - 80x80x25

I could get the quieter ones, - they are half as loud, but half the airflow, so I'll probably stick with these.

BTW - how do I connect these to the mobo? I have connected 1 case fan already, but how do I connect 4 on one slot?

Case fans come with a 3-pin to 4-pin ( such as those used on IDE devices ) converter so you can connect the fan directly to the PSU.

I'm confused.... :confused:

http://www.mikhailtech.com/articles/cooling/scf2/rheo.jpg
I have a connector like that brown one on my current fan, and I assume I'll have that on my new fans - how does that plug in?
this is just an example fan, not the one I'll be getting

At the moment I have one fan, with the brown connector plugged into my motherboard. There are no more connectors for fans - so how do I connect them to the PSU?

Should I buy fans with a 4 pin connector instead? :confused:

ok, I think I get it now.

I want the fans with a 4 pin connector - which will connect to the cables coming out of the PSU. If I want to measure the speeds of one of these fans, I want the 3 pin version - but I can only attatch one of those, to the motherboard.

So, I buy one fan with a 3 pin connector, and three with a 4 pin connector. Right? :)

You can get adapters to go from that 3 pin connector to MOLEX connector. Or you can change them yourself. The MOLEX connectors will only be using two of the pins, one for red and one for black. The third wire will be "taped" off(meaning it is not used) The only use for the third wire is monitoring, if you connect it to the mobo(and is supported) or if you use a baybus or other means of control/monitoring then the tach wire will be used. In the case of connecting to the PSU, you can either just buy those fans with the MOLEX connector, or you can adapt them yourself if they aren't available that way.

MOLEX connector - as in the 4 pin one?

EDIT: ok, the 4 pin one is the MOLEX:

YS-TECH FD8125 80mm Fan - 4 Pin (FG-002-YS)
The high output YS-TECH FD8125 80mm fan produces a massive 47CFM airflow. This makes it ideal for case cooling applications and is fitted with a 4-pin Molex (PSU) passthrough connector.

Rick why would you need all those fans? Right now I have my AMD xp 1600 oced to 1.6 ghz without any problems and running at 37*c. The only case fan is the power supply fan however i have a 7800 rpm heatsink that i let go full blast (people say it would be loud, not loud at all to me.)

I really don't see why you would need so many fans, unless your system really is too hot...

I can't stress this enough, make sure the heatsink isn't on backwards. This might be causing those abnormal temperatures. And I agree with Nick, you reall don't need 50 fans in your computer. I only have a power supply fan and a stock AMD cooler. My temps are at about 37C-42C and 24C system temperature, I also have th side of my case off to let all the excess heat go out. Try that, and for the last time, MAKE SURE THE FAN/HEATSIK ISN'T ON BACKWARDS!!!!!

case off would make the air circulation mess up...

It was in fact recommended by the people that I bought the case, processor etc. from, that I should take the case off instead of buying another cooler. Plus I've never had any problems I dont know why he should.

Originally posted by Nick
Rick why would you need all those fans? Right now I have my AMD xp 1600 oced to 1.6 ghz without any problems and running at 37*c. The only case fan is the power supply fan however i have a 7800 rpm heatsink that i let go full blast (people say it would be loud, not loud at all to me.)

I really don't see why you would need so many fans, unless your system really is too hot...

If you are talking about the "four fans" idea.. That was Vehementi that suggested that. I suggested one intake and one exhaust which is by no means extravagant... It's pretty standard.

The reasons I recommend at least 2 fans is for proper case temperatures is not solely for your CPU. Your temperatures are abnormally low, and whether that is misinformation or you just have really low room tempertaures.. Not many people idle at 37*C. Imagine how cool it would be with two case fans! :) The fact you have a very powerful CPU fan is also something that not everyone has or wants.

My main concern would be hard disk drives. Espcially systems with drives sandwiched together. Unlike most of the other parts of your system they are mechanical and wear down with heat. If you indeed have no case fans, that hard drive is stewing in its own heat.. The platter is contracting and expanding with each shut-off of your system because of the variances between high and low temps, lowering the hard disk life of your computer. Maybe you'll never notice it - maybe it will blow up tomorrow - But if you value your computer, its components and your data, proper cooling helps run your system safely and optimally.

Hot components run slower, live shorter and cause problems. Your CPU is not that the only thing in your system that gets hot and two extra case fans can go a long way in maintaining your system's health and performance.

The main thing here though, is that his CPU IS too hot. While your CPU is not, he must do something about it. Two case fans can easily shave off 15*C from his CPU temperature providing he has high ambient temperatures.

Originally posted by palmboy5
case off would make the air circulation mess up...

There's no air circulation to mess up if you don't have any case fans...

I'd like to know where some of you are getting your cooling info. It surely isn't from experience. Using 10, 20, or 50 fans (I know it is an exageration but..) this is rediculuous. The more fans you add, the more difficult it is to control the airflow without creating "dead air", which are places where air gets trapped because of the turbulence of all the fans blowing in different directions. I've seen many cases that have several fans, in the side panel alone, but, while they look cool, they don't do anything other than hinder the airflow inside the case. If you have a fan in a side panel sucking air out, and it is directly over the CPU fan, it is hindering the CPU fan because the CPU fan is trying to blow air that the other fan is trying to pull away from it. If one of these fans is stron enough, it could stop the other, or at least slow it down and eventually burn it up. There are correct ways of venting and ducting when using that many fans but it is not necessary if you can acomplish your goal in another way. The most important thing is to move the hot air out and cool air in, which I have tried many times to stress but it seems to be ignored.

Someone said to remove the cover to increase airflow, this is wrong and will kill any airflow except that of the fans. Areas with no fans will be in dead air. If you remove the cover, you better get a house fan or you're asking for trouble.

The most intelligent reply I've seen was made by Rick when he explained the effects of heat on the drives. Similar things happen to the solid state components in the system as well. When they get hot and cold, the substrate becomes less stable. This shortens their life.

Yea i got a hard drive cooler for that rick... =P