As the dust settles with Windows 11, Microsoft is readying the rollout of Windows 10 21H2

nanoguy

Posts: 1,019   +14
Staff member
The big picture: Windows 11 is here, but not everyone can or should upgrade to the new operating system. For people who choose to stay on Windows 10 until the end of support in 2025, Microsoft has only promised to service it with the usual monthly updates. The latest major update -- Windows 10 21H2 -- will start rolling out to users next month, and while it doesn't bring any major changes, it could be the last feature update for Windows 10 users.

Between the strict system requirements and all the bugs and performance problems, Windows 11 isn’t a typical Microsoft OS release. For one, many people can’t upgrade their machines to it unless they bypass Microsoft’s compatibility checks. Then you have all the visual and quality-of-life changes, some of which enhance the user experience while others subtract from it by locking the Taskbar in place, aligning Taskbar icons to the center by default, hiding an old context menu behind a new design, and more.

Many PC users haven’t even heard of Windows 11 despite the fact that Microsoft made a big deal of it being the next generation of Windows. That said, there are now well over 1.3 billion Windows 10 users who will likely take their time to upgrade to the new operating system.

The good news is that Microsoft has promised to support Windows 10 with fixes and security updates until October 2025, allowing ample time for consumers and businesses to prepare their transition. In the meantime, the Redmond company is getting ready to roll out Windows 10 21H2 (aka Windows 10 November 2021 Update) to the general public. In fact, you can download the final build (19044.1288) right now as an ISO and do a fresh install or an in-place upgrade.

As of writing, you can also get the 21H2 update if you’re an Insider enrolled in the Release Preview Channel. Those of you with systems that aren’t officially supported with Windows 11 will be able to participate in the Windows 10 Insider Program moving forward, and will automatically receive new servicing updates as they become available for public testing.

Windows 10 21H2 is a bland update with very few new features. Think of it as more of a Cumulative Update than a feature update, which also means it will be faster to install than the latter type. Notable changes are support for WPA3 Hash-to-Element (H2E) standards for better Wi-Fi security, GPU compute support in the Windows Subsystem for Linux (WSL) and Azure IoT Edge for Linux on Windows (EFLOW). The original plan included support for passwordless deployment methods via Windows Hello for Business, but that feature will arrive in a later update to those running 21H2.

Microsoft didn’t say if it plans to offer more biannual feature updates to Windows 10, but it also didn’t say that it would leave Windows 10 behind. This will be the last officially supported version of Windows for many PCs made before 2018, and while you can get around the system requirements check to install Windows 11, you won’t be entitled to updates moving forward, making this a difficult proposition for most people.

The only thing that’s certain right now is that Microsoft will fix any bugs and security issues with the usual servicing cadence they've been using for years. Some industry watchers have speculated that Windows 11 features could have been released as a feature update for Windows 10 users, but that was never the plan. Microsoft did say it would port features like DirectStorage to Windows 10, but it's not yet clear if people who buy a PC with a hybrid CPU architecture such as Alder Lake will get full support if they choose to run Windows 10 instead of Windows 11.

Otherwise, Windows 10 version 21H2 follows the same pattern of support as previous versions, meaning Windows 10 Home and Pro users will get 18 months of support while Enterprise and Education users will get 30 months. The new update will start rolling out next month as a staged release, ensuring that any issues that pop up will be caught before it has a chance to see widespread adoption.

Permalink to story.

 

Neatfeatguy

Posts: 553   +959
Windows 10 will never be Windows 7.

I never had a Windows 7 update break Windows itself where it required a format and reinstall because a recovery couldn't even be performed.
I've never had Windows 7 update break drivers and forced me to remove, download and re-install drivers.
I've never had Windows 7 update delete data.
I've never had Windows 7 update break Windows itself so bad for a second time that I had to do another format and re-install.
I've never had Windows 7 update break printing.

Those are just my experiences with Windows 10 updates, I can't talk for anyone else.
 

Puiu

Posts: 5,050   +3,913
TechSpot Elite
Windows 10 will never be Windows 7.

I never had a Windows 7 update break Windows itself where it required a format and reinstall because a recovery couldn't even be performed.
I've never had Windows 7 update break drivers and forced me to remove, download and re-install drivers.
I've never had Windows 7 update delete data.
I've never had Windows 7 update break Windows itself so bad for a second time that I had to do another format and re-install.
I've never had Windows 7 update break printing.

Those are just my experiences with Windows 10 updates, I can't talk for anyone else.
I also never had an window 10 update break the OS like that, but I had plenty for win7. Like it or not the update system in 10 is much more robust than in 7. If an error does accour during the update process it just reverts back to the pre-update state.

The number of "can't boot after update" threads in google for 7 is not small. I personally had to fix several PCs that stopped showing the login screens after win7 updates (I have other horror stories too if you want).

Drivers breaking for win happened all the time, for example in 2017 some security updates broke amd video drivers, you had to uninstall the updates. MS was just as incompetent back then too.

I don't doubt you had problems with win 10, but I doubt you had all of the things you mentioned.
 
Last edited:

Uncle Al

Posts: 8,348   +7,156
I think MicroSludge would be wise to make a version that did not require the various requirements that make so many machines incompatible. They could easily soft switch these "features" so everyone could upgrade and those with the necessary attributes could turn them on, otherwise more and more (like myself) will continue to move to Linux and leave windows far, far behind .....
 

Neatfeatguy

Posts: 553   +959
I also never had an window 10 update break the OS like that, but I had plenty for win7. Like it or not the update system in 10 is much more robust than in 7. If an error does accour during the update process it just reverts back to the pre-update state.

The number of "can't boot after update" threads in google for 7 is not small. I personally had to fix several PCs that stopped showing the login screens after win7 updates (I have other horror stories too if you want).

Drivers breaking for win happened all the time, for example in 2017 some security updates broke amd video drivers, you had to uninstall the updates. MS was just as incompetent back then too.

I don't doubt you had problems with win 10, but I doubt you had all of the things you mentioned.

Every single one of them. What a cluster fck of an OS Windows 10 is. Best thing I did was upgrade to a Pro version so I could completely disable the windows updates.
 

envirovore

Posts: 328   +650
TechSpot Elite
Windows 10 will never be Windows 7.

I never had a Windows 7 update break Windows itself where it required a format and reinstall because a recovery couldn't even be performed.
I've never had Windows 7 update break drivers and forced me to remove, download and re-install drivers.
I've never had Windows 7 update delete data.
I've never had Windows 7 update break Windows itself so bad for a second time that I had to do another format and re-install.
I've never had Windows 7 update break printing.

Those are just my experiences with Windows 10 updates, I can't talk for anyone else.

Win10 has been perfectly stable for me so far.
Win7, not so much.

Of course, everyone's milage may vary.
 

wiyosaya

Posts: 6,724   +5,157
I also never had an window 10 update break the OS like that, but I had plenty for win7. Like it or not the update system in 10 is much more robust than in 7. If an error does accour during the update process it just reverts back to the pre-update state.
AFAIK - that is a recent addition. Also, it does only happen for serious things that the OS can detect, for example, an exception in the OS that leads to a blue screen. I have one PC that the last time I tried to update, it refused to go beyond 1809, and all the infinitely helpful M$ "tech support" could say was "Do a clean install". Right. :rolleyes:

With another PC a few years back, the update installed without apparent error. However, when it came back up, all I could see on my monitor was a completely black screen with only a mouse cursor. I had to roll that back manually with an image backup that I made before I did the update.

In fact, I never do a Windohs 10 update without doing an image backup.
The number of "can't boot after update" threads in google for 7 is not small. I personally had to fix several PCs that stopped showing the login screens after win7 updates (I have other horror stories too if you want).

Drivers breaking for win happened all the time, for example in 2017 some security updates broke amd video drivers, you had to uninstall the updates. MS was just as incompetent back then too.
For M$, incompetence is SOP, IMO.
I don't doubt you had problems with win 10, but I doubt you had all of the things you mentioned.
The simple fact of the matter is that you do not know if the poster had all the problems listed; however, from the number of problems I have had with Windohs 10 updates, I don't doubt that the poster had all the problems that were listed. Just because all of them did not happen to you does not mean that the poster did not experience them and, I see it as patronizing that you state that you doubt that experience. The number of results out there on Windohs 10 update problems is rather not small either, IMO, all you need to do is search. Its also logical fallacy to assume that "just because it happens/does not happen to me" means everyone's experience is the same.

As I see it, count yourself among the fortunate that you have not had significant update problems with Windohs 10.
 

Geralt

Posts: 798   +1,209
AFAIK - that is a recent addition. Also, it does only happen for serious things that the OS can detect, for example, an exception in the OS that leads to a blue screen. I have one PC that the last time I tried to update, it refused to go beyond 1809, and all the infinitely helpful M$ "tech support" could say was "Do a clean install". Right. :rolleyes:

With another PC a few years back, the update installed without apparent error. However, when it came back up, all I could see on my monitor was a completely black screen with only a mouse cursor. I had to roll that back manually with an image backup that I made before I did the update.

In fact, I never do a Windohs 10 update without doing an image backup.

For M$, incompetence is SOP, IMO.

The simple fact of the matter is that you do not know if the poster had all the problems listed; however, from the number of problems I have had with Windohs 10 updates, I don't doubt that the poster had all the problems that were listed. Just because all of them did not happen to you does not mean that the poster did not experience them and, I see it as patronizing that you state that you doubt that experience. The number of results out there on Windohs 10 update problems is rather not small either, IMO, all you need to do is search. Its also logical fallacy to assume that "just because it happens/does not happen to me" means everyone's experience is the same.

As I see it, count yourself among the fortunate that you have not had significant update problems with Windohs 10.
Count me too.
 

seeprime

Posts: 626   +803
I don't doubt you had problems with win 10, but I doubt you had all of the things you mentioned.
As an owner of a small computer repair shop I can state that I have seen all of the above problems with Windows 10 updates on customer computers and the data loss one on my own laptop when an update wiped and changed the drive letter of my SD card (used for File History backups). I worked with a Microsoft engineer, after posting on an online forum, to get the Realtek SD card controller issue eventually resolved.
 

brucek

Posts: 940   +1,360
Abandoning machines without TPM2 chips for non-TPM-related Windows feature updates is pretty crappy, but given the feature updates are rarely earth shattering maybe not the world's biggest problem.

But when 2025 comes, and Microsoft abandons them for security updates too, Microsoft will truly be commuting an egregious act they should be held accountable for. On the one hand, business and other supported environments will likely throw out a bunch of otherwise perfectly usable hardware, which is a waste of resources. And on the other hand, homes and other non-supported environments will probably keep using the now non-supported Windows 10, which will cause many downstream problems for others when those machines are exploited.
 
Android, Windows 10 & Windows 11 are for the Lemmings of the world, who could care less about privacy.

I now have the most secure desktop in the World!...FOR WHAT?

To fend off the hackers?

Well, I also have "3" cloned drives and if one gets hacked, I pull it out and use another.

Fresh as a DAISY!

I personally could care less what Android & Microsoft have on me.

I'm nobody, but to "FORCE FEED" their way's of thinking, doing and using their systems, now and forever referred to as Apps is pure HOGWASH!

Microsoft Edge taking over my HTML's & PDF's is NOT just an aggravation, but PURE computer communism!

Chrome and Your web browser EDGE, cannot even remember my preferences upon updating??

ASK me where downloads go! Yes, ALWAYS!

NO, I don't want YOU to remember my Passwords, Wallet, Crypto Currency, etc etc!

Just wondering, if I do set these setting to the defaults, will you then change them to what I want? I need to experiment!

You don't see an issue with this?

Microsoft...You rely on Businesses' and your Office Products, THAT'S IT!

Well, this newest venture will eventually be your demise as you have only an operating system and an Office Suite.

There are plenty of Free Office products now available and extremely usable.

So that leaves you with an operating system also known as an overgrown app in your terms.

So long Microsoft, keep your patents, because you'll need them to re-coup; it's just a matter of time.

Acrobat invented this PDF, and I want ONLY Acrobat to open them. Am I asking too much here?

And, NO, I don't want to have to edit the registry, find a program to stop this, hack the operating system...I just want to let your operating system (Big App) know what I desire on MY computer and have you obey!

Android / Samsung...when I don't want YOUR app's to have access to my contacts and you are so kind to ask me. I delete my contacts from your app and what happens? They are deleted from ALL apps? So basically you DO have access, now don't you? Why even ask or give me the option?

Windows 11 is supposedly an operating app, not an operating system that is trying to do what Microsoft failed miserably in prior attempts. Now they want to be a HUGE Desktop Computer PHONE, that can't even obtain any apps that are worthy of a Phone, let alone a computer.

First and foremost, STOP calling everything Apps!

Apps are for KIDS!

Those Apps as you call them are washed down, totally useless, pieces of **** that you want US to open our files with?

Seriously...You had at one time a program called Photoeditor, not to be confused with the Photoeditor piece of **** in your App store and this Office XP program STILL blows all your apps out of the water in 2021!
 

Puiu

Posts: 5,050   +3,913
TechSpot Elite
As an owner of a small computer repair shop I can state that I have seen all of the above problems with Windows 10 updates on customer computers and the data loss one on my own laptop when an update wiped and changed the drive letter of my SD card (used for File History backups). I worked with a Microsoft engineer, after posting on an online forum, to get the Realtek SD card controller issue eventually resolved.
Was it a driver issue? Or?

And I expect repair shops to see computers with problems. I don't expect a single computer to get all of them (or even 2 of them) as most of them were very limited in scope.

For example, one of my first jobs was as an IT assistant at an important high-school that specialized in IT classes. The tens of windows 7 computers there were a big headache. Anything that could go wrong did go wrong and I only stayed one year there. The number of times I had to reinstall an OS there... I still dread that job :)
 
Last edited:

Puiu

Posts: 5,050   +3,913
TechSpot Elite
Android, Windows 10 & Windows 11 are for the Lemmings of the world, who could care less about privacy.

I now have the most secure desktop in the World!...FOR WHAT?

To fend off the hackers?

Well, I also have "3" cloned drives and if one gets hacked, I pull it out and use another.

Fresh as a DAISY!

I personally could care less what Android & Microsoft have on me.

I'm nobody, but to "FORCE FEED" their way's of thinking, doing and using their systems, now and forever referred to as Apps is pure HOGWASH!

Microsoft Edge taking over my HTML's & PDF's is NOT just an aggravation, but PURE computer communism!

Chrome and Your web browser EDGE, cannot even remember my preferences upon updating??

ASK me where downloads go! Yes, ALWAYS!

NO, I don't want YOU to remember my Passwords, Wallet, Crypto Currency, etc etc!

Just wondering, if I do set these setting to the defaults, will you then change them to what I want? I need to experiment!

You don't see an issue with this?

Microsoft...You rely on Businesses' and your Office Products, THAT'S IT!

Well, this newest venture will eventually be your demise as you have only an operating system and an Office Suite.

There are plenty of Free Office products now available and extremely usable.

So that leaves you with an operating system also known as an overgrown app in your terms.

So long Microsoft, keep your patents, because you'll need them to re-coup; it's just a matter of time.

Acrobat invented this PDF, and I want ONLY Acrobat to open them. Am I asking too much here?

And, NO, I don't want to have to edit the registry, find a program to stop this, hack the operating system...I just want to let your operating system (Big App) know what I desire on MY computer and have you obey!

Android / Samsung...when I don't want YOUR app's to have access to my contacts and you are so kind to ask me. I delete my contacts from your app and what happens? They are deleted from ALL apps? So basically you DO have access, now don't you? Why even ask or give me the option?

Windows 11 is supposedly an operating app, not an operating system that is trying to do what Microsoft failed miserably in prior attempts. Now they want to be a HUGE Desktop Computer PHONE, that can't even obtain any apps that are worthy of a Phone, let alone a computer.

First and foremost, STOP calling everything Apps!

Apps are for KIDS!

Those Apps as you call them are washed down, totally useless, pieces of **** that you want US to open our files with?

Seriously...You had at one time a program called Photoeditor, not to be confused with the Photoeditor piece of **** in your App store and this Office XP program STILL blows all your apps out of the water in 2021!
You should add iOS/MacOS to the list. Even some Linux distros :)
 
My very first Window 10 experience was about "4" years earlier. Fed-up with the annoying ads to upgrade, I finally caved and did so.

This was the worst decision, I've EVER made since using computers starting in 1985 and the ONLY time EVER I wasn't able to recovers files that were deleted during the update.

I've ALWAY's been able to at the very least, pull the hard drive out and recover my files on another computer, but this time, "4" years earlier, they were all gone and hundreds of dollars spent on recovery software did NOTHING!

I should have known better than to let Microsoft handle the upgrade and should have made my own back-up, because 4 years ago, back-up software really wasn't much better than it was 15 years ago and still in 2021 doesn't utilize a "COMMON SENSE" approach to making a back-up.

These programmers are fantastic at what they do, but are seriously lacking in writing skills aimed at describing the actions and consequences of using their programs.

Windows 7 Ultimate user for the last 4 years and thought I'd give it another go.

Not as bad this time, but a redundancy of "3" cloned drives makes it so much safer.

It's so much easier and just as fast to clone the drive, than to utilize a horrendously explained back-up.

Windows 10 isn't made for you and I. It's made for Big Business and Government, where security is first and foremost.

You and I are Windows Guests, short for (Guiana pigs)
 

scavengerspc

Posts: 1,732   +1,787
TechSpot Elite
Windows 10 will never be Windows 7
Thank God for that.

Those are just my experiences with Windows 10 updates, I can't talk for anyone else.
Definitely. I have 26 staff members with a desktop and a laptop, and we have never had any of those things happen. What we have had happen is the breaking of our printer drivers. A reinstallation fixed that all but once, which took 2 weeks for an updated driver from Brother. And in 2018 a major update caused a broken connection to my Synology Disk stations. We had to run the entire setup process again but obviously no data loss.
 

TheRealSCDC

Posts: 28   +52
Home and work, we are all Windows 10. Mostly all non-problematic, except for dumb *** users loading stuff they shouldn't.

Only 2 times in the past 5 years we've had updates wipe out the installation. It was a pain, but it happens.

I like Windows 10, it's really quite good if you don't go to bad sites or load hacked warez. You shouldn't anyways.
 

bandit8623

Posts: 344   +192
Had a new pc at work this week boot and freeze after latest update brand new load. recovery woudlnt fix. had to reload. probably ssd corruption though.
 

seeprime

Posts: 626   +803
Was it a driver issue? Or?

And I expect repair shops to see computers with problems. I don't expect a single computer to get all of them (or even 2 of them) as most of them were very limited in scope.

For example, one of my first jobs was as an IT assistant at an important high-school that specialized in IT classes. The tens of windows 7 computers there were a big headache. Anything that could go wrong did go wrong and I only stayed one year there. The number of times I had to reinstall an OS there... I still dread that job :)
No single computer had all the issues, of course. But, they all do occur spread out over multiple machines. Only a few were driver issues. Many were corrupted by Windows update even when the storage drive was healthy.
 

Morphine Child

Posts: 104   +147
Win10 has been perfectly stable for me so far.
Win7, not so much.

Of course, everyone's milage may vary.
I was quite happy with both. Tho, on 10 I postpone updates by a few weeks and so far has proven a good tactic.

Other than that it is more stable than 7, in 6 years never had entire OS crash on me, which I can't say for 7...

I did try 11 on VirtualBox and I do not like it at all... so many weird design decisions...
 

envirovore

Posts: 328   +650
TechSpot Elite
I was quite happy with both. Tho, on 10 I postpone updates by a few weeks and so far has proven a good tactic.

Other than that it is more stable than 7, in 6 years never had entire OS crash on me, which I can't say for 7...

I did try 11 on VirtualBox and I do not like it at all... so many weird design decisions...
I've been in the Beta Insiders ring for the last couple years and jump into the updated builds/feature packs the moment they get pushed to that ring with stable/positive results, but again realize my experience isn't another's.

Probably wise to hold off on updates though until outlets report back on any major issues with them, and what they may be.
Figure I'll just roll back if something does go sideways.

As an aside I've often wondered if those with repeated major problems are running fully updated systems in other respects, Chipset drivers, BIOS, etc, as well as RAM timings/voltages and such. All those little things do add up and come into play with system stability in all sorts of ways.

Holding off on 11 for a while myself (it was 2 or so years after the release of 10 before I moved from 7).
While I'm happy to beta test features and updates for an already solidly established and functioning OS I'm not interested in doing so for a fresh OS, and that's exactly what the consumer release of 11 is right now - a live beta.
I get why though, test for stability and bugs across as wide variety of hardware and software combinations as possible.