Is Windows 11 coming? Leaks confirm it

DZillaXx

Posts: 334   +455
Windows are sit on one program and that is Photoshop. If that program is ported to Linux windows is “dead” in 4 years. Gimp is 80% close, just a good ui away.

Photoshop only accounts to a very small amount of users.

Hell even most armature photographers like myself just use lightroom.

The real apps getting businesses tied to windows is office365. Excel is hands down the best and free versions just do not compare. Hell the options for printing that you have in Excel are missing or just down right hidden in openoffice.

Google Docs/etc is a poor mans version of 365 apps. They work great for all the basic stuff, but working out of the browser just isnt the same. Granted 90% of the time Google Sheets is fine, but any time you need to build a new sheet with references to tables on other tabs. Better off making it in excel.

Linux is just a poor option for a business, even if you are on a budget.

There are plenty of reasons why people stick to windows.

Linux is a better Server OS, but is a pretty crappy OS for GUI use. MacOS is a good alternative, but has plenty of flaws. I myself got a macbook air not because I wanted MacOS, but because for around $1000 is it the best laptop on the market ATM for thin and light.
 

Mr Majestyk

Posts: 824   +730
A tabbed file browser would be nice. Looking forward to it. Despite the hate for me Windows 10 has been by far the most stable OS they've released. I've never had an update break anything. Of course it could be better, and at least Edge is now a pretty good browser.
 

arrowflash

Posts: 460   +498
If these new screenshots are real, it's looking like a better polished version of the Windows 10 UI, rather than an unnecessary revamp.

I have to admit, I don't dislike what I'm seeing so far. The Start Menu looks like a big improvement from the terrible Windows 8 start screen reshaped as a list that Microsoft implemented in Windows 10. Of course, I'll probably keep using the classic Windows 7 start menu through a third-party program (currently Open Shell).

Like others, my main concern really is the Control Panel - if Nadella completely removes the classic Control Panel, it must be replaced by something better than that Metro-style "settings" screen garbage. At least the Computer Management (compmgmt.msc) applet UI hasn't changed, and that's a good sign.

Of course, there's also the concerns about under-the-hood changes and things like subscription-based licensing. But from what's being displayed so far, W11 is looking like a better polished W10 rather than any attempt at something revolutionary, and that's really the best outcome we could hope for.

Speaking of under the hood changes, if the polished W10 scenario turns out to be the case, I wonder about gaming performance. Lately W10 is progressively becoming a worse gaming OS with every new cumulative update, that bring up new glitches and performance issues that are only piling up (since the older ones aren't being fixed). I wonder if W11 will solve these issues and bring back gaming performance at least to the level of 1809/1903 builds, or if it will continue to get worse.
 

terzaerian

Posts: 981   +1,419
The Redmond cultists that insist Windows 10 is great is just tiresome.

At best, Windows 10 is tolerable. The amount of deshitting you need to do, from ripping out the telemetry, basically being forced to use Pro in order to restore sanity to the update system, to installing a proper start menu is galling, and the invasive creep of the Metro environment into the desktop should arouse the suspicion of any rational person. It is not a worthy successor to Windows 7 in any sense of the word. The performance improvements it allegedly brought to the table could be gained with an SSD on a Windows 7 install.

The Metro environment is an atrocity, vast swathes of wasted whitespace, hyperlinks hanging in space, and clumsy aping of Android and Mas OS are the sum total of its parts. Blind kindergartners could put together a better design language than that garbage heap. The fact Redmond insists on ripping out more and more of the desktop environment for this clumsy bullshit reveals they learned nothing from Windows 8 besides to move slower on their insidious designs.

They seem to forget that there is a tipping point at which the time cost of un****ing their operating system vs. learning a new one in the form of Linux tips strongly and irrevocably in the favor of the latter, and each update they push seems dead set on accelerating that day for their userbase.
 
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arrowflash

Posts: 460   +498
The Redmond cultists that insist Windows 10 is great is just tiresome.

At best, Windows 10 is tolerable. The amount of deshitting you need to do, from ripping out the telemetry, basically being forced to use Pro in order to restore sanity to the update system, to installing a proper start menu is galling, and the invasive creep of the Metro environment into the desktop should arouse the suspicion of any rational person. It is not a worthy successor to Windows 7 in any sense of the word. The performance improvements it allegedly brought to the table could be gained with an SSD on a Windows 7 install.

The Metro environment is an atrocity, vast swathes of wasted whitespace, hyperlinks hanging in space, and clumsy aping of Android and Mas OS are the sum total of its parts. Blind kindergartners could put together a better design language than that garbage heap. The fact Redmond insists on ripping out more and more of the desktop environment for this clumsy bullshit reveals they learned nothing from Windows 8 besides to move slower on their insidious designs.

They seem to forget that there is a tipping point at which the time cost of un****ing their operating system vs. learning a new one in the form of Linux tips strongly and irrevocably in the favor of the latter, and each update they push seems dead set on accelerating that day for their userbase.

Based on the released screenshots, it appears that they're trying to make the UI at least a bit more tolerable. It's not enough to really reach any conclusions, but seems to me they're perhaps trying to reduce the excess whitespace a bit (I agree with you - excess whitespace is the worst thing about the W10 UI). Also notice how the rounded window corners are back - nice throwback to Aero in my opinion (would be better if the min-max-close window buttons were more pronounced with a background and different colors like in Aero).

And the performance improvements aren't even from Windows 10 - they were introduced in Windows 8 and improved upon in 8.1. Windows 10 has better performance than Windows 7, but worse than 8.
 

Nobina

Posts: 3,292   +3,369
Icons in the middle of the taskbar look out of place, it's trying to be MacOS instead of Windows. Start Menu looks like it could be good. I wonder how "new" it actually is.

P.S. The one good one bad Windows list is dumb. The best Windows was XP and 7, everything else was either bad or tolerable.
 

maroon1

Posts: 46   +57
You're not grading them based on their time. You're grading them based on what came next.
No

I'm grading them based on their time

WIndows XP in 2001-2004 is not as good as windows 10 in 2015-18.

1st release of windows XP is buggy and has a lot of issue. They have to make two service packs to fix issues. Windows 10 did not have as much issue even on launch (at least based on my experience on multiple machine)

Not to mention that is not very user friendly. For example, windows XP lack search bar in windows explorer and start menu. You have to go to the search option which is painful to use and not as simple as windows 10 (and win 8 & 7). Also, control panel options are too limited. Installing driver in painful and sometimes it does not work well. Changing setting or connecting internet etc is painful to use. I was young kid when I used windows XP but I remember that is pain to use and can easily get infected with virus. ALso, when running buggy games that freeze, the whole computer freeze and it forced me to reset. Modern OS is better when it come to that, if game freeze it won't cause the whole OS to freeze.

For me, modern OS are far better and more user friendly and much more secure. Not to mention high-end PC today with SSD will run windows 10 way smoother than windows XP using on high-end PC from its time. So for me, everything is better now.


In my office, we still have one computer with windows XP and it is garbage. Surely windows XP was big improvement over windows 98, but that does not mean windows XP is good OS. All old OS were buggy, had poor security, limited option and not user friendly. WIndows 7 and newer one are way way more user friendly and secure than any older OS at it time


Also, people complains about windows 10 forced update

But updates are not actually forced. There is option to delay the updates by 7 days, and you can click again after those 7 days.
Also, there is option called "Metered connection". If you enable it, windows 10 will almost never updated except in rare cases. You can also uninstall updates that you don't want

Also, I never had problem with updates on windows 10 in last 5 years of using, except for one time, but that was not an issue for me cause I did uninstall that updated and then paused the updated for 7 days to prevent for downloading again, until microsoft fixed the issue with update
 

maroon1

Posts: 46   +57
A tabbed file browser would be nice. Looking forward to it. Despite the hate for me Windows 10 has been by far the most stable OS they've released. I've never had an update break anything. Of course it could be better, and at least Edge is now a pretty good browser.

Me too
Windows 10 is the most stable OS I ever used. I had less issue with it than even windows 7

I don't use Edge (I use firefox). But yea Edge is way better than internet explorer ever was and faster than any other browsers.
 
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paul1122

Posts: 154   +143
It runs win32 software, Linux software as well as windows 10 malware, so whats your point?

Hell, it even boots to DOS

Lets see you do that with your shiny new spyware platform

Oh, that's right, YOU CAN'T!

Shall we call it a Linux machine?
A Hackintosh?
A Chromium Device?

No, I call it what it shines at, running the widest selection of usable software on the Planet

It's an XP machine that also does anything else I need it to do

Can your new PC boot to all these X86 operating systems, or are you settling for a gimped virtual machine?

I keep seeing your posts. What's your point? I have am AM handheld radio that works great also. I don't point it out to everyone walking by though.
 

cliffordcooley

Posts: 12,936   +6,265
No

I'm grading them based on their time

WIndows XP in 2001-2004 is not as good as windows 10 in 2015-18.
One day you might understand where your logic is flawed. You are just trash talking all of history because of technological advancement. If you judge a tool based on its time, you don't campare it to future tools.
 
In my opinion I think Microsoft should remake Windows phone. I know it sounds stupid but mobile phones are getting more popular than pc's and also, there is no competition in the smartphone OS space. If they don't at least try then in 20 years people will be like "Do you remember when having a windows pc was a thing?"
 

terzaerian

Posts: 981   +1,419
No

I'm grading them based on their time

WIndows XP in 2001-2004 is not as good as windows 10 in 2015-18.

1st release of windows XP is buggy and has a lot of issue. They have to make two service packs to fix issues. Windows 10 did not have as much issue even on launch (at least based on my experience on multiple machine)
I'll take buggy over corrupt from inception. Day 1, Windows 10 had invasive telemetry - it still does. Day 1, Windows 10 had the Windows Store which no one asked for or wanted - it still does.

Not to mention that is not very user friendly. For example, windows XP lack search bar in windows explorer and start menu. You have to go to the search option which is painful to use and not as simple as windows 10 (and win 8 & 7). Also, control panel options are too limited. Installing driver in painful and sometimes it does not work well. Changing setting or connecting internet etc is painful to use. I was young kid when I used windows XP but I remember that is pain to use and can easily get infected with virus. ALso, when running buggy games that freeze, the whole computer freeze and it forced me to reset. Modern OS is better when it come to that, if game freeze it won't cause the whole OS to freeze.
XP didn't need the search bar because the amount of cruft in the OS was far smaller, and Microsoft wasn't trying to hide critical functionality behind layers and layers of organizational obfuscation yet, like the way Admin Services is now stuffed in a subfolder in the "legacy" control panel.

Windows 10 needs the search bar as a crutch because now Redmond is removing icons and shortcuts you previously could organize yourself into static hyperlinks randomly sprinkled throughout the shitty Metro settings menu instead.

For me, modern OS are far better and more user friendly and much more secure. Not to mention high-end PC today with SSD will run windows 10 way smoother than windows XP using on high-end PC from its time. So for me, everything is better now.
No, operating systems are faster now, and speed is only one facet of the ways software has improved. Windows has degraded on virtually every other metric since XP.

In my office, we still have one computer with windows XP and it is garbage. Surely windows XP was big improvement over windows 98, but that does not mean windows XP is good OS. All old OS were buggy, had poor security, limited option and not user friendly. WIndows 7 and newer one are way way more user friendly and secure than any older OS at it time
I had a prebuilt that ran XP well into the 2010s. It was fast, efficient, and the only reason I ultimately had to replace it was because it didn't have enough physical clearance in the case for the larger video cards that were coming out. The software end was never an issue for it, and it still compares favorably to any Windows 10 machine I've put together in the fast year which needs to be immediately remediated because of problems Redmond decided were features.

Also, people complains about windows 10 forced update

But updates are not actually forced. There is option to delay the updates by 7 days, and you can click again after those 7 days.
Also, there is option called "Metered connection". If you enable it, windows 10 will almost never updated except in rare cases. You can also uninstall updates that you don't want

Also, I never had problem with updates on windows 10 in last 5 years of using, except for one time, but that was not an issue for me cause I did uninstall that updated and then paused the updated for 7 days to prevent for downloading again, until microsoft fixed the issue with update
Yes, it is a problem. Just because you can "delay" the updates doesn't mean they aren't forced. And the exploits and trickery you use on Home edition to try and trick the OS into not making them forced aren't solutions. The solution is giving the user agency over their own God damn hardware and software that they ****ing well paid for.

And don't give me that tired "but the average user can't be trusted to keep their machine up to date!" bullshit either. I don't give a damn. As XP and Windows used to state, this is "My Computer."
 

maroon1

Posts: 46   +57
I'll take buggy over corrupt from inception. Day 1, Windows 10 had invasive telemetry - it still does. Day 1, Windows 10 had the Windows Store which no one asked for or wanted - it still does.
Android has play store
iOS has its own store

Nobody is forcing you to use windows store. Just pretend it does not exist, it does not effect you in anyway. Also, just because you don't use it, it does not mean other don't use it. There some games that are windows store exclusive for example

"invasive telemetry" you mean collecting just basic data about what you click and how you use the PC to improve windows service. It is no different than what facebook or youtube does. It does not effect you in anyway. You basically worying about something that has zero impact on your life.
 

terzaerian

Posts: 981   +1,419
Android has play store
iOS has its own store
And both of them are garbage. I don't need or want garbage on my PC.

Nobody is forcing you to use windows store. Just pretend it does not exist, it does not effect you in anyway. Also, just because you don't use it, it does not mean other don't use it. There some games that are windows store exclusive for example
You have a habit of contradicting your own point by the end of the paragraph. A Windows Store exclusive is mandatory for that game, so yes, Microsoft is forcing you to use the store. It comes pre-installed, has no option to uninstall, and can't be otherwise turned off without using a third-party hack. That's the definition of mandatory.

Microsoft also has a history of gradually making the optional mandatory - see Windows Update - which, coincidentally, was briefly tied into the Windows Store during the 8.1 era.

"invasive telemetry" you mean collecting just basic data about what you click and how you use the PC to improve windows service. It is no different than what facebook or youtube does. It does not effect you in anyway. You basically worying about something that has zero impact on your life.
And every file you open.

And yes, it does. Just because you can't see the impact doesn't mean there isn't one. You might as well argue that the police investigating you for a crime doesn't have an impact because you haven't been arrested yet. By the time you realize the impact and want to do something about it, it's already too late.

And just because Facebook or YouTube do the same or worse does not remotely justify it. I burned the former out of my life and am working every day to encourage others to do the same.

My data is my property, period. Microsoft does not have the mandate or the right to spy on how I use it, for any reason, in software that I paid for on hardware that I paid for. If there is information I want to volunteer re: a crash or bug, that is my call, not theirs.
 

Farkinell

Posts: 188   +298
I keep seeing your posts. What's your point? I have am AM handheld radio that works great also. I don't point it out to everyone walking by though.

If he managed to get a 3090 running on XP (Super Secured) then him and Quantum Physics could form some kind of perpetual fanboy echo chamber. Pretty sure we could somehow harvest energy from it.
 

terzaerian

Posts: 981   +1,419
If he managed to get a 3090 running on XP (Super Secured) then him and Quantum Physics could form some kind of perpetual fanboy echo chamber. Pretty sure we could somehow harvest energy from it.
Bullwinkle only pops up in discussions about Windows; QP can't go a single day without flogging his DUAL 3090S multiple times, sometimes per thread. You can't compare the two.