Tesla's stock has rallied nearly 60 percent in one week

Shawn Knight

Posts: 13,080   +131
Staff member

To put the rally into perspective, Tesla’s stock closed at $443.01 on January 3, 2020. Now just one month later, it’s trading at $924.48. Much of the growth has come during the past week as the stock opened at just $576.00 on January 29. Onlookers and investors alike are now wondering just how high it can go. Some believe this is just the beginning.

As Reuters highlights, the rally is likely the combination of a couple of factors. Tesla announced favorable fourth quarter financials last week but more so, battery partner Panasonic on Monday revealed that its battery venture with Tesla was in the black for the first time.

LG Chem and Chinese battery giant CATL also signed deals with Tesla over the past week, signaling the end of its exclusive agreement with Panasonic. CATL’s deal runs from July 2020 through June 2022 according to Reuters.

Tesla’s late rally has pushed the company’s market cap north of $165 billion.

Investor Ron Baron recently appeared on an episode of CNBC’s Squawk Box to discuss the stock’s surge. That full interview with host Rebecca Quick can be viewed above.

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BadThad

Posts: 449   +422
BAH! High debt and new, fierce competition from the big automakers will eventually bring this stock into reality.
 

umbala

Posts: 340   +434
BAH! High debt and new, fierce competition from the big automakers will eventually bring this stock into reality.
You sound like a short seller. Tesla's making a lot of effort to reduce debt and that's part of the reason the stock is surging. And fierce competition from big automakers? Yeah, keep dreaming. They all made big fancy announcements about many many different EV models... in the future. How many of those cars will actually materialize is yet to be seen. None of the big auto makers are taking EVs seriously.
 

MilwaukeeMike

Posts: 3,214   +1,467
You sound like a short seller. Tesla's making a lot of effort to reduce debt and that's part of the reason the stock is surging. And fierce competition from big automakers? Yeah, keep dreaming. They all made big fancy announcements about many many different EV models... in the future. How many of those cars will actually materialize is yet to be seen. None of the big auto makers are taking EVs seriously.
To quote WIRED magazine when talking about this exact same thing regarding the current major car makers being slow to adopt EV models. "It takes a long time to turn an aircraft carrier. But when you do, you have a freaking aircraft carrier!"

One thing people look at to see if a stock is over valued or under valued is the Price to Earnings Ratio. It's a measure of how much money is made per share. GM for example has one of 5.6. Ford's 22, Apple is 25, and Amazon's is 89! Telsa's is -180. So by standard measures they're overvalued.

I'm not a tesla hater. I have Tesla envy. I used to own their stock and sold it years ago when it was at $250, which back then seemed pretty good.

 

ShagnWagn

Posts: 1,297   +1,084
I sold all my tesla stock a few years back. Their forcing of self-wrecking cars at our safety risk is something I can't get behind. People have been killed directly because of it and they still continue to push it on us. Yes, I am still glad I sold my stock. The love of money over people's lives ends here.
 

wiyosaya

Posts: 5,789   +3,996
To quote WIRED magazine when talking about this exact same thing regarding the current major car makers being slow to adopt EV models. "It takes a long time to turn an aircraft carrier. But when you do, you have a freaking aircraft carrier!"
Exactly. It would, for all intents and purposes, be impossible for the existing automobile manufacturers to wave a magic wand and turn their factories into EV producing factories over night.
 

wiyosaya

Posts: 5,789   +3,996
I sold all my tesla stock a few years back. Their forcing of self-wrecking cars at our safety risk is something I can't get behind. People have been killed directly because of it and they still continue to push it on us. Yes, I am still glad I sold my stock. The love of money over people's lives ends here.
"Autopilot" can be turned off.
 

Plutoisaplanet

Posts: 404   +563
BAH! High debt and new, fierce competition from the big automakers will eventually bring this stock into reality.
Their debt is a fraction of their annual revenue. Plus about a third of it can be converted into equity, which at these stock prices are basically a guarantee that they won't have to pay out of pocket to close those loans out. Tesla also has over $6 billion in cash (roughly half of their debt) and has had positive free cash flow in 5 of the 6 last quarters with plans to use increase cash flow to pay off debt and pay for future capital expenditures (unlike past years). Just last quarter they had $1b of FCF, meaning their debt isn't a big deal.

Also, people have been saying competition is coming for years. The Chevy Bolt was supposed to be the Model 3 killer, which was introduced first, had a lower price, and has almost 250mi of range. Instead last year the Model 3 sold 12x what the Bolt sold. The Model 3 has outsold every other automaker's plug-in lines in the world for each of the last two years.

10 of the last 11 quarters were all time delivery records for Tesla. Fierce competition can appear all they want; there were like 5 EV SUVs introduced last year (Kia Niro Electric, Hyundai Kona EV, Audi e-tron, Mercedes-Benz EQC, and Jaguar I-Pace). Basically all of them are battery starved and half of them had production delays. And apparently not a single EV released by any legacy automaker matches the range of the Tesla Model S in 2012 (265mi). Today the Model S has over 380 miles of range.

The VW ID.3 is the only imminent vehicle I see that might do well long term (release slated for this summer). But it would take a long time for them to get their battery manufacturing spun up as it's their first mass market EV. VW tells us this will happen next year and they might be right, but they still have the battery cell constraint issue that every automaker is facing. Plus, the EV market as a whole is growing rapidly, begging the question: why would one EV's success mean another one will fail?
 
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EEatGDL

Posts: 762   +484
BAH! High debt and new, fierce competition from the big automakers will eventually bring this stock into reality.
I couldn't get if you were joking and quoting the short-sellers or for real your "own" words.

First: any asset with such volatility on any direction will have volatility in the opposite direction, that's the most probable outcome, regardless of any "reason" behind the retracement.

Now, back to Tesla: you may have your fundamentals, I have my fundamentals and trading game plan. I simply won't spend the energy enlisting mine, but in the mid-term (1-3 years) and long term almost all development areas will lead and excel. The competition is not really coming, because the competition is just buying components and outsourcing software development, just integrating, not much optimisation.
Also, the "competition" doesn't have the battery production to push BEVs out of the production line. Mercedes, Jaguar, and the others forgot to secure batteries, because apparently they forgot BEVs use them.

The list can go on and on about supercharging network, car value, car raw cost, future battery and powertrain technologies, core efficiency, real dataset for training the NNs, etc. That's the list I'm too lazy to develop so that you can read 10% of it and reply with a stupid one line statement.
 

poohbear

Posts: 614   +519
When Elon Musk bought those battery factories and battery company a couple of years ago he was ridiculed & laughed at. Tesla stock plummeted. I remember because I had Tesla stock at the time. Now, it turns out that to have proper EV production on a mass scale...u need those batteries. Which none of the "competition" has because they never invested in battery production, they were too busy laughing at Elon Musk.

Who's laughing now?
 

Michiel

Posts: 67   +35
I sold all my tesla stock a few years back. Their forcing of self-wrecking cars at our safety risk is something I can't get behind. People have been killed directly because of it and they still continue to push it on us. Yes, I am still glad I sold my stock. The love of money over people's lives ends here.

You do realize people get killed by humans driving cars all the time right?
 

DZillaXx

Posts: 219   +325
I sold all my tesla stock a few years back. Their forcing of self-wrecking cars at our safety risk is something I can't get behind. People have been killed directly because of it and they still continue to push it on us. Yes, I am still glad I sold my stock. The love of money over people's lives ends here.

I'd take the few deaths every decade from software bugs over the thousands of deaths every year from actual humans. It is impossible to see everything going on around you, a human will never be a perfect driver and always has risk. Taking the human out of the equation is the only way to start bringing those numbers down.

I had a good friend die 3 years ago in a accident. Truck driver going to fast shifted lanes right into their truck. Killed 3 good people. If the Truck had the Tech that the Tesla had, and was using it. They would be alive right now.

Driving assists and autonomous driving will be the sole reason for turning thousands of deaths each year into a single or double digit number.

The next two decades are going to be exciting. If only the Power Grid can be upgraded to handle the rapid transition, and charging stations become a standard in every city.
 

Nobina

Posts: 2,993   +2,780
I'd take the few deaths every decade from software bugs over the thousands of deaths every year from actual humans. It is impossible to see everything going on around you, a human will never be a perfect driver and always has risk. Taking the human out of the equation is the only way to start bringing those numbers down.

I had a good friend die 3 years ago in a accident. Truck driver going to fast shifted lanes right into their truck. Killed 3 good people. If the Truck had the Tech that the Tesla had, and was using it. They would be alive right now.

Driving assists and autonomous driving will be the sole reason for turning thousands of deaths each year into a single or double digit number.

The next two decades are going to be exciting. If only the Power Grid can be upgraded to handle the rapid transition, and charging stations become a standard in every city.
In reality, you won't take the human out of the equation. The software is flawed, made by humans who also won't be willing to let go of the control of the vehicle and have faith in a machine.

You don't know whether Teslas tech would save those people and you just assume that every car will be a Tesla in the future which is nonsense. Car manufacturers will have to make their software work together with one another for it to work seamlessly.
 

ShagnWagn

Posts: 1,297   +1,084
You do realize people get killed by humans driving cars all the time right?

You do realize people get killed by these self-wrecking cars right? You have been duped by basic math. You can't compare a few thousand of these versus several BILLION cars driven DAILY all across the world - in REAL WORLD situations. Multiply how many of these cars are being driven by cars in the world. Then multiply that exponentially by how many times more difficult the different weather, unmarked roads, foreign obstacles falling off vehicles, uneven and varying terrain and traction, mechanical failures, etc etc. Billions of unique obstacles every single day, of which change. You can't program for this. Even if you try, it is all REACTIVE and not proactive. Humans can predict things that will happen. You cannot do this with a computer. Then there is the whole death by computer rather than people that you can forgive. People make mistakes. You think as though computers don't - they do what they are programmed to do. This does not include human preservation and the fear of death. Computers don't care about death.

I'd take the few deaths every decade from software bugs over the thousands of deaths every year from actual humans. It is impossible to see everything going on around you, a human will never be a perfect driver and always has risk. Taking the human out of the equation is the only way to start bringing those numbers down.

I had a good friend die 3 years ago in a accident. Truck driver going to fast shifted lanes right into their truck. Killed 3 good people. If the Truck had the Tech that the Tesla had, and was using it. They would be alive right now.

Driving assists and autonomous driving will be the sole reason for turning thousands of deaths each year into a single or double digit number.

The next two decades are going to be exciting. If only the Power Grid can be upgraded to handle the rapid transition, and charging stations become a standard in every city.

"If the Truck had the Tech that the Tesla had, and was using it. They would be alive right now."

First I would like to express my condolences for your friend's death. You shouldn't place your trust in technology. Please, do provide this evidence. Prove that this would never ever happen in any circumstance ever again. Go ahead, we'll be waiting. Hint: You can't.

You need to quit forcing your failed technology on people. This is what democrats try to do. I bet you would have said that lady crossing the street would never have been killed. Well, here we are. I bet you also would have claimed nobody would ever been killed by a highway divider again. Well, here we are. I bet you also... well you get the point. Every time someone gets killed by one of these, you know what? It would happen every single time in the same situation. You know why? If you know how computer work you would. They follow the same instructions every time. You would be dead have you had been that lady crossing the street. your child would be too. Every person in the world would have. We are past due for a multi-billion dollar class action lawsuit.
 

Markoni35

Posts: 1,025   +411
This is all artificial stock pumping up. There's nothing real about those billions. They as easily deflate as they inflated. It's enough that someone starts selling that ****, to get actual real money, and the entire balloon deflates with a big long smelly fart.

Stocks started as a great way to finance companies, but turned into a virus that is destroying the world. Same as money, whether fiat or crypto, same thing. If it's not based on a physical value, then it's virtual. And that means worthless.
 

wiyosaya

Posts: 5,789   +3,996
The next two decades are going to be exciting. If only the Power Grid can be upgraded to handle the rapid transition, and charging stations become a standard in every city.
I know people think this, but have a look at this which was published in 2010 already - http://energyenvironment.pnnl.gov/ei/pdf/Impact Assessment of PHEV on US Power Grid.pdf
Previous work has shown that the existing US generation and transmission infrastructures have the technical potential to supply power to 73% of the U.S. light duty vehicle (LDV) fleet [1]. The level of 73% is a national average, with the actual values varying significantly by regions.

 

wiyosaya

Posts: 5,789   +3,996
This is all artificial stock pumping up. There's nothing real about those billions. They as easily deflate as they inflated. It's enough that someone starts selling that ****, to get actual real money, and the entire balloon deflates with a big long smelly fart.

Stocks started as a great way to finance companies, but turned into a virus that is destroying the world. Same as money, whether fiat or crypto, same thing. If it's not based on a physical value, then it's virtual. And that means worthless.
This. The sheep are bleating.
 

ShagnWagn

Posts: 1,297   +1,084
Demonize much or do you just enjoy fostering more division?

Can't argue with the facts. Can't demonize demons if they already are. :) Encouraging death is pretty demonic in my eyes. Killing the unborn and in the same breath protecting mass murders... I guess I didn't really need to state fact, but so many are so blind. You're right.
 

DZillaXx

Posts: 219   +325
You do realize people get killed by these self-wrecking cars right? You have been duped by basic math. You can't compare a few thousand of these versus several BILLION cars driven DAILY all across the world - in REAL WORLD situations. Multiply how many of these cars are being driven by cars in the world. Then multiply that exponentially by how many times more difficult the different weather, unmarked roads, foreign obstacles falling off vehicles, uneven and varying terrain and traction, mechanical failures, etc etc. Billions of unique obstacles every single day, of which change. You can't program for this. Even if you try, it is all REACTIVE and not proactive. Humans can predict things that will happen. You cannot do this with a computer. Then there is the whole death by computer rather than people that you can forgive. People make mistakes. You think as though computers don't - they do what they are programmed to do. This does not include human preservation and the fear of death. Computers don't care about death.



"If the Truck had the Tech that the Tesla had, and was using it. They would be alive right now."

First I would like to express my condolences for your friend's death. You shouldn't place your trust in technology. Please, do provide this evidence. Prove that this would never ever happen in any circumstance ever again. Go ahead, we'll be waiting. Hint: You can't.

You need to quit forcing your failed technology on people. This is what democrats try to do. I bet you would have said that lady crossing the street would never have been killed. Well, here we are. I bet you also would have claimed nobody would ever been killed by a highway divider again. Well, here we are. I bet you also... well you get the point. Every time someone gets killed by one of these, you know what? It would happen every single time in the same situation. You know why? If you know how computer work you would. They follow the same instructions every time. You would be dead have you had been that lady crossing the street. your child would be too. Every person in the world would have. We are past due for a multi-billion dollar class action lawsuit.

See the issue here is for decades manufactures tried to get people to drive safer. It doesn't work. That's why designing a product to Fail Safely has been the new model. Accidents will never stop happening, and a human at the wheel is not going to make the best split second decisions to allow a product to fail is the most safe way. Humans get scared, they lock up, they don't always think right when the moment goes down. Don't think for a second that when your life is in danger you will be able to act.

Many cars on the road today have lane assists and little warning lights to notify the driver that there are drivers next to them. But only a few of those will keep you in your lane or from hitting someone else. My Term of the tech that Tesla uses is industry wide. Tesla just happens to be use one that is talked about for using it the most.

If someone dies because of a bug or computer glitch, or perimeters that were not considered. The tech is changed to make it better. Every fail is a chance to make it better. Having someone to blame doesn't mean a death doesnt happen. We've had over 100 years of Human fails while driving and the lessons we've learned are largely, humans shouldn't drive.

Automation will lower death counts by the thousands. That is not even debatable. Sure it wont get rid of it. But anything that saves lives are worth it by me. While writing this, someone has died in a car accident. This doesn't need to be the case.

Nice thing about all of this, the roads we drive on are public. When they decide that certain forms of automation as required to drive on certain roads. There is nothing you can do about it.
 

ShagnWagn

Posts: 1,297   +1,084
See the issue here is for decades manufactures tried to get people to drive safer. It doesn't work. That's why designing a product to Fail Safely has been the new model. Accidents will never stop happening, and a human at the wheel is not going to make the best split second decisions to allow a product to fail is the most safe way. Humans get scared, they lock up, they don't always think right when the moment goes down. Don't think for a second that when your life is in danger you will be able to act.

Many cars on the road today have lane assists and little warning lights to notify the driver that there are drivers next to them. But only a few of those will keep you in your lane or from hitting someone else. My Term of the tech that Tesla uses is industry wide. Tesla just happens to be use one that is talked about for using it the most.

If someone dies because of a bug or computer glitch, or perimeters that were not considered. The tech is changed to make it better. Every fail is a chance to make it better. Having someone to blame doesn't mean a death doesnt happen. We've had over 100 years of Human fails while driving and the lessons we've learned are largely, humans shouldn't drive.

Automation will lower death counts by the thousands. That is not even debatable. Sure it wont get rid of it. But anything that saves lives are worth it by me. While writing this, someone has died in a car accident. This doesn't need to be the case.

Nice thing about all of this, the roads we drive on are public. When they decide that certain forms of automation as required to drive on certain roads. There is nothing you can do about it.

The problem is not that manufacturers have tried. It's that anybody and everybody is allowed to. I've gone in for the written test and the people working at the DMV gave the answers to a person that didn't know what signs mean and that couldn't even speak English. This is the core problem. People need to pass a driving test, and repeatedly - not just once a lifetime. If you can't pass being able to follow basics and how to avoid obstacles, you know what? You don't pass. This will take accidents way down. Nobody can't bother to let them know not to hit the brakes when hydroplaning. I have a classroom of college students that didn't know this. This is the parent's fault, and lack of driving education.

Adding more and more assists just compound the problem. These "assists" they've added give so many false alarms it's ridiculous. Then these systems failure to do any corrective action. It is laughable and added to making the driver react inappropriately. This has added danger to driving. Case in point? The f'in turn signal lights in the side mirrors they added when I drive up to them is ILLEGAL. When I'm pulling up on a car this false indicator light makes me brace for someone to side swipe me. Tell all of these "assists" to the drivers of the tesla cars that have died. Oh wait...

"If someone dies because of a bug or computer glitch, or perimeters that were not considered."
I think you meant "parameters". as I mentioned, there are billions/trillions of variables of driving every day. You cannot program for them. How about we put you in the passenger seat of one of these going around a mountain curve and simulate a sensor error? Are you prepared for that?

You cannot say automation will "lower deaths by the thousands". lol. You have no idea. Are you a prophet or something? I'm sorry, but you have lost credibility with trying to predict the future. Kinda like we should all have flying cars by now? ;) That's ok, computers can't predict either. haha. Let alone be proactive on avoiding accidents.

Yes, there is something I can do about trying to take away my freedom of driving. I am doing it right now with this post, if you haven't noticed. I can also vote. I can also protest. I can also, etc etc. I wonder who this "they" will be who force us off the roads. Greased palms of politicians. People can't even maintain the tires or even change the oil on their cars. You think they are going to maintain these? lol. Go ahead, take away vehicle ownership. I'm sure we can all afford someone else to do it for us. And you know someone else doing it is always perfect? I can't wait for the time this happens and it pulls up when the last person puked in it. I can go on and on. lol