GPU Pricing Update, April 2023: Is the Nvidia RTX 4070 Another Flop?

[KofeViR]

That's not really true though. Annoyingly, the 6800 / 6800XT still make a lot of sense in the current market. Maybe they'll tick down by another $20 when the 4060 cards come out, but they're already priced to where the market says they should be for the performance.

Gen to gen has nothing to do with this. It's cards from different brackets. The point of a new gen is to deliver more performance at less power. Obviously flagship should be much faster than last gen flagship as well.

4090 is ~75% faster than 3090 at 4K. This is a decent jump. You want 50% increase - or more - when buying a new GPU.

People act like AMD don't need 7800XT + 7800 because last gen cards can counter 4070. This is BS. 6800XT uses at least 50% more power than 4070 while delivering same performance and has less + worse features and mediocre RT perf.

This is not how you move forward. Nvidia can counter 7900XT with 3090 Ti as well, pointless tho...

AMD can't compete with lower end 4000 series using price cuts on last gen cards. They need new stuff. Lower watt parts. With smaller footprint.

4070 is a lower mid-end tier card. AMD needs a last gen high-end SKU to counter it.

6800XT = uses way more power, much bigger cards and way more noisy, this is why it's slightly cheaper. 3 year old tech.

AMD needs to put out 7800 series ASAP.

However they probably want to sell the remaining last gen cards first, just like Nvidia (this is why prices are high on 4000 series - same with 7900 series).

I will eat my hat if 7900XTX is not below 800 dollars by the end of the year.
When 4080 Ti comes out, Nvidia drops 4080 below 1000 dollars for sure. Maybe even 899. (4090 Ti probably 1999 dollars, after 4080 Ti sometime)

4070 Ti will drop to 699, 7900XT should be 699 tops as well at this point. If AMD actually want to sell alot of cards, they should price it at 649 and undercut 4070 Ti by 50 dollars.

AMD can do nothing else than lower prices, because Nvidia can beat 7900XTX easily, which is the flagship from AMD this gen. Well 7950XTX might come, it will just be the same, running at higher clockspeed. Custom 7900XTXs already does this.

4090 Ti, 4090 and 4080 Ti will all soundly beat 7900XTX, yes for more money, many people don't care tho. People that splash 1000-2000 dollars on a GPU don't care.

4080 performs on par with 7900XTX.

Even AMD said it would be pointless to try and compete with 4090. They have nothing. Outside of pricedrops.

 

[Q Wales]

Is this a 1974 Mercedes 450SL for *twenty-four thousand dollars*?

 

[jimmy12]

People act like AMD don't need 7800XT + 7800 because last gen cards can counter 4070. This is BS. 6800XT uses at least 50% more power than 4070 while delivering same performance and has less + worse features and mediocre RT perf.

That's why consumers need AMD to step up at the lower tiers. I'm sure AMD is stoked that they can get more mileage out of 7nm instead of having their own products eat each other for 4nm/5nm allocation.

 

[KofeViR]

That's why consumers need AMD to step up at the lower tiers. I'm sure AMD is stoked that they can get more mileage out of 7nm instead of having their own products eat each other for 4nm/5nm allocation.

Yeah but this is why AMD GPUs are doing worse than ever. Low priority.

AMD's GPU Market Share Drops to 22 Year+ Low in Q3 22: NVIDIA Controls Nears the Entire Graphics Card Market | Hardware Times

AMD’s graphics card market has been in a slump of late. In fact, the Radeon share dipped to an all-time low of 10% last quarter, a reminiscence of the 2017-18 post-mining hangover. NVIDIA, on the other hand, gained ample market share through the last few quarters despite falling prices (and...

www.hardwaretimes.com

Also, AMD soon drops below the 10% mark on Steam Hardware Survey.

...and people think AMD competes perfectly fine in the GPU market?

I am starting to miss ATi. I hope AMD wakes up soon.

 

[jimmy12]

I don't disagree. In a perfect world AMD would step up in GPU instead of treading water. But they're not, consumer/AMD interests are not in alignment when it comes to GPU. Arc 2.0 to the rescue. Maybe Arc 3.0.

 

[Threadcount]

People act like AMD don't need 7800XT + 7800 because last gen cards can counter 4070. This is BS. 6800XT uses at least 50% more power than 4070 while delivering same performance and has less + worse features and mediocre RT perf.

Well you just said it yourself, "delivering same performance" so people don't really care about the 5 people you know who got the card, people care about actual numbers and what makes sense for them, and having 16g VRAM just makes sense, not everyone cares about RT or DLSS, maybe stop trying to justify this card and stick to the topic(its not selling well), you have been on an anti AMD rant all across this website promoting this card and slamming everyone with a 6800XT or "3rd gen tech as you put it" it is still a relevant card today.

 

[KofeViR]

Well you just said it yourself, "delivering same performance" so people don't really care about the 5 people you know who got the card, people care about actual numbers and what makes sense for them, and having 16g VRAM just makes sense, not everyone cares about RT or DLSS, maybe stop trying to justify this card and stick to the topic(its not selling well), you have been on an anti AMD rant all across this website promoting this card and slamming everyone with a 6800XT or "3rd gen tech as you put it" it is still a relevant card today.

People care about power usage and heat in their room. Buying a last gen card with high power usage, will make the savings vanish over time. Electricity is still expensive in many countries.

Also, try putting a 6800XT in a small build. Then a 4070 after. You will see what I mean. Small builds are very popular. Heat is a big problem.

No-one cares about 3 year old tech. They want new stuff, when they splash. You are in denial, probably a 6800XT owner, who cares. Why are you butthurt because 4070 beats 6800XT by 1% while consuming just 200 watts? The card is selling just fine. Sells way better than everything from AMD currently.

Having 16GB VRAM makes no difference, when the GPU is too weak to max out games anyway. Alot of VRAM never saved a weak GPU over time. You need to lower settings to make games run well, and when you do that, VRAM usage lowers as well.

4070 was the topseller at Mindfactory and you claim it's not selling? LMAO!
Look at Amazon top gpu sales, it has tons of 4070 and 4070 Ti listed.

Amazon Best Sellers: Best Computer Graphics Cards

Discover the best Computer Graphics Cards in Best Sellers. Find the top 100 most popular items in Amazon Computers & Accessories Best Sellers.

www.amazon.com

Only a pure AMD fanboy would claim 4070 is not selling.

6800XT is nr. 29 on that list...
Nvidia dominate the top 25.

But sure, you can act like AMD is doing well in the GPU segment, while Nvidia closes in on 85% dGPU marketshare on Steam... I guess whatever AMD is doing works...

If AMD keeps this up, they will be sub 10% in a year or two. AMD is the cheaper alternative to Nvidia. With same pricing, or relying on old cards, they will fail bigtime. People vote with their wallets, which is why AMD is doing worse than ever. Almost NO-ONE outside of tech people will even consider buying an AMD GPU. It's Nvidia or nothing. Sad but true. This is AMDs big problem.

AGAIN, stop calling me Nvidia fanboy when I want a 7900XTX LMAO... It's just fact that AMD is doing BADLY in the GPU space and when they lower prices, I will pick up a 7900XTX. Not paying 1000 dollars for it. High prices is EXACTLY WHY AMD is not doing good. Look at AMDs best selling GPUs in the last 10 years, some still present on Steam HW Survey, all cheaper cards with very good value, like RX580/570/480/470, 5700XT etc.

AMD can't ask Nvidia prices. They simply won't sell any GPUs if they do.

 

[Watzupken]

I think you need to go do your own research on the TSMC pricing subject.

Yes they raised prices, no where near the hikes you've recently seen.

I can dig it out but TSMC do release pricing for wafers of each node. All said and done, a 7950X costs (to make) around £80. They sell for £750.

I'm just saying, TSMC isn't fully to blame here, the likes of AMD and Nvidia blamed their massive price hikes on TSMC but it's mostly a lie.

I don't think this is full picture of the cost of a chip. The fab cost is only part of it. You mean the designing of the chip just appears out of thin air and TSMC just manufactures the chip? The chip will then teleport to your home? Clearly there are many other costs that people don't consider. So I won't jump to conclusion that these companies are making 90% profit margin.

 

[waclark]

"Such low level of interest has surprised us a little as the 4070 is one of the better value cards on the market right now, but it seems that the PC community isn't interested in a new GPU just being slightly or somewhat better value than existing options; that isn't good enough and it's going to take a really compelling product offering outstanding value for things to pick up again."

Because its still a terrible value overall. I paid $600 for my EVGA 1080ti Hybrid back in the day - and I thought that was a massive splurge at the time. Now they want that for a xx70 series, air-cooled card? No thanks.

Curious to know how the 1080 stacks up against the 4070. If, for a moment, you set aside product names, which GPU delivers more performance? Honestly, if you paid $600 in 2017 that would equate to $745 in today's dollars. That would seem to make the 4070 a better buy, perhaps?

 

[Burty117]

I don't think this is full picture of the cost of a chip. The fab cost is only part of it. You mean the designing of the chip just appears out of thin air and TSMC just manufactures the chip? The chip will then teleport to your home? Clearly there are many other costs that people don't consider. So I won't jump to conclusion that these companies are making 90% profit margin.

Oh absolutely, completely agree the price is much higher. I was responding to a comment about TSMC being blamed for the recent price hikes and I was giving evidence, that's not true.

Designing, testing, R&D, marketing, support, software development, soo much goes into it.

Purely blaming TSMC on the price hikes as of late (Nvidia claim the reason all their cards have effectively doubled in price is because of TSMC) is just not accurate at all.

 

[waclark]

You're saying the 4070 is "selling"?? Are you really reading this article??

It plains states: "The bad news for Nvidia, which is good news for consumers, is that the RTX 4070 is selling badly even at the MSRP. "....!!!!!!

Try reading the article again before posting.

They are kind of basing that on inventory, which isn't necessarily the best way to determine sales stats. Per Tech Epiphany, the 4070 is top of the chart in sales, by a fairly wide margin. Now, that doesn't mean it's selling "well", it's just outselling everything else, as of today. Next week or next month that could all change.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1649321427277946881

 

[waclark]

Is this a 1974 Mercedes 450SL for *twenty-four thousand dollars*?

Cars are different, some have collector value. GPUs, not so much.

 

[waclark]

Really hope these things rot in a warehouse.
600$ for mid range - just no.
Nvidia and AMD are doing a fine job building up the console market.
Games wise beyond online multiplayer what offering does PC have that can’t be had from a PS5 Xbox series ?

Game-wise, mostly nothing except maybe upgradability. But, if you're like most of us, you need to do more than game and that's where the PC tends to pull ahead, in my opinion.

 

[neeyik]

Per Tech Epiphany, the 4070 is top of the chart in sales, by a fairly wide margin.

Do bear in mind that those figures are specifically for Mindfactory, an online retailer in Germany.

 

[waclark]

@Techspot I would love to see you guys do an in-depth analysis of what you think these cards cost to make. I know it's probably not a trivial exercise, but I'd like to understand where these cards could be priced. We all assume that they could be cheaper, but how much cheaper? They may cost a lot to manufacture, and whether that's AMD/Nvidia's fault would depend on their design choices.

 

[waclark]

Do bear in mind that those figures are specifically for Mindfactory, an online retailer in Germany.

Fair enough, I didn't spend the time to determine their source. And, I'm not so sure there is one good single source for that info. I don't think Nvidia nor AMD are very forthcoming for that info.

 

[neeyik]

@Techspot I would love to see you guys do an in-depth analysis of what you think these cards cost to make. I know it's probably not a trivial exercise, but I'd like to understand where these cards could be priced. We all assume that they could be cheaper, but how much cheaper? They may cost a lot to manufacture, and whether that's AMD/Nvidia's fault would depend on their design choices.

Anything like that is very hard to do, simply because there's so little concrete information publicly available, and few vendors (if any at all) are going to be forthcoming about such information. My own back-of-a-napkin estimates put the profit margins at anywhere between $100 to $700, depending on the vendor and model -- some of this was estimated through going through public info, the rest garnered over the years by talking to, and working with, various people in the associated industries.

So yes, modern graphics cards could be a whole lot cheaper, but no GPU vendor is going to do it -- third-party add-in board manufacturers have pretty low operating margins, and they're not going to cut into that any further than they have to. Intel currently makes a loss in its graphics division and AMD doesn't make a huge profit either (with the bulk of that sector's revenue coming from console APUs). Only Nvidia has a big operating margin, though that varies enormously, depending on what quarter one examines -- it doesn't break down its margins by sector, only revenue.

We're not going to see graphics cards drop significantly in price any time soon, if ever, for three reasons: (1) if sales are reaching expected targets, then vendors have no call to lower prices; (2) if sales aren't reaching targets, but aren't way off, then keeping the prices high will still generate sufficient revenue. Both AMD and Nvidia increased the price tags for the new generation of models in part because they expected sale figures to be lower, due to shrinking economies and a continued decline in PC shipping (3) if sales don't get anywhere near targets, the companies are more likely to simply absorb losses until the market improves, as per Intel. Or, in the case of AIBs, just bail out altogether, a la EVGA.

 

[m3tavision]

People care about power usage and heat in their room. Buying a last gen card with high power usage, will make the savings vanish over time. Electricity is still expensive in many countries.

Also, try putting a 6800XT in a small build. Then a 4070 after. You will see what I mean. Small builds are very popular. Heat is a big problem.

No-one cares about 3 year old tech. They want new stuff, when they splash. You are in denial, probably a 6800XT owner, who cares. Why are you butthurt because 4070 beats 6800XT by 1% while consuming just 200 watts? The card is selling just fine. Sells way better than everything from AMD currently.

Having 16GB VRAM makes no difference, when the GPU is too weak to max out games anyway. Alot of VRAM never saved a weak GPU over time. You need to lower settings to make games run well, and when you do that, VRAM usage lowers as well.

4070 was the topseller at Mindfactory and you claim it's not selling? LMAO!
Look at Amazon top gpu sales, it has tons of 4070 and 4070 Ti listed.

Amazon Best Sellers: Best Computer Graphics Cards

Discover the best Computer Graphics Cards in Best Sellers. Find the top 100 most popular items in Amazon Computers & Accessories Best Sellers.

www.amazon.com

Only a pure AMD fanboy would claim 4070 is not selling.

6800XT is nr. 29 on that list...
Nvidia dominate the top 25.

But sure, you can act like AMD is doing well in the GPU segment, while Nvidia closes in on 85% dGPU marketshare on Steam... I guess whatever AMD is doing works...

If AMD keeps this up, they will be sub 10% in a year or two. AMD is the cheaper alternative to Nvidia. With same pricing, or relying on old cards, they will fail bigtime. People vote with their wallets, which is why AMD is doing worse than ever. Almost NO-ONE outside of tech people will even consider buying an AMD GPU. It's Nvidia or nothing. Sad but true. This is AMDs big problem.

AGAIN, stop calling me Nvidia fanboy when I want a 7900XTX LMAO... It's just fact that AMD is doing BADLY in the GPU space and when they lower prices, I will pick up a 7900XTX. Not paying 1000 dollars for it. High prices is EXACTLY WHY AMD is not doing good. Look at AMDs best selling GPUs in the last 10 years, some still present on Steam HW Survey, all cheaper cards with very good value, like RX580/570/480/470, 5700XT etc.

AMD can't ask Nvidia prices. They simply won't sell any GPUs if they do.

Oh lord, someone opened up a koolaid stand^

No, the RTX4070 is NOT selling well... (poor performance) and if you friends purchased a 4070 over a 6950XT and they are Gamers, then those friends certainly not buying it for price/performance... but more like to join a cheerleading club. Bcz AMD price/performance is extremely hard to beat.

7 days later....

 

[Loadedaxe]

I know at least 5 people IRL that picked one up so far, I bet the 4070 will show up on Steam HW Survey in bigger numbers than the entire AMD 7900 series in 3-6 months.

4070 is selling just fine, availablity is just high, this is why Nvidia reduces it now. They wanted to deliver a bunch on release, better than AMDs paper lauching yeah?

I cant tell if your trolling or you just have friends that aren't smart with their money. And five of them? ..... Oh Lord

No one in their right mind would pay MSRP for a 4070 when there are much better options.

 

[Julnor]

$600 isn't a value range product. Half and under that is where value becomes a consideration.

If I'm spending $600+ on something I want it to be a high quality item, the best at what it does, a very premium experience. At that point I'll just spend more than that to make sure it's something that I will be happy with for at least several years, longer, probably until it reaches its natural end of life.

For tech that's not generally a value proposition because electronics are designed to fail and especially for tech obsolescence is only a few years away. Hence most people buy mid-range with the idea of it being disposable and a few years later being replaces. They still want years out of it, but they won't expect it to last over half a decade or so.

The number of people that swap out yearly or even bi-yearly is a very small fraction of the overall consumer base. Most people just buy a console or build a PC and then don't even think about it again for 5+ years. A mid-range/budget GPU they might swap out 2-3 years if it's cheap and because it's easy, and if generational improvements are large enough to justify that. And that means not gimmicks like RTX or DLSS that don't even work on budget options anyway and people have to use marketing speak to try and pressure average people into caring. Most people don't care how fancy the graphics are they care if the game is fun, Smash Bros. and Animal Crossing are so much more popular than Forespoken or Godsworn or whatever other big graphic tech demo game the industry is trying to shove down people's throats.

 

[m3tavision]

When was the last time we seen an FULL ON -(twenty game)- Raster Review*...?
Max everything at 1080p/1440p/4k...!

Thats it^ (The creme dele creme of the top 20 dGPU in the top 20 games)
Throw the best these games have to offer currently... and let the Consumer drivel and nibble and min/max the meta data themselves...



*no upscaling, no vsync, no rt, etc.

 

[curreyj]

4070 uses 200 watts in gaming (50-60% less than 3080 and 6800XT) while delivering same perf, I don't want one, but I understand why it's selling.

It's a good card for small case builders. You don't want a 300-350 watt GPU in a small case...

Yes, exactly- why I bought the 4070 already- this is the most powerful 2 fan card available. When, if, I go to a 13", 3 fan, 350 watt card I will be going to a new case, AM5, DDR5 rig. What this does for me now, is postpone all that for a couple or 3 more years.

 

[KofeViR]

Yes, exactly- why I bought the 4070 already- this is the most powerful 2 fan card available. When, if, I go to a 13", 3 fan, 350 watt card I will be going to a new case, AM5, DDR5 rig. What this does for me now, is postpone all that for a couple or 3 more years.

Yes and electricity is still expensive in many countries, meaning that the savings will be eaten up buying a last gen high-end card instead of a newer - more efficient - mid-end card.

 

[KofeViR]

I cant tell if your trolling or you just have friends that aren't smart with their money. And five of them? ..... Oh Lord

No one in their right mind would pay MSRP for a 4070 when there are much better options.

There's not better options for people with small builds that have expensive electricity. AMD has nothing close to 4070 in terms of perf per watt.

4070 delivers 6800XT/3080 performance or more, at 200 watts and with better features (DLSS3 is a lifesaver for many that enjoy RT or just wants to bump performance)

A custom 6900XT hits like 400 watts in gaming compard to 4070's 200 watts.

 

[KofeViR]

Oh lord, someone opened up a koolaid stand^

No, the RTX4070 is NOT selling well... (poor performance) and if you friends purchased a 4070 over a 6950XT and they are Gamers, then those friends certainly not buying it for price/performance... but more like to join a cheerleading club. Bcz AMD price/performance is extremely hard to beat.

7 days later....

What Nvidia considers "not selling well" would be a dream for AMD.
This is why Nvidia sits at 85% dGPU marketshare and AMD barely competes.

6950XT uses like 400 watts avg in gaming, people that want a efficient card, won't look at that for a second.