Ireland to eliminate "Double Irish" loophole favored by many tech companies

By Shawn Knight
Oct 14, 2014
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  1. Ireland is known for awesome pubs and a deep talent pool of programmers but that isn't what has attracted some of the largest technology companies to the region. Leaders in Ireland have revealed plans to eliminate the controversial tax loophole...

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  2. tomkaten

    tomkaten TS Addict Posts: 183   +83

    It's sad how governments go after the small time tax payers while allowing these billion-dollar companies dodge their local responsibilities through shady off-shores. It's just the kind of world we live in...
  3. davislane1

    davislane1 TS Evangelist Posts: 3,391   +2,175

    It will be interesting to see how this impacts Ireland's tax revenue (the applicable portion of it) over the next ten years.
  4. Mr Majestyk

    Mr Majestyk TS Enthusiast Posts: 34   +10

    What a sick joke, giving them another 6 years of rorts . We are talking tens of billions of dollars in tax, yet theses scumbag politicians will scream blue murder about spending a few million on some good cause and complain they don't have the money.
  5. VitalyT

    VitalyT Russ-Puss Posts: 3,114   +1,379

    So, by 2020 we will be so dead!!! Or maybe they gave so much time to come up with a different loophole.

    Anyway, if those corporations leave us, it will be a total disaster for the country.

    Our government in Ireland is becoming less and less popular. Just last week, about 100,000 came out to protest against charges for water, which for Ireland's overall population of 5m is huge!
    Mattrixx likes this.
  6. BlueDrake

    BlueDrake TS Evangelist Posts: 346   +101

    Already charging us for water in Canada, which is just stupid given the situation. Can they really give a good reason? No of course not, just it's better to start taxing anything. Keep people poor and then segregate them into areas, so they know you're within their grasp.
  7. VitalyT

    VitalyT Russ-Puss Posts: 3,114   +1,379

    Yeah, and given that:

    1. Money will go into a private account;
    2. Ireland is an island, with water all around it;

    This looks like a privately owned and outright corrupt government, as dumb as it is greedy.
  8. MilwaukeeMike

    MilwaukeeMike TS Evangelist Posts: 2,732   +1,097

    Of course they charge you for water. Why wouldn't they? They charge me for water, and I live next to a huge lake. You can't expect taxes to just cover things that people use drastically different amounts of. Is it fair to charge the same tax to a single person in a home as it is to charge their neighbor with 4 kids showering daily who fills his above-ground pool every summer and waters his lawn constantly?

    People rarely get audited. Companies do every year without fail. You don't hear about the IRS 'going after' a company often because they probably already have an office in their building and their auditors are there 3 months out of the year already anyway.

    Kudos to Ireland for stepping up and fixing the problem. These are American companies pulling this stunt and it's not like our govt was going to do anything about it. We did have a presidential candidate who wanted to put an end to stuff like this, but the other guy was smart enough to make friends with Zuckerberg (Facebook), Schmidt (Google) and Jobs (duh) before the last election and that bought them at least another 4 years of tropical tax shelters. Having every major tech company at your back doesn't hurt during an election either.
  9. Axle Greese

    Axle Greese TS Enthusiast Posts: 30

    I think any sum of money not paid by these technology companies to the Irish government is beneficial to the country. The government is financially incompetent and generates no wealth whereas Apple, Facebook and Google etc are financial competent and generate huge amounts of wealth. We all use their products. In any case, if the tax loophole was indeed the reason for technology companies to setup in Ireland then it might also be a good reason to layoff their employees and go elsewhere, preferably to New Zealand (heh... no seriously, please? ). The Irish don't need employment, wealth, and a thriving economy. They need only beer and potatoes.
    Mattrixx likes this.
  10. Mattrixx

    Mattrixx TS Rookie

    Thing is, the US has a 40% corporate tax rate, higher than any other nation. That is something plenty of companies can't handle and grow much. Tons of small private companies go out of business solely because of the taxes, and it stifles their growth. Most large companies only really start to grow only after they "outsource" their state of residence.
  11. tomkaten

    tomkaten TS Addict Posts: 183   +83

    Maybe small enterprises should lobby for more rights then. The situation is the same where I'm from, instead of supporting growth, the government does nothing but discourage start-ups, the mainstay of any healthy economy.

    Instituting insane taxes and then watching your most prized companies going to great lengths to avoid paying them does nothing for your economy. It's a delicate balance... Companies outsource to keep tax contributions low, which keeps the prices low and most of their customers happy, but it's borderline immoral whichever way you look at it IMO...

    It happens at all levels, though. Look at tennis players that make it big fleeing to tax havens... And I would probably do the same, in a country set to take away half my earnings or more.
  12. Win7Dev

    Win7Dev TS Evangelist Posts: 537   +152

    What they are doing is completely legal though. It's simply smart business practices.
    SNGX1275 likes this.
  13. SirGCal

    SirGCal TS Maniac Posts: 365   +136

    Ireland is smaller then some US states. Still they need their tax revenue also. But I've given up on any world government. They are all corrupt and self-serving anymore.

    But the US has charged for water as long as I can remember. And they pollute it with chlorine...
  14. Capaill

    Capaill TS Addict Posts: 280   +86

    Most (all?) of these companies are US companies. So why does the US government not enforce where the companies are allowed to register their taxes? Instead, the US government bitches and moans about how Ireland is stealing all their money. So Ireland bites the bullet and takes steps to close the "loophole". What then? The US companies will shift their taxation to the next country and the US will start bitching and moaning again.

    The US needs to fix it at the source and stop bullying smaller countries who are doing nothing illegal (according to international law).

    Regarding the new water charges that have been introduced to Ireland, yes, fine, Ireland is surrounded by water. But can you drink it? The charges are to finance the repair and update of a 100-year old system of distributing and cleaning the water, something that has never been done in any seriousness and is in dire need as it is currently believed that over 50% of the water being sent through the pipes never reaches the house. It's a choice between water charges or an increase in tax. And water charges are simply more fair.
  15. TorturedChaos

    TorturedChaos TechSpot Chancellor Posts: 828   +17

    I see no problem with companies taking advantage of every tax loophole they can find. The taxes on Corporations in the USA are outrageous. Payroll taxes for a small business owner alone are ridiculous. It cost me around $16-$17/hr to pay a $10/hr employee. After you take into account the 40/60% business matching on social security (that a business cant even draw....) and the matching of medicare and other social welfare BS I can't reap the rewards of since I work for my money. Then add on workman comp unemployment insurance, it really eats into what I can pay my employees. If I didn't have to pay so many taxes and fees on their wages I would happily pay my employees more. Many of them are worth it, but as a small business I can't afford to pay them what they are worth after all the taxes and fees.

    I write EVERYTHING off I can, and take very loophole avaiable to me so I don't have to shell 10's of thousands of dollars out of my pocket to uncle sam.
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2014
  16. What you describe is one of the primary reasons I decided not to grow my company. The hassle and cost made it so that I was disproportionately working for the Government rather than my company.

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