PayPal's new refund policy has sellers up in arms
- Thread starter Bubbajim
- Start date
SBKenn
Posts: 18 +5
Is it a matter of a survival strategy, or is it just greed ? As an almost 100% buyer, I still take the seller's interests into account. I will be actively seeking alternative payment systems EVERY time I buy.
OutlawCecil
Posts: 739 +570
The problem is, this is exactly how our justice system works as well. It's all honor system. If somebody says you did something, and you say you didn't, you're pretty much guilty based on their word alone if the evidence either way is lacking.
Well, give a middle finger to the buyer and add a 3% fee to every purchase to make up for the returns. Yes, the buyer will get their money back, but if (like myself) they really want the item, then they will have to pony up an extra 3% to get it. And just make it clear in every item for sale, "Due to eBay's policies, an extra 3% is automatically added to each and every sale."
Thank you Paypal for saving few thousands of € that I would have lost if you weren't protecting small buyers. I am tired of being manipulated by sellers who sell broken/fake stuff and then explained how it's normal that product doesn't work, and refund is impossible. Thank you Paypal for making it possible.
treetops
Posts: 3,064 +784
The post office records how much every package weighs. Someone could claim they never got the package. No wonder all these brick and mortar stores are thriving and online selling is all but dead... (Sarcasm)
JamesSWD
Posts: 331 +184
Sounds to me like there might be possible legal issues with PayPal doing this. That 2.9% commission they're keeping is based on the sales transaction. If the item is returned, then there's no sale and no justification for keeping the commission.
I wouldn't be surprised if some energetic attorney goes after this or tries to assemble a class action against PayPal.
I wouldn't be surprised if some energetic attorney goes after this or tries to assemble a class action against PayPal.
CybaGirl
Posts: 92 +36
I guess we will have to see what the "Australian Competition and Consumer Commission" says about this. They shut eBay down when they tried to make people use only PayPal as the payment method and removed all other payment methods.
So no doubt the ACCC will do something about this as well.
So no doubt the ACCC will do something about this as well.
OutlawCecil
Posts: 739 +570
Very doubtful. Everybody has the option to simply go with a different payment processor. By using Paypal, you agreed to their terms of service and thus, can't fight them on rules you agreed to.
CybaGirl
Posts: 92 +36
Yes that is very true. But the problem is you cannot remove PayPal as a payment option and because most people are in a hurry these days to get their goods they will choose to pay with PayPal as it's more or less an instant payment. As opposed to other payment methods such as direct deposit, paymate and other services and I think it's safe to say PayPal already know this.
The other question to ask is. If you do close your PayPal account does this affect your ability to sell on eBay as they don't allow you to remove PayPal as a payment option. So how would this work for someone who does not have a PayPal account?
Kind of makes sense now that Ebay has dumped PayPal for Adyen.
https://www.ebayinc.com/stories/news/ebay-to-intermediate-payments-on-its-marketplace-platform/
https://www.ebayinc.com/stories/news/ebay-to-intermediate-payments-on-its-marketplace-platform/
CybaGirl
Posts: 92 +36
From what I understand you will only be out of pocket for the initial $29.00.
What is the rest of the story. I have had hundreds pull that game over the years and NEVER lost a case when it showed delivered so I believe you are not telling the entire story..
You do know Ebay does not own Paypal anymore, Ebay is also getting away from Paypal in a couple of years Paypal will no longer be an accepted payment method on Ebay.
This is why when I sell I make sure to pay the extra to make it were they have to sign for it.
Yep! If it turns out to be true, then you know for sure that there is no humanity left in this world!
Bye bye Paypal. Too many other options available to deal with your greedy crap. Whatcha gonna do for money when everyone else starts closing accounts like you suggested we do if we disagree with your policy? Ooooo, maybe join Kmart and Toys R Us in the unemployment line!!
Whoa...I know I'm late to the game, but I just heard about this. I haven't used PayNow...err...I mean PayPal in a while, but lets look at something here....PayPal's net income per year (after tax) IN MILLIONS....
2014 = 419
2015 = 1,228
2016 = 1,41
2017 = 1,975
2018 = 2,077
Am I missing something here? How greedy can they get? (Dangerous question, I know). And, what added value did they put forth to justify this? It would have to be one heck of a tremendous value if you take into consideration the potential profit increase this move will bring them. This alone would bring in hundreds of millions of dollars per year.
Also, thinking on the legal side of things. The $0.30 transaction fee is understandable (even if they increased it a few points), but...the 2.9% is a commission/transaction fee based on the amount of the sale, but after the refund, the sale is ZERO!!!!! You can not be paid commission when there is no sale (or trust me, I would become a sales rep for any company willing to hire me, simply because I would get paid commission whether I sell product or not. I would work a deal out with friends to purchase something and then return it for full credit so I can get my commission. Sounds sleezy, right?!.... RIGHT PAYPAL???) Once product has been returned and the sale is refunded, the sale is no more, does not exist, ZERO dollars & ZERO cents. No more obligations between the seller and buyer. No one is ahead or behind. So, to me, that would mean PayPal is effectively committing theft? Stealing money right out of our hands. So we have Theft? Computer fraud? Wire fraud?
I see PayPal is listed on the BBB (Better Business Bureau). Oddly enough they have an A+ rating with 1 out of 5 stars based on 612 customer reviews. Not sure how that works.
Hey Amazon, here's your chance! Jump on it before someone else does!
Hey business owners out there...what would happen if you told your customers you were keeping 2.9% of their refund just because you wanted to??? Or because you want to give your CEO another 5mil a year raise and need to come up with the money somehow.
The would is getting out of hand. The little guy gets bent over once again while big businesses & corporations get away with this type of sh*t .
2014 = 419
2015 = 1,228
2016 = 1,41
2017 = 1,975
2018 = 2,077
Am I missing something here? How greedy can they get? (Dangerous question, I know). And, what added value did they put forth to justify this? It would have to be one heck of a tremendous value if you take into consideration the potential profit increase this move will bring them. This alone would bring in hundreds of millions of dollars per year.
Also, thinking on the legal side of things. The $0.30 transaction fee is understandable (even if they increased it a few points), but...the 2.9% is a commission/transaction fee based on the amount of the sale, but after the refund, the sale is ZERO!!!!! You can not be paid commission when there is no sale (or trust me, I would become a sales rep for any company willing to hire me, simply because I would get paid commission whether I sell product or not. I would work a deal out with friends to purchase something and then return it for full credit so I can get my commission. Sounds sleezy, right?!.... RIGHT PAYPAL???) Once product has been returned and the sale is refunded, the sale is no more, does not exist, ZERO dollars & ZERO cents. No more obligations between the seller and buyer. No one is ahead or behind. So, to me, that would mean PayPal is effectively committing theft? Stealing money right out of our hands. So we have Theft? Computer fraud? Wire fraud?
I see PayPal is listed on the BBB (Better Business Bureau). Oddly enough they have an A+ rating with 1 out of 5 stars based on 612 customer reviews. Not sure how that works.
Hey Amazon, here's your chance! Jump on it before someone else does!
Hey business owners out there...what would happen if you told your customers you were keeping 2.9% of their refund just because you wanted to??? Or because you want to give your CEO another 5mil a year raise and need to come up with the money somehow.
The would is getting out of hand. The little guy gets bent over once again while big businesses & corporations get away with this type of sh*t .
After years of using PayPal to accept combined millions in payments, I'm leaving them because of this. It costs way too much if you're selling high dollar items with small margins that people also might immediately change their minds on 30 seconds later. I got scammed out of $2.3k on a stolen item that ebay forced me to refund, I don't do international sales but paypal charged about a 5% fee because of how they paid, so I still owed PayPal $115 after being scammed $2.3k.
There's no reason why my business should now lose thousands more a year because of normal returns, scammers or immediately refunded payments because of errors by the purchaser. If I sell a defective product....maybe, but I believe this to be immoral and there are other options.
There's no reason why my business should now lose thousands more a year because of normal returns, scammers or immediately refunded payments because of errors by the purchaser. If I sell a defective product....maybe, but I believe this to be immoral and there are other options.
cliffordcooley
Posts: 13,141 +6,441
With all the crap merchandise people scam others with. I don't blame them for taking action this way. We did it to ourselves, and now we are bitching about the results.
PayPal just sent a note out with some further details:
"Commercial Transaction Refunds: If you refund a Commercial Transaction payment, there are no fees to make the refund, but the fees you originally paid to receive the payment are not returned. In the event you would prefer to decline these changes and close your account"
No problems - Goodbye PayPal
"Commercial Transaction Refunds: If you refund a Commercial Transaction payment, there are no fees to make the refund, but the fees you originally paid to receive the payment are not returned. In the event you would prefer to decline these changes and close your account"
No problems - Goodbye PayPal
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