Amnesty questions claims about Libyan attrocities

[Benny26]

But an Englishman dressed as 'Sheikh' should be easily identified as 'fake sheikh' in the first place, not sure how that worked out.

Celebritys can be stupid .....Nah, there are plenty of Englishmen with dark skin and an accent.

One can always hope, but the way the system now works, it is subservient to big business, so I would not be holding my breath for this change coming any time soon.

Yes you're right. But i think public pressure is gonna come down on our side with this one, It has a funny feel about it. Plus we already have a seperate body that's a tune to this sort of thing, the competition commission; you would feel the pressure on it from the fallout should beef up its practices. And then there's Ofcom, but they can only control the TV side of things which is only a small portion of overall business here in the UK.

 

[Archean]

Will News of the Screws reappear as Sunday.co.uk?

I guess this links tells that probably News Corp is simply changing the medium while continuing to do what it always has done.

Celebritys can be stupid

That is a given, I have yet to see one with 'some brain'.

 

[Benny26]

Yeah, I think everyone already knows that The Sun newspaper will take over as a "Sun on Sunday", and i say good luck to 'em. I just bought the final edition of the News of The World this morning and it's obvious from the first page all the good they've done for the British press. Like i said, no other paper ever came close to the scam finding that the NoW did (but maybe that was because their team had a whole week to investigate things and people, unlike daily newspapers)

So yeah, I can't wait for them to start bringing in those scandals again, even if it is under a new name. I just hope any editors that may have wronged in the past take something from this ugly episode.

That is a given, I have yet to see one with 'some brain'.

Tell me about it. I suppose i could come up with a few old 'seasoned' actors that's had their head screwed on in the past though.

Sean Connery wasn't easy to fool...I know that

 

[captaincranky]

That is a given, I have yet to see one (edit.."a celebrity), with 'some brain'.

Oddly, I watch a show called "Jeopardy", which is a quiz show. (In reverse though. They give the answer, you determine the question). When celebrity tournaments are held, more often than not, it is people from the news media, (reporters and such), that get their clocks cleaned by movie stars.

In reality, being a movie star today is a harder job than in the past. Many stars are gifted and intelligent. And while this may sound sexist, it's usually the men. I would hazard a guess that it's because they can't skate on their looks, as can the average ingenue. The men are usually much more interesting when interviewed also.

In a late night talk show situation, you find yourself trying to look up the woman's skirt, and manage to completely miss noticing, the sound of air escaping from her head.

 

[red1776]

Will News of the Screws reappear as Sunday.co.uk?

I guess this links tells that probably News Corp is simply changing the medium while continuing to do what it always has done.



That is a given, I have yet to see one with 'some brain'.

Tom Selleck,. Matt Damon, and Ben Affleck are pretty sharp it would appear after seeing extensive interviews with them.

 

[Archean]

Many stars are gifted and intelligent. And while this may sound sexist, it's usually the men.

Tom Selleck,. Matt Damon, and Ben Affleck are pretty sharp it would appear after seeing extensive interviews with them.

I stand corrected by both of you. Thanks

I don't like Tom Cruise, but he too sounded ok to me from one interview which I saw.

I would hazard a guess that it's because they can't skate on their looks, as can the average ingenue. The men are usually much more interesting when interviewed also.

+1

 

[Archean]

On Sunday July 10, France seemingly allied itself with Russia and China in calling on NATO to immediately stop its counterproductive and counterintuitive bombing, as more countries witness public demonstrations against NATO’s actions in Libya. French Defense Minister Gerard Longuet said in Paris that military action in Libya must end and Colonel Gaddafi be welcomed around the negotiating table. Continual bombing of the country is not working, and diplomacy is the only solution - even if Gaddafi retains limited power, In an apparent U-turn in policy, Mr Longuet said Gaddafi could remain in Libya ‘in another room of the palace, with another title.’

How convenient, now that they are in a stalemate they think it is prudent to propose other solutions to save face. I wonder who will be the biggest loser in this farce?

Longuet said:

‘We must now sit around a table...

'We will stop bombing as soon as the Libyans start talking to one another and the military on both sides go back to their bases.

'They can talk to each other because we’ve shown there is no solution through force.’

NATO and the Obama administration can have no part of a dialogue because they will be the major losers if peace comes to Libya without Qadaffi leaving power.

Enough said.

NATO is getting hammered by critics, including during its press conferences, especially by reporters from such groups as Jane’s Defense Weekly who know a thing or two about weapons and war. Last week Jane’s ridiculed the NATO commander who claimed that seeing satellite dishes on roofs were evidence of a particular site being a “Command and Control Center.” Jane’s found that assertion silly.

They just can't stop making fools out of themselves

And to further dampen stupid assumptions and hopes of the French, British and Americans:

The Russian and Chinese leadership has grown increasingly critical of NATO’s actions in Libya and are demanding a immediate and permanent ceasefire. Some cynics here are pointing out that these countries, unlike NATO, knows exactly what they are doing and it includes the realization that they have an excellent chance to obtaining many billions of dollars in lucrative contracts. It is partly this realization that it’s “all of nothing” that keeps the US and its potent military asset, NATO, focused on assassinating Colonel Qaddafi and breaking his civilian support base. If Qaddafi lives, NATO loses and so do the current major oil industry contractors who are reportedly becoming depressed seeing reports of all the Russian and Chinese businessmen arriving in Libya.

As I said in the earlier post, it has always been all about oil. Unfortunately, people don't seems to grasp the fact that 'money' is the biggest motivator, nothing else can move the likes of NATO otherwise.

What this means is they will be completely impotent when comes to Syria, I have been digging lately about my suspicions about US/British intelligence community being financing and supporting the protests over there, and I think in coming few weeks things will start to get clear. Probability is, Americans saw an opportunity in what happened during the Egyptian riots, they pretty much succeeded in maintaining 'status quo' by involving their army directly (however, I think Egyptians aren't buying this as they keep coming back to keep an eye). Perhaps their wish to re-shape ME is going to die in coming weeks, hopefully, for good as they need to understand the world doesn't always need their thoughtless interventions.

Edit:
Captain & Benny

I have a question for you, why don't enough people in the west ask 'difficult' questions with regard to real motives of their leaders' adventurism in these matters?

 

[Benny26]

This isn't surprising from France, you just have to look at their military track record to see that this was coming. Everyone knows the running joke about France and the white flag (and it's their own fault really) France even came out against Britain in the Falklands war, talk about 'friendship', eh? (although France didn't attack us directly, they did call us 'fools' and kept moaning about us not getting Argentina "around the diplomatic table")

I have a question for you, why don't enough people in the west ask 'difficult' questions with regard to real motives of their leaders' adventurism in these matters?

You know something, people actually bounce these questions around alot in the UK, It's just people in the real top tier that shy away. I suppose they mostly shy because the cold facts are correct; as someone once said: "The only difference between Sadam Hussein and Robert Mugabe was that Sadam Hussein produced oil".

But yes, members for parliment do bounce these questions around in the chamber and even to the press, but i think it's just that most people already know the right facts -- and in turn these questions really don't make much impact.

 

[captaincranky]

This isn't surprising from France, you just have to look at their military track record to see that this was coming. Everyone knows the running joke about France and the white flag (and it's their own fault really) France even came out against Britain in the Falklands war, talk about 'friendship', eh? (although France didn't attack us directly, they did call us 'fools' and kept moaning about us not getting Argentina "around the diplomatic table")

Believe me, Britain has my full support for simply giving France to Germany, the next time they invade. "Hey, all you had to do was ask"! That's my story, and I'm sticking to it....

 

[Archean]

Make sense to me captain

Beside, what good having France anyway, I mean those communistical ******** are hardly good at anything but moaning about everyone else being 'un-civilized' and yet with my experience I feel they are one of the most racist of nations on this planet.

 

[Benny26]

Make sense to me captain

Beside, what good having France anyway, I mean those communistical ******** are hardly good at anything but moaning about everyone else being 'un-civilized' and yet with my experience I feel they are one of the most racist of nations on this planet.

Damn, I had a really witty comment lined up for Captain about France...but decided not to put it in fear of offending any French people ..... typical

I'll just say that i'm not a fan of France either...(eating frogs and snails aside)

 

[Archean]

Eating frogs? Whats wrong with it, I mean frog legs are liked in many places around the world. Although if I ever decided to eat frog legs, I'd rather choose one of those bigger ones they show on NGC etc. (I don't remember the name of species but it weighs in kgs by the way).

 

[Benny26]

Bull frog?

Around the world eh?...I'm sure there are lots of places 'around the world' that will tell you humans are also tasty.

Not quite right for me. Some things are just better left off the menu.

 

[Archean]

Not quite right for me. Some things are just better left off the menu.

That is why I said 'if'

Remember people eat all sort of weird stuff e.g. cockroaches, snakes, dogs, sparrows, and monkeys to name a few.

 

[Benny26]

Remember people eat all sort of weird stuff e.g. cockroaches, snakes, dogs, sparrows, and monkeys to name a few.

I dunno, maybe i just mean slimy food like snails and frogs are. I would probably try some monkey or sparrow...obviously a few beers first though

Some good things about France i will say; I like cheese and i like garlic......but that's about my limit of good things about France.

 

[Archean]

You forgot to include wine !

At least they provide 'raw material' for it anyway.

Just have a look at this to have an idea about range of 'weird food' sold around the world. My favorite in this one is the 'edible menu', but I wouldn't eat it unless I know what the hell they have used to make it in the first place.

I am sure not many would be interested in this menu though.

 

[Benny26]

You forgot to include wine !

At least they provide 'raw material' for it anyway.

Wine?...What are you, a yuppie? It should be beer for a man, wine for the women (and yuppies), cider for the alcoholics, and vodka, brandy and rum for the elite.

...Ok, I shall slap myself for the mistake because i do in fact like a little drop of wine now and then. Although France is known for good wine making, most of the wine we get in the UK comes from Spain strangely enough.

Just have a look at this to have an idea about range of 'weird food' sold around the world. My favorite in this one is the 'edible menu', but I wouldn't eat it unless I know what the hell they have used to make it in the first place.

Nice find.

I'll admit the world does like strange things...I wouldn't mind trying some of that pizza cone though

 

[Archean]

Wine (especially Red Wine) is good for your heart, that is why I mentioned it.

I am not too sure about trying anything in that article, unless I am able to examine all the ingredients before hand.

 

[Benny26]

Ahh but is it really good for your heart?

They once said coffee was good for your heart, but then they changed their mind about it.

 

[Archean]

They once said coffee was good for your heart, but then they changed their mind about it.

As far as I remember, they still say it is good for your heart, obviously you have to be prudent about your coffee intake though.

About wine, have a look at here and here.

Many studies investigated the benefits of red wine suggested that moderate amount of red wine lowers the risk of heart attack for people in middle age by ~ 30 to 50 percent.

 

[Benny26]

Ok, fair enough. I shall try to drink more wine in future then. Luckily i'm an avid coffee drinker and have been for many years.

I certainly remember the 'boffins' saying coffee was good, then it was bad...maybe they changed their mind again or something.

 

[Archean]

Murdochs agree to appear before MPs

FBI to open 9/11 victims 'phone-hacking' investigation

I wasn't expecting this twist, but anyway, having seen 'hyper' news channels of his empires in last few years, I would rather see news corp be broken into small entities to stop its monopolization of cable/satellite mediums.

 

[Benny26]

Although they have been summoned and don't really have a choice on appearing (the summoning of media execs has only happened twice in the past 50 years), they don't have to really do anything or say anything, they can just sit there if they want.

This is what people are expecting because that's what the last lot did back in 1991. "I'll leave that question for my solicitor, Mr. MP."

 

[Archean]

May be, but as Ms. Brooks has been arrested things may get 'nasty' for the Murdoch clan.

A new twist about the events on the topic:

“We underestimated al-Gaddafi ,” one French officer told Jauvert. “He was preparing for forty-one years for an invasion. We did not imagine he would adapt as quickly. No one expects, for example, to transport its troops and missile batteries, Gaddafi will go out and buy hundreds of Toyota pick-up in Niger and Mali. It is a stroke of genius: the trucks are identical to those used by the rebels. NATO is paralyzed. It delays its strikes. Before bombing the vehicles, drivers need to be sure they are whose forces are Gaddafi’s. ‘We asked the rebels to a particular signal on the roof of their pickup truck, said a soldier, but we were never sure. They are so disorganized ...’"

Toyota Pickup trucks ...... hmm no wonder Toyota is the biggest auto maker in the world now

The NATO coalition is now falling apart, though disclosure of this development has been muted to non-existent in the US press. French defense minister Gerard Longuet gave an interview at the end of last week to a French tv station saying that military action against Libya has failed , and it is time for diplomacy: “We must now sit around a table. We will stop bombing as soon as the Libyans start talking to one another and the military on both sides go back to their bases.’ Longuet suggested that Gaddafi might be able to remain in Libya, ‘in another room of the palace, with another title’.”

If Longuet’s startling remarks were for local consumption on the eve of an Assembly vote, it clearly came as a shock to Cameron and Secretary of State Clinton. To heighten the impression of a civil war in NATO Cameron and Clinton rushed out statements asserting the ongoing goal of regime change, and that Gaddafi’s departure was a sine qua non, as demanded by the Benghazi gang.

I would have loved to see reaction of Obama (and his cronies, mainly Clinton) and Cameron. :grinthumb

Initially, France and Britain nourished hopes of close military liaison but that soon collapsed for all the usual reasons -- inertia, suspicion and simple incompetence.

Sarkozy’s suspicions of Germany and Turkey were apparently so intense, according to Le Nouvel Observateur, that he called for the sidelining the Turkish and German officers present in the command structure of NATO, on the grounds that they could undermine the war given Berlin and Ankara’s distaste for the whole exercise. Normal guidelines dictate that when the supreme commander of NATO, an American general and his No. 2, a Briton, are on leave, the No. 3, is to be a German. Sarkozy had this sequence nixed.

I didn't knew this, but I think when you are after 35% share of total oil (would be) output from Libyan oil fields, I guess you don't want to have more competition.

Before his retirement Defense Secretary Gates took the opportunity to twist the knife in a speech in Brussels: “The mightiest military alliance in history, is . . . into an operation against a poorly-armed regime in a sparsely populated country — yet many allies are beginning to run short of munitions, requiring the U.S., once more, to make up the difference.” He said ominously, “future U.S. political leaders . . . may not consider the return on America’s investment in NATO worth the cost.”

I guess Americans were promised lot less than the French?

In sum, we on the left should rejoice that a simple colonial smash and grab is currently in a shambles, with serious long-term consequences for NATO’s credibility and pretenses to respect for international law . The kangaroo cage known as the International Criminal Court has been even further discredited, another cause for joy.

Couldn't summarized it any better then AC. :grinthumb

 

[Benny26]

Toyota Pickup trucks ...... hmm no wonder Toyota is the biggest auto maker in the world now

Toyota trucks even made it into the Toy Story films, what gives?

The NATO coalition is now falling apart, though disclosure of this development has been muted to non-existent in the US press. French defense minister Gerard Longuet gave an interview at the end of last week to a French tv station saying that military action against Libya has failed , and it is time for diplomacy: “We must now sit around a table. We will stop bombing as soon as the Libyans start talking to one another and the military on both sides go back to their bases.’ Longuet suggested that Gaddafi might be able to remain in Libya, ‘in another room of the palace, with another title’.”

If Longuet’s startling remarks were for local consumption on the eve of an Assembly vote, it clearly came as a shock to Cameron and Secretary of State Clinton. To heighten the impression of a civil war in NATO Cameron and Clinton rushed out statements asserting the ongoing goal of regime change, and that Gaddafi’s departure was a sine qua non, as demanded by the Benghazi gang.

Again, that's the French for you; No guts, no courage, couldn't fight their way out of a paper bag, ect...

Anyone with half of a brain wouldn't give two looks at whatever France says.

Before his retirement Defense Secretary Gates took the opportunity to twist the knife in a speech in Brussels: “The mightiest military alliance in history, is . . . into an operation against a poorly-armed regime in a sparsely populated country — yet many allies are beginning to run short of munitions, requiring the U.S., once more, to make up the difference.” He said ominously, “future U.S. political leaders . . . may not consider the return on America’s investment in NATO worth the cost.”

My opinion would be that Libya is not a normal war; some say it's a no-fly zone, others say it's regime change. The UN and NATO have some wires crossed over this, anyone can see that. I personally think that NATO are doing just fine outside of this balls up.