Ford: The US can't compete with China on electric vehicles, for now

[midian182]

What just happened? Bill Ford, executive chairman of Ford Motor Company, has warned that when it comes to the production of electric vehicles, the United States is still not ready to compete with China. Speaking about China's EV industry during an interview with CNN's Fareed Zakaria GPS, Ford said "They developed very quickly, and they developed them in large scale. And now they're exporting them [...] They're not here but they'll come here we think, at some point, we need to be ready, and we're getting ready."

The US automaker in February announced that it would be investing $3.5 billion in building an electric vehicle plant in Michigan. Reuters writes that the deal will use technology from Chinese battery company Contemporary Amperex Technology Co. Ltd, which led to Senator Marco Rubio asking the Biden administration to review the deal. Ford says the Michigan battery plant is a chance for Ford engineers to learn the technology and use it for themselves.

"It [Michigan] is a wholly owned Ford facility. They'll be our employees, and all we're doing is licensing the technology. That's it." Ford said.

In May, China said it had become the world's biggest exporter of cars after overtaking Japan in the first three months of the year. The country exported 1.07 million vehicles in the period, an increase of 58% compared to the first quarter of 2022, partly due to extra demand from Russia. For comparison, Japan's exports during the first three months of 2023 were 954,185, up 6% year-on-year.

Elon Musk's Shanghai Tesla plant is a big exporter of EVs. It passed the million-vehicles-made milestone last August and is expected to increase its yearly production capacity from 1.5 million.

On Sunday, US Transportation Secretary Pete Buttigieg said the US must take step steps to cut China's advantage in EV batteries, and that building the refining capacity for key materials is "addressable."

Buttigieg added that the US must build relationships domestically and internationally for raw materials and refining capacity. Chinese firms make up more than half of the EV battery market and provide as much as 90% of the demand for some battery materials.

An independent think tank report from earlier this year concluded that China was ahead of the US when it comes to research in 37 out of 44 crucial and emerging technologies, including electric batteries, one of the areas that China has a high risk of monopolizing.

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https://www.techspot.com/news/99132-ford-chairman-us-cant-compete-china-when-comes.html

 

[Achaios]

The result of decades of gross treason against the US and its people by their own Elites and Government.

For decades all they did was frantically and fanatically move almost every factory and technology they had over to Red China.

Now they "are behind China".

Once the American people understand how much they have been betrayed by their Elite they will be angry. Very angry. That day will probably signal the end for the Elites in the US as we know them.

 

[godrilla]

Raise your hand if you would buy an EV made there. From what I am seeing in my feeds is how disastrous their EV progress is going there. Imagine Ebikes but bigger fires. https://www.usnews.com/news/us/arti...— A,injuring several others, authorities said.

 

[ScottSoapbox]

The only reason Chinese EVs aren’t here already is the US government won’t allow them in. They are more basic but much cheaper. The added competition would be good for consumers, but the government is protecting you. Oh and protecting automaker campaign donors' profits.

 

[Uncle Al]

Sooner or later American industry is going to learn that moving to another country isn't always a safe or smart move. Now would be the time for the government to offer inducements to NEW start up car makers to help them pass the GM's and Fords in competition and let the big boys pay their way back into the US.

 

[godrilla]

The only reason Chinese EVs aren’t here already is the US government won’t allow them in. They are more basic but much cheaper. The added competition would be good for consumers, but the government is protecting you. Oh and protecting automaker campaign donors' profits.

From what I am seeing is they aren't selling combustion engines and hybrids In the USA either although those are being phased out currently.
The cheapest EV that I can research is the EV Bolt by Chevrolet Bolt EUV starting at $27,495.

 

[wiyosaya]

Apple: Gee, look at all the money we have in the bank. It's great that capitalism has been supporting our having everything made in China. Its cheap for us and its enabled us to become the single company in the world with the most money in the bank.

Ford CEO - hey look, you have a dragon that has broken off your leash.

Apple: What? That's a dragon? It been our favorite pet. Its not our fault, its the fault of the consumer being only willing to pay a tiny amount for the materialistic crap we push to them as being an essential for modern life.

Ford CED

 

[ScottSoapbox]

From what I am seeing is they aren't selling combustion engines and hybrids In the USA either although those are being phased out currently.
The cheapest EV that I can research is the EV Bolt by Chevrolet Bolt EUV starting at $27,495.

China has EVs starting at $5,000.

Low range and max 35 mph, but with doors, AC, etc. (I.e., not a golf cart) which could work for some people in cities.

“Real” car EVs starting more like $16K.

One is a new category for consumers the other disrupts on price.

 

[GeforcerFX]

Yeah EVs arn't going great over there. They have fields filled with abandoned EVs that are brand new, they were built to get money from the central government but no one could buy them or wanted them and a lot of Chinese cities have banned rental fleets. Then you have the fires, there is still no safety ratings or requirements for most Chinese vehicles if they copy western designs well then they copy the safety of designs. But that cost more money, requires better building practices and would raise the price of each vehicle up a lot which means they couldn't compete. The west is taking the smart approach building mainly high-end high quality vehicles at a slower pace to allow time for the technology and the infrastructure to develop.

 

[wiyosaya]

Assuming the comments about EV production in China are correct, it sounds like they really do not have a good handle on making a quality product and it would not meet NA, or other, safety standards, though it may be "cheap". Based on that, I think the Ford CEO is over-reacting. This should not lead the Ford CEO to complacency; rather, he should view it as an opportunity to spur Ford, and others, to beat China to the punch.

 

[MyIOnU]

LOL sure China can product mass number of electric cars, but they don't last long. You probably do not see the graveyard of electric cars in China.

 

[p51d007]

Couple things....
In the USA, we are "not allowed" to mine the materials to make the batteries, not to mention most of the worlds production comes FROM CHINA.
China, may be "the king" of EV's, but look into the figures and you will find their "sales" numbers can be considered misleading. The company will "register" the vehicle so it will look like a sale, then abandon the
vehicle. But, because it is registered, they continue to receive government money or some such thing.

https://insideevs.com/news/672926/china-abandoned-electric-car-graveyard-byd-geely/

 

[bviktor]

They don't even want to. The US is full of fanatic petrol heads who hate EVs with passion, even though they have plenty money to buy them.

 

[dangh]

China has EVs starting at $5,000.

Low range and max 35 mph, but with doors, AC, etc. (I.e., not a golf cart) which could work for some people in cities.

“Real” car EVs starting more like $16K.

One is a new category for consumers the other disrupts on price.

This is not ev, it is e-death. There are good products from China, but cheap cars is asking for troubles.

 

[Lew Zealand]

It seems that people here are unaware that Chinese EVs are already being sold in the US.

Polestar

Models 1 and 2 are manufactured in Chengdu, China. They're here and have been for over a year now

 

[wiyosaya]

Couple things....
In the USA, we are "not allowed" to mine the materials to make the batteries,

That's not, or more correctly, no longer true.
https://www.rpc.senate.gov/policy-papers/protecting-americas-supply-of-rare-earth-elements Yes, I know, she's a democrat, but

U.S. Begins Forging Rare Earth Supply Chain

U.S. Begins Forging Rare Earth Supply Chain

www.nationaldefensemagazine.org

California Mine Becomes Key Part of Push to Revive US Rare Earths Processing

US to revive 70-year-old mine to break up China’s monopoly

www.voanews.com

EDIT: The new US EV Tax credits rely on having the batteries and most of their components manufactured in the US. In order for US Citizens to take advantage of these tax credits, the materials must come from the US. What would be the point of having these credits if the materials were not available in the US? And yes, I know the "Biden, Biden, Biden" argument, but please, at least make an effort to verify your info before posting stuff that is blatantly false.

 

[axiomatic13]

Couple things....
In the USA, we are "not allowed" to mine the materials to make the batteries, not to mention most of the worlds production comes FROM CHINA.
China, may be "the king" of EV's, but look into the figures and you will find their "sales" numbers can be considered misleading. The company will "register" the vehicle so it will look like a sale, then abandon the
vehicle. But, because it is registered, they continue to receive government money or some such thing.

https://insideevs.com/news/672926/china-abandoned-electric-car-graveyard-byd-geely/

That is incorrect. Ford buys lithium from Ioneer in Nevada.
https://www.reuters.com/business/au...-ioneer-american-ev-battery-plant-2022-07-21/

 

[p51d007]

That is incorrect. Ford buys lithium from Ioneer in Nevada.
https://www.reuters.com/business/au...-ioneer-american-ev-battery-plant-2022-07-21/

What I was trying to say, is given the amount of minerals mined in the USA for batteries, is a drop in the bucket to what China is doing. Granted, they do not have the environmental concerns that a lot of western countries do. Perhaps in 10-20 years, they will end up like a lot of the former Soviet Union areas that are nothing but waste land.

 

[Tantor]

EVs are meaningless until they can produce a small, inexpensive EV that's easy to work on, has great mileage and reliability. Something like the original Honda Civic.

And the initial carbon footprint, out the door, should be LESS than an IC vehicle.

Most EVs are bloated money pigs. They weigh 5000 lbs, tear up roads, and provide almost no carbon benefit.

 

[imac1957]

The US can't compete? The US has the dominant EV manufacturer in production numbers, profit total and margin, market capitalization and brand recognition in the world. How is that not competing? Tesla is the elephant in the room for EVs, and is a US company that also has a HUGE factory in Texas with another huge factory being built in Mexico. Yes, it builds in China as well, but so does Apple. Are Apple representative of US tech?

I don't know who is more deliberately ignorant: young Ford or the anti-Tesla press who can't bring themselves to recognise their own home grown champion.

 

[GhostLegion]

They don't even want to. The US is full of fanatic petrol heads who hate EVs with passion, even though they have plenty money to buy them.

Tell me you are out of touch without telling me you are out of touch.

https://www.pcmag.com/news/us-ev-ca...d-and-people-are-buying-more-than-just-teslas

Find me a compelling electric car that hits the 20-30K mark. The list linked below has maybe 6 out of 20 cars in that price range. And that is *base* model price. My wife got a higher trim Civic for just over 30K. I want an EV, quite badly in fact but nothing produced is the the kind of car I want, many of the EVs are for SUV/crossover type vehicles but I want a sedan. Most of America makes under 75K a year, you obviously have no idea what you are talking about.

https://www.caranddriver.com/features/g32463239/new-ev-models-us/
https://www.statista.com/statistics/203183/percentage-distribution-of-household-income-in-the-us/

 

[dalpilot]

Raise your hand if you would buy an EV made there. From what I am seeing in my feeds is how disastrous their EV progress is going there. Imagine Ebikes but bigger fires. https://www.usnews.com/news/us/arti...— A,injuring several others, authorities said.

Actually, with the drag of Biden administration strings on any IRA money and Union wages American EVs will never be cost competitive. They will lose to European and Asian manufacturers building EVs (and PHEVs and Hybrids) in non-union right to work states in the Southeast US. Ford stopped making cars (which they never made money on anyways) and GM is doing the same thing. They hope they can make their EVs profitable BEFORE they stop making their profits off ICE Trucks and SUVs. Gentlemen, start your engines (my bet is they lose). It's been decades since Ford and GM innovated anything.