I'm overheating... but how?

[DragonMaster]

A can of air works perfectly for me.

Not for me, they're always empty when I need some.

BTW, although it doesn't seem to do any damage, but forcing a processor out like that.... is not recommendable I believe. Is there a better way of removing HSs with processors stuck on them like glue? You can't reach the lever, and stock Intel HS sticks on processors like glue....

Scrape it? I would not recommend this with say, an Athlon XP tho. The core could be damaged easily, but if you take a Pentium I, there's no problem, the core is under.

Heat it? My S3 Savage3D's heatsink was glued with cheap compound and after a couple of years, I found it was cooling my winmodem instead of the GPU. Maybe if you let it passing some time under the hair dryer it will come off. I think you can twist it or something like this also.

and I got it in some plastic bag.....

The Antec is that too : 5 plastic bags in a cheapo plastic bag. The small bags are unbranded.

 

[akaivan]

No dont force it out. Proccesors damage easily. Try twiSting it like dragon master said.

 

[Eddieguard]

So as of yet I haven't purchased the AS5 yet. (Still a little scared of opening my computer up for the first time.) But I'm trying to understand what this case description is trying to say because I don't understand. Does this mean it has a liquid-cooling kit/system already in place when I buy the case or is it just liquid-cooling ready?

Go here http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1710666&CatId=1510

It's the thermaltake Tai-Chi Aluminum Case and it's quite expensive so that's kind of an important detail...

Thanks

Eric

 

[kirock]

By Eddieguard:

So as of yet I haven't purchased the AS5 yet. (Still a little scared of opening my computer up for the first time.) But I'm trying to understand what this case description is trying to say because I don't understand. Does this mean it has a liquid-cooling kit/system already in place when I buy the case or is it just liquid-cooling ready?

By the Site:

The Tai-Chi sports retaining holes for liquid cooling kits, internal space optimization for cooling installation, an all-copper base waterblock, transparent green water tube piping, dual 1300 rpm fans, a powerful DV 12V liquid pump and a simple refill liquid tank

Eddieguard: Dude, friend, buddy. Chill please. Your prob does not require this amount of investment, really! Are you just playing with us?, I could buy a whole new mobo/CPU combo for this money.

The answer to above Q is:.......Liquid cooling ready....but really high end. you need to supply the: COOLING TECHNOLOGY..... and they say the rest is simple because they have ports and a refill tank!

My friend, I don't think anyone here was trying to give you the impression that your system required this technology..honestly. Are you running the Pentagon? Maybe the Cremlin? Prob, good idea to get this cooling system then.

No offence, just trying to save you money.
Cheers.

 

[CMH]

No dont force it out. Proccesors damage easily. Try twiSting it like dragon master said.

Have you ever tried twisting a stuck stock P4 cooling? I can hardly find the space. Plus, I would imagine the strain on every pin.... Pulling them out vertically seems like a better idea here...

 

[PaulWuzHere]

When my old P-4 2Ghz was stuck i was like f*** it. YANK! ... nothing. It was fine. used some rubbing alcohol to clean it off with a q-tip added some thermal compound and was done. magic. Simply, CPUs are weak. Don't be stupid like me. :slurp:

 

[CMH]

Which was precisely what I did... will try twisting next time though, cos it does seem VERY dangerous to just yank out the CPU.

I am very hesitant to try using a hair dryer to heat it up, all that airflow may cause static, not to mention the air being blown might be charged too.

 

[PaulWuzHere]

HAIR DRIER VERY BAD! They are heated by little pieces of metal that are heated by straight electricity. Thats why your hair is all frizzy when you finish. Don't try it. Unless you want a dead CPU and mobo.

 

[DragonMaster]

In the oven at a very low temp?

 

[CMH]

Lol.... "What are you baking dear?" "Nothing much, just my computer "

Anyway, best thing to do is NOT to install the stock cooling and go straight for the good stuff

And if you did, do not use the hairdryer. I'd say, it looks like its no problem yanking the whole thing out, as long as you're careful not the bend the pins trying to get the CPU unstuck after taking the whole thing out. I've dropped the CPU every time I unstick CPUs from stock HSFs (which makes it a grand total of 3 times).

 

[PaulWuzHere]

This is a strange story. When I first installed my 64 3000+ I forgot to get ac5 so I just used the thermal pad. It ran cool. Once I got some ac5 I popped the hsf off and cleaned off the pad. Once I was using ac5 it ran REALLY cool. Yet, everyone knows 3000+ are really hard to oc over 2.2Ghz. Well mine was no exception. I got a new mobo and when I took out the CPU i droped it 4 feet onto a hardwood floor. I was sure it was gone. I looked for bent pins, nothing. I installed it and now I can have it oc up to 2.5Ghz on stock cooling stable at 34 and load at 45. Strange. Before I dropped it 2.2Ghz was the fastest stable oc I could get. Now don't start droping your CPUs to test this.

 

[kirock]

Just a note on ESD and handling precautions. The ideas of using a hairdryer and a vacuum are not entirely obsurd if done properly. ESD (electrostatic discharge) can damage sensitive electronics by literally vapourizing a small area of the chip die. Some ICs are as sensitive as 100V. In comparison when you walk across a carpet and build up a static charge and then touch a door knob the shock you feel happened at 2000 -3000 Volts (the ionization potenial of relatively dry air: 30-40% RH). When the room air is higher in moisture (60-70% RH) the air is more conductive and static charges naturally dissipate and the whole "carpet effect" decreases.

Now when handling sensitive ICs (as in a CPU, or RAM etc) everyone knows to ground yourself, but this is not entirely correct. The act of grounding actually can cause an ESD event. By grounding yourself you effectively have no charge nor can you build a static charge. But if the circuit you are about to touch has charge... then bam, you've just provided the perfect path for a sudden ESD event.

In electronic labs ground straps are used and ESD safe material (things that don't tend to build and hold static charge) are used through out. But the grounding straps are NOT just wires that provide path to ground. They are a relatively high resistance path to ground. A few Megaohms. The reason for this is to prevent a SUDDEN discharge of any static from or to the device being handled. A low resistance path will product a sudden discharge and result in damage to the device.

So the hairdryer would produce a static charge to some degree. Solution. Unplug the PC and ensure it does NOT have a clean path to ground. You should wear rubber shoes to prevent yourself from being a ground path. And all this would be much safer if it was done at high RH% (70%).

For the vacuum situation things are the opposite. The vacuum by design is grounded electrically (thank god for good electrical safety standards), so to keep everything at the same static potential we would leave the PC plugged into the wall socket(not powered on though, of course). If you're not comfortable with that, then use a wire from your case to the wall socket ground. Yes now you can just use a low resistance ground path to maintain the case at ground potential.

My knowledge comes from 8 yrs as the Reliabilty Test Lab supervisor for a large Telecommunication company located in Ottawa Canada (you'll have heard of them). We made the worlds first 10GHz communications GaAs laser diodes (amoung other cool stuff) which still power the internet today.

Cheers all.

 

[DragonMaster]

Lol.... "What are you baking dear?" "Nothing much, just my computer "

Guess how they solder the components on your motherboard...

For the vacuum situation things are the opposite. The vacuum by design is grounded electrically (thank god for good electrical safety standards), so to keep everything at the same static potential we would leave the PC plugged into the wall socket(not powered on though, of course). If you're not comfortable with that, then use a wire from your case to the wall socket ground. Yes now you can just use a low resistance ground path to maintain the case at ground potential.

My Electrolux isn't grounded ;-) , but maybe there's a capacitor to the chassis.

 

[CMH]

Guess how they solder the components on your motherboard...

You can't be serious.... I'll try it next time I need to re-solder pins on my CPU.... (those guys who try to resolder bent pins usually dump them on ebay. Cheap).

 

[DragonMaster]

Make sure that the core doesn't fall tho(If it's on the top). I don't know if CPUs can handle this temp but it's worth trying if you can save the CPU.

Things to look for :
-An other oven, solder fumes in your oven is not the best thing
-It needs to get to 700F
Small timer ovens can be used for this.

 

[CMH]

and how exactly are you supposed to do the actual soldering, given that our god-given hands can't really handle those temps?

I was actually joking about fixing CPUs, but you got me interested.

 

[DragonMaster]

You need solder paste, to put the component and heat the thing. (Heat gun or oven)

http://www.infidigm.net/articles/solder/

 

[Eddieguard]

So I've finally gotten around to installing the Arctic Silver 5 and it works great now. My idle temp is about 35 C and my load is about 45 C down from about 80 C and 95 C respectively. I'm not sure whether it was the AS5 or just cleaning up the dust (a vacuum cleaner, toothbrush, and pipe cleaner) that helped so much because I could barely see the components beneath all the filth

Also there were remnants of a thermal pad which were removed easily thanks to ArctiClean in about a minute. That stuff is great.

Anyways guys thanks for all your help.

 

[DragonMaster]

AS5 is miraculous! (40C difference!) I should try that on my Athlon XP! (Upgraded cooler, output fan in the case, cover open, 8" fan blowing on all this to keep it up to 52 C)

 

[CMH]

I know we "worship" AS5 in these forums, and we're not the only ones.

We can start a new religion, on how AS5 created the world or something...

Either way, the temperature drop shouldn't be more than 5-10 (5 being typical), so I'd say that blowing the dust away would be the main reason for the 40C difference. I know it does on my Tt Golf 325 (notorious for dust buildup cos of the thinly spread fins). You should notice a furthur drop in temperature while using, but thats probably an extra 2C or so only.

Also, I won't recommend using the cover off like that, dust gets in even more. Also, I'd prefer to add in a couple of 120mm fans, and a whole bunch of 80mm fans wherever I can stuff them to keep the comp cool, cover the side panel, and move the 8" fan to cool my super parallel CPU called the BRAIN.

 

[DragonMaster]

I know we "worship" AS5 in these forums, and we're not the only ones.

We can start a new religion, on how AS5 created the world or something...

I also read about liquid metal to use instead of AS5, but I also read that there is no temp. difference.

Also, I won't recommend using the cover off like that, dust gets in even more.

Yup, there's more dust, but I clean it. Also, the fan moves so much air that there never is lots of dust. Only fine one... (But blowing in there works)

Also, I'd prefer to add in a couple of 120mm fans, and a whole bunch of 80mm fans wherever I can stuff them to keep the comp cool, cover the side panel,

The case's too cheap to have more than one place to have an output fan... (I cut the air flow blocker on the output hole and put an 80mm last year, it helps, but I still need that 8")
There's also a place for an input fan but, as usual with generic cases, they forgot the holes...

I would have to put some sort of duct going to the CPU fan... Gotta have some thinking to do!

and move the 8" fan to cool my super parallel CPU called the BRAIN.

Where have you got that CPU? I've never been able to find one! ;-)

 

[CMH]

Where have you got that CPU? I've never been able to find one! ;-)

Lol....


About your case, you can probably try to make some holes yourself. How about drilling a whole lot of holes, and fill the whole side panel with 120mms? You'd need... some 10 of them? You wouldn't need to worry about exhaust fans with that (but it sure would help).

 

[DragonMaster]

About your case, you can probably try to make some holes yourself. How about drilling a whole lot of holes, and fill the whole side panel with 120mms? You'd need... some 10 of them? You wouldn't need to worry about exhaust fans with that (but it sure would help).

Why not a side cover made of 120mm fans?

 

[CMH]

Why didn;t I think of that...Much easier to make too!

 

[DragonMaster]

The problem then is that you get as much dust as the 8" and some more airflow noise as a bonus.

It's the 3rd CPU cooler I put on that CPU...

The cheap CoolerMaster thermal pad -could- explain some things.

(BTW, is there a way to remove thermal pads easier than burning the heatsink with an hair dryer and scraping it?)