TechSpot

XP Home won't install updates

By Poppa Bear
Jul 9, 2010
Topic Status:
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  1. Sharam

    Sharam TS Rookie Posts: 538

    Things are clearer thanks to you.

    We are always at the mercy of the Software Engineers; I know exactly what you are saying about installing those programs you mentioned.

    It is always best to do a back up when working on a system, you never know what could go wrong but performing a Repair Install is safe, it will allow you to maintain settings, data and all applications including the ones that have problems, Repair Install Repairs XP which might or might not affect other programs with problems. You will have to re-install all Windows update you had already installed.

    Many "Software Optional" updates available through Manual Custom Update are necessary for Windows to operate properly.

    2 teenage daughters with MSN, Face Book, P2P programs and such does sound like "trouble", I know many with no problems at all.
    If the programs you used were already installed before the infection if any, the chances are they were compromised; In such cases, I load Windows in Safe Mode, log in as Administrator, perform some manual cleaning, use some cleaning programs then uninstall MBAM and SAS, run the cleaning programs, re-install (I always have the latest setup + the latest updates on a thumb drive) then do a quick scan with each first and run the cleaning programs again, still, this practice does not guarantee a clean system.

    Just trying to make a point that running the programs you mentioned in "regular" Windows on a possibly infected system giving you a clean bill of health would not surprise me.
  2. Poppa Bear

    Poppa Bear TS Enthusiast Topic Starter Posts: 266

    Thanks for the feedback. Re:
    Pardon my igonorance but what exactly are MBAM & SAS?
  3. Sharam

    Sharam TS Rookie Posts: 538

    MalwareBytes' Anti-Malware

    SUPERAntiSpyware
  4. Poppa Bear

    Poppa Bear TS Enthusiast Topic Starter Posts: 266

    Cleaning Programs

    Duuuu....hhhh! :blush: I knew that! LOL!

    What cleaning programs do you use? And what is the purpose of cleaning/uninstalling/reinstalling etc as per:
    When you say have the latest setup and updates on a thumb drive, do you mean an OS you can run from the thumb drive? Or the cleaning programs like MBAM running on the thumb drive?
  5. Sharam

    Sharam TS Rookie Posts: 538

    PLEASE understand I am only answering your questions and this has NOTHING to do with your system and current state of it as in when I say “infected system” I AM NOT talking about your system.

    I use the programs listed in the Virus and Malware removal Forum.

    Boy oh boy , you really can't or don't read in-between lines :) but I like the fact that you don't give up; reading your text, I am thinking this might have been an easy fix that became complicated if you miss understood a symptom and took a wrong action. No disrespect.

    With a badly infected systems I can not be certain what the malware has done or changed and I have to be certain of the steps I take so I remove all cleaners, AVs and such and use my own known good copies on a memory stick that I have a back up of on another stick, I wipe the partition on the memory stick I used and restore from the other after each and every use. You don’t need this but I do since I do on-site service. In my post with thinking “mild” infection, I only would have removed MBAM and SAS.

    please understand, I just wanted to ask why you ignored ruready2's question and have been adding to my post since then, I only scanned through the post to see if you answered his question and did not pay much attention to the rest of the subject in dept and didn't want this to stop the steps you were asked to take and all, please continue as directed before my first post. I do commend you asking every little bit in order to be sure of your next step.
  6. LookinAround

    LookinAround TechSpot Chancellor Posts: 8,372   +167

    Mea Culpa.. I think maybe the thread is drifting to peripheral topics (including my own pre-mature post about registry cleaning by hand! :blush: ) so i gotta admit i'm losing track of the germane issues and problems at hand

    So... strickly from my own point of view and IMHO i'm going to stick to items /topics which i'll enumerate so we can keep apart
    1. Doing a backup at this point
      It's not clear what's happening on your machine or if, in fact, things are just getting worse as we speak. So before going any further, have you backed up all your data? Or even done a full disk image clone backup if you want guarantee you can get both your data back plus able to get back to this point in time on your system if a full disk restore is important to you (EASUS Todo is a good freeware tool if need be)

    2. Is Microsoft Installer working at all?
      Based on all info to date, I'm most interested to separate whether Microsoft Installer (MSI) is working or not? Or is it a matter of MSI works with some product installs and/or uninstalls but not with others?? (which is my current impression from your posts above that it only fails for SOME things like Adobe) p.s "microsoft" installer and "windows" are same thing.. just often refered to differently

    3. If MSI is failing for selective products, could you again delineate (just a couple) of the products it works for and which not


    4. As far as Windows updates, my only question is can you uninstall/reinstall MS office and retry the updates (cuz if MSI is the culprit OR just problems with select program updates, then security update problems are a red herring and less important)
      >> /* EDIT */
      Actually, on reflection, this step isn't worth doing till we know normal program installs/reinstalls can work! as you may still want to so a Repair or Full Install again, regardless

    5. Getting error info from your Windows Event Log
      If MSI is selectively failing, here's a script that will generate a list of the last 20 relevant messages in your Windows Application and System logs. Re-run a couple scenarios where the MSI installer fails. Then run the script below to see what's captured in your Windows Event Logs and post the output captured on your desktop in events.txt file
      > Start->Programs->Acessories->Notepad
      > Copy paste the code below into notepad and save on your desktop as a .BAT file. Double click it to run. Then look for file events.txt on your Desktop and attach it to next post (p.s. this script only works for XP)
      Code:
      cscript "C:\WINDOWS\system32\eventquery.vbs" /l application /l system /r 20 /v  /fo table /fi "Type eq error OR Type eq warning" > "%userprofile%\desktop\events.txt"
    6. re: Your questions about Repair Installs
      • NOTE: It's a common confusion but note that hitting "R" on the setup menu takes you to Recovery Console (which is an entirely different beast and is NOT how you do a Repair Install)
      • For now, suffice it to say, a Repair install essentially resets Windows "back to factory defaults" so Windows and all its settings are reset (e.g. if you had enabled File Sharing before it will be reset to its default of Disabled)
      • Repair installs should not touch or affect any personal data but as i like to say "The only thing 100% for sure about computers is there "ain't nuthin" 100% for sure with computers, so I still think is wise to backup before a Repair Install
      • But i'd say any futher detail about the procedure is best wait till we decide it comes to that point

    7. IMHO: Repair installs are easy enough to try but if all is really screwed up, of course, full installs take care of that
  7. Poppa Bear

    Poppa Bear TS Enthusiast Topic Starter Posts: 266

    Update

    Thanks for all the input guys. I agree the waters are getting a bit muddied. I haven't had an opportunity to get back to her PC yet, but when I do, I plan to:

    1. Uninstall/reinstall Office and get all updates, including relevant optional ones.

    2. Run all the various cleaning processes.

    3. Try to uninstall/reinstall Adobe, and the Office updates, and if it fails, obtain and post the logs as per Item 5 by LookinAround.

    4. If this doesn't fix the problem, I'll delete the empty storage partition on the 2nd hard drive on the PC; create a new primary non-active partition, format it, and store all data on this partition.

    5. Run Install/Repair off the installation CD.

    6. If that doesn't work, I'll reload the Acronis back-up image of the main OS; update any necessary programs; then reload the data from the 2nd HD partition.

    To LookinAround re:

    1.
    No, data is not backed up and that's covered in Item 4 of this post. Yes, there is an Acronis image clone, mentioned in Item 6 of this post.

    2.
    Yes that is the correct status.

    3.
    It installs Windows updates. It uninstalled the current Zone Alarm and reinstalled the latest version. It cannot uninstall, repair or reinstall Adobe; nor can it install Office 2003 updates, or Windows Clean Install.

    4.
    I haven't had a chance to try yet. See Item 1 in this post.

    5.
    Yes I will do this as per Item 3 of this post.

    6.
    What does the acronym IMHO stand for? I was aware of the difference between "R" repair option and Repair/Install option. This is covered in Item 5 of this post.

    I will advise further once I've had a chance to do the above items.

    Thanks PB
  8. Poppa Bear

    Poppa Bear TS Enthusiast Topic Starter Posts: 266

    Update

    Update: One other error message I forgot to include was:

    "windows installer service could not be accessed."
  9. LookinAround

    LookinAround TechSpot Chancellor Posts: 8,372   +167

    OH! Now you tell me! ;)

    You may still have multiple and different problems going on. But start here with this KB How to resolve Common "Windows Installer" Problems

    > If problem persists pls repeat some of the failing installations then generate the Event Log per my script in above post

    but fyi: IMHO I'd still only do limited amount of further troubleshooting stuff before recommend you just try a Repair Install if your multiple problems still persist

    but suggest you try the MS KB first and then run the event log script AFTER you try the MS KB suggestions
  10. jobeard

    jobeard TS Ambassador Posts: 13,408   +314

    could be as simple as
    net start "windows installer" from a command prompt in the admin login
  11. LookinAround

    LookinAround TechSpot Chancellor Posts: 8,372   +167

    just a point of note: net start "windows installer" just tells Windows to try and start the Windows Installer service. But since reboot doesn't help (which would also start the Installer service AND doing it after a reboot) don't think net start should make a difference :(


    /* edit */
    Probably best to try the solutions in the MS KB to fix known problems that can occur with installer on XP. And if installer still fails, is time for a Repair Install
     
  12. LookinAround

    LookinAround TechSpot Chancellor Posts: 8,372   +167

    Sorry for the double post but want to correct myself.. (PoppaBear you can ignore this post.. is just to correct tech detail in my last post for reply to jobeard)

    I just checked Services.msc. The Installer service is set with StartupType= Manual (I thought it was Automatic). So stand corrected: Windows wouldn't start the service on boot. But still since a reboot isn't fixing the problem where the service should be starting ON DEMAND, then IMHO the MS KB is still best approach :)
  13. LookinAround

    LookinAround TechSpot Chancellor Posts: 8,372   +167

    Hi PoppaBear

    I wanted to narrow the scope of what needed. i think should focus on only Windows Installer issues. For now the only test cases to use to for testing if Installer will install:
    > Windows Installer Cleanup Tool
    > Revo Uninstaller
    > EASUS ToDo Backup

    ==> Do not do try it with any Adobe product (Adobe may have separate issues due to registry)
    ==> Do not worry about any Windows Updates working or not yet (they may also fail for their own reasons)

    So if you just test installing (and then try opening/starting) each of the 3 tool products i mentioned above after trying the fixes in the MS KB.

    If any one of them still fails to install, run that script to generate the event log text file we can then look at
  14. Poppa Bear

    Poppa Bear TS Enthusiast Topic Starter Posts: 266

    Windows Installer

    1. Of the three test programs, Revo Uninstaller and ToDoBackup installed OK, but Windows Installer CleanUp Uninstall failed.

    2. After running the Events Log recorder this was the error reported:
    3. I tried to run the Windows Installer repair as per the KB article referred to here.

    Method 1 made no difference.

    Method 2 said to open this link "http://msdn.microsoft.com/downloads", but it did not show the window pane referred to in this method.

    4. I could not install LogMein.

    5. Update: Tried to install Windows Installer 4.5, KB942288-v3, and initially got the following error message:

    Setup could not backup registry value. HKLM\software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\InstallerLocation\'. 5: Access is denied.

    Reset permissions for registry key and it installed, but did not fix the problem.
  15. LookinAround

    LookinAround TechSpot Chancellor Posts: 8,372   +167

    Uggghhh. :(

    It does sound like your Windows installation, in general, is quite a mess. Is why I think the shortest distance to getting a working machine again is a Full Reinstall. (And as i understand it EASUS Todo Backup is now installed? And you start it?)

    There are several steps to prepare for a full reinstall - to help assure it goes smoothly. And i would recommend creating the backup on a large external device (i.e. on separate physical media rather then a different partition on the same media)

    But if you did want to try the Repair Install first instead, we can do that. (Part of the reason for me leaning towards Full rather then Repair install)
    1. Repair install, at best, will fix Windows installer itself
    2. But it won't fix any registration issues/corruption for any added product (e.g. Adobe)
    3. And if by chance malware is somehow involved or responsible for any of this mess, it'll still be there to find and deal with after the Repair

    So i think is best to bite the bullet at this point and do a full reinstall of Windows and your applications

    If that sounds OK? Do you have an external backup device you could use?

    I'll wait to hear back on these points before talking further about reinstall
  16. Poppa Bear

    Poppa Bear TS Enthusiast Topic Starter Posts: 266

    Hi LookinAround,

    Thanks for the feedback. And yes I agree that a full reinstall is the best option. I've discovered other weird things, like Office is shown in the start menu, and works, but is not listed in Add/Remove Programs. Also, the picture shown in the account for the user is not the one that appears when you log off. Also if it is changed, the new picture does not show either. It just keeps the one picture regardless of what you do.

    Re:
    Yes, that's correct. It installed OK but I haven't tried to use it yet. Can this help in a re-load?

    Re backing up music, data files, favoirtes, etc, there is a 2nd separate empty hard drive, (not a partition on the main HD), in the machine. So what I propose to do is to:

    1. Create a new non-active primary partition in the 2nd hard drive, and format it.

    2. Save all the data to this hard drive.

    3. Delete the existing system on the primary hard drive; create a new partiton and unconditionally format it in NTFS.

    4. Reload Windows from scratch. I do have an Acronis clone image of the original pristine installation which I can reload in about 15 minutes, after reformatting the hard drive. This image has all the drivers for video card, printer, motherboard, etc. All I'd have to do would be update the security software and get updates for Windows and Office.

    5. Transfer all the data back onto the new operating system.

    I have done many, many reloads from scratch, so this shouldn't be a problem. The big time killer is saving all the data, etc.

    Once again, thanks for your support
  17. LookinAround

    LookinAround TechSpot Chancellor Posts: 8,372   +167

    Don't know that you intended to do the reinstall right away.. as i have some info and hints / etc. for you that might help make the process go smoother (e.g. creating a separate backup of your drivers so they can be easily restored on the new HD)

    in any case, can't follow up now with that info but can do so sometime later in the day..

    And, I'm sure i speak for everyone when i say we're all glad to help :)

    /* edit */
    btw.. i forget if this info is already elsewhere in this thread.. but could you state the computer make/model of your friend's computer?
  18. LookinAround

    LookinAround TechSpot Chancellor Posts: 8,372   +167

    Oh. When i first skimmed your post i didn't notice you said you already had an Acronis image you could load!
    > Do you have Acronis True Image or some other Acronis product?
    > Do you have an Acronis Rescue CD then
    > And/or do you have (and if so, what) Acronis product is running on your machine??

    EASUS Todo is freeware. It's a "subset" of Acronis True Image functionality. You can use it to backup the current hard drive onto the other drive. EASUS freeware (unlike Acronis True Image) doesn't do intelligent data "compression" like Acronis which means for EASUS: The backup drive should be at least as large as your friend's
    > Hard drive (if you want to backup the full drive) OR
    > At least as large as the C drive if you only need to backup C

    If you we do a full C partition or disk backup then needn't worry whether you missed any personal files or folder data.

    Will post back with more organized steps later when we decide when we might want to use Acronis and when use EASUS (based on which Acronis product you have)
  19. Poppa Bear

    Poppa Bear TS Enthusiast Topic Starter Posts: 266

    1. Acronis®*True*Image*Home® version 11.0 (build*8,027) is loaded on my friend's OS.

    2. There is also an Acronis Rescue CD which loads the fully operational Acronis program onto RAM at startup.

    3. Her SATA HD is divided into 2 primary partitions.

    4. The 1st active parition contains the OS. The 2nd primary paritition is a data storage parition.

    5. The following programs were originally loaded onto the primary partition:

    > WinXP Home
    > Drivers for Motherboard, Web Cam, TV card, LAN card, Wireless mouse and keyboard, etc.
    > Office 2003
    > 3rd Party programs such as Zone Alarm, Avast, Acronis, WinZip, WinRAR, Adobe, etc.
    > All current updates at the time of installation.

    6. No personal data such as music, photos, emails, favorites, contacts, etc was loaded at this point.

    7. An Acronis back-up image of the 1st parition was then created, and saved onto the 2nd data partition of the SATA HD. The same image was also saved onto DVDs.

    That sounds like a good idea because her personal data could then be recovered at leisure from the IDE hard drive.

    Exactly how would you go about creating a copy of the existing C drive partition on the SATA HD and putting it on the IDE HD?

    Another method would be:

    1. Save all personal data, application settings and emails using Acronis to create backup images of these files on the 2nd IDE HD.

    2. Unconditionally format the existing primary active partition on the SATA HD, which contains the current WinXP OS.

    3. Unconditionally format the C drive partition on the SATA HD. And then reload the original Acronis image of the OS back onto the C drive partition. The image that would be reloaded is pristine and free of all malware, program conflicts and corruptions.

    4. Update all drivers and 3rd party software + Windows/Office updates.

    5. Copy the personal data saved as Acronis back-ups from the non-active OS on the 2nd storage IDE hard drive back onto the OS on the SATA HD.
  20. LookinAround

    LookinAround TechSpot Chancellor Posts: 8,372   +167

    This is just some thoughts about tips, so if anyone reading has some additional points pls do add to this info as well

    For starters, here's not a step-by-step but just things to consider including during the reinstall process

    1. While the Acronis backup might already include all the currently installed MS products? Even so, can be handy before you reinstall or reload the image to first get a copy of currently installed MS product license numbers and info since it's easy to do. Checkout magicjelly bean and/or ProduKey. (Note the freeware versions don't yet provide for Office 2010 or win 7 i think. so just make sure you have what you'll need)

    2. See How to backup your drivers (and reinstall them later when needed!)

    3. Look through everything currently listed in Add/Remove Programs
    > If you need it, make sure you know how to reinstall it! Have the install CD or locate its current program installation file online that you can later download after the reinstall
    > If it's a paid product, be sure you have its license key jotted down/saved somewhere so you can re-enter it later
  21. Poppa Bear

    Poppa Bear TS Enthusiast Topic Starter Posts: 266

    Hi Lookin Around,

    Thanks for that input. :) And yes, I will follow those tips as a guide to ensure I don't miss anything. My friend has all the original installation CDs and licence keys neatly stacked in a CD filing rack. And as her XP is OEM she has the original product key sticker on her tower. However, I will certainly check out Add/Remove programs.

    Also, I have never backed up drivers before so that is something I will definitely do. After I've had the opportunity to get back and do the re-install I will definitely advise details of her PC, via copy of System Information.

    One last question. Can EASUS Todo paste a non-active copy of the current C drive, (on her SATA HD), onto the other IDE partition? In other words, can you directly copy the C drive onto another hard drive, or do you first have to create a back up image somewhere, and then use EASEUS Todo to load it onto the other HD as a non active system?

    Cheers Bernie :wave:
  22. LookinAround

    LookinAround TechSpot Chancellor Posts: 8,372   +167

    Just to make sure i understand what you mean (or maybe i'm misinterpreting it?)
    Do you have one physical hard drive or two physical drives?

    I think you are saying you have one physical drive which is divided into two partitions? Soo... Sounds like there is one physical drive. The physical drive would use either an IDE or SATA interface. The interface for the physical drive applies to all parititons on the drive.

    Also note, EASUS Todo is a great freeware tool (IMHO ;) ) It provides a subset of functions/tools you get from Acronis True Image Home.
    I had you install it 1) to prove it would install! and 2) before i realized you had Acronis TIH

    They both
    > Allow you to clone a disk. This is copy one disk image to another. You need two physical disks to clone. One disk image is copied to another disk. Since it's disk image to disk image copy, the target disk data is overwritten when you clone
    > Create a backup image then restore. The backup image is created as a file and can be stored in a folder on a partition. So Backups can be created in a second partition on the same physical disk
    Skim through this thread. You'd want to a Backup (not a Clone) operation.

    In general, backing up to a physically separate media is preferred (like an external USB hard drive) so if the HD itself should crash you don't lose both the original AND backup at the same time. Tho for this specific case, i guess two partitions are OK if you just need a temporary place to save the current image. But if you want to save it for awhile to use in the future, an external USB drive is usually easiest backup medium i think.

    P.S. It sounds like you'll be overwriting the Acronis image currently on the 2nd partition in order to save the new image. (Altho if it's a BIG enough drive with enough space, you can also save both images IF they'll both fit.

    Also, if you haven't yet, you might tell Acronis to verify integrity of the DVD based backup image before you wipe out the old one on HD... just to be extra safe ..
  23. Poppa Bear

    Poppa Bear TS Enthusiast Topic Starter Posts: 266

    1. There are TWO physical hard drives, an IDE and a SATA.

    2. The IDE HD is blank.

    3. The SATA is divided into 2 primary partitions.
    • The 1st partition contains the XP OS.
    • The 2nd partition contains the original pristine uncorrupted back-up Acronis image of the 1st partition.
    Unfortunately the 2nd partition on the SATA HD is only 30GB and not big enough to hold an image of the current OS, as the current system contains 69GB of data all up. Even with compression it would not fit.

    It would be possible to clone the SATA HD onto the blank IDE HD. This would:
    • Wipe out all data on the SATA HD.
    • The IDE HD would then have a clone containing 2 partitions.
    • The XP OS would be on the 1st partition
    • The Acronis image would be on the 2nd partition.
    The Acronis image of XP could then be restored to the SATA HD, and the SATA HD made the active partition. The data contained in the inactive OS on the IDE HD could then be used to retrieve her personal data.

    The risk would be that the clone might be corrupted, either for data or the Acronis image.

    I think maybe the safest method to avoid any corruption would be to:

    • Manually copy all personal data to the IDE HD, OR use the Acronis utility to create images of selected data folders of the existing OS.... 2nd method is less safe, if the images are corrupted.
    • Use the Acronis image on the 2nd partition of the SATA HD to restore the OS on the 1st partition of the SATA HD.
    • Copy the personal files from the IDE storage HD back onto the newly loaded OS on the SATA HD.
  24. LookinAround

    LookinAround TechSpot Chancellor Posts: 8,372   +167

    Sorry for my earlier confusion :confused: !

    Now i follow you have two disks one SATA and one IDE with the 2 partitions on the SATA

    A couple questions:
    1. How big is the IDE HD?
    2. From your description, I’m going to guess that the Acronis “image” file you refer to on that second partition on SATA is stored as a TIB file? (it has a tib file extension?)
    3. How big is each of the partitions on your SATA disk?

    Note that Acronis TIB files have special properties. They include BOTH
    > Disk (and partition) image information so you can recover the disk image from it (or just individual partitions)
    > AND also you can validate them. And you have the ability to mount them and then explore the content of the tib file. (If Acronis can still successfully mount it and you can see its content all help prove its still good :) )

    So you could
    1. Run Acronis backup to backup the SATA disk to the IDE disk (this will include both SATA partitions- assuming the IDE HD is large enough? Could it hold the SATA C drive backup? And perhaps also hold a backup of both SATA partitions?) /* edit */ My distinction here is doing a DISK and PARTITION BACKUP vs. a CLONE operation. Backups are compressed into TIB files. Or maybe you that's you meant in your post above?

    2. Run Acronis to first Validate, then Mount the TIB file on the SATA disk's 2nd partition
    2a. And use Acronis to see how much space will be needed on the SATA C drive to restore that 2nd partition

    3. After Mounting the backup archive from the 2nd SATA partition, you can Explore it and see its content

    4. Be sure to Unmount when done

    5. Boot from Acronis Recovery CD. Tell Acronis
    Source:Point to the TIB file on that 2nd SATA partition
    DestiinationPoint to the C drive on the SATA disk
    Let Acronis complete the recovery operation. On reboot you should have the old image on the active C partition and should (hopefully!) all reboot ok
  25. Poppa Bear

    Poppa Bear TS Enthusiast Topic Starter Posts: 266

    I did a bit of research on my own system. I've had Acronis True Image Home for several years, but never even knew the Mount option existed.... :p Duuuuhhhh! Silly me!

    I'm over the moon! :D It mounts the image in a separate partition on the HD, and allows it to be mounted in read only or wrte/rewrite mode, so it acts like a normal file. 2 questions:

    1. What is the importance of unmounting it?

    2. Can you extract emails, contacts and email accounts; and application settings; from the mounted image?

    Or should these be saved separately using Acronis > Manage Task > Create a new task. And run the task manually as a one off?

    So all I have to do is:

    1. Create a .tib backup file of the current OS on the empty IDE partition. Then validate the .tib file, and mount it in write/rewrite mode.

    2. Restore the pristine original Acronis backup .tib file of the XP OS which is on the 2nd partition of the SATA HD, onto the C drive of the SATA HD thus overwriting the corrupt OS. I'll probably format the 1st partition on the SATA before restoring, just to be sure any remaining traces of corruption or malware are removed.

    3. Then copy the personal data from the mounted Acronis image on the IDE HD to the newly recovered OS.

    Thank you, thank you, thank you! Oh so simple when you know how.

    Sorry I'm a bit slow on the uptake. I'm sure you already knew all of the above... of course you did!.... you suggested it in your post above! Thanks for persevering with me. Even though the original problem wasn't able to be fixed it was all worth it if for no other reasons than to find out about the Mount option in Acronis.

    Cheers and mega gratitude. PB :grinthumb
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