European Central Bank president calls crypto worthless and "based on nothing"

Karlos95

Posts: 271   +188
The difference is that publicly traded companies have tangible value. They have factories, patents, productive employees, trusted brands, visionary leaders and oversight from boards that all contribute to the creation of a useful and profitable product. Returns have never been guaranteed from equity investments but there is a lot of actual data you can use to make an informed bet.

"Investing" in crypto on the other hand is just waiting around hoping more suckers jump on the bandwagon after you did to prop up the price.
I can bet you a tonne of money, more people have lost more money on stocks than on crypto.


"trusted companies" get real please. Companies are there for one thing, and that is profits.
Then you get the smaller companies that rely on capital raising because they have no income, yet the board members still take a pay cut from those funds. It's laughable to say that stocks are regulated. I mean they are in a way. Let the rich keep getting richer all the while the poor are the suckers, only a few win.

If you have held crypto for over 5 years, you are most definitely in the green (besides the scam coins, but hey, you can research that, like you said, use data to determine the best investment).
You do realise some coins are backed by actual businesses making a crap more money than what some businesses are making on the stock market right? Or did you not research that?

And the same can be said about stocks also. Your "STOCK" is only worth what people are willing to pay. Value is added through what people think it's worth, not productivity. Otherwise, the most productive companies would be the richest, which isn't a true statement. For me to sell at a higher price than what I bought a stock, another person has to value it higher and buy it.

Honestly, it's incredible the lengths some go to keep the status quo that keeps them in dumps while the 1% are laughing at the top. Stop thinking companies and governments have you best interests. They don't. And now there is another form of business that they don't understand, they'll say everything they can to make it seem like the worse thing ever. (Warren Buffett for example)
 

AlaskaGuy

Posts: 397   +300
I can bet you a tonne of money, more people have lost more money on stocks than on crypto.


"trusted companies" get real please. Companies are there for one thing, and that is profits.
Then you get the smaller companies that rely on capital raising because they have no income, yet the board members still take a pay cut from those funds. It's laughable to say that stocks are regulated. I mean they are in a way. Let the rich keep getting richer all the while the poor are the suckers, only a few win.

If you have held crypto for over 5 years, you are most definitely in the green (besides the scam coins, but hey, you can research that, like you said, use data to determine the best investment).
You do realise some coins are backed by actual businesses making a crap more money than what some businesses are making on the stock market right? Or did you not research that?

And the same can be said about stocks also. Your "STOCK" is only worth what people are willing to pay. Value is added through what people think it's worth, not productivity. Otherwise, the most productive companies would be the richest, which isn't a true statement. For me to sell at a higher price than what I bought a stock, another person has to value it higher and buy it.

Honestly, it's incredible the lengths some go to keep the status quo that keeps them in dumps while the 1% are laughing at the top. Stop thinking companies and governments have you best interests. They don't. And now there is another form of business that they don't understand, they'll say everything they can to make it seem like the worse thing ever. (Warren Buffett for example)
Crypto = pyramid scheme
 

tancabean

Posts: 42   +48
I can bet you a tonne of money, more people have lost more money on stocks than on crypto.


"trusted companies" get real please. Companies are there for one thing, and that is profits.
Then you get the smaller companies that rely on capital raising because they have no income, yet the board members still take a pay cut from those funds. It's laughable to say that stocks are regulated. I mean they are in a way. Let the rich keep getting richer all the while the poor are the suckers, only a few win.

If you have held crypto for over 5 years, you are most definitely in the green (besides the scam coins, but hey, you can research that, like you said, use data to determine the best investment).
You do realise some coins are backed by actual businesses making a crap more money than what some businesses are making on the stock market right? Or did you not research that?

And the same can be said about stocks also. Your "STOCK" is only worth what people are willing to pay. Value is added through what people think it's worth, not productivity. Otherwise, the most productive companies would be the richest, which isn't a true statement. For me to sell at a higher price than what I bought a stock, another person has to value it higher and buy it.

Honestly, it's incredible the lengths some go to keep the status quo that keeps them in dumps while the 1% are laughing at the top. Stop thinking companies and governments have you best interests. They don't. And now there is another form of business that they don't understand, they'll say everything they can to make it seem like the worse thing ever. (Warren Buffett for example)

Yes companies are there to make profits. It's those profits that make them valuable in the stock market. It's mind boggling that you equate real assets owned by companies (cash, buildings, people, product inventory) with essentially worthless crypto currencies that produce nothing and represent nothing except hopes and prayers. Your entire argument is based on the equivalence of crypto and real tangible assets and is grossly misinformed.

Crypto is 100% gambling and the only way to make money is for the hype to continue. Investing in the stock market is a gamble too but you're gambling with something tangible that's of value to society.
 

Karlos95

Posts: 271   +188
Yes companies are there to make profits. It's those profits that make them valuable in the stock market. It's mind boggling that you equate real assets owned by companies (cash, buildings, people, product inventory) with essentially worthless crypto currencies that produce nothing and represent nothing except hopes and prayers. Your entire argument is based on the equivalence of crypto and real tangible assets and is grossly misinformed.

Crypto is 100% gambling and the only way to make money is for the hype to continue. Investing in the stock market is a gamble too but you're gambling with something tangible that's of value to society.
Did you even finish reading my last comment?

I literally said some are tied to businesses (think of their currency as shares but not really) who make a lot more money than some stocks, more assets, more employees. You are literally looking at this in a 2D vision instead of a 3D vision. So tied to your status quo that you cannot look past the fact that stocks a meaningless. And now there is something to threaten it you are trying to argue that stocks are superior LOL!

Like I said. Plenty more people gamble on stocks. And are ill regulated for that only of the rich man. Not for you or I.
 

tancabean

Posts: 42   +48
Did you even finish reading my last comment?

I literally said some are tied to businesses (think of their currency as shares but not really) who make a lot more money than some stocks, more assets, more employees. You are literally looking at this in a 2D vision instead of a 3D vision. So tied to your status quo that you cannot look past the fact that stocks a meaningless. And now there is something to threaten it you are trying to argue that stocks are superior LOL!

Like I said. Plenty more people gamble on stocks. And are ill regulated for that only of the rich man. Not for you or I.

Yes I read every word. You’re not addressing the fundamental point that crypto has no inherent value. Stocks are not “meaningless”. If you truly believe that then you simply don’t understand how financial markets work.

The sad part is that regular people are losing tons of money thinking crypto is some get rich quick scheme because they’re caught up in the hype and have no idea what they’re doing. And it’s the people who already have money who benefit the most.
 

Karlos95

Posts: 271   +188
Yes I read every word. You’re not addressing the fundamental point that crypto has no inherent value. Stocks are not “meaningless”. If you truly believe that then you simply don’t understand how financial markets work.

The sad part is that regular people are losing tons of money thinking crypto is some get rich quick scheme because they’re caught up in the hype and have no idea what they’re doing. And it’s the people who already have money who benefit the most.
Ok so when blockbuster turned to 0, the stocks are still worth something? Ok.

Have you looked at tech stocks in the last year? Most down, some down 70%, worse than some coins that are apparently the most volatile.

"The sad part is that regular people are losing tons of money thinking crypto is some get rich quick scheme because they’re caught up in the hype and have no idea what they’re doing. And it’s the people who already have money who benefit the most." - Holy cow. You could literally replace crypto with stocks and get the exact same outcome and still be factual.

For you not to realise this, shows you don't understand how financial markets work. All the analysts in the world can value a company, but the big bucks come from the hype. Look at Zoom (not the video conference software) it went up 70% because fools thought it was the mainstream Zoom during the pandemic.
 

tancabean

Posts: 42   +48
Ok so when blockbuster turned to 0, the stocks are still worth something? Ok.

Have you looked at tech stocks in the last year? Most down, some down 70%, worse than some coins that are apparently the most volatile.

"The sad part is that regular people are losing tons of money thinking crypto is some get rich quick scheme because they’re caught up in the hype and have no idea what they’re doing. And it’s the people who already have money who benefit the most." - Holy cow. You could literally replace crypto with stocks and get the exact same outcome and still be factual.

For you not to realise this, shows you don't understand how financial markets work. All the analysts in the world can value a company, but the big bucks come from the hype. Look at Zoom (not the video conference software) it went up 70% because fools thought it was the mainstream Zoom during the pandemic.

Yes fools who think they can pick individual stocks and make big money in one year are gambling. That’s not what stock investing is about. investing is all about index funds and 401k’s for people who aren’t trying to make a quick buck. Those people deserve to lose their money along with the other fools betting on crypto.
 

Karlos95

Posts: 271   +188
Yes fools who think they can pick individual stocks and make big money in one year are gambling. That’s not what stock investing is about. investing is all about index funds and 401k’s for people who aren’t trying to make a quick buck. Those people deserve to lose their money along with the other fools betting on crypto.
Hoping people lose money because they most likely don't have a stable income/living arrangements and trying to use part of the system created (that keeps them in such conditions) to try to better themselves is quite ignorant to say the least. Some people don't have 10 years to wait. They need the money now, so obviously they are going to use certain tools to do that.

Yes, some are well off and are most likely "betting" obscene amounts of money. But some are just trying to get their next meal ticket. Since that is how capitalism works.
 

NightAntilli

Posts: 911   +1,184
Yes I read every word. You’re not addressing the fundamental point that crypto has no inherent value. Stocks are not “meaningless”. If you truly believe that then you simply don’t understand how financial markets work.

The sad part is that regular people are losing tons of money thinking crypto is some get rich quick scheme because they’re caught up in the hype and have no idea what they’re doing. And it’s the people who already have money who benefit the most.
Sounds like every market.

But let's be real here. The whole "no inherent value" argument makes zero sense. Does the internet have inherent value? If so, why? If not, why not?

I wonder what people think something like Bitcoin is when they say it has no inherent value. Do you know how many computers are at work to maintain the network? All that hardware definitely has intrinsic value, and especially the ASICs are specifically designed just for that purpose.

And if we take Ethereum, unless you're going to argue that graphics cards have zero intrinsic value, one can't argue that Ethereum has zero intrinsic value. That's not even counting all the other things that can be done on Ethereum and other smart contract platforms.

At this point, arguing that crypto has no value but stock do is like arguing that emails have no value but the postal office does.
 

Karlos95

Posts: 271   +188
Sounds like every market.

But let's be real here. The whole "no inherent value" argument makes zero sense. Does the internet have inherent value? If so, why? If not, why not?

I wonder what people think something like Bitcoin is when they say it has no inherent value. Do you know how many computers are at work to maintain the network? All that hardware definitely has intrinsic value, and especially the ASICs are specifically designed just for that purpose.

And if we take Ethereum, unless you're going to argue that graphics cards have zero intrinsic value, one can't argue that Ethereum has zero intrinsic value. That's not even counting all the other things that can be done on Ethereum and other smart contract platforms.

At this point, arguing that crypto has no value but stock do is like arguing that emails have no value but the postal office does.
"BiTcOiN HaS nO VaLuE" Meanwhile, it's only the most secure network on the planet.
 

fps4ever

Posts: 936   +1,364
"BiTcOiN HaS nO VaLuE" Meanwhile, it's only the most secure network on the planet.

You are talking about the underlying blockchain technology used to mine it. Not bitcoin itself, which is only magical beans worth nothing. That can be used for Financials backend transactions. Some poeple don't even know what the hech they are arguing... 🙄
 

Karlos95

Posts: 271   +188
You are talking about the underlying blockchain technology used to mine it. Not bitcoin itself, which is only magical beans worth nothing. That can be used for Financials backend transactions. Some poeple don't even know what the hech they are arguing... 🙄
Sounds like you don't...

You do realise why it's blockchain technology is secure right?
 

fps4ever

Posts: 936   +1,364
Sounds like you don't...

You do realise why it's blockchain technology is secure right?

Yes.. please tell me it's only because you mine bitcoin and it can't work without mining...come on I dare you to change the target. TelL uS More hoW We JusT dOnT uNderStand.
 
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Karlos95

Posts: 271   +188
Yes.. please tell me it's only because you mine bitcoin and it can't work without mining...come on I dare you to change the target.
Who is mining without the incentive to do so?

Please tell me. Who is wasting all those $ on electricity without the incentive.


There wouldn't be a company in the world willing to spend that much $$ on keeping a network as secure as Bitcoins.
 

fps4ever

Posts: 936   +1,364
Who is mining without the incentive to do so?

Please tell me. Who is wasting all those $ on electricity without the incentive.


There wouldn't be a company in the world willing to spend that much $$ on keeping a network as secure as Bitcoins.

You mean like Wells Fargo and HSBC are going to do for backend transactions? They won't be using their servers for mining. More banks will be using blockchain with no regard for mining. No companies huh?
 

Karlos95

Posts: 271   +188
You mean like Wells Fargo and HSBC are going to do for backend transactions? They won't be using their servers for mining. More banks will be using blockchain with no regard for min


They can use blockchain all they want. Still won't be as secure as Bitcoins network. Also, no mention on how they plan to implement their network. Who will be using their electricity?

But again, still a dumb comment to make that bitcoin has no value.
 

tancabean

Posts: 42   +48
They can use blockchain all they want. Still won't be as secure as Bitcoins network. Also, no mention on how they plan to implement their network. Who will be using their electricity?

But again, still a dumb comment to make that bitcoin has no value.

Bitcoin has lots of value to grifters taking advantage of uneducated saps chasing a quick dollar.
 

fps4ever

Posts: 936   +1,364
They can use blockchain all they want. Still won't be as secure as Bitcoins network. Also, no mention on how they plan to implement their network. Who will be using their electricity?

But again, still a dumb comment to make that bitcoin has no value.

I see you fail to realize that not all blockchain networks require the full power of the sun to process transactions. Or do you think there is just one blockchain network? 😒 Before you go calling others dumb maybe you should educate yourself more. All other network technology requires electricity as well, not just magic coins. They don't have a monopoly on electricity use.
 
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Karlos95

Posts: 271   +188
I see you fail to realize that not all blockchain networks require the full power of the sun to process transactions. Or do you think there is just one blockchain network? 😒 Before you go calling others dumb maybe you should educate yourself more. All other network technology requires electricity as well, not just magic coins. They don't have a monopoly on electricity use.
Maybe you should re-read before commenting. I did not ever say "all blockchain networks require the full power of the sun to process transactions."

I quite literally said no blockchain is as secure as Bitcoins. Prove me wrong.

Never said anything about anyone else using the technology. They can. Just won't be as good. Really simple.

"But again, still a dumb comment to make that bitcoin has no value."