US stops trading with eight Chinese quantum computing groups

mongeese

Posts: 584   +119
Staff member
In brief: The US Department of Commerce has banned dealings with 27 foreign entities based in China, Japan, Pakistan, and Singapore. Eight are developing quantum computing technologies, which the US has now recognized as a national security concern.

All eight entities developing quantum computing technologies were found to be pursuing potential military applications on behalf of the Chinese government. Three of them were found to be acquiring or attempting to acquire American technologies to assist them.

The Department of Commerce believes that quantum computing could support a number of military applications that China is interested in, including "counter-stealth and counter-submarine applications, and the ability to break encryption or develop unbreakable encryption."

One of the eight entities was the quantum computing branch of the University of Science and Technology of China, which claimed to have built the fastest quantum computer in the world earlier this year. It theorized that the computer was two to three times faster than America’s best.

Several of the entities have downplayed the bans. QuantumCTek is describing the situation as "manageable," according to Nikkei Asia. It said that because it owns the essential technologies and mostly relies on Chinese sources, it was never dependent on the US.

Of the 19 non-quantum computing entities that were also banned, three were Chinese-owned companies based in China, Japan, and Singapore selling American technology to Iran’s military and space programs and North Korean front companies.

The remaining 16 were blacklisted because they’ve contributed to Pakistan’s "unsafeguarded nuclear activities or ballistic missile program." Some are based in Pakistan, while others are Chinese. Curiously, one was a refrigeration and air conditioning company.

In addition to the banned entities list, the Department of Commerce also maintains a list of entities that have a military end-user (MEU) for their products. The Moscow Institute of Physics and Technology has been added to that list.

Permalink to story.

 

Dimitriid

Posts: 2,106   +4,032
Ah yes: Glad to see the free trade champions of the world in the US use their favorite excuse, "security concerns" to avoid competing in the free market they push when it does not suits them.
 

Kosmoz

Posts: 581   +1,065
Both countries are heavily arming themselves (plus other nations too) in every aspect that matters and more and more restrictions are placed against each other (but more from US), so the only question I have is: WW3 when?

Not if, but when...

I think the US can choke China only so much until they explode with anger.

I'm also not a fan of either of them and there will be no winner in this upcoming (but inevitable) war. The entire world will suffer.
 

ScottSoapbox

Posts: 298   +530
Ah yes: Glad to see the free trade champions of the world in the US use their favorite excuse, "security concerns" to avoid competing in the free market they push when it does not suits them.
In what way is trying to prevent a competitor from stealing your intellectual property "avoid[ing] competing in the free market"?

You really should spend 10 minutes googling the slogans you espouse so you can at least use them correctly.
 

Dimitriid

Posts: 2,106   +4,032
Both countries are heavily arming themselves (plus other nations too) in every aspect that matters and more and more restrictions are placed against each other (but more from US), so the only question I have is: WW3 when?

Not if, but when...

I think the US can choke China only so much until they explode with anger.

I'm also not a fan of either of them and there will be no winner in this upcoming (but inevitable) war. The entire world will suffer.
Don't think open war is very likely. Sadly, the more plausible scenario is a return to cold war era of proxy wars, particularly in places where China and the US + EU block are fighting each other for control of key resources so: Africa, Latin America and some parts of Asia.

Even with direct attacks to trade like the one on this article, the US would never go so far as to leave themselves basically with 0 manufacturing overnight which is something that would bring down the US way faster than trying to suffocate China out of really high end tech, simply because while the strategic advantage is important, it's not nearly as important as basic goods.

Even just a tiny bit of disruption on electronics (Not even *just* the high end stuff like processors but just pcbs, transistors, etc. Cheap stuff) is making the US so worried you could even see moves like this not as an attack but as retaliation and it wouldn't be incredibly out of hand to consider it such.

So, while the US seeks to gain and control allies to move & secure those production lines for basic goods (Because they'll never go back to being a manufacturer country: That's why they invest most of they money on military to make sure they can force others to do the low profit but really necessary manufacturing) they might want to maneuver some strategic resources: Oil is probably not going to be greatly contested for much longer but rare metals will be and I can easily see escalating violence around Africa, Latin America, etc. as China tries to hold on or gain some of those resources while the US gets to just deploy that behemoth military force on brown people they don't really care about massacring in the process.

There's no point in directly attacking China and basically taking yourself out by disrupting almost *ALL* of your manufacturing but a little bit to help gain more influence, that's no problem.
 

Kosmoz

Posts: 581   +1,065
Don't think open war is very likely. Sadly, the more plausible scenario is a return to cold war era of proxy wars, particularly in places where China and the US + EU block are fighting each other for control of key resources so: Africa, Latin America and some parts of Asia.

Even with direct attacks to trade like the one on this article, the US would never go so far as to leave themselves basically with 0 manufacturing overnight which is something that would bring down the US way faster than trying to suffocate China out of really high end tech, simply because while the strategic advantage is important, it's not nearly as important as basic goods.

Even just a tiny bit of disruption on electronics (Not even *just* the high end stuff like processors but just pcbs, transistors, etc. Cheap stuff) is making the US so worried you could even see moves like this not as an attack but as retaliation and it wouldn't be incredibly out of hand to consider it such.

So, while the US seeks to gain and control allies to move & secure those production lines for basic goods (Because they'll never go back to being a manufacturer country: That's why they invest most of they money on military to make sure they can force others to do the low profit but really necessary manufacturing) they might want to maneuver some strategic resources: Oil is probably not going to be greatly contested for much longer but rare metals will be and I can easily see escalating violence around Africa, Latin America, etc. as China tries to hold on or gain some of those resources while the US gets to just deploy that behemoth military force on brown people they don't really care about massacring in the process.

There's no point in directly attacking China and basically taking yourself out by disrupting almost *ALL* of your manufacturing but a little bit to help gain more influence, that's no problem.
You and a lot of other people are going to be negatively surprised of what's going to happen in the next 5 years... we're gonna go from bad to worse and then, the worst.

There is no stopping of what's coming... it's just a question of when: sooner or later, like I said, not if.

I would like to be wrong, but I'm not.
 

Dimitriid

Posts: 2,106   +4,032
You and a lot of other people are going to be negatively surprised of what's going to happen in the next 5 years... we're gonna go from bad to worse and then, the worst.

There is no stopping of what's coming... it's just a question of when: sooner or later, like I said, not if.

I would like to be wrong, but I'm not.
Actually considering I live in Latin America, I would be positively surprised if the wars (Which we sort of agree are inevitable) don't happen on my country or other poor countries around here.

Don't get me I don't want anyone to suffer but if it's inevitable and war happens on China and/or US territories directly, well let's just say that the richer and powerful countries can bounce back much faster than the poorer ones as we're still not fully recovered from 20th century wars, recessions and conflicts in many cases.

In fairness to your point I would be surprised if there's direct war nevertheless.
 

Crinkles

Posts: 226   +211
Don't think open war is very likely. Sadly, the more plausible scenario is a return to cold war era of proxy wars, particularly in places where China and the US + EU block are fighting each other for control of key resources so: Africa, Latin America and some parts of Asia.

But... I'm glad we've got you on our side. Geez Xst.

From the news with links.

Commerce Department has added eight technology producers to its Entity List to prevent them from supporting the Chinese military's quantum computing efforts. Officials are concerned the entities could feed "emerging" US tech that could aid with breaking encryption, producing 'unbreakable' encryption and developing anti-stealth or anti-submarine systems.

The list focuses on a mix of companies and researchers, including QuantumCTek and the Hefei National Laboratory for Physical Sciences at Microscale. The US also added three affiliates of Corad Technology Limited, a Chinese firm on the list since 2019, although it wasn't clear that quantum computing was involved — it was also accused of backing Iran's military and space programs as well as North Korea "front companies."

The broader Entity List update included 27 organizations and people, including 13 in Pakistan accused of backing the country's "unsafeguarded" nuclear programs.

I doubt we're going to BLOW UP THE WORLD just because there's a list!

trying to suffocate China out of really high end tech, simply because while the strategic advantage is important

They have other trading partners, dreamer.

is making the US so worried you could even see moves like this not as an attack but as retaliation and it wouldn't be incredibly out of hand to consider it such.

Once again. It's a list. A list of companies/ppl to not do business is not a warehouse stocked with bombs.

The US also has bombs, Chyna better watch their moves.

So, while the US seeks to gain and control allies to move & secure those production lines for basic goods (Because they'll never go back to being a manufacturer country:

Disregarding that the US is a MANUFACTURING country?

[TABLE]
[TR]
[TD]Country[/TD]
[TD]Manufacturing Output (USD in billions)[/TD]
[TD]Percent of National Output[/TD]
[TD]Percent of Global Manufacturing[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]China[/TD]
[TD]$2,010[/TD]
[TD]27%[/TD]
[TD]20%[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]United States[/TD]
[TD]1,867[/TD]
[TD]12[/TD]
[TD]18[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Japan[/TD]
[TD]1,063[/TD]
[TD]19[/TD]
[TD]10[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]Germany[/TD]
[TD]700[/TD]
[TD]23[/TD]
[TD]7[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

That's why they invest most of they money on military to make sure they can force others to do the low profit but really necessary manufacturing)

And education, and highways, waterways, ports, the LIST is endless.

There's no point in directly attacking China and basically taking yourself out by disrupting almost *ALL* of your manufacturing but a little bit to help gain more influence, that's no problem.

It's fantasy day, Fantasize hard.
 

kiwigraeme

Posts: 992   +742
Good to know you're fine with stealing intellectual property. I saw that you were big into file sharing and torrents so I'm not surprised.

What do you think the War of Independence was about?
The Tea tax was actually not that much . Many of the founding fathers were in debt to Europe - they didn't want to pay for IP etc
So America was founded on IP theft ( yes you would of got Independence anyway ) and has continued to steal IP and belittle the rights of less developed countries.
Yes we have the right to come and steal your crops , TM mark and modify them , stop you from selling in competition against us .

The rest of the world owes The USA and big European countries like England, Germany nothing with regards to IP - they colluded,conspire to steal, economically dominate, commoditise developing countries output ( so paid peanuts , while money made overseas ) - Throw Switzerland in the mix with Nescafe/chocolate

Why are people afraid of trade agreements with The USA - they fear that Corporations will have sovereignty over them - I don't know if this is true. That in America is easier for corporations to kill, steal than an US citizen. Will the Sacklers do jail time - I think not - there are hundreds of thousands of these examples - a black man in Texas - life imprisonment for stealing a frozen chicken .
 

Rayneofpayne

Posts: 502   +415
Both countries are heavily arming themselves (plus other nations too) in every aspect that matters and more and more restrictions are placed against each other (but more from US), so the only question I have is: WW3 when?

Not if, but when...

I think the US can choke China only so much until they explode with anger.

I'm also not a fan of either of them and there will be no winner in this upcoming (but inevitable) war. The entire world will suffer.
Will never happen, the stupid countries intertwined their economies(also they are at the mercy of corporations that are international) and supply chains on each other that they literally could never afford a WW, China by far isn't broke however the tighter they close their fists on their own people the more people from within will eventually take care of its own issue of the communist party, Hong Kong and Taiwan are issues they cannot solve. They have shadow Debts out the ying yang and alot of their gold was counterfeit and while that may lead to desperation they really have no one to turn to, all their allies are more likely to drop a bomb on them versus an opposition.
The US has the major issue of extremist dummies on the left in control now and extremist dummies on the right wing of the politics and only a few in the median trying to control the 3 ring circus atm, and a population that is incredibly mostly low IQ wannabes pretending to be qualified for the jobs they hold the US has gotten fat and lazy, and let the education system slip into nonsense stupidity leading to a population hoping on dreams rather than reality. People are led to believe there is a race war that for the most part does not exist caving and catering to extremist groups rather than keeping an eye on that extremist capitalism groups that give way to corporatism which are running around behind the curtain probably controlling everything in n an attempt to make the rich richer while dissolving the middle class. It seriously is the nightmare fuel from a dystopian Sci Fi novel.
 

Kosmoz

Posts: 581   +1,065
Will never happen, the stupid countries intertwined their economies(also they are at the mercy of corporations that are international) and supply chains on each other that they literally could never afford a WW, China by far isn't broke however the tighter they close their fists on their own people the more people from within will eventually take care of its own issue of the communist party, Hong Kong and Taiwan are issues they cannot solve. They have shadow Debts out the ying yang and alot of their gold was counterfeit and while that may lead to desperation they really have no one to turn to, all their allies are more likely to drop a bomb on them versus an opposition.
The US has the major issue of extremist dummies on the left in control now and extremist dummies on the right wing of the politics and only a few in the median trying to control the 3 ring circus atm, and a population that is incredibly mostly low IQ wannabes pretending to be qualified for the jobs they hold the US has gotten fat and lazy, and let the education system slip into nonsense stupidity leading to a population hoping on dreams rather than reality. People are led to believe there is a race war that for the most part does not exist caving and catering to extremist groups rather than keeping an eye on that extremist capitalism groups that give way to corporatism which are running around behind the curtain probably controlling everything in n an attempt to make the rich richer while dissolving the middle class. It seriously is the nightmare fuel from a dystopian Sci Fi novel.
I agree with almost everything you said and the description of US is spot on, the only thing missing from that description is their $28 trillion debt they have now...

Yet, I still believe a WW3 followed by the worst global economic crash (both will be the worse that ever been) will happen or vice-versa, which ever comes first will be the incentive for the other... and it will happen because there are forces above governments and countries and politics that have their own agenda and it's not the well-being of humanity, but their own selfish one.
 

kiwigraeme

Posts: 992   +742
Will never happen, the stupid countries intertwined their economies(also they are at the mercy of corporations that are international) and supply chains on each other that they literally could never afford a WW, China by far isn't broke however the tighter they close their fists on their own people the more people from within will eventually take care of its own issue of the communist party, Hong Kong and Taiwan are issues they cannot solve. They have shadow Debts out the ying yang and alot of their gold was counterfeit and while that may lead to desperation they really have no one to turn to, all their allies are more likely to drop a bomb on them versus an opposition.
The US has the major issue of extremist dummies on the left in control now and extremist dummies on the right wing of the politics and only a few in the median trying to control the 3 ring circus atm, and a population that is incredibly mostly low IQ wannabes pretending to be qualified for the jobs they hold the US has gotten fat and lazy, and let the education system slip into nonsense stupidity leading to a population hoping on dreams rather than reality. People are led to believe there is a race war that for the most part does not exist caving and catering to extremist groups rather than keeping an eye on that extremist capitalism groups that give way to corporatism which are running around behind the curtain probably controlling everything in n an attempt to make the rich richer while dissolving the middle class. It seriously is the nightmare fuel from a dystopian Sci Fi novel.
a lot of good points - I don't think the mega rich want to dissolve the middle-class - they are their consumers and protectors - Sure a lot of rich are driven ( I only have more if you have less mentality ) . But they want to blend in sometimes -well maybe just their kids/family- so they can hangout at cheap places like Aspen without 24 hour security .
It's the endebited people at the bottom they want to do low paid , poor condition jobs, to incur repetitive bank , loan penalties just try to enjoy or provide in life .
The slave system at the bottom in say America is a huge corporate subsidy and off-loading of social and negative consequences . Who picks up the costs - you the the tax payer in money , crime and more disorder .
I understand MAGA - remember when a person could work as a labourer , rent/buy a house - could afford to go to the bar and have a few beers etc .
They couldn't afford all the mod-cons like flying internationally a big color tv . But they had financial independence . Now you can afford consumer stuff , but not a home - do they have time to chill working 2 jobs , worried about medical bills, paying back payday loans
 

Dimitrios

Posts: 1,049   +855
LOL no joke 1-2 nights ago I was actually thinking how China will use Quantum computing against us.
 

umbala

Posts: 603   +1,007
Ah yes: Glad to see the free trade champions of the world in the US use their favorite excuse, "security concerns" to avoid competing in the free market they push when it does not suits them.
Free trade and free market does not mean that anything goes.