Windows 8 discussion

[SNGX1275]

Thought we needed a thread where users could posts their thoughts/experiences/questions about Windows 8. I'll start off.

I didn't want to replace my existing Win 7 on my main machine with Win 8, and I had a a Pentium 4 2.4Ghz with HT and 1 GB of RAM that I use sparingly with Win 7 and PC-BSD. It had a freshly formatted old 200GB IDE/PATA drive in it so I thought I'd try a triple boot.

WEI Scores:
Processor: 3.4
RAM: 4.4
Graphics: 2.1
Gaming Graphics: 2.7
Primary Hard Disk: 5.3

Seems pretty usable. Certainly not a speed demon, little surprised the RAM and HD scored so high because it seems when there is a noticeable amount of lag it is when the HD is churning away pretty hard. Suppose thats just the lack of RAM. But I'm not going to be upgrading the RAM in this thing anyway (old ram is way too expensive) - I later turned off paging on the C drive and put it on the D (Window's 7's C) so now the pagefile is on a different drive than where the programs and OS are. I expect that has helped, but I didn't use it terribly long before the change-over.

Was disappointed on first boot that neither the graphics card (nvidia 6200) nor the audio (some c-media chipset) were not auto detected. So on boot I had 2 resolutions to choose from and no audio. Fortunately this machine also boots into PC-BSD and Windows 7, so I was able to go to the other hard drive and get the nvidia drivers from <Win7Drive>:\nvidia and then I told Device Manager to look in <Win7Drive>:\Windows\system32 to find the audio driver. So I have decent video and sound now.

It seems to be a fair bit faster than Windows 7 on the same hardware. In fact, using Opera with the option set where plugins do not load without my consent has made browsing on it almost as quick as on my main machine.

 

[hahahanoobs]

How is software compatibility?

 

[Archean]

I have just downloaded W8CP x64, and hopefully will be able to find some time to install /try it later on once I get home, will update once I have formed my opinion

 

[SNGX1275]

How is software compatibility?

Well. So far so good. Just installed Garmin Mapsource from a CD that came with my Forerunner 201. The CD says minimum requirements are a Pentium processor, Windows 98, and 32 megs of HD space. I don't know if I needed to, but I launched the setup as administrator and with compatibility mode for Windows 98. It installed. Then I ran an update, got it updated to the newest version which is totally Win 7 compatible. I was doing this because my Forerunner 201 still works and my girlfriend is using it, but her modern PC doesn't have a serial port, which the Forerunner uses. So serial ports still work too!

I do have a question though:
Do I need Security Essentials (or any other AV) for Windows 8? I'm not getting a warning about needing it, and the action center is showing Windows Defender doing the antivirus work now. Isn't it in Win 7 that Windows Defender just does some malware protection or scanning? I'm a little confused on this.

 

[EXCellR8]

Got it up and running pretty smooth on a whipped together frankenstein build downstairs. I have to say most of the new UI elements are a bit too simple for my taste but at least it's workable. No traditional start menu is a pretty bold move imo but the new design works all the same. Overall most of what I'm seeing is just UI and layout changes but I suppose previous versions of Windows have all been pretty similar in these respects. I'm gonna do a little more tinkering and see if I can get some heavier software to run on this guy.

As far as security goes I'd say try installing your favorite AV and see what happens... wondering if the latest Avast will have any issues. Avast 7 is pretty great btw

 

[Burty117]

How the hell do you get the start menu back!

 

[jmjsquared]

On a 4+ year-old Dell Inspiron 1525 laptop, Pentium Dual T3200 2Ghz/2GHz, 8 GB DDR2, Hitachi 320 GB 7200 RPM SATA HDD, with Windows 8 64-bit, I get:

WEI Sub-scores:
Processor: 5.7 (I believe this is .3 -.4 better than when I ran Windows 7 on same machine.)
RAM: 6.1 (Also higher than on Window 7)
Graphics:3.7
Gaming Graphics: 3.1 (Same as Win 7)
Primary Hard Disk: 6.1 (HDTune logs 2 Reallocated Sectors or I think this would be higher.)

All drivers installed for me, including basic Intel HighDef Audio drivers but had to custom install Sigmatel drivers to get all OEM features working. Even auto-installed drivers for an old HP OJ 5510 printer!

No software compatibility issues... yet.

Installed Avast Internet Security 7 (upgraded with a Version 6 license valid 'til April) no problems, except Avast's NDIS Filter Miniport won't install properly. Working on it. Windows 8 definitely seems significantly faster to me than Windows 7, even tho' Avast 7 does an extra pre-load function with 8 that it doesn't do with Windows 7.

With this laptop's low-end video processor, disabling IE 10's use of GPU rendering sped up loading of flash/video, where in 7's IE9 disabling slowed things down!?!

Windows 8's Metro-cious GUI corn-fuses me. I'm getting old, I guess. Used Spiderworks Technologies' "Enable Windows8ClassicMenu.exe" to get back the good, ol' Desktop and Start Menus. Find download and DIY Registry hack here: http://www.mywindowsclub.com/resources/5088-Enable-classic-start-menu-Windows.aspx
There's also Microsoft's "Windows 8 Tweaker.exe" (MD5: a656d4c7cd8d7e84c50acce346d75609) . Sorry but can't find the link.


All-in-all, I like Windows 8.

Note below: Can't get it to install on Virtual PC or VHD but runs a charm on VMWare.

 

[oldikes]

i need HELP!

I tried installing the windows 8 consumer preview on a new 75 GB partition a created. For some reason, Acer formatted the hard drive as MBR on an UEFI mobo. Windows can't do that, apparently. is there any way to do this without a hard drive reformat? (deleting all the data)?
not familiar with hard drive and boot stuff very much, so small words are good!

 

[jmjsquared]

I do have a question though:
Do I need Security Essentials (or any other AV) for Windows 8? I'm not getting a warning about needing it, and the action center is showing Windows Defender doing the antivirus work now. Isn't it in Win 7 that Windows Defender just does some malware protection or scanning? I'm a little confused on this.

Pre-Windows 8, Windows Defender and Microsoft Security Essentials were separate products. Now, in Windows 8 CP, Microsoft has made them into a single solution called "Windows Defender". So, no third-party AV necessary... at least, not until the anti-bundling, anti-trust/competition lawsuits begin to fly.

 

[jmjsquared]

i need HELP!

I tried installing the windows 8 consumer preview on a new 75 GB partition a created. For some reason, Acer formatted the hard drive as MBR on an UEFI mobo. Windows can't do that, apparently. is there any way to do this without a hard drive reformat? (deleting all the data)?
not familiar with hard drive and boot stuff very much, so small words are good!

Greetings, ikesmasher. Been a while.

I require smallerer words than you but, in a similar dilemma with Windows 7, I still found this discussion helpful: http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=1035719815&postcount=6

Hope it helps.

 

[mpkl55]

New install of 8 preview

I just installed the latest consumer preview this morning. It installed slow on a fairly high end system (socket 1155 mb with i5 2500k sandy bridge and 8 gb ram. I'm unable to get the Creative XFI Fatal1ty working so no sound unless I pull out the card and use the onboard chip.

From what I see currently unless they change the method of navigation with a classic start menu then I have no intention of adopting this for my 3 desktops or my 1 laptop. I like the way windows 7 navigates and so far this os is a disappointment

 

[SNGX1275]

I haven't tried it yet myself, but jmjsquared in post #7 of this thread had a link that allows you to get your regular Start menu back. I think I'm going to hold off on doing that for the time being, just to try and get used to how 8 operates, if I feel it still sucks after a while (it probably will) I'll add the regular start menu.

I imagine that I'll quickly just end up having a bunch of programs and shortcuts to specific locations 'pinned' to the task bar. It will end up looking like the Dock in OS X.

 

[EXCellR8]

I sort of wish they kept the interface the same and just made it more secure and with some of the newer UI tweaks. The clarity and simplicity is nice but they could have always made a tablet version and a regular desktop OS, instead of this all-in-one deal. Of course they need some kind of gimmick to make people want to shell out more money for a "new" OS, but it really isn't that much different from 7 when you strip away all the new interface elements.

 

[SNGX1275]

I'm not sure EXCellR8 - The memory and processor management is superior to Win 7.

 

[Archean]

I will add one more dimension to this debate, going forward, I think desktop users (read 'power users') will have to understand that MAK (i.e. mouse-and-keyboard) UI will no longer be the priority for MS (or for any other software company for that matter) as touch (due to explosion in mobile tech) is the way forward, hence, from hereon in I fully expected touch interfaces to be prioritized above MAK. Problem is, generally we are (including me) are averse to change.

 

[Dawn1113]

I'm not sure EXCellR8 - The memory and processor management is superior to Win 7.

So better malloc? Other than the increase in WEI scores cited above, are the improvements immediately apparent, say, the way W7 was (for many, at least) over Vista when it first came out? I wonder what the benchmarks will look like.

 

[jmjsquared]

New Coke or Coke Classic?

Microsoft may dodge the bullet that had Coke scrambling to backtrack on their gross mis-read of their customers. There are already some really good third-party apps (ViStart, Metrocheat, XLaunchpad...) that restore the accustomed Start Menu and Desktop to Windows 8 CP and permit you to toggle Metro on/off with a mouse click. I can see the benefits of having the familiar interface for business and power users who may then easily switch to the tablet-oriented GUI for "play".

I'll be surprised if MS doesn't build-in this capability to the final release.

Under the hood, Windows 8 appears to be a solid improvement on 7 which, imo, is a really great OS.

 

[SNGX1275]

Other than the increase in WEI scores cited above, are the improvements immediately apparent, say, the way W7 was (for many, at least) over Vista when it first came out? I wonder what the benchmarks will look like.

Well, I've noticed that it feels faster than 7 on the same hardware. I don't think it is a placebo effect. It is supposed to handle memory and processor usage better. (Can't find a link on processor usage at the moment, but I've read one where certain apps are essentially prevented from using processor if they are in the background).

As far as the improved WEI scores.. I think at least some might be artificial. The scale is now 0 to 9.9, whereas in 7 its 0-7.9, and in Vista it is 0-5.9. I need to go back and look at what my WEI score is in 7 and compare it to what I'm getting in 8. I may be wrong, and I'm not sure if I'll be able to tell on my system because I have 7 and 8 on different physical hard drives. Need more data Problem is, 8 didn't recognize that I had 7 installed. So now I'm going to have to use the 7 disk to redo the MBR, and then run EasyBCD to get my triple boot back up.

 

[aart12]

Trouble with VM

Getting this error when attempting to mount CD ISO;


Failed to open a session for the virtual machine Win8 64.

VT-x features locked or unavailable in MSR. (VERR_VMX_MSR_LOCKED_OR_DISABLED).

Result Code: E_FAIL (0x80004005)
Component: Console
Interface: IConsole {1968b7d3-e3bf-4ceb-99e0-cb7c913317bb}

Any suggestions?

BTW...
Running VM on Win7 64b, VM set to 1 core, 13GB RAM, 32GB Space

 

[jmjsquared]

VT-x features locked or unavailable in MSR. (VERR_VMX_MSR_LOCKED_OR_DISABLED).

Try disabling Hardware Acceleration/Virtualization. That caused conflicts for me with Windows 7.

 

[aart12]

Try disabling Hardware Acceleration/Virtualization. That caused conflicts for me with Windows 7.

Yeah, tried that. No go.
I'm suspecting that I need to enable VM in my BIOS. I'm on with HP now to help me get into those settings, which are not selectable. Some secret HP has to enable the admin settings in the BIOS. We'll see.

 

[aart12]

Solved...

Yeas, that was it. Had to enable VM in the BIOS. Good grief.

 

[jmjsquared]

Great! Was it disabled by default?

Anyway, enjoy the weekend.

 

[aart12]

Great! Was it disabled by default?

Anyway, enjoy the weekend.

Yes it was, indeed. HP playing Big Brother. "Don't play with sharp objects".
But, as it turned out, a nearly complete waste of time. I was so completely under-whelmed with the Win8 preview, I uninstalled it and the VM soon thereafter.

I'll be sticking to Win7 for quite some time if this is anywhere near the final product.

At least I figured out how to get into the administrator functions of my BIOS!!

 

[mpkl55]

My two cents worth

I will add one more dimension to this debate, going forward, I think desktop users (read 'power users') will have to understand that MAK (i.e. mouse-and-keyboard) UI will no longer be the priority for MS (or for any other software company for that matter) as touch (due to explosion in mobile tech) is the way forward, hence, from hereon in I fully expected touch interfaces to be prioritized above MAK. Problem is, generally we are (including me) are averse to change.

I know there is a tremendous mobile market out there but I think they are forgetting there is also millions of desktop users out there playing games, conducting business and so forth using programs that require a mouse and keyboard such as word processing at wpm levels you cannot obtain on a virtual keyboard, Photoshop, online games such as World of Warcraft, Everquest2, Eve online, Call of Duty, Skyrim and the list goes on. My big issue is I absolutely dislike Metro and really need the old style start menu and taskbar to operate just like Win7 for the things I use my computer for.