Google says plaintiffs haven't proved scanning books hurts sales

By Rick · 16 replies
Jul 27, 2012
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  1. It appears Google has asked for a summary judgment regarding the legality of scanning books and posting them online via Google Books. Google defended its book-scanning project (formerly known as Google Library) on the basis of fair use, preserving those works,……

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  2. Tygerstrike

    Tygerstrike TS Enthusiast Posts: 827   +93

    Wow Google is just as blind as half the ppl who post on TS. Thier logic is flawed. Just because they dont see the drop in revenue, Google that is, they do not agree that it actually exists. Perhaps the next time someone smells smoke they wont believe its a fire untill thier little bungholes get burned.
  3. fimbles

    fimbles TS Evangelist Posts: 1,185   +208

    Would be nice to finaly answer the " does piracy hurt sales" argument.

    I also think its fair for google to ask this question.
  4. killeriii

    killeriii TS Enthusiast Posts: 213   +14

    I figure Googles got a little more insight on this than you. I'd say your logic is flawed.
    When someone smells smoke...there's smoke.
    Just cause someone has matches, doesn't mean you need to call the fire department..
    Just because people could abuse fair use practices, doesn't mean they do.
    cliffordcooley likes this.
  5. Darkshadoe

    Darkshadoe TS Guru Posts: 571   +113

    Where is your proof? Not your opinion. If you want people to understand your argument, then you need to convince them with verifiable facts. Calling us "blind" without supporting data just makes you look like you have no idea what you are talking about. If you are here to troll, you aren't doing a very good job.
    cliffordcooley likes this.
  6. spydercanopus

    spydercanopus TS Evangelist Posts: 856   +121

    The article's title is grammatically incorrect. It should say "hasn't proven" instead of "haven't proved".
  7. SNGX1275

    SNGX1275 TS Forces Special Posts: 10,742   +422

    This is one of the "do no evil" google projects that I believe in. They are scanning so many pages, and for what? where is their evil in this? So... do a few rogue publishers get a few pages of their $450 books get made available for free? ok so that happens, then what is the harm? If you can't immediately say why they are in trouble because of what Google did then I'd say that publisher had a bad business model.

    I have a degree in engineering management, an advanced degree even. Trying to push some legal action is a weak argument here ... Man, we all saw the writing on the wall as consumers.... Upper Management for various companies was blind to that, they screwed up, reap the results of your failures (upper man). Adolescents saw this coming, your (Circuit City, ect) arrogance caused your downfall.
  8. Rick

    Rick TechSpot Staff Topic Starter Posts: 4,572   +65


    "plaintiffs" is plural so "have" *must* be used. "Has" cannot be used.

    Even if you have a problem with "proved" instead of "proven" (a mostly British English vs. American English debate), suggesting "hasn't" is absolutely incorrect.

    Another example of what you're suggesting is:
    "Hawking believes scientists hasn't proven higgs boson exists" -- scientists is plural.

    What I've used looks like this:
    "Hawking believes scientists haven't proved higgs boson exists" -- scientists is plural. This sounds better, no?

    As far as "proved" vs. "proven" goes, "proven" is considered less formal and typically used as an adjective by American English speakers. The two can be used interchangeably in most situations though, as some official sources will tell you.

    I'll be the first to admit I make plenty of mistakes, but I don't think many people here find grammar snobbery very useful. Save your criticisms for when I *really* butcher the English language, an event which happens at least a few times each week. :)
    spydercanopus and cliffordcooley like this.
  9. spydercanopus

    spydercanopus TS Evangelist Posts: 856   +121

    Not trying to be a snob. Just wanted to be useful, however I am obviously counter productive. :(
  10. Doctor John

    Doctor John TS Enthusiast Posts: 204   +15

    I agree with spydercanopus re. "proven" ;)
    It made me flinch a bit, too.
    spydercanopus likes this.
  11. Tygerstrike

    Tygerstrike TS Enthusiast Posts: 827   +93

    Ok I will break it down again...If the author and original publisher are having thier intellectual property, only available in book format, used,scanned,posted online. They lose out on the revenue that would normally be generated by the purchase of that book. As it was only previously available as a solid material item. We all know the human creature. Its is lazy. If they can get what they need w/o any real effort they will do so.
    That means there is a more then likely chance, that given the choice of getting something for free instead of paying for it, they will take the free version.
    By Google offering this information online, they effectivly take away the only revenue generating channel that the publisher had.
    Its simple economics and logic......why is it so hard to understand? You dont really need someone to draw that much of a map do you?? The Internet is mankinds greatest invention, but its draw back can sometimes harm more then it helps.
  12. TJGeezer

    TJGeezer TS Enthusiast Posts: 385   +10

    And where in the U.S. did you grow up, spydercanopus? In case you hadn't noticed, TechSpot goes by a British spell and grammar checker. So do people in Australia, Canada, New Zealand, and various other places. There's even a barely detectable possibility that TechSpot isn't written in the U.S. at all. It's pretty mind-boggling.

    Uh oh. I fell for a gag, didn't I...
  13. spydercanopus

    spydercanopus TS Evangelist Posts: 856   +121

    Arkansas in the southern US. Redneck country.

    I had no idea... If I knew this website was run by a bunch of brits I would never have come in the first place. ;)
  14. I like google, but this is surely theft.
    Doctor John likes this.
  15. Doctor John

    Doctor John TS Enthusiast Posts: 204   +15

  16. the more books become part of an internet data base the more it could reduce the number of visitors to libraries and so on, since those libraries have no books that cannot now be accessed through this easier google index.

    a lot of the old timers will see this great innovation and just freak out! (as usual)
  17. Whatever google do is right, whatever we do is wrong.
    can I bring this scanner xcanex to library and do my own scanning?

    I would not damage the book BUT IT WILL DAMAGE SALE.
    How about that?

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