There is TSMC and there's everybody else, can Samsung or Intel catch up?

[Sandyf]

The US does not recognize Taiwan as part of the PRC. The US (officially) only acknowledges that it understands that China wishes to claim Taiwan as part of its territory.

Basically the same as a school bully claiming another person's lunch as his own. Everyone around only acknowledges that they hear the bully's claims, not that the right of ownership is actually valid. The only people who agree with the bully are those who are also threatened by the bully (China's economic bullying). But the actual reality is that at no point in all of mainland China's history, has it at any point officially governed the island we know today as 'Taiwan'. That's a fact.

The CCP are the usurpers. The ORIGINAL Chinese government officials fled to Taiwan after the communist takeover, hence the reason why Taiwan refers to itself as the Republic of China, because it's the original governing body of China. Like when a piece of software is taken over and ruined by a bunch of VC's, causing the original developers to leave and fork the software. The fork that is maintained by the founding developers carries the true spirit and essence of that software, even if the name has been changed. Land and title can be usurped, but not the spirit.

To quote president Tsai Ing-wen:
"We do not need to declare independence. We are already independent."

At least you recognize that Taiwan is called China a fact that is now heavily ommited by those who spread antichina propaganda.
The CCP are not the usurpers of the mainland but the victorious successors of a civil war that lasted 4 years.
In this civil war, the opponents were the communist party of China and the Kuomintang (KMT), or the Chinese Nationalist Party. The reason why the Kuomintang lost, was because of its unpopularity, its corruption and its ineptitude as well as its unjustified brutality. Google "February 28 incident" to learn about the horrific massacre in Taiwan in 1948 contacted by the Kuomintang to impose its rule in the island.
Ironically, Kuomintang is now supporting the One China policy in Taiwan and the political forces that promote the Taiwan independence arose decades after the end of Chinese civil war, promoting the most absurd arguments.
Hint: They now claim that Taiwanese are not Chinese despite the fact that 97% of the population have a Chinese origin.

 

[neeyik]

Please take discussions over Taiwan itself to private messages or the General Discussion forum. Stick to the content of the news article for the comments, thank you.

 

[dragosmp]

It's still very profitable but needs lots of capital to be top players.
Asml euv machine is 300+ musd.

It may be expensive, but money has been cheap for a while, at under 2% interest, below inflation. TSMC / Samsung would just need a 3% margin to pay off the debt and overhead, the rest is to cover their own costs and print money.

I wonder if Samsung haven't stayed too much pondering, and others more decisive have placed the orders for EUV machines. Basically there's where they are behind, in DUV they're still OK. EUV nodes, not so much.

 

[shady28]

INTEL better catch up since Biden gave him $20B to "build chips in America." Let's keep an eye on this as time goes on. In my opnion nothing will really come out of this. I hope tech sites keep track as the years go on. I believe INTEL will just back out or lower expectations with some sort of crazy excuse and pocket the money.

When I was young and stupid I didn't believe comments like this. As I got older I started to see a pattern.

Let's be real. The entire CHIPS act is 52.7B, for everyone. It is a drop compared to what they are planning to invest. For Intel, just two fab expansions in Arizona alone coming online in 2024, is $20B. Columbus OH is $20B initial, $100B over the next 10 years. Their packaging facility in New Mexico is $3.5B.

For all of this, they'll probably get $3 or $4B from the CHIPS Act.

You should also be aware, TSMC is largely state sponsored by Taiwan, along with UMC. Then there is SMIC, which is Chinese state sponsored. Taiwan and China spent and continue to spend way more than the CHIPS Act on those industries.

 

[Watzupken]

The US does not recognize Taiwan as part of the PRC. The US (officially) only acknowledges that it understands that China wishes to claim Taiwan as part of its territory.

Basically the same as a school bully claiming another person's lunch as his own. Everyone around only acknowledges that they hear the bully's claims, not that the right of ownership is actually valid. The only people who agree with the bully are those who are also threatened by the bully (China's economic bullying). But the actual reality is that at no point in all of mainland China's history, has it at any point officially governed the island we know today as 'Taiwan'. That's a fact.

The CCP are the usurpers. The ORIGINAL Chinese government officials fled to Taiwan after the communist takeover, hence the reason why Taiwan refers to itself as the Republic of China, because it's the original governing body of China. Like when a piece of software is taken over and ruined by a bunch of VC's, causing the original developers to leave and fork the software. The fork that is maintained by the founding developers carries the true spirit and essence of that software, even if the name has been changed. Land and title can be usurped, but not the spirit.

To quote president Tsai Ing-wen:
"We do not need to declare independence. We are already independent."

In my opinion, I don't think US is any better than China if you are talking about bullying. Just look at all the countries that do not agree with US. What happens to them? They get slapped with sanctions, left, right, and, center. And US will then urged all other nations to also apply the same sanctions. In more extreme cases, these nations get invaded as well. Not bullying? It is like you standing up against someone in school or in your workplace, someone with influence. And he/she tells people to stay away/ ignore you.

 

[AlaskaGuy]

Why would that be a problem? If anything its a benefit because you don't have to deal with China. Taiwan is a country - period. The UN recognizes it as an "independent territory", I.e. a sovereign state. China has exactly ZERO say in Taiwan's internal affairs. We should never, ever have to hear the ludicrous "Chinese Taipei" uttered by anyone outside of the pathetic Chinese regime.

Nobody cares what the UN says or does. Fact of the matter is nobody can stop China if they decide to invade Taiwan.

 

[Avro Arrow]

The only way that Samsung or Intel catch TSMC is if TSMC screws up. If they screw up ROYALLY, then even GlobalFoundries could catch them but then of course Intel and Samsung would have surpassed TSMC.