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Motherboards

By Matt Harris
Mar 1, 2005
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  1. Matt Harris

    Matt Harris TS Rookie Topic Starter Posts: 38

    Thanks a lot vnf4ultra you have been a good help.

    When the dual core processors come out will they fit the 775 socket or would i have to buy a new motherboard that will have the right socket?

    Also when do they come out and are they really worth the wait if i decided to?
     
  2. vnf4ultra

    vnf4ultra TechSpot Paladin Posts: 2,195

    dual core

    I think dual core intel cpus will be socket 775, but they will not work in current motherboards, they need a new chipset (955x or something). Intel dual core should come out first, followed by amd dual core. Amd dual core will(supposedly) work on any current 939 motherboard with a bios update. For multitasking, dual core will be the best you can get. Intel isn't going to use hyperthreading on the dual core chips though, at least not for a while from what I've read. You can get multi processor systems now, but then you need 2 separate cpus.

    Intel dual core not supported on 925x.
    http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=2329&p=3

    Hyperthreading only on "extreme edition" dual cores.
    http://www.nordichardware.com/?action=more&id=896

    Athlon 64 939 dual core works on existing motherboards
    http://forums.techwatch.com.au/viewtopic.php?t=4238&sid=8
    http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=05/02/24/1336255&from=rss
     
  3. jake80

    jake80 TS Rookie

    I am new to the site and have a question on buying a mobo the problem I have is I have a Dell 4700 with a Pent 4 3.4Gig CPU and One gig of memory.
    My problem is I only have three PCI slots and need a few more.
    From reading on the Dell site I hear there is a question on the power supply hook up to a non-Dell mobo.
    My question is there a mobo out there that will fit the Dell mid tower computer? Do I have to buy a new power supply and tower?
    Any options ,ideas would be appreciated
     
  4. vnf4ultra

    vnf4ultra TechSpot Paladin Posts: 2,195

    mobo

    I think you can use a micro atx mobo in a dell. But you can't get any more pci slots(well, maybe one) because matx only allows 3-4. You'd need a case that fits a full atx mobo to get more pci.
     
  5. Matt Harris

    Matt Harris TS Rookie Topic Starter Posts: 38

    vnf4ultra if the dual core Intel processors when they come out won't work on any Intel motherobard i can buy now, but will on the 939 Athlon boards then do you think it would be worth getting one of those boards if i can benefit from dual core processors?

    When they come out what proce do you think they will be?

    Or do you think if i just get a new Intel motherboard now with one of the 6** processors then that should be fine for a while without even worrying about dual processors?

    I am really trying to think in the future for this PC i am buying as i will not be getting one for a long time after. Well i will have to finish two more years of at University first and then i will have a major debt to pay off, so you can see my problem.


    cheers
     
  6. Matt Harris

    Matt Harris TS Rookie Topic Starter Posts: 38

  7. RealBlackStuff

    RealBlackStuff TS Rookie Posts: 8,165

    You could try, but intel needs to design a new chipset around the dual-core. Current mobo's will NOT be able to handle them.

    AMD64 however, on a S939 board, only needs a BIOS-update to accomodate the Egypt dual-core CPU.

    Whichever way you look at it, if you want to buy now and be equipped for dual-core without other expenses, your only choice is AMD64 on S939 (or the more expensive Opteron/S940 option, really only meant for servers).
     
  8. vnf4ultra

    vnf4ultra TechSpot Paladin Posts: 2,195

    dual core

    " So while you can't plug a Smithfield(dual core intel cpu) into your existing 925X motherboard, it may be for the better."
    http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=2329&p=3

    Unless intel pulls some sort of switch (which intel could do), then the dual core processors will require a new mobo based on the 945/955 chipset.

    Intel 2.8ghz dual core = U.S. $241, 3ghz dual $316, 3.3 dual $530, sorry, I don't know what the prices are in your currency, maybe you can use a converter to check.

    Those actually are really good prices for being 2 cpus, only a few $'s more gets you a whole extra core.

    Amd dual core pricing is yet unknown.
    Amd's dual core plans
    The article above also attests to being able to use dual core in most present 939 mobos with a bios flash.

    But amd will want to be competitive with intel, so I would guess that their prices will be similar.

    Nein, you can't actually say you don't have any use for faith or beliefs. You believe I'm a person, right? I haven't proven to you that I am, but you have faith that I am, the same way I believe you are a person, not a robot, alien, spirit, etc. Take for instance this example: A person doesn't belive that gravity exists, they jump off a cliff, they still fall and die. Not believing in gravity doesn't make it not exist. When you sat on your chair today, did you inspect it thoroughly to be sure it would hold your weight? No? Well then you had FAITH that it would hold you because it has done so in the past.

    Anyway, why do you have your status blocked and your pm's turned off? Are you paranoid? Afraid that someone here will do something to you?
     
  9. Matt Harris

    Matt Harris TS Rookie Topic Starter Posts: 38

    Ok then so it seems that the dual core processors will not fit the current LGA775 socket mobo's.

    In that case do you think it is worth waiting for the new 945/955 mobo's?

    Is the lauch date soon?

    This just keeps getting harder and harder, when i finally though i was going for a LGA775 mobo i now am in two frames of mind for either waiting building a new computer now.
     
  10. vnf4ultra

    vnf4ultra TechSpot Paladin Posts: 2,195

    intel dual core

    I'm thinking intel's dual core will be available midyear.
    Details

    That's a while to wait, even if they do ship on time.
    Do you need the computer now?
    3 choices
    1. Get a intel 925xe now.
    2. Wait for intel 945/955 and intel dual core
    3. Get amd 939 now (whatever cpu) and then upgrade to dual core once they arrive.
    Choice 1 probably will be the least upgradeable.
    If you can't wait, then consider choice 3.

    Amd dual cores will probably be out later this year(year end), but that's still a little uncertain.
     
  11. RealBlackStuff

    RealBlackStuff TS Rookie Posts: 8,165

    And you can stop bashing 'nein' now, he has been banned from this forum (rightly so).
    AMD S939 is your choice.
    Intel needs new mobo's and at least 1 revision after that to work properly.
     
     
  12. Matt Harris

    Matt Harris TS Rookie Topic Starter Posts: 38

    Yeah your right they are my three options.

    I would consider myself an unpatient person, so that does not help with my choices. The truth is i don't really need a new computer right now, but i am not very good with money, so i am worried i will spend it all and then have nothing.

    if i did go for the Intel 775 socket mobo now it would still be good for a few years doing all i need right?

    Are the dual core processors going to be a lot better or is there not a very significant change?
     
  13. vnf4ultra

    vnf4ultra TechSpot Paladin Posts: 2,195

    dual core worth it?

    "From a software perspective, it will be treated just as two seperate CPUS. Yes, it's possible to run software to take advantage of n number of CPUs, but only in specific applications where you're not waiting on the results from one calculation before you begin the next. Take for example 3D rendering in something like Maya. If you're rendering a 320x240 image and you happen to have 76,800 CPUs then you can assign 1 pixel to each CPU and it can be rendered all at the same time. If you only have 2 CPUs, you can assign 38,400 pixels to each CPU, etc."
    Maya dual core

    Avid pro hd is "multiprocessor optimized" which means it can use more than 1 cpu to work faster. avid hd pro

    For the types of things you're going to do, dual core would definitely be beneficial, but to what extent, I don't know. Is it worth the wait? Hard to tell since dual core isn't here yet.

    I think you would be happier with dual core, but it could be a bit of a wait. If I were you, which I'm not, I think I would get an amd 939 and then upgrade to dual core, because I hate waiting, and 939 should have dual core compatibility. But that is me, I hate to wait, but want maximum upgradeability.

    I looked for more maya benches, and found that in maya amd's fx51 (2.2ghz actual speed), a formerly top of the line chip, is better than a p4 3.2ghz of the old generation. But the new intel generation(6xx) is faster in maya. The article says that maya version 5(and probably higher) is more tolerant of the amd64.
    The a64 single core should give acceptable performance in maya, probably good enough to last until dual core.Xbit maya bench

    Do you know anyone who's used amd 64 in the apps you want to use? If you can find someone ask them how it performs.

    Edit: here's another chart comparing cpu's,no intel 6xx cpus which should be better, but interesting, I haven't seen this before. Ace's hardware Maya
     
  14. Matt Harris

    Matt Harris TS Rookie Topic Starter Posts: 38

    Thanks that is very useful information.

    I do not know anyone with an AMD computer they all have Intel's, so unfortunetly i can only ask ppl on forums and believe there word.

    It is still a very hard decision, but i see what you are saying about getting AMD now and it is a good point.

    Will the AMD dual core processors definetly fit the sicket 939 boards. Do you know this 100 percent?

    Do we know yet what will be better out of the Intel dual core processors and AMD's?

    Are there going to be different AMD dual core processors and if so what one supposively is going to work on the current mobo's?

    If there are different ones do we know what is going to be the best?

    These are questions that i know you may not be able to answer at this date, but the more information you give me the better. You are good at researching for the right data when it comes to computers far better then i.

    thanks a lot

    matt
     
  15. vnf4ultra

    vnf4ultra TechSpot Paladin Posts: 2,195

    dual core

    Unfortunately, no, until amd actually makes a *production* dual core and demonstrates that it will work in a current motherboard, we cannot say that for sure it will work. Amd has said that it will, but that is not a 100% guarantee.
    Check out this article.
    Amd demo.

    Amd may make a dual core "fx" ,or something similar, with more cache, but I don't know of any "versions" unless you count the 940 pin one as a different version.

    I think that comparing an intel dual core 3ghz to an amd dual core 3000+ will be about the same as comparing today's intel single 3ghz to amd's current single 3000+. They both will have areas where they excel. I don't really know any details about this though.
    Here's another informative read.
    Extremetech
     
  16. Didou

    Didou Bowtie extraordinair! Posts: 5,899

    The Opteron Dual Core parts work with current Socket-940 motherboard, they just need a BIOS update. AMD is aiming to offer the same possibilities for the Socket-939 parts. Even on the article you linked you can read :
     
  17. vnf4ultra

    vnf4ultra TechSpot Paladin Posts: 2,195

    dual core

    Here's another article about dual core on both sides.
    Extremetech
     
  18. Matt Harris

    Matt Harris TS Rookie Topic Starter Posts: 38

    That last article is one of the best i have read so far on dual processors.

    It really puts people off on buying an Intel at this current time i have to say.

    It is one artcile that really makes me think i am impatient and want a new PC now, so why not go with an Atlon 939 socket and near enough 100 percent sure to be able to support there dual cores when they come out.

    We don't know yet what will be better out of Intel's and Atlons dual core processors yet, but will the athlon dual cores when they come out be better for what i want to do than the Intel 6** series processors out at a moment?

    That is the question that i really want to know if it is worth going for the Atlon, so i can have the future upgrade in mind or either go with a new Intel mobo now, bit i will not be able to upgrade much.

    Any suggestions?
     
  19. RealBlackStuff

    RealBlackStuff TS Rookie Posts: 8,165

    Matt Harris
    Please make up your mind, you are dragging this out into the ridiculous!
    Buy a chrystal ball, that can answer your questions at least as good...
     
  20. vnf4ultra

    vnf4ultra TechSpot Paladin Posts: 2,195

    dual core

    I'm pretty sure that a dual core athlon will be better than the current 6xx intel's.
    I think the nforce 4(ultra/sli) chipset will have the upgrade capability, and it's a good chipset.
     
  21. Matt Harris

    Matt Harris TS Rookie Topic Starter Posts: 38

    LoL Realblackstuff i am only asking all the questions just to be sure as a grand to me is a lot of money.

    There is no such thing as dragging out an answer to the question in my opinion. It is about making sure i make the right decision.

    Now if someone still replies then fair enough and if you don't want to then don't bother, but there is no need to say stuff like that is there?
     
  22. RealBlackStuff

    RealBlackStuff TS Rookie Posts: 8,165

    Face it, you WANT an Intel CPU, but all arguments say you should really GET an AMD.
    It is your money, and you should get as much bang for your buck as you can get.

    As they said in the old days: no-one ever got fired for buying IBM. But they did by no means always get value...

    AMD: S939 available now, mobo upgradable to dual-core with only a BIOS update. Cheap now, cheap later.
    INTEL: no upgradable mobo now, if you buy now, will most likely require yet another mobo later when dual-core comes. Expensive now, expensive later.

    Expected performance difference: negligeable.

    What more do you need to know?
     
  23. tbrunt3

    tbrunt3 TS Rookie Posts: 495

    Basically in a nut shell In June 2004 Issue of Maximum PC maginzne go with the single CPU there not to many apps that support the dual right now so basically it is a waste of electricty thats what they said.. Maybe things will be more supported when a new OS comes out.. SO if it was me I go with AMD..
     
  24. vnf4ultra

    vnf4ultra TechSpot Paladin Posts: 2,195

    The apps that matt will be using are optimized for multiple processors, so dual core should be of benefit to him.
     
  25. Matt Harris

    Matt Harris TS Rookie Topic Starter Posts: 38

    Ok i have definetly made up my mind now to go with AMD and when the dual core come out i will get one for the socket 939 motherboard i buy now.

    I do however want your opinion on an AMD mobo.

    Is this board good Gigabyte K8NXP-SLi nForce4 SLi ?

    I am having problems finding what RAM works best with it any siggestions?

    A stupid question, but just to check is it compatible with the new dual core when it comes out?

    I can buy a Lian li pc 65 case of a friend, will this mobo fit into it and what is a good power supply to go for?

    Once i have these questions sorted this post will slowly vanish as i will not need any more answers.

    thanks for all of your help it has been very useful
     
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