Have you got anxiety when you build?

terzaerian

Posts: 804   +1,137
Only on one step: seating the processor in the socket. I can't shake how nerve-wracking that part is. But I've otherwise been putting together and tinkering with PCs since the 90s so the rest is basically silicon LEGOs at this point.
 

captaincranky

Posts: 16,536   +5,332
My latest journey into angst and uncertainty involves, (as it always seems to), installing a video card. These things seem to be my draconian nemesis.

So, I have a 32 bit Windows 7 machine. It's built on a G-41 IGP Intel board.

As you all likely know, a 32 bit OS, can only deal with 4 GB of RAM. This is shared with the onboard video.

I've had all sorts of black screen problems with a lot of tabs open. So, I decided to put any old video card in the machine, as long as it had 2 GB of Vram, which should leave the full 4 GB for system use. I found an MSI GT-730 for $50.00 (!!) about a month ago, I bought it, and stuffed it in, hooking it up to the DVI connection I had been using.

Well, the screen flashed a few times, then went blank. I hooked back up to the IGP's DVI output, and still, no joy, the monitor was still dead as a door nail.
So, I dragged out an old S-VGA cable, hooked that to the video card output. "I saw the light, and it was good". Ditto for the IGP's S-VGA connection, working perfectly.

Here's the anxiety and paranoia part:


Is the video card defective?
Did the video card blow the chip out on the mobo or the monitor?
Was the monitor's digital input ready to blow anyway? (It's about 10 years old).

But most importantly, which part should I substitute to find out which part is bad. Will I ruin the same parts over if it's the video card?

I expect the safest route would be to hook up another monitor to the board's DVI. Still, I'm left biting my nails, not wanting to torch any more expensive parts via trial and error substitution(s).
 

Avro Arrow

Posts: 1,150   +1,280
TechSpot Elite
My latest journey into angst and uncertainty involves, (as it always seems to), installing a video card. These things seem to be my draconian nemesis.

So, I have a 32 bit Windows 7 machine. It's built on a G-41 IGP Intel board.

As you all likely know, a 32 bit OS, can only deal with 4 GB of RAM. This is shared with the onboard video.

I've had all sorts of black screen problems with a lot of tabs open. So, I decided to put any old video card in the machine, as long as it had 2 GB of Vram, which should leave the full 4 GB for system use. I found an MSI GT-730 for $50.00 (!!) about a month ago, I bought it, and stuffed it in, hooking it up to the DVI connection I had been using.

Well, the screen flashed a few times, then went blank. I hooked back up to the IGP's DVI output, and still, no joy, the monitor was still dead as a door nail.
So, I dragged out an old S-VGA cable, hooked that to the video card output. "I saw the light, and it was good". Ditto for the IGP's S-VGA connection, working perfectly.

Here's the anxiety and paranoia part:

Is the video card defective?
Did the video card blow the chip out on the mobo or the monitor?
Was the monitor's digital input ready to blow anyway? (It's about 10 years old).

But most importantly, which part should I substitute to find out which part is bad. Will I ruin the same parts over if it's the video card?

I expect the safest route would be to hook up another monitor to the board's DVI. Still, I'm left biting my nails, not wanting to torch any more expensive parts via trial and error substitution(s).
It sounds like perhaps the DVI port on your monitor is acting up or it might be your DVI cable. The fact that the monitor works with the D-SUB outputs of both the IGP and the card but not with the DVI output of either tells me that it is most likely a problem with the monitor (or, in rare cases, the DVI cable) because both GPUs are working.
 
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captaincranky

Posts: 16,536   +5,332
@Avro Arrow Yeah, I subbed out the DVI cable first thing on both board and IGP ports, and no joy. The monitor is still dead as a door nail at the DVI input.

It's just sort of suspicious that the monitor would choose to fail, as soon as I attached it to the new video card. (Which is what I did first at when I installed it)..

Adden-dumb: "Weird Science";
OK, so I finally got out of the doldrums and started making substitutions with the system..
1: Hooked the monitor up to a G-31 GT-8400 relic. DVI works just fine
2: Yanked the GT-730 our of the G-41 troubled relic. DVI output works just fine, same monitor.
3: Took the time to look at thje G-41 board. As it turns out the sole PCI-E slot is only 4X. (Ouch) Apparently the GT-730 won't produce digital video at 4X, and kills the IGP digital output while it's at it.
With only 22.+ Gbs memory bandwidth, you'd think the damned thing wouldn't be so fussy about which speed PCI-E slot it got stuffed in. :facepalm:
 
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Puiu

Posts: 4,495   +3,326
TechSpot Elite
@Avro Arrow Yeah, I subbed out the DVI cable first thing on both board and IGP ports, and no joy. The monitor is still dead as a door nail at the DVI input.

It's just sort of suspicious that the monitor would choose to fail, as soon as I attached it to the new video card. (Which is what I did first at when I installed it)..

Adden-dumb: "Weird Science";
OK, so I finally got out of the doldrums and started making substitutions with the system..
1: Hooked the monitor up to a G-31 GT-8400 relic. DVI works just fine
2: Yanked the GT-730 our of the G-41 troubled relic. DVI output works just fine, same monitor.
3: Took the time to look at thje G-41 board. As it turns out the sole PCI-E slot is only 4X. (Ouch) Apparently the GT-730 won't produce digital video at 4X, and kills the IGP digital output while it's at it.
With only 22.+ Gbs memory bandwidth, you'd think the damned thing wouldn't be so fussy about which speed PCI-E slot it got stuffed in. :facepalm:
If I'm not mistaken, the G41 chipset should support PCIe 16x. There are mobos with this chipset with only a sole 4x slot? O_o
 

captaincranky

Posts: 16,536   +5,332
If I'm not mistaken, the G41 chipset should support PCIe 16x. There are mobos with this chipset with only a sole 4x slot? O_o
This is a Matx board. It has a PCI-E X 16 socket, but it only has contacts halfway down the socket. So PCI-E X 8 or X 16.....are well, an optical illusion. I will research how many PCI-E lanes are available overall in these boards and get back to you.

I've had no luck installing either GT-710 or GT-730 into these older systems. I have a P-43 based XP system as well., ("Performance" (no graphics)). It runs just fine with a 9500 GT card, but wouldn't successfully run the GT-710. I thought both VGAs were defective, but that's probably not the case..

I've been trying to install these 2 GB Vram cards into my older 32 bit machines, to prevent the IPG from scavenging system RAM. No joy.

My next oldest system is on a 55 board w/ i3-530 "Clarkdale", That runs a GT-1030 just fine. It's 64 bit Win 7 though.
 
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Avro Arrow

Posts: 1,150   +1,280
TechSpot Elite
@Avro Arrow Yeah, I subbed out the DVI cable first thing on both board and IGP ports, and no joy. The monitor is still dead as a door nail at the DVI input.

It's just sort of suspicious that the monitor would choose to fail, as soon as I attached it to the new video card. (Which is what I did first at when I installed it)..

Adden-dumb: "Weird Science";
OK, so I finally got out of the doldrums and started making substitutions with the system..
1: Hooked the monitor up to a G-31 GT-8400 relic. DVI works just fine
2: Yanked the GT-730 our of the G-41 troubled relic. DVI output works just fine, same monitor.
3: Took the time to look at thje G-41 board. As it turns out the sole PCI-E slot is only 4X. (Ouch) Apparently the GT-730 won't produce digital video at 4X, and kills the IGP digital output while it's at it.
With only 22.+ Gbs memory bandwidth, you'd think the damned thing wouldn't be so fussy about which speed PCI-E slot it got stuffed in. :facepalm:
Holy hell! Just when you thought that Intel platforms couldn't get any more gimped! Yeah, I wasn't aware that the PCI-e slot HAD to be x16 for a GT 730 to produce digital video because it's quite a rudimentary card. It actually makes even less sense because I was able to get an old 8400GS to produce 720p and it was a PCI card! That is remarkably weird, something that I never would have imagined in 1000 years.
 

pcmasterrrrrace9

Posts: 20   +5
Only on one step: seating the processor in the socket. I can't shake how nerve-wracking that part is. But I've otherwise been putting together and tinkering with PCs since the 90s so the rest is basically silicon LEGOs at this point.
Only on one step: seating the processor in the socket. I can't shake how nerve-wracking that part is. But I've otherwise been putting together and tinkering with PCs since the 90s so the rest is basically silicon LEGOs at this point.

My latest journey into angst and uncertainty involves, (as it always seems to), installing a video card. These things seem to be my draconian nemesis.

So, I have a 32 bit Windows 7 machine. It's built on a G-41 IGP Intel board.

As you all likely know, a 32 bit OS, can only deal with 4 GB of RAM. This is shared with the onboard video.

I've had all sorts of black screen problems with a lot of tabs open. So, I decided to put any old video card in the machine, as long as it had 2 GB of Vram, which should leave the full 4 GB for system use. I found an MSI GT-730 for $50.00 (!!) about a month ago, I bought it, and stuffed it in, hooking it up to the DVI connection I had been using.

Well, the screen flashed a few times, then went blank. I hooked back up to the IGP's DVI output, and still, no joy, the monitor was still dead as a door nail.
So, I dragged out an old S-VGA cable, hooked that to the video card output. "I saw the light, and it was good". Ditto for the IGP's S-VGA connection, working perfectly.

Here's the anxiety and paranoia part:

Is the video card defective?
Did the video card blow the chip out on the mobo or the monitor?
Was the monitor's digital input ready to blow anyway? (It's about 10 years old).

But most importantly, which part should I substitute to find out which part is bad. Will I ruin the same parts over if it's the video card?

I expect the safest route would be to hook up another monitor to the board's DVI. Still, I'm left biting my nails, not wanting to torch any more expensive parts via trial and error substitution(s).

My latest journey into angst and uncertainty involves, (as it always seems to), installing a video card. These things seem to be my draconian nemesis.

So, I have a 32 bit Windows 7 machine. It's built on a G-41 IGP Intel board.

As you all likely know, a 32 bit OS, can only deal with 4 GB of RAM. This is shared with the onboard video.

I've had all sorts of black screen problems with a lot of tabs open. So, I decided to put any old video card in the machine, as long as it had 2 GB of Vram, which should leave the full 4 GB for system use. I found an MSI GT-730 for $50.00 (!!) about a month ago, I bought it, and stuffed it in, hooking it up to the DVI connection I had been using.

Well, the screen flashed a few times, then went blank. I hooked back up to the IGP's DVI output, and still, no joy, the monitor was still dead as a door nail.
So, I dragged out an old S-VGA cable, hooked that to the video card output. "I saw the light, and it was good". Ditto for the IGP's S-VGA connection, working perfectly.

Here's the anxiety and paranoia part:

Is the video card defective?
Did the video card blow the chip out on the mobo or the monitor?
Was the monitor's digital input ready to blow anyway? (It's about 10 years old).

But most importantly, which part should I substitute to find out which part is bad. Will I ruin the same parts over if it's the video card?

I expect the safest route would be to hook up another monitor to the board's DVI. Still, I'm left biting my nails, not wanting to torch any more expensive parts via trial and error substitution(s).
OMG the last time I felt a lot of anxiety was installing a video card as well. Maybe it was because I was making it as a favor for my girldfriend and things weren't working out...
 

Avro Arrow

Posts: 1,150   +1,280
TechSpot Elite
OMG the last time I felt a lot of anxiety was installing a video card as well. Maybe it was because I was making it as a favor for my girldfriend and things weren't working out...
The computer or the relationship?

d4d4a236e98b5836e8c365e065518fbdcd3b1126d0779abe54306b7d18b9b5db_1.jpg
 

Geralt

Posts: 187   +162
TechSpot Elite
I never build a whole system from the start. I just update this or that component in my current rig every year. One year, a new SSD, another year, a new graphics card, another year, a new CPU or motherboard or both, the next year, a new monitor, etc. I tend to keep my big full tower Thermaltake case always. No need to buy a new one. In this way, I am renovating the whole rig very gradually over the years. Now I have a Ryzen 3950 with Gigabyte Aorus Extreme. My next CPU will be a Ryzen 6950, for example, and I will probably have to change the mobo too, etc. I am never anxious because I plan any change very carefully always.
 

Avro Arrow

Posts: 1,150   +1,280
TechSpot Elite
I never build a whole system from the start. I just update this or that component in my current rig every year. One year, a new SSD, another year, a new graphics card, another year, a new CPU or motherboard or both, the next year, a new monitor, etc. I tend to keep my big full tower Thermaltake case always. No need to buy a new one. In this way, I am renovating the whole rig very gradually over the years. Now I have a Ryzen 3950 with Gigabyte Aorus Extreme. My next CPU will be a Ryzen 6950, for example, and I will probably have to change the mobo too, etc. I am never anxious because I plan any change very carefully always.
Yeah, I tend to do that too. I have a gargantuan Ultra Black Edition U12-40670 Full Tower ATX case. It's made of some high-gauge steel and it is damn heavy but it's also more or less immortal and the space inside makes building easy. Cable management, on the other hand, is essentially impossible. It looks pretty awesome though:
U12-40670-04-jl.jpg

The other advantage is that there's nothing that won't fit in it:
U12-40670-09-jl.jpg

The thing is, it's really starting to be a pain in the butt to use because it's so damn cumbersome. I bought a smaller case with a glass side panel that was designed with cable management in mind (it was on sale for less than $40!) and has the PSU mount at the bottom instead of the top but I haven't been able to get myself off of my posterior long enough to change everything over.

Hell, I even bought an X570 mobo that was on sale so that I could use PCI-Express v4.0 and I even bought faster DDR4 RAM for it. The problem is that I'm a typical male when it comes to trying to motivate myself to change everything over when the X370 mobo I'm currently using works just fine. :laughing:
 

Geralt

Posts: 187   +162
TechSpot Elite
Yeah, I tend to do that too. I have a gargantuan Ultra Black Edition U12-40670 Full Tower ATX case. It's made of some high-gauge steel and it is damn heavy but it's also more or less immortal and the space inside makes building easy. Cable management, on the other hand, is essentially impossible. It looks pretty awesome though:
U12-40670-04-jl.jpg

The other advantage is that there's nothing that won't fit in it:
U12-40670-09-jl.jpg

The thing is, it's really starting to be a pain in the butt to use because it's so damn cumbersome. I bought a smaller case with a glass side panel that was designed with cable management in mind (it was on sale for less than $40!) and has the PSU mount at the bottom instead of the top but I haven't been able to get myself off of my posterior long enough to change everything over.

Hell, I even bought an X570 mobo that was on sale so that I could use PCI-Express v4.0 and I even bought faster DDR4 RAM for it. The problem is that I'm a typical male when it comes to trying to motivate myself to change everything over when the X370 mobo I'm currently using works just fine. :laughing:
Yes, another gargantuan full tower here. It's immortal too. Since I use only eATX, I need something big. The whole case + components weighs around 20 kg. The problem is when I need to move the thing to a technician. I need to remove the big disks there to make it lighter.
 

Avro Arrow

Posts: 1,150   +1,280
TechSpot Elite
Yes, another gargantuan full tower here. It's immortal too. Since I use only eATX, I need something big. The whole case + components weighs around 20 kg. The problem is when I need to move the thing to a technician. I need to remove the big disks there to make it lighter.
Agreed. There's no better way to make a computer lighter than to remove the spinning drives. My PC weighs about the same as yours, somewhere around the 20kg mark (I have five spinning drives in it.)

To move it any serious distance is to risk your back going out. Whudda thunk that moving a computer could be so damn dangerous! šŸ¤£
 

captaincranky

Posts: 16,536   +5,332
Holy hell! Just when you thought that Intel platforms couldn't get any more gimped! Yeah, I wasn't aware that the PCI-e slot HAD to be x16 for a GT 730 to produce digital video because it's quite a rudimentary card. It actually makes even less sense because I was able to get an old 8400GS to produce 720p and it was a PCI card! That is remarkably weird, something that I never would have imagined in 1000 years.
Here's the punchline. I ran WEI on the G-41's IGP: 4.0 Aero, 3.5 gaming.

While it was installed, I ran WEI on the GT-730 Aero 6.2, gaming 6.0. (That's with no DVI on the board or card).

The only other time I saw such a fairly inexplicable jump in a WEI score, was when I doubled the memory in another machine. Two times the same speed memory jumped its performance score from 5.5 to 7.0.

OK, so it's likely I'm getting the benefits of the extra Vram, in spite of the fact that DVI is dead. S-VGA isn't an issue @1080p. So, as long as nothing broke, I'm thinking I should stuff the 730 back in, if only to free up system RAM. Maybe, I mean why not, I can't think. :confused:
 

Avro Arrow

Posts: 1,150   +1,280
TechSpot Elite
Here's the punchline. I ran WEI on the G-41's IGP: 4.0 Aero, 3.5 gaming.

While it was installed, I ran WEI on the GT-730 Aero 6.2, gaming 6.0. (That's with no DVI on the board or card).

The only other time I saw such a fairly inexplicable jump in a WEI score, was when I doubled the memory in another machine. Two times the same speed memory jumped its performance score from 5.5 to 7.0.

OK, so it's likely I'm getting the benefits of the extra Vram, in spite of the fact that DVI is dead. S-VGA isn't an issue @1080p. So, as long as nothing broke, I'm thinking I should stuff the 730 back in, if only to free up system RAM. Maybe, I mean why not, I can't think. :confused:
Freeing up as much system RAM as possible is never a bad thing. Go for it! :D
 

SNGX1275

Posts: 10,605   +464
Here's the punchline. I ran WEI on the G-41's IGP: 4.0 Aero, 3.5 gaming.

While it was installed, I ran WEI on the GT-730 Aero 6.2, gaming 6.0. (That's with no DVI on the board or card).

The only other time I saw such a fairly inexplicable jump in a WEI score, was when I doubled the memory in another machine. Two times the same speed memory jumped its performance score from 5.5 to 7.0.

OK, so it's likely I'm getting the benefits of the extra Vram, in spite of the fact that DVI is dead. S-VGA isn't an issue @1080p. So, as long as nothing broke, I'm thinking I should stuff the 730 back in, if only to free up system RAM. Maybe, I mean why not, I can't think. :confused:
what? WEI still exists? I thought they dumped that? (sorry if I missed you are running 7 or something, I only visit here on occasion anymore :( and super skimmed to catch up).

Edit - did some Binging (yeah pts!), and figured out the WEI thing... Ran the CLI one but could only see a couple scores, but didn't read too much into it. Downloaded a potentially sketchy Winaero tool to do the same crap just graphically and.... I guess graphics top out at 9.9? heh. I've got a pretty old card, and its the highest rated thing in my system at 9.9.

Double edit - my primary hard drive is the lowest rated thing in my system. Its a Samsung EVO 840.. man I'm behind the times.
 
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captaincranky

Posts: 16,536   +5,332
what? WEI still exists? I thought they dumped that? (sorry if I missed you are running 7 or something, I only visit here on occasion anymore :( and super skimmed to catch up).
Well, welcome back, even if only briefly. And yes, I'm still running "Lucky 7", across the board. I refuse to join the Windows 10, "Evil Cult of the Double Pentacle". (Final answer). I don't own a smartphone either..

The WEI in 7 only goes to 7.9. (That's a score which I can only assume was designed to weed out those who could actually run "Crysis", from the wannabes). Truth to tell, I'm sort of a wannabe myself, since I build "mainstream" machines into gaming cases.

I'm guessing you're talking about a SATA 3 SSD? IDK if I have an 840 or 850 in my, "Sunday go to meetin' box", but it bags the limit, 7.9.. (Although so does the GTX-1050 ti I bought to make my last build , "a real computer"). That's an OC'd "FTW" edition, which embarrassingly enough, I haven't gotten hot enough yet to start the cooling fans. The card's a beast though, it even has a 6 pin plug me in on top. :laughing:

I toyed with the idea of buying an NVME drive for it, and quickly found out the Z170 micro board doesn't even have a slot for one.

In current events, Newegg has turned into a sh!thole deep enough, that I'm starting to buy my computer parts from Amazon. :eek: I just checked today's, "Shell Shocker", and found out I could buy a $25.00 Domino's gift card for $25.00, and they'd be kind enough to email it to me. (To be fair, they are including a $5.00 bonus card, also email). Way back when I was back in remedial community college for photography, I never dreamed I'd be firing up a printer for this horse ca-ca. Besides, I've tasted Domino's pizza, and I'm sticking to DiGiorno's.

Anyhoo, I have to get back to my "digital archaeology adventure" (Pentium E 6300 (Q2, '09))., and my lard a**ed Maine coon is head butting my leg. It seems it's time for his 2nd can of food for the day.

It's good hearing from someone whose screen alias I recognize. Take care of yourself, "don't hesitate vaccinate". I got the J & J vaccine a couple of weeks ago. It would seem it doesn't strike down those of us in male menopause, and now I can come and go from my house, without 2 or 3 days of panic following the excursion. (y) (Y)