Intel CEO Lip-Bu Tan admits company is no longer a top 10 chipmaker

[GhostLegion]

There are plenty of people outside the US who also suffer from TDS… Oh wait, are you defending the OP, chief?

Hardly, try not to presume someone’s political leanings from a comment that doesn’t specifically endorse anything

I hate Trump and have good reason to. His policies are non-sensical and conflict with one another. There is no consistency in thought and intellectual hypocrisy. But then, this news article wasn’t really about Trump, was it? And I don’t care to discuss him in the slightest.

 

[Vanderlinde]

You're not wrong that products drive everything....but that’s exactly why Intel’s situation is so concerning. For years, they coasted on branding and market inertia while AMD, a company with a fraction of the resources, out executed them on product. Better value, better performance, and a roadmap that actually delivered.

The fact that AMD is predicted to hit 40% enterprise share is wild....because it's not just about specs. It’s a referendum on Intel’s stagnation. Zen started as a small win, and Intel laughed it off. Now, AMD is setting the pace in data center, cloud, and workstation markets. That’s not just better marketing.....that’s long-term, strategic execution. Meanwhile, Intel is still chasing its own 7nm ghosts and trying to fix problems it created over the last decade.

And yeah, you’d think spinning off fabs or leaning into TSMC would be obvious by now. But Intel’s identity was its fabs. The whole IDM 2.0 strategy is a bet that they can fix that, and frankly, that’s still up in the air. If they can’t catch up, they’ll have no choice but to go fabless or double down on partnerships.....but that’s also a big cultural shift, and they haven’t shown they're nimble enough to make it fast.

At the end of the day, you’re right, it’s about product. But product isn’t just silicon. It’s execution, timing, ecosystem, and vision. Intel has the resources to compete. What they’ve lacked is bold innovation and leadership that doesn't rely on the past to justify the future.

Let’s hope they figure that out before AMD eats what’s left of their lunch.

Intel shrunked to only 40% of total market share would actually be good, because it would set them to being hungry mindset again. For decades Intel has dominated the consumer and enterprise market, and kept pushing prices high, and kept progression on things such as cores on a low fruit.

AMD understood that and worked on products that where never done before. An 8 Core FX for half price? On MT it dominated a 3x as more expensive i7 back in the days. Incredible value to begin with.

Fabs and development are in the billions. If you cant beat them join them. Intel got too lazy with going into all sorts of products instead of being the number one in X86.

I believe their P cores are good; but they keep coming up with these P+E core designs. Just stick to what your good at, P cores and build strong chips around it. Why toss SMT away if it can be beneficial? It works on AMD products....

I mean if I want my PC to be efficient ill just tap on "power saving mode" and the thing just downclocks with a power consumption of less then 50W while I'm actively working on it.

Previous year I replaced my Xeons with Epyc's. What a world of difference in performance, value and efficiency. I can toss away all the remaining 4 servers and replace it with one big epyc. Simple as that.

 

[Loadedaxe]

Intel shrunked to only 40% of total market share would actually be good, because it would set them to being hungry mindset again. For decades Intel has dominated the consumer and enterprise market, and kept pushing prices high, and kept progression on things such as cores on a low fruit.

AMD understood that and worked on products that where never done before. An 8 Core FX for half price? On MT it dominated a 3x as more expensive i7 back in the days. Incredible value to begin with.

Fabs and development are in the billions. If you cant beat them join them. Intel got too lazy with going into all sorts of products instead of being the number one in X86.

I believe their P cores are good; but they keep coming up with these P+E core designs. Just stick to what your good at, P cores and build strong chips around it. Why toss SMT away if it can be beneficial? It works on AMD products....

I mean if I want my PC to be efficient ill just tap on "power saving mode" and the thing just downclocks with a power consumption of less then 50W while I'm actively working on it.

Previous year I replaced my Xeons with Epyc's. What a world of difference in performance, value and efficiency. I can toss away all the remaining 4 servers and replace it with one big epyc. Simple as that.

That’s a good take, and I agree with most of it, Intel did get too comfortable at the top for too long. But shrinking to 40% market share isn’t exactly “good” news for them, it’s a wake up call, sure, but also a sign of real structural challenges that won't be solved by just "being hungry" again.

AMD’s rise has been impressive, no doubt. They saw the multicore future coming and delivered serious value with Zen. But it’s worth remembering that a competitive market needs both AMD and Intel firing on all cylinders. If Intel truly tanks, TSMC bottlenecks will hit AMD too, and the whole ecosystem suffers. And lets not forget AMD's pricing structure has gone up substantially due to being on top currently, not that it matters, just food for thought, without Intel, like Nvidia, AMD will have dominance and we see that now, where that has gotten us.

As for the P and E core design, it's not perfect, but it’s part of a long term bet on heterogeneous computing. Efficiency cores aren’t just about saving watts, they help keep background tasks from dragging down foreground performance, especially in laptops and consumer workflows. On the desktop, it’s more of a mixed bag, I get that. But ditching SMT? I don't think that’s happening. Intel still uses it on P cores, it's E-cores that lack it. It’s a tradeoff in space and power, not laziness.

Also, spinning off fabs isn’t just a switch you flip. Intel’s IDM 2.0 plan is a long term pivot. If they succeed, they’ll become both a design and a manufacturing powerhouse again, something AMD and NVIDIA can't do alone.

And yep, Epyc is a beast, no debate there. But don’t count Intel out yet. Their roadmap isn’t weak yet, it’s just been delayed. The real question is whether they can execute before they bleed too much market share I do agree.

 

[Nintenboy01]

Hardly, try not to presume someone’s political leanings from a comment that doesn’t specifically endorse anything

I hate Trump and have good reason to. His policies are non-sensical and conflict with one another. There is no consistency in thought and intellectual hypocrisy. But then, this news article wasn’t really about Trump, was it? And I don’t care to discuss him in the slightest.

Those fools have the real TDS - Trump Devotion Syndrome. He's been deified

 

[J Oelschl]

Clearly the BOARD chose the new leader poorly. He sounds like he is throwing up his arms and wants to sell off the company in piece parts. Was he a trojan horse from the ghouls at Blackrock or other chop shops? What is his strategy to turn things around? Dr. Lisa Su was in charge of a bigger disaster than Intel is and she managed to outperform competitors on a shoestring budget.

 

[BrightlightJohn]

Donald Trump Tariffs are what we the USA needs to stop the sale of our manufacturing base to foreign companies. If Demcrats get their way again, many of our vital industries and manufacturing will be moved to China. This must not happen. We demand our goods to made in the USA again!

 

[GhostLegion]

Intel still uses it on P cores, it's E-cores that lack it.

Arrow Lake doesn’t have SMT and neither will the upcoming gens.

 

[GhostLegion]

Donald Trump Tariffs are what we the USA needs to stop the sale of our manufacturing base to foreign companies. If Demcrats get their way again, many of our vital industries and manufacturing will be moved to China. This must not happen. We demand our goods to made in the USA again!

I’m begging you, learn some economics and also look at the country. Tariffs cannot and will not work to do what you want. I don’t really want to discuss Trump but here I go again…

https://www.cato.org/blog/americans-think-manufacturing-employment-greatfor-other-people

Cato is a right leaning think tank, so they aren’t even trying to sink the policy. We are already at full employment essentially, where do you think these people are going to come from to staff these factories? Especially when Americans don’t WANT to work in factories. Add in the fact that most of the manufacturing China does is for low value products, toys and the like.

Immigration would solve the employment problem but we’re cracking down on that, so no chance of importing cheap labor for these factories.

It takes years to build factories, years that Trump doesn’t have because the second someone else is elected, the tariffs go out the window because Congress didn’t authorize them with a law. No business is going to invest under those conditions. Especially not when Trump keeps delaying and delaying implementation.

Tariffs only generate value for the US as long as partners don’t proceed to slap tariffs on us…and they have and will. The Canadians are boycotting the products we make already. So even if these factories were built, and you magically had the workers to run them…who is buying the products? Everybody is an exporter these days, very few industries survive with just a domestic market and the scale of manufacturing Trump wants required exports to pay for it all. Exports that won’t happen because of reciprocal tariffs. Yes, the US market is important and yes, our control of the dollar gives us a lot of leeway to punish those we don’t like, for example NK, Russia, and Iran but let’s not arrogantly assuming that somehow, our population is greater in wealth than the rest of the planet.

Foxconn boondoggle continues as company puts property in Green Bay, Wisconsin, up for sale

<p>In 2017, Gov. Scott Walker made a deal with the Taiwan-based multinational electronics manufacturer to bring thousands of jobs to Wisconsin. Six years later, few of those jobs have materialized.</p>

wisconsinindependent.com

https://www.techspot.com/news/108575-tsmc-arizona-lawsuit-alleges-anti-american-discrimination-racist.html

Consider the above cases as well, nobody wants to build manufacturing here and for good reason. American workers are expensive and our culture isn’t competitive with Asian ones and I’m ok with that. Let’s lean into our strengths and not look backwards to a past that cannot be reclaimed and frankly, a past we shouldn’t want. Manufacturing is polluting and terrible and we shouldn’t want it in our communities.

 

[HardReset]

Arrow Lake doesn’t have SMT and neither will the upcoming gens.

Sure about that? Lion Cove has SMT support.

 

[GhostLegion]

Sure about that? Lion Cove has SMT support.

Yes?

Intel did the unthinkable with its new Arrow Lake CPUs

Intel is giving up on a feature that has been at the center of its desktop CPUs for decades with the release of Arrow Lake.

www.digitaltrends.com

Intel® Core™ Ultra 5 Processor 245 (24M Cache, up to 5.10 GHz) - Product Specifications | Intel

Intel® Core™ Ultra 5 Processor 245 (24M Cache, up to 5.10 GHz) quick reference with specifications, features, and technologies.

www.intel.com

Random SKU I grabbed, 14 cores, 14 threads. And I just checked the top end desktop SKU with 24 cores and 24 threads.

 

[Loadedaxe]

SMT will remain for P-core only designs where maximum performance matters, hyperthreading will continue to have a place in CPU design. For Lion Cove and Lunar Lake, it makes more sense to focus on single-threaded performance and rely on E-cores for added multi-threaded performance.

So why has Intel ditched hypertheading? The short answer is because it helps them create more efficient processors, and a longer answer is that hybrid CPU designs make hyperthreading a lot less useful than it once was. Intel are rethinking x86 CPU design, and that means that are changing the way that cores are created. For Lion Cove, that means that hyperthreading is going away, and more changes are coming with Intel’s future core designs.

Source: OC3D

So, rumors are there will still be SMT on chips with P-Cores only, and I think for desktop/enthusiast, Intel needs to or AMD will continue to eat their lunch.

I haven't heard an update on Bartlett Lake other than what has been posted here and TH, so we will see.

 

[GhostLegion]

SMT will remain for P-core only designs where maximum performance matters, hyperthreading will continue to have a place in CPU design. For Lion Cove and Lunar Lake, it makes more sense to focus on single-threaded performance and rely on E-cores for added multi-threaded performance.

So why has Intel ditched hypertheading? The short answer is because it helps them create more efficient processors, and a longer answer is that hybrid CPU designs make hyperthreading a lot less useful than it once was. Intel are rethinking x86 CPU design, and that means that are changing the way that cores are created. For Lion Cove, that means that hyperthreading is going away, and more changes are coming with Intel’s future core designs.

Source: OC3D

So, rumors are there will still be SMT on chips with P-Cores only, and I think for desktop/enthusiast, Intel needs to or AMD will continue to eat their lunch.

I haven't heard an update on Bartlett Lake other than what has been posted here and TH, so we will see.

They do mention that it is expected that SMT is thought to be a server only feature.

 

[Loadedaxe]

They do mention that it is expected that SMT is thought to be a server only feature.

Yes, but other sources, while a year old suggest Intel is still working on P Core only designs with SMT, again all rumors, we will have to wait and see.

 

[HardReset]

Well, only real reason why Intel "dropped" HT is fact that Intel will use P, E and LPE cores. Scheduling: P core, E core, LPE core. Add P-core HT into that and scheduling will be Very messy.

Another question is where desktop CPU needs those stupid LPE cores. You can probably save like half watts of power. Awesome. Just plain stupid. No wonder AMD market cap is twice Intel.