Colonel Blimp
Posts: 90 +77
Vega56, Sapphire Pulse, 1440p on a Dell 2719DGF
Let's Test This: Ryzen 9 3900X on a B350 Motherboard
- Thread starter Steve
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PetrolHead
Posts: 68 +36
All DDR4 memory is not the same. Different manufacturers, different quality modules etc. Some will work only at 2133MHz with some boards, others will work at 3200MHz or beyond on other boards, and then there's also the question of the latencies that can be reached. The "one click overclock" of enabling XMP profile is more or less guaranteed to work with Intel CPUs (it's Intel XMP, after all), but it's not guaranteed to work with AMD CPUs, unless the memory is specifically meant to be used with AMD CPUs - and even then it depends on the motherboard; if the RAM is not listed in the motherboard's memory QVL, good luck. Also, RAM heatsinks are more for looks than any real cooling need. The main reason heatsinks (may) correlate with overclocking potential is that modules without heatsinks tend to be the cheapest models you can find and thus will also have the lowest quality components.
Stark
Posts: 192 +174
there is a quality difference, yes, but my point was regarding overclocking RAM, which can be easily done on AMD boards too, which is called by different names by various vendors, for eg it is A-XMP for MSI https://www.vortez.net/articles_pages/msi_b450_gaming_pro_carbon_ac_review,6.html
you just need to select the profile 1 or 2 and you are done. "XMP" is Intel specific, so the naming differs but the end result is the same for AMD too.
Secondly, 99% of ram will* work @2933 with the BIOS improving the compatibility after AGEA 1.0.0.6. till the time you stick with name brands, it can be done.
I have 32GB 4 sticks @ 3200 MHz on 2700x which are corsair vengeance RGB module, these were not on the Motherboard QVL list and were not rated for 3200 MHz for all four slots populated. but they worked nonetheless. DDR4 is rated lower in terms of power requirement than DDR3, also there are only 3 main suppliers Samsung, Micron, and SK Hynix. all DDR4 is made the same, they may differ in-terms of the top speed a module can achieve, but they all will hit the middle spot fine.
Also it was in-terms of OP trying to overclock before investing in new modules especially after the price hike due to Japan restricting chemical supply to South Korea.
also because that's the fun part of building your own PC.
Edit: here Linus explains how every DDR4 module has the JDEC specified speed plus the overclock profile baked into each module :
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PetrolHead
Posts: 68 +36
That's the thing, it's not guaranteed to be the same end result. It depends on the motherboard, the BIOS and the memory (down to silicon lottery). That's why the QVL is so important when buying RAM for AMD platforms.
I hope you're right, but even name brands had a lot of issues on first gen Ryzen and the AGESA version is not the only thing affecting memory compatibility (and how widespread is AGESA 1.0.0.6 at the moment anyways?).
You've more or less lucked out. As a general rule this is not what should be expected. Four modules puts more stress on the IMC and this makes reaching overclocked speeds harder. Also, depending on the motherboard and the memory, there are several different situations one may end up with when using four modules, as you can have single or dual rank memory and the motherboard may use either daisy chaining or T-topology. This means it's extra hard to say what the end result is using four modules.
Samsung's B-die has been considered superior since the launch of Ryzen. The quality differences between different manufacturers doesn't seem to be limited to DDR4 either, since Vega cards with Hynix HBM were (AFAIK) worse overclockers than those with Samsung HBM.
It's supported in the sense that you can try taking advantage of it on AM4 platforms I.e. the BIOS can read the overclock profile and apply it. It's not supported in the sense that the advertised speeds would be necessarily be achievable on Ryzen processors, as the speeds are only Intel certified (unless the RAM is explicitly meant to be used with Ryzen). When pairing 3200MHz RAM with Intel chips, you can be almost certain that activating the XMP profile will result in 3200MHz. With Ryzen, that same memory might not be stable beyond the failsafe speed of 2133MHz, even if you can try enabling the XMP profile. Alternatively (and more likely), you might need to settle for a lower speed of 2933MHz, for example.
Now, I don't consider 2933MHz to be especially hard to achieve on Ryzen platforms. However, the OP had 2400MHz RAM, which likely means that there is no XMP profile for 2933MHz and that the memory is from Hynix, Micron etc. - but not from Samsung. Considering all the variables and the fact that no overclock is ever guaranteed, I think it's a bit far fetched to "promise" an overclock to 2933MHz based on "all DDR4 is the same". It's possible, sure, but it may also not work out as hoped.
Stark
Posts: 192 +174
I get your point and the thing is, OP has to just go in the BIOS and check its only 5 min. and it probably took us more time to reply to each other regarding such.
and am too tired to type an essay for an act which takes less time to do than to explain that why it should be done, yes "XMP" is Intel introduced, but It is equally supported for AMD too, and guess all the Motherboard vendors missed the memo that it is not. yes depending on the memory module it may hit a lower speed but such is a good option than buying new modules.
hence I suggested OP to at least try to hit the XMP profile in his set up before clicking on the "buy now" option.
AGESA 1.0.0.6 was released by MSI at least in November 2018. At least I did the upgrade of my BIOS. Most vendors now offer desktop applications to notify if a driver/BIOS update is provided.
Yes, 4 modules do put the stress on integrated memory controller on the CPU die which makes it hard to hit higher GHz on CPU due to higher temperatures but I hit 4.2+ easily on 3 cores while gaming, and yes it may not be the general thing especially for first-gen Ryzen.
Samsung B die was discontinued mid last year.
PC building is not only about the QVL list but also knowing which parts could/would work together, yes its does serve as a guideline but not always all the parts that are available in a country are on a vendors QVL list or the parts on the list may not be available for purchase. so we improvise.
So OP may hit the rated speed or something a step lower but again it will save him some money. at least something worth trying before spending more money.
Our viewpoints, in themselve exists together like the 2 sides of the coin, but its always helpful to try a few things before spending your money in the space of PC building.
and am too tired to type an essay for an act which takes less time to do than to explain that why it should be done, yes "XMP" is Intel introduced, but It is equally supported for AMD too, and guess all the Motherboard vendors missed the memo that it is not. yes depending on the memory module it may hit a lower speed but such is a good option than buying new modules.
hence I suggested OP to at least try to hit the XMP profile in his set up before clicking on the "buy now" option.
AGESA 1.0.0.6 was released by MSI at least in November 2018. At least I did the upgrade of my BIOS. Most vendors now offer desktop applications to notify if a driver/BIOS update is provided.
Yes, 4 modules do put the stress on integrated memory controller on the CPU die which makes it hard to hit higher GHz on CPU due to higher temperatures but I hit 4.2+ easily on 3 cores while gaming, and yes it may not be the general thing especially for first-gen Ryzen.
Samsung B die was discontinued mid last year.
PC building is not only about the QVL list but also knowing which parts could/would work together, yes its does serve as a guideline but not always all the parts that are available in a country are on a vendors QVL list or the parts on the list may not be available for purchase. so we improvise.
So OP may hit the rated speed or something a step lower but again it will save him some money. at least something worth trying before spending more money.
Our viewpoints, in themselve exists together like the 2 sides of the coin, but its always helpful to try a few things before spending your money in the space of PC building.
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PetrolHead
Posts: 68 +36
Fair point. It's quick to do and there's practically nothing to lose.
Hmm. This is not really relevant to the article or what has been discussed, but the AGESA version numbers seem to exhibit some odd behaviour. BIOSes with 1.0.0.6 have indeed been released last year, but my BIOS from 2017 should have 1.0.0.6b and 1.0.0.1a, 1.0.0.4 and 1.0.0.5 have apparently been released after the 1.0.0.6b. In addition, the newest AGESA version I've seen Ryzen 3xxx benchmarks done on is 1.0.0.3AB - and this is a very recent release with some early fixes, although there may be newer ones available by now. The newest available BIOS for the ASRock AB350M Pro4 has AGESA Combo-AM4 1.0.0.1., so maybe AMD has started again from 1.0.0.1 with AGESA versions that support Zen 2?
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