Nvidia: RTX 3060 won't be good for Ethereum mining

Irata

Posts: 1,290   +2,065
An RTX 3090 gets around 120 MH/s at 300W or so, which suggests that if the chip layout really is like that, then it's clocked to something like 400 MHz - which doesn't make any sense at all. I think I'll stick with my original assumption that the CMP HX range is simply made from duff GA10x chips and be disappointed with the promo die shot appearing to be nothing more than an intern's vivid imagination with Photoshop.
Aren‘t they based on Turing with the exception of the top SKU ?
That would explain the poor hash rate / power consumption compared to RTX 3xxx cards.

Still don‘t see who would buy these mining cards considering very low resale value unless they are priced very attractively.
 

neeyik

Posts: 1,788   +2,061
Staff member
Aren‘t they based on Turing with the exception of the top SKU ?
That would explain the poor hash rate / power consumption compared to RTX 3xxx cards.
To be honest, I was only examining the top spec CMP model (assuming that's what the chip image was for). At this stage, we know almost nothing about the actual products, so anyone's guess is as good as anything else as to what's really inside them.
 

Achaios

Posts: 93   +301
QUOTE OP
Emerging trends like working and studying from home, as well as people looking to entertain themselves during lockdowns have put additional pressure on the tech industry's supply chain, leading to a lot of scalping and higher prices for computer hardware.
UNQUOTE OP

Simply not true.

If this was true, ALL new GPU would have disappeared from the market, however ppl can still buy any GPU with 4GB RAM or less b/c such GPUs cannot be used to mine ethereum.

Yesterday when I looked, all custom versions of the 1050 TI were available for sale in more than a dozen major computer stores all over Greece, however any GPU with more than 4GB RAM was sold out and out of stock.
 

JamesBlond

Posts: 54   +29
Stupid is Stupid
I buy 1070, Game and Mine, 10months I have not paid for the card as the mining paid me back
I buy 2070, Game and Mine, 10months I have not paid for the card as the mining paid me back
Why would I buy a gaming card that cannot pay itself back?????????????????????????? NIVIDIA are you STUPID... Get into the crypto business and stop faffing around... make more cards
 

Duke9192

Posts: 32   +28
The bottom line is miners will still buy the gpu's. They will use bots to buy and make it difficult and more expensive for us gamers to purchase one. People will trash talk Nvidia for catering and then when supply returns we will all scramble to purchase the latest gpu they make because it will be the fastest out there for the games we play.
 

enemys

Posts: 236   +247
TechSpot Elite
QUOTE OP
Emerging trends like working and studying from home, as well as people looking to entertain themselves during lockdowns have put additional pressure on the tech industry's supply chain, leading to a lot of scalping and higher prices for computer hardware.
UNQUOTE OP

Simply not true.

If this was true, ALL new GPU would have disappeared from the market, however ppl can still buy any GPU with 4GB RAM or less b/c such GPUs cannot be used to mine ethereum.

Yesterday when I looked, all custom versions of the 1050 TI were available for sale in more than a dozen major computer stores all over Greece, however any GPU with more than 4GB RAM was sold out and out of stock.
Which proves nothing, because a) Greece isn't the whole world (different countries might be affected to a different degree), b) you can't just disregard price hikes, even if cards are still in stock. High end cards are completely gone due to combination of mining craze and pandemic-driven supply & demand constraints, while lower end GPUs are only affected by the second factor, which is why they are more expensive, but not gone entirely.

I.e. I was able to buy a GTX 1650 in Poland for ~€170 three months ago, now the cheapest 1650 there costs about €250-270. Old 4GB RX cards have inflated prices as well - they're sold for €200 on eBay across the whole Europe, even though they used to be available for (IIRC) at least 30% less.
 

neeyik

Posts: 1,788   +2,061
Staff member
If this was true, ALL new GPU would have disappeared from the market, however ppl can still buy any GPU with 4GB RAM or less b/c such GPUs cannot be used to mine ethereum.

Yesterday when I looked, all custom versions of the 1050 TI were available for sale in more than a dozen major computer stores all over Greece, however any GPU with more than 4GB RAM was sold out and out of stock.
That may be the case for Greece, but it's not entirely so for the US. For example:


While those prices are beyond ridiculous ($925 for a GTX 1060!), there are some >4GB models in stock. However, the likes of the UK, the quantities of almost any graphics card (AMD or Nvidia) are extremely limited - Newegg UK has just a couple of GT 710s and GT 1030s, and one GTX 1650 model in.


Does that mean every single one of the rest has been bought to do ethereum mining? Possibly, but it's more likely to be the case that retailers only keep stocks of the lowest spec cards for office/home PCs upgrades. Everything else is for gaming and they let levels of older models drop, as new ones come in. The UK has gone through two long lockdowns, with people unable to do much for entertainment, other than watch movies and play video games.

Nobody is buying an Xbox Series X or PlayStation 5 to do mining, but the availability of them (in the UK, at least) is also extremely poor. There are older consoles, albeit with high prices: PS4 500GB on Amazon start at £290 and go up to £431, but there are no new Xbox One units of any kind. There are some supplies of the Switch Lite, but the normal version is quite rare and expensive.

All of this isn't to say that mining isn't having a significant impact of stock levels of graphics cards, but it's not the sole, nor the primary, cause of the dearth of GPUs.
 

Irata

Posts: 1,290   +2,065
To be honest, I was only examining the top spec CMP model (assuming that's what the chip image was for). At this stage, we know almost nothing about the actual products, so anyone's guess is as good as anything else as to what's really inside them.
If it‘s all Ampere then I don‘t see how this helps the market - it should still mean fewer dies for gaming cards plus no cheaper cards for the used market down the road which is actually beneficial for nVidia and their AIB if there is no way to circumvent the mining restrictions found in the 3060.
 

ZipperBoi

Posts: 69   +120
iu
Nvidia after being asked about this.
 

neeyik

Posts: 1,788   +2,061
Staff member
If it‘s all Ampere then I don‘t see how this helps the market - it should still mean fewer dies for gaming cards plus no cheaper cards for the used market down the road which is actually beneficial for nVidia and their AIB if there is no way to circumvent the mining restrictions found in the 3060.
Much depends on what these new products actually are, and there's 3 possibilities:

  • New Ampere/Turing custom chip
  • GA10x/TU10x GPUs from bins that can't be employed for graphics cards
  • A combination of the above across the CMP range

In the case of the 2nd option, it won't affect graphics card supply, as those chips simply don't fit any of the current product ranges. If it's the former, then it's impact on GPU supply will depend on which manufacturer and what node is being used to make them - if it's Samsung 8N, then it will obviously dig into that supply, but they do have other nodes that they could potentially be fabricated on.
 

terzaerian

Posts: 634   +881
You realize that they've been doing that for a long time, right? Quadros use the same silicon as consumer cards, but consumer cards have artificially limited FP16 performance.
I'm gonna level with you mate, I didn't. I've been kind of basic when it comes to following that.
 

mbrowne5061

Posts: 1,791   +1,030
And unlike drivers, firmware couldn't be hacked, at least not on NV cards, because the whole stuff is encrypted and to my best knowledge, no one has done it yet, or at least hasn't revealed it.
I don't think anyone has incentive to even try it until now. The firmware worked and was fairly permissive, so there wasn't much reason to try to change it. Now that has changed, and anyone who can change the firmware stands to make a lot of money via mining.

I give it 90 days before someone comes up with a custom mining firmware that can be flashed onto nVidia GPUs. 180 days, tops.
 

Irata

Posts: 1,290   +2,065
I don't think anyone has incentive to even try it until now. The firmware worked and was fairly permissive, so there wasn't much reason to try to change it. Now that has changed, and anyone who can change the firmware stands to make a lot of money via mining.

I give it 90 days before someone comes up with a custom mining firmware that can be flashed onto nVidia GPUs. 180 days, tops.
Considering the size and financial resources of the mining outfits that is very likely. And if they keep the custom firmware to themselves, it means even more profit.
 

Irata

Posts: 1,290   +2,065
Not impossible, and I don't see why they would claim something that can so easily get fact-checked by the tech community.
The community may do this, tech sites and tubers, at least the ones with reach...big doubt.
 

tellmewhy

Posts: 74   +33
What makes the Nvidia to believe that the miners will they use the latest driver? They simple can use an older one which it is unmodified. If they try to modified and the olds in their website the miners they will find somewhere a copy, so there is no point.

If the demand is too high and you can’t support it then just increase the price. It’s so simple and let your customers play jenga with their hardware if they want.
 

eforce

Posts: 140   +141
All this will do is make it difficult for the average joe to get a few $ back on their purchase, the big mining farms will just alter the cards to get the hashrate back and they have the money to hire former Nvidia/AMD engineers..
 

Markoni35

Posts: 961   +389
I thought they are now using ASICs for mining, since first CPUs, and then GPUs, became too slow for crypto mining. Why don't people just buy specialized hardware for that?
 

neeyik

Posts: 1,788   +2,061
Staff member
I thought they are now using ASICs for mining, since first CPUs, and then GPUs, became too slow for crypto mining. Why don't people just buy specialized hardware for that?
For casual miners, custom ASICs aren’t a realistic option, as they’re not going to be cheap. Unlike a GPU from AMD or Nvidia, which are designed to operate in as low a power envelope as possible, mining ASICs are set out to just crunch the maths with power given little consideration. So while their hash rates are enormous, the wattage level (> 1kW) requires PSUs and cooling systems of a similar level. The actual ASICs aren’t super expensive any more but the rest is, so it’s more cost effective to buy a few graphics cards and associated PC hardware. GPUs have the added advantage of being flexible and be turned to a variety of mining options, where ASICs, by their very nature, are far more focused.
 

JamesBlond

Posts: 54   +29
All Nvidia brainless designers need to do is make a GPU that is not dual purpose, ONLY MINING...15% boost in mining performance, extra cooling and charge 20% extra