Volvo will only sell all-electric vehicles by 2030, is moving all EV sales to online-only...

midian182

Posts: 7,081   +62
Staff member
What just happened? Volvo has announced it will only sell electric vehicles by 2030, phasing out all car models with combustion engines, including hybrids, over the next nine years. The company previously said it's aiming for 50 percent of global sales to consist of fully electric cars by 2025 and wants to become an all-electric automaker within twenty years; this new 2030 target represents an “acceleration” of the electrification strategy.

Swedish company Volvo, owned by the Chinese Geely Group, says the new target date is driven by strong early demand for its first EV, the XC40 Recharge that launched last year, and an expected expansion of EV charging infrastructure.

Volvo also said it is increasing its focus on online sales. The company will be rolling out several new fully-electric models in the coming years, all of which will only be available online.

“To remain successful, we need profitable growth. So instead of investing in a shrinking business, we choose to invest in the future – electric and online,” said Håkan Samuelsson, Chief Executive of Volvo Cars. “We are fully focused on becoming a leader in the fast-growing premium electric segment.”

Several countries in Europe and elsewhere have announced plans to ban the sale of new cars or vans powered solely by fossil fuels within the next decade. This is in addition to the numerous carmakers that have pledged to go electric-only. Is the writing on the wall for combustion engines? Volvo certainly believes so.

“There is no long-term future for cars with an internal combustion engine,” said Henrik Green, Chief Technology Officer at Volvo Cars.

Image credit: Philip Lange

Permalink to story.

 

QuantumPhysics

Posts: 5,226   +5,927
As a hellcat and jeep SRT owner I think I speak for the majority of people who have a V-8 engine when I say that it will be a very long time before the electric vehicle market is able to convince us to upgrade our personal vehicles to a silent, response less, non-enthusiastic vehicle.

But as a car reviewer, Tesla owner, and EV stock investor who has tested all of the Tesla vehicles, Volvo Polestar 2 and any other electric vehicle that comes to market (waiting for the Cadillac Lyriq) I must say that electric vehicles are definitely a better fit for most people who have a four-cylinder or a V6 car - even outperforming V8s.

The only real problem with electric vehicles at this point is the price. The R&D is expensive and those costs are being passed directly to the consumer. Only the largest of the Automakers have the ability and the experience to build high-quality EV without huge costs, but on average, an EV still costs "more" than an equivalently sized and equipped ICE vehicle. That will change, however, as the market retools towards EV.

Range anxiety is slowly becoming a non-issue. Building all new homes with built in EV chargers should be a standard to allow as many people as possible to charge at home- overnight.

The vast majority of us are not driving more than 200 miles a day and even on most long range road trips most of us are not driving more than 300 miles without taking a break.

Newer electric vehicles are offering between 300 miles and 500 miles of range. As long as we have a place to charge them which is easily identifiable autumn map and next to a rest stop, stopping for an hour and a half to charge the vehicle isn’t so bad. It gives the person time to nap, defecate or eat.

The other issue is that there needs to be more ubiquitous charging stations. It’s one thing to have them spaced every few miles but it would be a totally revolutionary thing for charging stations to be “everywhere“. They need to be behind movie theaters, behind grocery stores, behind malls and “everywhere“.

The only way that will happen is if individual stores and businesses get a tax break for setting up a high voltage charger at their place of business. Once charges are everywhere no one will have ranch anxiety because every single time they stop their vehicle they will be able to charge if necessary.

Tesla has done a great job setting up software that allows people to recognize the distance between chargers and remind them to recharge the vehicle when possible.
 
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Irata

Posts: 1,675   +2,812
So, the „mostly SUV“ company is going all electric....

I suspect that this may also have something to do with the cost of developing a new internal combustion engine or engines.
 

Lounds

Posts: 896   +796
Online only sales... I know loads of people that if they're buying or leasing a new car they would never commit to something like that without a test drive, so unless this online sales services has some form of bookable test drive option then I think Volvo will lose a lot of customers.
 

VEGGIM

Posts: 35   +7
As a hellcat and jeep SRT owner I think I speak for the majority of people who have a V-8 engine when I say that it will be a very long time before the electric vehicle market is able to convince us to upgrade our personal vehicles to a silent, response less, non-enthusiastic vehicle.

But as a car reviewer, Tesla owner, and EV stock investor who has tested all of the Tesla vehicles, Volvo Polestar 2 and any other electric vehicle that comes to market (waiting for the Cadillac Lyriq) I must say that electric vehicles are definitely a better fit for most people who have a four-cylinder or a V6 car - even outperforming V8s.

The only real problem with electric vehicles at this point is the price. The R&D is expensive and those costs are being passed directly to the consumer. Only the largest of the Automakers have the ability and the experience to build high-quality EV without huge costs, but on average, an EV still costs "more" than an equivalently sized and equipped ICE vehicle. That will change, however, as the market retools towards EV.

Range anxiety is slowly becoming a non-issue. Building all new homes with built in EV chargers should be a standard to allow as many people as possible to charge at home- overnight.

The vast majority of us are not driving more than 200 miles a day and even on most long range road trips most of us are not driving more than 300 miles without taking a break.

Newer electric vehicles are offering between 300 miles and 500 miles of range. As long as we have a place to charge them which is easily identifiable autumn map and next to a rest stop, stopping for an hour and a half to charge the vehicle isn’t so bad. It gives the person time to nap, defecate or eat.

The other issue is that there needs to be more ubiquitous charging stations. It’s one thing to have them spaced every few miles but it would be a totally revolutionary thing for charging stations to be “everywhere“. They need to be behind movie theaters, behind grocery stores, behind malls and “everywhere“.

The only way that will happen is if individual stores and businesses get a tax break for setting up a high voltage charger at their place of business. Once charges are everywhere no one will have ranch anxiety because every single time they stop their vehicle they will be able to charge if necessary.

Tesla has done a great job setting up software that allows people to recognize the distance between chargers and remind them to recharge the vehicle when possible.
Isn't another problem weight, you need lots of power to invalidate that weight. For sports cars that's kinda important. It's also space. It's not really might be worth if you are having only 1 shared family car.. If they have 2 cars it might kinda make sense.
 

QuantumPhysics

Posts: 5,226   +5,927
Isn't another problem weight, you need lots of power to invalidate that weight. For sports cars that's kinda important. It's also space. It's not really might be worth if you are having only 1 shared family car.. If they have 2 cars it might kinda make sense.


Have you driven an EV?

Have you driven a Tesla Plaid or Ludicrous Mode - or even a standard model?

Electric Vehicles produce peak torque almost instantly and because of that, they are able to move their mass easily.

The Tesla Ludicrous out accelerates the bulk of ICE cars including Lamborghini Aventador and Bugatti Chiron which cost wayyyyy more.

Furthermore, more mass actually helps protect drivers in the event of a collision - and due to the mass being the battery near ground, helps prevent rollovers.
 

QuantumPhysics

Posts: 5,226   +5,927
I personally drove and vlogged on the Polestar 2 which is essentially what you'll expect to be coming from Volvo.

It was a little cramped for my taste, but it was a great alternative to the base Tesla Model Y and Model 3 (somewhere in between both of them).

The only thing it absolutely needed was a solid 300 mile range
 

Theinsanegamer

Posts: 2,661   +4,141
"Is the writing on the wall for combustion engines?"

Nope. Despite these pushes, electric sales are still a tiny blip on the radar of overall car sales. Even in eco hippy loving Europe, electric car sales fell off a cliff once rebates from the government went away. Electric cars still have a huge number of hurdles to clear:

1.) range. While some may say range anxiety is lessening, sales say otherwise. Until electric cars can easily do 600+ miles of range on a charge equivalent of modern electric cars, or can recharge in sub 10 minutes, the electric car is going to be a hard sell

2.) infrastructure. Given you cant carry spare electricity with you, infrastructure is very important, and outside of a few major cities still isnt there. 5 years ago on a different car related site I wrote how there were four tesla superchargers in a supermarket parking lot and ONE (1) DC fast charger half an hour away in another lot. Since then, there has been TWO (2) put in downtown in street parking, of course away from the apartments where people live, and ONE (1) in a different lot on the other end of town. Wow. At this rate electric charging may be as common as gas by the year 2300.

3.) BUT MUH HOUSE CHARGING

Most of the houses here are older, and require new electric boxes with additional 240v lines to allow for home charging. That costs $$$$, sometimes up to $10,000 depending on the house. And once you do that, if you want it in your garage, which isnt connected to the house, get ready to shell out even more and pay for permits, ece. This is a lot of work and money to then go and either buy a car that cost more then half what houses here cost, or buy an electric car that costs more then a F-150 and has the interior from a chevy sonic with 100 miles of range. Bleh.

4.) ownership. Supplying replacement batteries is a huge gray area. I can buy new gas tanks for my 30 year old truck for $100 each. Can you buy new batteries for a 15 year old electric car? Where will you get it services? Tesla, the biggest electric car maker, is notoriously dickish about supplying replacement parts unless THEY are the ones servicing it ($$$$) and they also do things like lock away features the original owner paid for until you pay for them again. Electric cars, by their nature, are inherently digital, and we have ALL seen what the digital world has done to the concept of ownership. Even fewer with the money for electric are going to buy one with such shaky long term prospects.

And lets not forget battery capacity, which tesla is sucking most of up in the automotive sphere. We would need to dramatically increaser battery production capacity, which no one seems to be doing right now, just to meet current production quotas.

And there is the matter of profit. Tesla took 15+ years to turn any profit, and still is shaky in that regard. It'll take more then that just to break even. The Bolt still supposedly loses money, as did the electric focus and e-golf.

Somehow, I feel that much like the predictions of florida being underwater by the year 2000, or the predictions that fusion reactors are just 10 years away, that in 2040 we will still be reading about the latest gas powered crossovers and cars.
 

VEGGIM

Posts: 35   +7
Have you driven an EV?

Have you driven a Tesla Plaid or Ludicrous Mode - or even a standard model?

Electric Vehicles produce peak torque almost instantly and because of that, they are able to move their mass easily.

The Tesla Ludicrous out accelerates the bulk of ICE cars including Lamborghini Aventador and Bugatti Chiron which cost wayyyyy more.

Furthermore, more mass actually helps protect drivers in the event of a collision - and due to the mass being the battery near ground, helps prevent rollovers.
The only thing is that certain enthusiasts want are enjoyment. For me acceleration is everything. Someone could mod a civic to be some 1000hp car but that doesn't make it enjoyable at all. And I have rode in an electric car once before. Even so I never felt any sense of enjoyment. If I was the person who only cared about muh top speed and drag racing, that would be a different story.
 

QuantumPhysics

Posts: 5,226   +5,927
The only thing is that certain enthusiasts want are enjoyment. For me acceleration is everything. Someone could mod a civic to be some 1000hp car but that doesn't make it enjoyable at all. And I have rode in an electric car once before. Even so I never felt any sense of enjoyment. If I was the person who only cared about muh top speed and drag racing, that would be a different story.


My question was if you've driven a TESLA Ludicrous before.

The Tesla Ludicrous and Model 3/ Y performance will outaccelerate virtually any equivalently priced/ equivalently sized 4-cylinder or v6. Many V8's get left in the dust by them as well unless they are performance twin-turbocharged.

And with gas prices creeping up, EV is inevitable.
 

QuantumPhysics

Posts: 5,226   +5,927
"Is the writing on the wall for combustion engines?"

Nope. Despite these pushes, electric sales are still a tiny blip on the radar of overall car sales. Even in eco hippy loving Europe, electric car sales fell off a cliff once rebates from the government went away. Electric cars still have a huge number of hurdles to clear:

1.) range. While some may say range anxiety is lessening, sales say otherwise. Until electric cars can easily do 600+ miles of range on a charge equivalent of modern electric cars, or can recharge in sub 10 minutes, the electric car is going to be a hard sell



I used to say the same thing until I lived with an EV.

Before quarantine, I drove up-to 20 miles into the city and 20 miles home or roughly 40- miles per day...working in my Manhattan Office for around 6 - 8 hours per day. That 6-9 hours can be used to charge if necessary, but the car recharges in less than 2.

My Jeep SRT averages less than 12MPG on Premium 93.
My Hellcat averaged less than 13 MPG on Premium 93.

Gas has risen since March 2020 from $1.99 to $2.80 here.

The highest I've paid for gas was closer to $4 a gallon in my 6.4-L Chrysler SRT. getting around 12 MPG.

My cousin, who has the stupidest and longest commute I know of, foolishly bought a 6.4-L SRT because he wanted a Dodge Charger like mine, but has to drive 120 miles to work, and 120 miles home from NYC to PA...and he's getting fewer than 15mpg at Premium 93 ($2.90 per gallon).

I tried to reason with him:

#1 A Tesla (or Polestar 2) would be cheaper to afford (lower maintenance and no gas)

#2 You can recharge it while you're putting in a 7 hour day in your garage.

or #3 You can recharge it at home in your garage.

But NO - he had to get that Hemi and now he's mostly broke and having to sacrifice elsewhere to afford it.

What good is a RWD car you can't drive in snow??? Almost all the EV come with AWD.

What good is spending $3 a gallon on premium just to show off a V8 Dodge Charger?

EV makes more and more economically sense.

The only disappointment I have with the Tesla is lack of ventilated/cooled seats (the original Model S models had them and they took the feature out).
 

Puiu

Posts: 4,865   +3,749
TechSpot Elite
"Is the writing on the wall for combustion engines?"

Nope. Despite these pushes, electric sales are still a tiny blip on the radar of overall car sales. Even in eco hippy loving Europe, electric car sales fell off a cliff once rebates from the government went away. Electric cars still have a huge number of hurdles to clear:

1.) range. While some may say range anxiety is lessening, sales say otherwise. Until electric cars can easily do 600+ miles of range on a charge equivalent of modern electric cars, or can recharge in sub 10 minutes, the electric car is going to be a hard sell

2.) infrastructure. Given you cant carry spare electricity with you, infrastructure is very important, and outside of a few major cities still isnt there. 5 years ago on a different car related site I wrote how there were four tesla superchargers in a supermarket parking lot and ONE (1) DC fast charger half an hour away in another lot. Since then, there has been TWO (2) put in downtown in street parking, of course away from the apartments where people live, and ONE (1) in a different lot on the other end of town. Wow. At this rate electric charging may be as common as gas by the year 2300.

3.) BUT MUH HOUSE CHARGING

Most of the houses here are older, and require new electric boxes with additional 240v lines to allow for home charging. That costs $$$$, sometimes up to $10,000 depending on the house. And once you do that, if you want it in your garage, which isnt connected to the house, get ready to shell out even more and pay for permits, ece. This is a lot of work and money to then go and either buy a car that cost more then half what houses here cost, or buy an electric car that costs more then a F-150 and has the interior from a chevy sonic with 100 miles of range. Bleh.

4.) ownership. Supplying replacement batteries is a huge gray area. I can buy new gas tanks for my 30 year old truck for $100 each. Can you buy new batteries for a 15 year old electric car? Where will you get it services? Tesla, the biggest electric car maker, is notoriously dickish about supplying replacement parts unless THEY are the ones servicing it ($$$$) and they also do things like lock away features the original owner paid for until you pay for them again. Electric cars, by their nature, are inherently digital, and we have ALL seen what the digital world has done to the concept of ownership. Even fewer with the money for electric are going to buy one with such shaky long term prospects.

And lets not forget battery capacity, which tesla is sucking most of up in the automotive sphere. We would need to dramatically increaser battery production capacity, which no one seems to be doing right now, just to meet current production quotas.

And there is the matter of profit. Tesla took 15+ years to turn any profit, and still is shaky in that regard. It'll take more then that just to break even. The Bolt still supposedly loses money, as did the electric focus and e-golf.

Somehow, I feel that much like the predictions of florida being underwater by the year 2000, or the predictions that fusion reactors are just 10 years away, that in 2040 we will still be reading about the latest gas powered crossovers and cars.
Most of those problems will be solved in a few years.
1. Range: you'll get your 500-600 miles in a few years. the 2021.5 Tesla Model S Plaid has an advertised range of almost 520 miles (demos reached 490 miles or more so it's real)
2. Infrastructure: it's much easier to build charging stations than petrol station. you'll find charging stations in many parking lots (restaurants, shopping centers, supermarkets, etc) alongside more traditional places.
3. that's mostly a rural issue where power delivery isn't that great. even in the US the normal powerlines should support 240V.
4. replacing batteries will not be a problem. the problem will the cost. once you are outside of your 5-8 years of warranty it will cost you an arm and a leg for a full replacement. hopefully solid state batteries and other technologies will drive costs down. as for ownership, as long as you don't buy an Apple car, you should be fine :)
 

VEGGIM

Posts: 35   +7
I used to say the same thing until I lived with an EV.

Before quarantine, I drove up-to 20 miles into the city and 20 miles home or roughly 40- miles per day...working in my Manhattan Office for around 6 - 8 hours per day. That 6-9 hours can be used to charge if necessary, but the car recharges in less than 2.

My Jeep SRT averages less than 12MPG on Premium 93.
My Hellcat averaged less than 13 MPG on Premium 93.

Gas has risen since March 2020 from $1.99 to $2.80 here.

The highest I've paid for gas was closer to $4 a gallon in my 6.4-L Chrysler SRT. getting around 12 MPG.

My cousin, who has the stupidest and longest commute I know of, foolishly bought a 6.4-L SRT because he wanted a Dodge Charger like mine, but has to drive 120 miles to work, and 120 miles home from NYC to PA...and he's getting fewer than 15mpg at Premium 93 ($2.90 per gallon).

I tried to reason with him:

#1 A Tesla (or Polestar 2) would be cheaper to afford (lower maintenance and no gas)

#2 You can recharge it while you're putting in a 7 hour day in your garage.

or #3 You can recharge it at home in your garage.

But NO - he had to get that Hemi and now he's mostly broke and having to sacrifice elsewhere to afford it.

What good is a RWD car you can't drive in snow??? Almost all the EV come with AWD.

What good is spending $3 a gallon on premium just to show off a V8 Dodge Charger?

EV makes more and more economically sense.

The only disappointment I have with the Tesla is lack of ventilated/cooled seats (the original Model S models had them and they took the feature out).
I used to say the same thing until I lived with an EV.

Before quarantine, I drove up-to 20 miles into the city and 20 miles home or roughly 40- miles per day...working in my Manhattan Office for around 6 - 8 hours per day. That 6-9 hours can be used to charge if necessary, but the car recharges in less than 2.

My Jeep SRT averages less than 12MPG on Premium 93.
My Hellcat averaged less than 13 MPG on Premium 93.

Gas has risen since March 2020 from $1.99 to $2.80 here.

The highest I've paid for gas was closer to $4 a gallon in my 6.4-L Chrysler SRT. getting around 12 MPG.

My cousin, who has the stupidest and longest commute I know of, foolishly bought a 6.4-L SRT because he wanted a Dodge Charger like mine, but has to drive 120 miles to work, and 120 miles home from NYC to PA...and he's getting fewer than 15mpg at Premium 93 ($2.90 per gallon).

I tried to reason with him:

#1 A Tesla (or Polestar 2) would be cheaper to afford (lower maintenance and no gas)

#2 You can recharge it while you're putting in a 7 hour day in your garage.

or #3 You can recharge it at home in your garage.

But NO - he had to get that Hemi and now he's mostly broke and having to sacrifice elsewhere to afford it.

What good is a RWD car you can't drive in snow??? Almost all the EV come with AWD.

What good is spending $3 a gallon on premium just to show off a V8 Dodge Charger?

EV makes more and more economically sense.

The only disappointment I have with the Tesla is lack of ventilated/cooled seats (the original Model S models had them and they took the feature out).
I don't think you buy a hemi or a charger for mpg. The charger wasn't built for that reason. It's a muscle car. He was expecting too much for a v8 muscle car lol. I don't think rwd cars were made to drive in snow. Not everyone has to copy subaru and go awd for all their models.
 

kapital98

Posts: 368   +320
As a hellcat and jeep SRT owner I think I speak for the majority of people who have a V-8 engine when I say that it will be a very long time before the electric vehicle market is able to convince us to upgrade our personal vehicles to a silent, response less, non-enthusiastic vehicle.

But as a car reviewer, Tesla owner, and EV stock investor who has tested all of the Tesla vehicles, Volvo Polestar 2 and any other electric vehicle that comes to market (waiting for the Cadillac Lyriq) I must say that electric vehicles are definitely a better fit for most people who have a four-cylinder or a V6 car - even outperforming V8s.

The only real problem with electric vehicles at this point is the price. The R&D is expensive and those costs are being passed directly to the consumer. Only the largest of the Automakers have the ability and the experience to build high-quality EV without huge costs, but on average, an EV still costs "more" than an equivalently sized and equipped ICE vehicle. That will change, however, as the market retools towards EV.

Range anxiety is slowly becoming a non-issue. Building all new homes with built in EV chargers should be a standard to allow as many people as possible to charge at home- overnight.

The vast majority of us are not driving more than 200 miles a day and even on most long range road trips most of us are not driving more than 300 miles without taking a break.

Newer electric vehicles are offering between 300 miles and 500 miles of range. As long as we have a place to charge them which is easily identifiable autumn map and next to a rest stop, stopping for an hour and a half to charge the vehicle isn’t so bad. It gives the person time to nap, defecate or eat.

The other issue is that there needs to be more ubiquitous charging stations. It’s one thing to have them spaced every few miles but it would be a totally revolutionary thing for charging stations to be “everywhere“. They need to be behind movie theaters, behind grocery stores, behind malls and “everywhere“.

The only way that will happen is if individual stores and businesses get a tax break for setting up a high voltage charger at their place of business. Once charges are everywhere no one will have ranch anxiety because every single time they stop their vehicle they will be able to charge if necessary.

Tesla has done a great job setting up software that allows people to recognize the distance between chargers and remind them to recharge the vehicle when possible.

I don't 100% agree with all these statements -- but this is a very thoughtful post. Thanks.
 

Tempus

Posts: 27   +18
The vast majority of us are not driving more than 200 miles a day and even on most long range road trips most of us are not driving more than 300 miles without taking a break.

Newer electric vehicles are offering between 300 miles and 500 miles of range. As long as we have a place to charge them which is easily identifiable autumn map and next to a rest stop, stopping for an hour and a half to charge the vehicle isn’t so bad. It gives the person time to nap, defecate or eat.

Sorry, but I have no will to stop every 300-400 miles for 90 minutes on our many times a year 1000 mile drives. My wife and I make that drive in less than 16 hours now without an overnight stop. Add in another 3+ hours for charging and its now a two day drive each way. I realize my use case is vastly different from most people however it isn't any less valid. Don't get me wrong, I'd love an EV that goes 400 miles between charges as long as those charges are only 5 or even 10 minutes and I can stop for a charge at any one of the 110,000 plus 'gas' stations in the US.

Waiting 90 minutes for a charge and hoping I can find a charging station at those 400 mile increments along the way are both non-starters for me right now.
 

Irata

Posts: 1,675   +2,812
Most of those problems will be solved in a few years.
1. Range: you'll get your 500-600 miles in a few years. the 2021.5 Tesla Model S Plaid has an advertised range of almost 520 miles (demos reached 490 miles or more so it's real)
Under ideal conditions. This may be different when it‘s very hot (batteries may need to be cooled, AC is on) or very cold.

2. Infrastructure: it's much easier to build charging stations than petrol station. you'll find charging stations in many parking lots (restaurants, shopping centers, supermarkets, etc) alongside more traditional places.

3. that's mostly a rural issue where power delivery isn't that great. even in the US the normal powerlines should support 240V.
The power requirements are higher than you might think. Even first gen fast chargers require inputs of 480+ volts and 100+ amps (50-60 kW), new gen a multiple of that. Per charger. This requires pretty good power lines, the higher the ev density, the better the power grid needs to be.

4. replacing batteries will not be a problem. the problem will the cost. once you are outside of your 5-8 years of warranty it will cost you an arm and a leg for a full replacement. hopefully solid state batteries and other technologies will drive costs down. as for ownership, as long as you don't buy an Apple car, you should be fine :)
This is particularly a problem for used car buyers. You can probably forget about getting a cheap older used car with ev that you can keep running yourself.
 

QuantumPhysics

Posts: 5,226   +5,927
Sorry, but I have no will to stop every 300-400 miles for 90 minutes on our many times a year 1000 mile drives. My wife and I make that drive in less than 16 hours now without an overnight stop. Add in another 3+ hours for charging and its now a two day drive each way. I realize my use case is vastly different from most people however it isn't any less valid. Don't get me wrong, I'd love an EV that goes 400 miles between charges as long as those charges are only 5 or even 10 minutes and I can stop for a charge at any one of the 110,000 plus 'gas' stations in the US.

Waiting 90 minutes for a charge and hoping I can find a charging station at those 400 mile increments along the way are both non-starters for me right now.


If more chargers are added and they become so ubiquitous as to be a second thought, Range Anxiety will completely go away.

Every Walmart
Every Home Depot
Every Movie Theater
Every fast Food restaurant
Every major parking lot...

Every shopping mall typically has them nowadays.

When someone does a "5 minute stop" for gas, even on road trips, chances are it will take them a whole lot more than 5 minutes. Factor in toilet use, eating and general "rest" like changing diapers or just stretching the legs and arms.

Sure there are some people an EV won't work for, but more and more people - through the Model 3 and Y are realizing that EV do work for them.

The PRICE is the only true barrier and that's quickly being challenged.
 

Mister_K

Posts: 2,080   +779
As a hellcat and jeep SRT owner I think I speak for the majority of people who have a V-8 engine when I say that it will be a very long time before the electric vehicle market is able to convince us to upgrade our personal vehicles to a silent, response less, non-enthusiastic vehicle.

It will be more like tasting matured Whiskey or aged Vine at a price. I think the market for fossil ran vehicles will always be there but the benefits/cost will side with EVs. People still have horses. I think majority of people will be happy with EVs by 2030 although the transition for people to purchase EVs will span all the way up to 2050. Oh and I think you can still be an enthusiast with EVs. Those preferences shift with technology but they still exist. Who knows what might become the trend for "juice" heads.

I think they should also add "upgrade" paths. I don't know what the endurance of EV battery is, but it would be good to simply drive your older model EV to a shop and swap the batteries for a new one.

EVs are already better and the only thing holding them back is lack of charging stations and the ability to charge quicker than filling up. If you can charge to 25-50% within 5-15 minutes then we are good, but it really needs to be under 5 minutes.

Hot-swap battery "pump" stations is a desperate option too but we certainly won't go this route.
 

koblongata

Posts: 432   +239
As a hellcat and jeep SRT owner I think I speak for the majority of people who have a V-8 engine when I say that it will be a very long time before the electric vehicle market is able to convince us to upgrade our personal vehicles to a silent, response less, non-enthusiastic vehicle.

The vibration that you dig is entropy, it's not good. Fumes are killing people around you, CO2 is killing life on Earth, even it is so fun, please give it up.
 

Irata

Posts: 1,675   +2,812
The vibration that you dig is entropy, it's not good. Fumes are killing people around you, CO2 is killing life on Earth, even it is so fun, please give it up.

Synthetic fuels are an alternative. Personally, I‘d say it‘s even preferable to EV as existing infrastructure and vehicles can be used and all this without the environmental damage from either battery production or the petroleum industry processes.
 

mbrowne5061

Posts: 1,910   +1,109
As a hellcat and jeep SRT owner I think I speak for the majority of people who have a V-8 engine when I say that it will be a very long time before the electric vehicle market is able to convince us to upgrade our personal vehicles to a silent, response less, non-enthusiastic vehicle.

Or, just picture "true" 4WD. electric motors for each wheel. Exactly the amount of power and torque, exactly where and when you need it. I've been waiting for an EV 4x4 for years now; hoping the 6th generation of 4runners has it as an option.
 

QuantumPhysics

Posts: 5,226   +5,927
The vibration that you dig is entropy, it's not good. Fumes are killing people around you, CO2 is killing life on Earth, even it is so fun, please give it up.


That's not true at all.

CO2 is a major necessity of plants which create oxygen - ala Photosynthesis.

It's the Methane, Sulfur Dioxides and heavy metals that we have a problem with.

I have no problem giving up the V8. But there are applications of V8 engines that EV have yet to match.
 

QuantumPhysics

Posts: 5,226   +5,927
Or, just picture "true" 4WD. electric motors for each wheel. Exactly the amount of power and torque, exactly where and when you need it. I've been waiting for an EV 4x4 for years now; hoping the 6th generation of 4runners has it as an option.


Having individual electric motors per wheel is actually less efficient than having just 1 or 2 motors driving 4 wheels by default - although some vehicles that aren't focused on efficiency could definitely benefit from this setup.

Tesla's new Plaid mode Model S will have a third motor and make the car capable of 0-60 in just 2 seconds.

I expect most vehicles will turn away from high speed and top speed and focus on efficiency.
 

Mister_K

Posts: 2,080   +779
Synthetic fuels are an alternative. Personally, I‘d say it‘s even preferable to EV as existing infrastructure and vehicles can be used and all this without the environmental damage from either battery production or the petroleum industry processes.

Would the synthetic fuel not still exhaust CO2 or other toxic waste? I think going the electric route (maybe Hydrogen) might have benefits in far future, who knows what other innovation will come from focusing on EVs. But that's a what if and we can all make guesses.