Which graphics card should I get for my PC?

Jurassic4096 said:
If you've ever seen this string of numbers in RAM details (ie 5-5-5-15 DDR2 timings or 7-8-7-24 DDR3 timings), the first number is your CAS latency. This is the most important number to look at when buying RAM. the lower the better, but you dont have to get the absolute lowest, so don't try too hard for that if it means higher cost. I know you're not building a monster machine.
Click to expand...
The memory latency explanation is a bit misleading, unless you explain that higher speed RAM by nature, has higher latency numbers.

DDR-400Mhz, has a latency of about 2.5, whereas DDR-3 1333Mhz, has latencies of 8 or 9. It's all good, as long as you remember to compare apples to apples, and oranges to oranges.
 
Atham said:
I have a DDR-3, but I don't know about the MHz

Now, on this page is the list of the GTX 550 TIs

Which one should I get from the list?

Page: http://www.alza.sk/graficke-karty/dle-vyuziti/herni/nvidia/geforce-gtx550-ti/18852551.htm

Thanks
Click to expand...

Don't worry about memory until you can afford at least a 2.8GHz triple or quad core CPU, and a 1333MHz or higher dual channel memory kit.

What 550 Ti should you get?... easy, the Zotac. If overclocked 550's are anything like the 560's, then the 100MHz overclock over reference you get with the Zotac should give you some good gains, and save you from overclocking it yourself. And considering how underpowered your system is right now, you can use all the help you can get! If you could of afforded the 560 Ti, i'd say buy reference and overclock it yourself, because at reference (stock), it's already a beast.

Don't forget the power supply. That Corsair Builder CX500/600 has your name on it!
 
Regarding the "multiple 12v Rail" debate: I deal with this constantly on a day by day basis for customer builds and have delved into it thoroughly

Here is the best explanation for the "single vs Multiple rail 12v PSU" debate. Its from JonnyGuru.com (they know what they are talking about)

From:
JonnyGuru.com
Ok... What's the bottom line?


The bottom line is, for 99% of the folks out there single vs. multiple +12V rails is a NON ISSUE. It's something that has been hyped up by marketing folks on BOTH SIDES of the fence. Too often we see mis-prioritized requests for PSU advice: Asking "what single +12V rail PSU should I get" when the person isn't even running SLI! Unless you're running a plethora of Peltiers in your machine, it should be a non-issue assuming that the PSU has all of the connectors your machine requires and there are no need for "splitters" (see Example 1 in the previous bullet point).

The criteria for buying a PSU should be:
Does the PSU provide enough power for my machine?
Does the PSU have all of the connectors I require (6-pin for high end PCIe, two 6-pin, four 6-pin or even the newer 8-pin PCIe connector)?
If using SLI or Crossfire, is the unit SLI or Crossfire certified (doesn't matter if a PSU is certified for one or the other as long as it has the correct connectors. If it passed certification for EITHER that means it's been real world tested with dual graphics cards in a worst case scenario).
Click to expand...

http://www.jonnyguru.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3990

The long and short of it <<< pun intended.....It's the quality of the PSU and procuring ample amperage/wattage, not the rail count.
 
red1776 said:
Regarding the "multiple 12v Rail" debate: I deal with this constantly on a day by day basis for customer builds and have delved into it thoroughly

Here is the best explanation for the "single vs Multiple rail 12v PSU" debate. Its from JonnyGuru.com (they know what they are talking about)

From:
JonnyGuru.com


http://www.jonnyguru.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3990

The long and short of it <<< pun intended.....It's the quality of the PSU and procuring ample amperage/wattage, not the rail count.
Click to expand...

If I'm helping someone, I'm gonna recommend single rail PSU's. I always think long term, and not for the moment. Are multi's crap? No, but I won't recommend them first. I certainly wouldn't tell someone to go single if it meant spending an unreasonable amount over a multi just to get it. No matter what johnnyGURU said, I've read at least 3 sites that said the opposite. No matter what, the single rail will always be the most reliable and most compatible with your hardware.

PC P&C said in a MaximumPC article at the same time of your johnnyG article (2008), that single rail is the future. They gave the same reasons I said in my earlier post about it. I'm not 100% against multi's, but I'm gonna side with a big name and well respected manufacturer (and others) over some guy with a website. SLi/Crossfire or not.

http://www2.maximumpc.com/article/single_rail_versus_multi_rail_power_supplies
 
Hi Jurassic,
A few observations here:
Firstly, you state that :
PC P&C said in a MaximumPC article at the same time of your johnnyG article (2008),
Click to expand...

That is not the case, the Maximum PC article was posted a full year prior to the JonnyGuru article. (March 28th 2007)
Date line from JonnyGuru article:
03-28-2008 jonnyGURU Site Founder
Click to expand...
Date line from Maximum PC article:
Posted 03/26/2007 at 4:54pm
Click to expand...

Secondly, you state;
PC P&C said in a MaximumPC article at the same time of your johnnyG article (2008), that single rail is the future.
Click to expand...

The Maximum PC article says nothing of the sort. The entire (and very brief article) Gives no facts based of its own testing. In fact, it does nothing more than re-state each sides "spin" on which is better (single rail or multiple rail)

From the Maximum PC article:
Which design philosophy is better? I won’t draw any conclusions here but I can give you each side’s spin on the issue.
Click to expand...

....and ends with this conclusion:
The practical upshot, if both have done their homework on their PSU designs, is both will work
Click to expand...

Thirdly you state as reasons for your decision and recommendation.
but I'm gonna side with a big name and well respected manufacturer (and others) over some guy with a website.
Click to expand...

Okay, however not only is JonnyGuru the only one here that has given and done hands on testing to the debated point here, but "the guy with a website" is the one with the SunMoon SM-8800 load tester , the USB oscilloscope, and the electrical engineer doing the testing.

4)
you stated:
I've read at least 3 sites that said the opposite. No matter what, the single rail will always be the most reliable and most compatible with your hardware.
Click to expand...

I find it very hard to believe that three "respected " sites would make such a crass statement that anything electronic will always be the best solution.

The problem here is, you have offered only an article that does nothing more than summarize the (as maximum PC says itself) "spin" from two manufacturers, and come to the same conclusion as the article I posted.
 
Oh no a year difference? Because technology never changes in a year right? Johnny has some testers? Well, manufacturers have... FACTORIES, R&D, Investors... Let me know when johnny boy has all that...

Maximum Article:
As the sole PSU vendor pushing a single rail design for big PSU’s, PC Power and Cooling’s argument is quite intriguing. Even though the company once also pushed a multi/split rail design, the company has since decided that the single rail is the future.

The problem with multi-rails, the company says, is that power tends to get stuck on the individual rails. If the PSU, for example, allocates 36 amps of power from rail 1 and 2 to the CPU but the processors only consume 22 amps – the rest cannot be reallocated to the GPU or hard drive array. With a single-rail design, if the CPUs only use 22 amps of juice, the rest can be sent to the GPUs or whatever else needs the 12 volt power because it all comes from a single bucket of power.

BTW, show me where it says single rail PSU's have a higher failure rate, then you can talk **** and keep holding onto that article from some guy three years ago... yes... three.
 
red1776 said:
Hi Jurassic,
A few observations here:
Firstly, you state that :


That is not the case, the Maximum PC article was posted a full year prior to the JonnyGuru article. (March 28th 2007)
Date line from JonnyGuru article:

Date line from Maximum PC article:


Secondly, you state;


The Maximum PC article says nothing of the sort. The entire (and very brief article) Gives no facts based of its own testing. In fact, it does nothing more than re-state each sides "spin" on which is better (single rail or multiple rail)

From the Maximum PC article:


....and ends with this conclusion:


Thirdly you state as reasons for your decision and recommendation.


Okay, however not only is JonnyGuru the only one here that has given and done hands on testing to the debated point here, but "the guy with a website" is the one with the SunMoon SM-8800 load tester , the USB oscilloscope, and the electrical engineer doing the testing.

4)
you stated:


I find it very hard to believe that three "respected " sites would make such a crass statement that anything electronic will always be the best solution.

The problem here is, you have offered only an article that does nothing more than summarize the (as maximum PC says itself) "spin" from two manufacturers, and come to the same conclusion as the article I posted.
Click to expand...


LOL, for someone so "educated" on the subject, its funny you're asking me to find more sources, and all you've done is refer to a JohnnyGuru article from three years ago in a forum from some guy with a tester and website.
 
What I've heard, is that most multi-rail power supplies only have a single source, with multiple wires in parallel for multiple rails.
 
I'm still waiting for someone to say single rails are proven to be more dangerous than multi. But they won't say that, because it's not true.
 
Jurassic4096 said:
LOL, for someone so "educated" on the subject, its funny you're asking me to find more sources, and all you've done is refer to a JohnnyGuru article from three years ago in a forum from some guy with a tester and website.
Click to expand...

1) I defy you to point to where I "asked you to find more sources".



2) of course I pointed to the Jonny Guru article....I agree with it....BTW....so does the article you pointed out :) The difference being (one more time) the author of your article says rather plainly that it is merely re-stating the "spin" of the manufacturers.

BTW, show me where it says single rail PSU's have a higher failure rate, then you can talk **** and keep holding onto that article from some guy three years ago... yes... three.
Click to expand...

That might be the dumbest thing I have seen here in several months. I have no intention in demonstrating that single rails have a higher failure rate....I never said, or implied that they did. again would you like to show me where exactly I did?

three years ago... yes... three.
Click to expand...
[/QUOTE]

Uhhh, yeah...and your article is four years old...whoopie! That has nothing to with what i wrote , which was very clear:

You wrote:
PC P&C said in a MaximumPC article at the same time of your johnnyG article (2008),
Click to expand...
I wrote:
That is not the case, the Maximum PC article was posted a full year prior to the JonnyGuru article. (March 28th 2007)
Click to expand...

The Maximum PC article was not out at the same time as the Guru article...Fact!




Just for you...this is the only thing I wrote on the subject:

The long and short of it <<< pun intended.....It's the quality of the PSU and procuring ample amperage/wattage, not the rail count.
Click to expand...

then you can talk ****
Click to expand...

once more..where was the **** talk? My response was very polite, measured , and reasoned. Do you tell people to ****off when they say "have a nice day" to you?

"show me where single rails have a higher failure rate.....Asking you to point to more sources...**** talk.....

Are you sure you are even responding to me??? I said none of that. You really just choose to ignore what is actually being debated/written and respond to whatever you want don't you?

BTW, Every manufacturer of single rail PSU's say that it is superior, every manufacturer of Multi-rail says its better. I wonder why you chose to buy into that side of the spin?.... I wonder if it's because YOU have a single rail PSU???

From your article:
Which design philosophy is better? I won't draw any conclusions here but I can give you each sides spin on the issue.
Click to expand...

*pets his single 66A*
Click to expand...

I have no doubt you are kid.

****edit
From above:
I'm still waiting for someone to say single rails are proven to be more dangerous than multi. But they won't say that, because it's not true.
Click to expand...

who is this invisible opposition you are fighting against ?:haha:
Nobody has said that...I have not said that. :haha:
 
red1776 said:
1) I defy you to point to where I "asked you to find more sources".



2) of course I pointed to the Jonny Guru article....I agree with it....BTW....so does the article you pointed out :) The difference being (one more time) the author of your article says rather plainly that it is merely re-stating the "spin" of the manufacturers.



That might be the dumbest thing I have seen here in several months. I have no intention in demonstrating that single rails have a higher failure rate....I never said, or implied that they did. again would you like to show me where exactly I did?
Click to expand...

Uhhh, yeah...and your article is four years old...whoopie! That has nothing to with what i wrote , which was very clear:

You wrote:

I wrote:


The Maximum PC article was not out at the same time as the Guru article...Fact!




Just for you...this is the only thing I wrote on the subject:





once more..where was the **** talk? My response was very polite, measured , and reasoned. Do you tell people to ****off when they say "have a nice day" to you?

"show me where single rails have a higher failure rate.....Asking you to point to more sources...**** talk.....

Are you sure you are even responding to me??? I said none of that. You really just choose to ignore what is actually being debated/written and respond to whatever you want don't you?

BTW, Every manufacturer of single rail PSU's say that it is superior, every manufacturer of Multi-rail says its better. I wonder why you chose to buy into that side of the spin?.... I wonder if it's because YOU have a single rail PSU???

From your article:




I have no doubt you are kid.

****edit
From above:


who is this invisible opposition you are fighting against ?:haha:
Nobody has said that...I have not said that. :haha:[/QUOTE]

LMAO. i love this forum. Glad to be aboard. ;)
 
Heaven forbid i start a thread asking if leaving my computer on all day will do harm. I can see that as a 10 pager at least.

Hey, why don't you go back to what i said to Atham earlier about memory. There should be enough there for you to keep this going, even tho the guy I was helping has seemed to have left, but you don't care about helping anyone. The past two pages proves that. Anyways, PSU manufacturers sell both single and multi. When you find evidence that single rail is proven worse than multi's, let me know... that is if you can find where JohnnyNobody says it is.
 
red1776 said:
Hi Jurassic,
A few observations here:
Firstly, you state that :


That is not the case, the Maximum PC article was posted a full year prior to the JonnyGuru article. (March 28th 2007)
Date line from JonnyGuru article:

Date line from Maximum PC article:


Secondly, you state;


The Maximum PC article says nothing of the sort. The entire (and very brief article) Gives no facts based of its own testing. In fact, it does nothing more than re-state each sides "spin" on which is better (single rail or multiple rail)

From the Maximum PC article:


....and ends with this conclusion:


Thirdly you state as reasons for your decision and recommendation.


Okay, however not only is JonnyGuru the only one here that has given and done hands on testing to the debated point here, but "the guy with a website" is the one with the SunMoon SM-8800 load tester , the USB oscilloscope, and the electrical engineer doing the testing.

4)
you stated:


I find it very hard to believe that three "respected " sites would make such a crass statement that anything electronic will always be the best solution.

The problem here is, you have offered only an article that does nothing more than summarize the (as maximum PC says itself) "spin" from two manufacturers, and come to the same conclusion as the article I posted.
Click to expand...

My Article: PC P&C said in a MaximumPC article at the same time of your johnnyG article (2008), that single rail is the future.

Some weirdo: The Maximum PC article says nothing of the sort. The entire (and very brief article) Gives no facts based of its own testing. In fact, it does nothing more than re-state each sides "spin" on which is better (single rail or multiple rail)

My Article: As the sole PSU vendor pushing a single rail design for big PSU’s, PC Power and Cooling’s argument is quite intriguing. Even though the company once also pushed a multi/split rail design, the company has since decided that the single rail is the future.


Are you sure you can read? Where does it say MaximumPC said that? Are you capable of reading a whole paragraph? To top it all off, you seem to think every website that talks about hardware, also has to test it? Is that because that is what Johnny did one time in a FORUM?

PS, don't you think all those hard enters' make you look uneducated?
Nevermind, THIS statement makes you look uneducated: "Okay, however not only is JonnyGuru the only one here that has given and done hands on testing to the debated point here..."
 
Comments on system #1
i wondered what crysis would look like @ 300fps looked like lol

Um...The same as 60? LMAO

Is that english, and do you even read what you write?
...look like @ 300fps looked like... WOW

PS, stop staring into those LED's, it's not helping.
 
Anandtech

It's important to have one 12V rail supply the CPU with power and the second rail for the PCI-E slots and 6-pin connector. Unfortunately, many companies make a tremendous mistake when it comes to power distribution. We have seen several power supplies that use one 12V rail for the 6-pin PEG connector and then a second 12V rail for the CPU and 24-pin ATX connector. That means if you have a graphics card that doesn't include a 6-pin jack, both the CPU and GPU will use the same 12V rail for power. In this case, the second 12V rail goes completely unused, and users risk drawing too much current on the remaining 12V rail. In addition, how much power a GPU draws from the 6-pin connector and how much it takes from the PEG slot varies.

Checking the labels of the entry-level units, we see that our selected power supplies should all have no difficulty running any of the above GPUs. Power supplies like the Corsair VX450W that has a single 12V rail have the advantage of being able to fully utilize the rated 33A.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/2624/8


AMMO FOR DAYS!
 
wikiHow

Check the number of rails. Just as your house's fuse box includes both a large main breaker and a smaller circuit breaker per circuit to ensure the smaller-branch circuit wires do not overheat, high-capacity PSUs divide their output into multiple "rails," each with a smaller current limit. The relevant safety standard requires a 20A limit, which is quite generous, given that the wires are smaller than those used in your house to carry 15A. (But there's the advantage that the wires aren't hidden in walls, so they're cooled better, and you'll smell it if something starts burning.) This, however, makes connecting the PSU more complex; in addition to not overloading it overall, you have to avoid overloading each rail, or it will shut down. A good power supply will make that easy by providing rails totalling much more than the total PSU rating. A cheaper alternative is to provide just enough rails to total the overall capacity, which makes it difficult to use all of a power supply's capacity. (This may be a clue that the PSU is incapable of delivering its full-rated capacity.) An even cheaper alternative, which has become quite popular, is to eliminate all of the safety circuitry and produce a "single-rail" power supply that can deliver all of its output on any wire. This is technically in violation of the ATX-power-supply specification but has not proved to be a safety problem in practice, and is preferred by many people. A single-rail design isn't itself a sign of a low-quality PSU.

http://www.wikihow.com/Buy-a-Power-Supply

... AND DAYS!
 
Couldn't you use the edit button instead of serially posting all this "valuable information" which BTW, really doesn't have much to do with the original topic.

Lest we forget, "which graphics card should I buy"?
 
captaincranky said:
Couldn't you use the edit button instead of serially posting all this "valuable information" which BTW, really doesn't have much to do with the original topic.

Lest we forget, "which graphics card should I buy"?
Click to expand...

Well, if you go back two pages, you would see where i was helping him with a graphics card and a PSU to go with it. It's these fellows that started on me about single and multi rail PSU's, just like you did with the memory latency. So yea Atham is gone, and we'll never know if he got the help he came here for (not a latency or multi rail PSU war), or left because of the arguing.

Next time i see someone in need, i'll email them one on one instead, and avoid another travesty like this one.
 
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