Dell can't ship Alienware PCs to certain US states due to newly adopted power consumption...

gamerk2

Posts: 585   +488
LOL!

By the time the electric car boondoggle is realized in these states, you won't be able to power a smart watch over power consumption concerns.

Elec cars require about 30kWh of charge per 100 miles. It takes roughly 1lb of coal to produce 1kWh. So 30lbs of coal for 100 miles in an elec car.

The average vehicle in the US gets 25mpg. 4 gallons to get 100 miles.

Hmmm, 30lbs of coal vs 4 gallons of gasoline (24.4lbs).

Oh, and the average home in the US uses 29kWh of elec per day. (without juicing up an elec car).

Some obvious points you are missing here:

1: You ignore the cost of extracting coal [both the immediate mining cost and the other longer-term costs involved in cleanup, healthcare for miners, and so on]

2: You ignore the energy cost of extracting, transporting, refining, and transporting (again) oil into usable gasoline. I'm reasonably certain that energy cost exceeds 30 Kw/h per 4 gallons.

3: The majority of the grid is ALREADY renewables. And it's holding together fine. Same with countries where upwards of 80% of the grid is renewable.
 

Austinturner

Posts: 271   +320
Yeah, talk about quality reporting. Far be it for a journalist to actually read the legislation in question or do any research beyond reading articles on other tech sites.
And the tech site they reported it from states the reason pretty clearly (The Reg is pretty reputable!), I don’t know why the key detail didn’t make the cut over here.
 

Xex360

Posts: 132   +164
They are not saving the planet. They are helping to save the planet.
The planet doesn't need saving, we are just making our lives worse, otherwise earth doesn't care when the human race disappears, life will certainly just continue, well till the sun dies that is.
 

bexwhitt

Posts: 550   +237
The USA average household electricity consumption kWh per day is 28.9 kWh in Europe it's less than 10 kWh get a brain morans
 

Bobbydpue

Posts: 218   +145
The USA average household electricity consumption kWh per day is 28.9 kWh in Europe it's less than 10 kWh get a brain morans
Europe is not the same place as the US. The people are different and more important, to this conversation, the temperatures are different.

What's the average temperature and humidity in Europe? What's the high for Germany today? Oh it's 26c. Right now as I'm writing this It's 30c in Arizona at 0300 in the morning. It will be 40c around mid day. In Texas the high today is 33 degrees with >80% humidity. The cost of electricity in Arizona is $0.12 per kWh in California it's around $0.20 and in Germany it's around $0.30. In Arizona it costs $110 a month for electricity. AC uses a lot of power, but it's a cost people are willing to pay to not have their homes be saunas all the time.

These rules don't make any sense in areas promoting electric cars which use thousands of times the energy as a computers at idle each day also the rules don't actually reduce how much electricity is used only the type of computer you can buy as a pre-built. High powered computer from an SI is perfectly legal. Also you misspelled "morons" and you are being toxic.
 
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Bobbydpue

Posts: 218   +145
Some obvious points you are missing here:

1: You ignore the cost of extracting coal [both the immediate mining cost and the other longer-term costs involved in cleanup, healthcare for miners, and so on]

2: You ignore the energy cost of extracting, transporting, refining, and transporting (again) oil into usable gasoline. I'm reasonably certain that energy cost exceeds 30 Kw/h per 4 gallons.

3: The majority of the grid is ALREADY renewables. And it's holding together fine. Same with countries where upwards of 80% of the grid is renewable.

The majority of the grid in the US is not renewables and I don't know where you got that information from.

"In 2020, renewable energy sources accounted for about 12% of total U.S. energy consumption and about 20% of electricity generation."

People who promote electric car adoption are not promoting to expand the power infrastructure. Once a significant number cars in the US are electric there is going to be a big issue with power production. Only 2% of cars sold in the US over the past few years were electric. If there are issues providing enough power now what happens when 10% of cars are electric and everyone starts charging their cars around the same time each night.
 

Ren128

Posts: 22   +14
I don't understand how the system on the left with Ryzen 5600x (65w) and GTX 1660 Super (125w) is banned. I mean that's barely mid-range as far as power consumption goes.

 

gamerk2

Posts: 585   +488
People who promote electric car adoption are not promoting to expand the power infrastructure. Once a significant number cars in the US are electric there is going to be a big issue with power production. Only 2% of cars sold in the US over the past few years were electric. If there are issues providing enough power now what happens when 10% of cars are electric and everyone starts charging their cars around the same time each night.
The power infrastructure will naturally expand to meet demand; that's the entire point of Capitalism after all.
 

scavengerspc

Posts: 1,580   +1,593
TechSpot Elite
The planet doesn't need saving, we are just making our lives worse, otherwise earth doesn't care when the human race disappears, life will certainly just continue, well till the sun dies that is.
I can see right now evidence of our misuse all around us, but that is another topic. But either way, please also take into account the air and water statement I made earlier.

If you are looking for another bullet point the anti EV\renewable energy crowd misses, then just consider that surveys of EV owners don't say anything about "saving the planet" as the top reason they bought an electric vehicle, as the lesser educated on this subject claim. A little over 60% of them state reducing pollution to help clean the water and air as their #1 reason.

Just something else for the anti-everythings to consider, the second most popular reason they state is a massive reduction in operating cost and near zero maintenance.
 
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scavengerspc

Posts: 1,580   +1,593
TechSpot Elite
Some obvious points you are missing here:

1: You ignore the cost of extracting coal [both the immediate mining cost and the other longer-term costs involved in cleanup, healthcare for miners, and so on]

2: You ignore the energy cost of extracting, transporting, refining, and transporting (again) oil into usable gasoline. I'm reasonably certain that energy cost exceeds 30 Kw/h per 4 gallons.

3: The majority of the grid is ALREADY renewables. And it's holding together fine. Same with countries where upwards of 80% of the grid is renewable.
Just one point. Renewables are now slightly more used than coal now (21%) but natural gas is the most common source (41%.) Not clean energy for sure but a huge jump from coal.

 
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scavengerspc

Posts: 1,580   +1,593
TechSpot Elite
The USA average household electricity consumption kWh per day is 28.9 kWh in Europe it's less than 10 kWh get a brain morans
As mentioned earlier, we have far, far greater weather driven power use needs than the others. I live in Arkansas and over 60% of our power usage is from June to mid September. High heat, but tropical humidity.

And get a spelling dictionary or word checker. It does not help your case when you call someone a ***** and then misspell it.
 
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Austinturner

Posts: 271   +320
Truthfully, I'm pretty sure I know why.
I’ll give the author the benefit of the doubt and assume the best case which is that: they were having a bad day, their editor was on their case and they didn’t have time to read the article on The Reg, understand it, then look up the regulation to check what it meant, contact Dell for comment and then write an informed news article.
 

Scrye74

Posts: 51   +84
Some obvious points you are missing here:

1: You ignore the cost of extracting coal [both the immediate mining cost and the other longer-term costs involved in cleanup, healthcare for miners, and so on]

2: You ignore the energy cost of extracting, transporting, refining, and transporting (again) oil into usable gasoline. I'm reasonably certain that energy cost exceeds 30 Kw/h per 4 gallons.

3: The majority of the grid is ALREADY renewables. And it's holding together fine. Same with countries where upwards of 80% of the grid is renewable.

I'll respond, in kind.

1: You ignore the cost of extracting materials for the batteries. The slave labor used and what those toxic materials are doing to the environment.

2: I am not ignoring any of that nor am I ignoring the many other useful products that are extracted from oil during the refining process. I hope you are enjoying the plastics in your computer.

3: I don't know where you get that idea. Please go back to researching that. Additionally, California routinely has brownouts and blackouts just trying to provide power to homes. Which, as I said, use less that 30kWh of elec on average per day. If, to replace 4 gallons of gasoline, normally distributed by a gas station, requires 30kWh from the grid, multiply that times the number of gallons pumped out of a singe gas station in a day. Then multiply that by number of gas stations in the state.

Do you really know what that would look like? Let me help you... A single power station generates about 14,000kWh per day. The typical gas station sells about 4000 gallons per day. That's 30,000kWh to replace that with elec. By my calc, that's two power plants per gas station.
 

Austinturner

Posts: 271   +320
Do you really know what that would look like? Let me help you... A single power station generates about 14,000kWh per day. The typical gas station sells about 4000 gallons per day. That's 30,000kWh to replace that with elec. By my calc, that's two power plants per gas station.
Not getting into your argument, but are you talking base load power plants? A US coal/ nuclear/ hydro plant could be producing 10,000,000 to 50,000,000kwh/ day
 

Scrye74

Posts: 51   +84
Just one point. Renewables are now slightly more used than coal now (21%) but natural gas is the most common source (41%.) Not clean energy for sure but a huge jump from coal.


So instead, it takes 1000 cubic feet of natural gas to produce a single kWh. And we will still be processing that oil for the many other products produced. Fun fact: Gasoline used to be a byproduct of the oil refining process and was initially discarded.

Ironically, I am all for electric vehicles. When the technology (cleaner battery materials with more storage) and the infrastructure are ready. States like California love to talk a big game but they are comically unprepared to support even the electric vehicles on their roads now.
 

Scrye74

Posts: 51   +84
Not getting into your argument, but are you talking base load power plants? A US coal/ nuclear/ hydro plant could be producing 10,000,000 to 50,000,000kwh/ day

I was thinking much smaller. I thought it ridiculous to look at the average output of giant base load plants. More along the lines of smaller power generating stations typically used for peak generating. I didn't want to get into the real estate needed for larger plants.
 

Austinturner

Posts: 271   +320
I was thinking much smaller. I thought it ridiculous to look at the average output of giant base load plants. More along the lines of smaller power generating stations typically used for peak generating. I didn't want to get into the real estate needed for larger plants.
Ok, I still think of gas peaking plants generally in the 500MW capacity range
 

Xex360

Posts: 132   +164
I can see right now evidence of our misuse all around us, but that is another topic. But either way, please also take into account the air and water statement I made earlier.

If you are looking for another bullet point the anti EV\renewable energy crowd misses, then just consider that surveys of EV owners don't say anything about "saving the planet" as the top reason they bought an electric vehicle, as the lesser educated on this subject claim. A little over 60% of them state reducing pollution to help clean the water and air as their #1 reason.

Just something else for the anti-everythings to consider, the second most popular reason they state is a massive reduction in operating cost and near zero maintenance.
What are on about.
I don't disagree, I encourage clean energy like nuclear, solar... Etc, cleaner transportation, reasonable use of natural resources), but please don't be arrogant and pretend to be morally superior, you are not saving the planet, what we are doing is just a selfish desire to live in a favourable environment for humans.