Father of AMD's Zen architecture says Zen 5 will offer massive performance gains

DragonSlayer101

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Something to look forward to: During its last Financial Analyst Day in June 2022, AMD announced that it was looking at a 2024 debut for its Zen 5 processors. While the company is yet to publish any official Zen 5 benchmarks, we now have unofficial projections about its performance and other metrics from a reputable insider.

Jim Keller, the man who spearheaded the development of AMD's Zen CPU architecture, has revealed some critical tidbits about the company's Zen 5 processors that are expected to launch next year. The revelations came during a keynote for university students in Bengaluru, India, and include details about the performance, clock speeds and power estimates of AMD's upcoming lineup.

Keller, who is currently the CEO of AI hardware firm Tenstorrent, was talking about the company's Ascalon processor cores and showed the comparative performance numbers for a range of data center CPUs including Intel's Sapphire Rapids, Amazon's Graviton 3 and Nvidia's Grace processors, alongside Zen 5.

Keller claimed that Ascalon will provide market-leading integer performance-per-watt, and predicted that Zen 5 will be 30 percent faster than Zen 4 in integer workloads. If that turns out to be accurate, it will be an impressive update, given that Zen 4 already delivered a 15 percent gain over Zen 3.

In terms of clock speeds, Keller said he expects the Zen 5 server chips to hit the 4 GHz mark, which could make them the first chips in their category to hit those speeds, depending on what Intel does with its Emerald Rapids lineup later this year. In comparison, the EPYC Genoa and Sapphire Rapids processors only go up to 3.7 GHz and 3.8 GHz, respectively.

Finally, Zen 5 chips are expected to be significantly more power efficient than their predecessors despite the increased frequencies and improved performance, thanks to a 4nm/3nm process node. Keller's data also suggests Zen 5 will emerge as the fastest enterprise-grade next-gen offering with 8.84 points in the SPEC CPU 2017 INT Rate benchmark. In comparison, Sapphire Rapids is expected to reach 7.45 points, Grace could hit 7.44 points, and Zen 4 could only notch 6.80 points.

It is worth noting here that Zen 5 performance numbers, frequencies and power estimates are Keller's projection rather than real-life benchmarks or even leaked specs. So take them with a pinch of salt as they are unlikely to be entirely accurate.

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I'm really excited for zen 5. I'm hoping they'll release a 32 core chip and get their 4 dim ram speed under control. I don't want to spend threadripper money as a hobbiest for 128gigs of ram and 32 cores. Wishful thinking, I know. I can't wait to see AMDs offerings and what Intel has to counter it. The 13 series of Intel chips has been relatively competitive so hopefully we'll get to see a good chip shootout. I'm supporting AM5 for my own reasons but I still recommend the 13600k for anyone building a PC
 
Hopefully AMD can bed ZEN 5 in nicely - if AMD is your flavour then maybe a cheaper M/B and the 76003D now.

But I'm prepared to wait - not sure of roadmap - but think Zen 5 will be good buy - Zen 6 etc going forward would need a lot of work and time . Does make you wonder about future of chip making - the entry barrier to this modular/chiclet- giant APU/SOCs - thankfully - think we will get tiny super powerful ARM/RISC V as another option.

The next decade is going to be exciting -diminishing returns on silicon with infinite design scope - vs new tech.
Still think with AI/Mathematicians there must be new computing tricks to be undiscovered.

We are still yet to create brains with all their synapses/variable strength connectors - with self generating/pruning etc - kind of get it with mega servers I suppose
 
Zen 5 sounds like a big improvement over Zen 4, butif Intel deliver on their claims of IPC uplifts for Meteor Lake and Arrow Lake, it still might not be enough from AMD. Also Arrow Lake will be vastly more efficient than Raptor Lake and Zen 5 does not appear to be much more efficient than Zen 4. I'm waiting for Arrow Lake before making any decision on upgrading next year. If I were buying now I'd get 7900 non X or 13700 non K.
 
Zen 5 sounds like a big improvement over Zen 4, butif Intel deliver on their claims of IPC uplifts for Meteor Lake and Arrow Lake, it still might not be enough from AMD. Also Arrow Lake will be vastly more efficient than Raptor Lake and Zen 5 does not appear to be much more efficient than Zen 4. I'm waiting for Arrow Lake before making any decision on upgrading next year. If I were buying now I'd get 7900 non X or 13700 non K.
What would be considered a better deal?
Intel Core i7-13700K, ASUS Z690-A Prime DDR5, G.Skill 32GB DDR5-6000 Kit, Computer Build Combo$781.96 SAVE $181.97
$599.99

or AMD Ryzen 9 7900X, ASUS B650E-F ROG Strix Gaming WiFi, G.Skill Flare X5 Series 32GB DDR5-6000 Kit, Computer Build Combo $862.96 SAVE $262.97
$599.99

although the 7900 non x fell to $399 it currently has no Combo deals that come close at Microcenter.
 
What would be considered a better deal?
Intel Core i7-13700K, ASUS Z690-A Prime DDR5, G.Skill 32GB DDR5-6000 Kit, Computer Build Combo$781.96 SAVE $181.97
$599.99

or AMD Ryzen 9 7900X, ASUS B650E-F ROG Strix Gaming WiFi, G.Skill Flare X5 Series 32GB DDR5-6000 Kit, Computer Build Combo $862.96 SAVE $262.97
$599.99

although the 7900 non x fell to $399 it currently has no Combo deals that come close at Microcenter.

Coin toss, but at least on AM5 you can upgrade to Zen 5 and if you run the 7900X in say 105W mode, it's power usage will be vastly better than the 13700K. What about a 13700 non K deal?
 
You should really state what you want to do with the PC before asking that question. You should also ask in the forums rather than in a review of Zen 5.
Exactly. If it's just for gaming anything i7/9 from the last 10 years is plenty.
 
You should really state what you want to do with the PC before asking that question. You should also ask in the forums rather than in a review of Zen 5.

Not OP, but disagree on the second part. It's a valid discussion point , to compare the price/perf of the current gen mainstream flagships , on a topic about the next gen. If people want to play gatekeeper and restrict scope of the discussion it will ultimately lead to a myopic view.
 
What would be considered a better deal?
Intel Core i7-13700K, ASUS Z690-A Prime DDR5, G.Skill 32GB DDR5-6000 Kit, Computer Build Combo$781.96 SAVE $181.97
$599.99

or AMD Ryzen 9 7900X, ASUS B650E-F ROG Strix Gaming WiFi, G.Skill Flare X5 Series 32GB DDR5-6000 Kit, Computer Build Combo $862.96 SAVE $262.97
$599.99

although the 7900 non x fell to $399 it currently has no Combo deals that come close at Microcenter.
It's a no-brainer. Zen 4 has rendered Raptor Lake obsolete, when Intel's horrendous power consumption and future m/board upgrade requirement are taken into account. Zen 5 will only make things worse for Intel.
 
Coin toss, but at least on AM5 you can upgrade to Zen 5 and if you run the 7900X in say 105W mode, it's power usage will be vastly better than the 13700K. What about a 13700 non K deal?
$399.99 SAVE $40.00
$359.99 no deals except this one same source.
You should really state what you want to do with the PC before asking that question. You should also ask in the forums rather than in a review of Zen 5.
I was responding to this
"If I were buying now I'd get 7900 non X or 13700 non K."
Also it's not a review. It's just a guesstimate of where Zen 5 performance might be. So instead of drooling at a cpu architecture a year from now I presented options with 1 actually able to upgrade to that same Zen5 cpu with am5 option I presented. So actually it's important for the community to know that AM5 today will allow you to upgrade to Zen 5 and possibly Zen 6. The response was relative to the content and not off topic!
 
It's a valid discussion point , to compare the price/perf of the current gen mainstream flagships , on a topic about the next gen. If people want to play gatekeeper and restrict scope of the discussion it will ultimately lead to a myopic view.
I wasn't trying to play "gatekeeper", I was simply trying to guide the OP to a place where he'd get a better response. If the user is after a gaming PC then they'd probably do better with the 7800x3d as it offers better performance, better value and more upgradability in the future. If they're after a PC to run certain applications then they'd do better by saying what the applications are as certain applications do better on certain brands of processor. If GPU processing is available in the app then obviously GPU choice is also important. If they just want the best PC for bragging rights then I'd suggest they just get the bundle with the flashiest RGB lighting.
 
He might not be entirely accurate but I wouldn't take anything said by the father of Zen and AMD64 with a grain of salt. I don't think that there's a more knowledgeable silicon designer on the planet than Jim Keller.
 
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Zen 5 sounds like a big improvement over Zen 4, butif Intel deliver on their claims of IPC uplifts for Meteor Lake and Arrow Lake, it still might not be enough from AMD.
As the Spartans said to Philip of Macedon, "If".
Also Arrow Lake will be vastly more efficient than Raptor Lake
That's really not saying much, eh?
and Zen 5 does not appear to be much more efficient than Zen 4.
Why do you think so? Jim Keller seems to disagree and there are few, if any, whose word I would believe over his.
I'm waiting for Arrow Lake before making any decision on upgrading next year. If I were buying now I'd get 7900 non X or 13700 non K.
Well yeah, it would be foolish to do otherwise. It's always better to have more options than fewer.
 
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He might not be entirely accurate but I wouldn't take anything that the father of Zen and AMD64 with a grain of salt. I don't think that there's a more knowledgeable silicon designer on the planet than Jim Keller.
The timing seems well planned too right when they launch the 7800X3D this news break and we find out Raja is on their team. The tech press is running with this story though.
 
What would be considered a better deal?
Intel Core i7-13700K, ASUS Z690-A Prime DDR5, G.Skill 32GB DDR5-6000 Kit, Computer Build Combo$781.96 SAVE $181.97
$599.99

or AMD Ryzen 9 7900X, ASUS B650E-F ROG Strix Gaming WiFi, G.Skill Flare X5 Series 32GB DDR5-6000 Kit, Computer Build Combo $862.96 SAVE $262.97
$599.99

although the 7900 non x fell to $399 it currently has no Combo deals that come close at Microcenter.
Do not opt for a Z690 board if you're going to run a 13 gen cpu and DDR5. Go for the Z790 chipset due to the better memory controller.

https://pcpartpicker.com/product/8m6p99/msi-pro-z790-a-wifi-atx-lga1700-motherboard-pro-z790-a-wifi
MSI PRO Z790-A WIFI $239.99

 
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