Guinness reinstates Billy Mitchell's Donkey Kong and Pac-Man records

Rayneofpayne

Posts: 162   +179
Actually... it's the other way around in the real world... to get something "approved", you generally have to PROVE that it is real (see: innocent until PROVEN guilty).

Mitchell's record was "proven" back in a different age - when it was far easier to post fake stuff and have it believed...

After extensive investigations - which were carried out in PUBLIC - so that anyone interested could see the evidence / rationale, it was decided to strip Mitchell of his records....

Now, after closed-door negotiations, Guinness - who had generally deferred to Twin Galaxies before, decides to reinstate - but doesn't give any reason other than "there wasn't sufficient evidence to DISPROVE"....

If this was a criminal case, and Mitchell was attempting to prosecute a case, he'd be going down in flames.... but civil suits tend to simply "follow the money".... and there's a fair amount on the line here....
You are blantantly ignoring a simple fact, innocent until proven guilty does not exist anymore(Depp vs A.Heard, and many cases where mere implication can cause damage to where there is no justice), and even then by proving your innocence you are proving and challenging the district attorney's office as well as the police with whatever evidence is in dispute.

..and look as abrasive and unlikable as the guy is most of his records were set even before MAME existed. Is it possible he cheat sure, is it likely, well unless I dissect the evidence myself I reserve judgment, the guy was a jerk and made a lot of enemies that wanted to see him burn. And know a released online video is not proof, I need the original video unedited or possibly tampered with. In order to prove the allegations either true or false you have to attack both sides, doubt is not enough as you pointed out, and as I have stated either of way whether guilty or not, he has started paying for it.
 

Squid Surprise

Posts: 3,209   +2,104
You are blantantly ignoring a simple fact, innocent until proven guilty does not exist anymore(Depp vs A.Heard, and many cases where mere implication can cause damage to where there is no justice), and even then by proving your innocence you are proving and challenging the district attorney's office as well as the police with whatever evidence is in dispute.

..and look as abrasive and unlikable as the guy is most of his records were set even before MAME existed. Is it possible he cheat sure, is it likely, well unless I dissect the evidence myself I reserve judgment, the guy was a jerk and made a lot of enemies that wanted to see him burn. And know a released online video is not proof, I need the original video unedited or possibly tampered with. In order to prove the allegations either true or false you have to attack both sides, doubt is not enough as you pointed out, and as I have stated either of way whether guilty or not, he has started paying for it.
Um.... innocent until proven guilty exists in LAW.... reality is another thing altogether... we're talking about actual records here... "reality" is that no one should give a flying **** who's the best at any video game...

Same with the scientific community... you don't need to prove something WRONG - you need to prove something RIGHT. That's how science works... you need empirical evidence to support whatever claim you are making.... Hence, we know the Earth is round, not because it isn't flat (after all, maybe it's a cube?) - but because we actually have PROOF that it is round (like pictures from space).

And here, we have the conundrum...
1) The initial "claim" (Mitchell's world record(s)) - were "proven" back when it was far easier to present false evidence....

2) Now, we have more sophisticated methodology - and using it, we can cast doubt on Mitchell's proof.

3) But... We don't actually have 100% proof that Mitchell was cheating - but we don't have any real evidence that he WASN'T cheating.

4) Circumstantial evidence points to Mitchell being shady... but much like OJ's trial, that isn't enough to convict...

5) --->> BUT.... this isn't a trial... do we simply say that Mitchell has the record because of sketchy evidence provided decades ago?

6) Originally, Guinness AND Twin Galaxies had the same answer-- > NO!

7) Now, after Mitchell grabs a lawyer, Guinness changes its answer to YES!

---> So.... maybe Guinness thinks the world is flat too?
 

ZedRM

Posts: 342   +180
Mitchell's record was "proven" back in a different age - when it was far easier to post fake stuff and have it believed...
Except that there are a lot of people, myself included, who have seen him either get very close to or make those records. How you gonna fake things on a convention floor?
 

Squid Surprise

Posts: 3,209   +2,104
Except that there are a lot of people, myself included, who have seen him either get very close to or make those records. How you gonna fake things on a convention floor?
“Close to” and record are very different. No one is arguing that he was one of the best... the argument is whether he is the absolute best...
 

ZedRM

Posts: 342   +180
“Close to” and record are very different. No one is arguing that he was one of the best... the argument is whether he is the absolute best...
No, you and TG are arguing semantics. Guinness has weighed in and TG's own internal accusers have been shown to be less than honest and seem to have an agenda against Mitchell. Credibility and context are important. Twin Galaxies has lost some of both.
 

Squid Surprise

Posts: 3,209   +2,104
No, you and TG are arguing semantics. Guinness has weighed in and TG's own internal accusers have been shown to be less than honest and seem to have an agenda against Mitchell. Credibility and context are important. Twin Galaxies has lost some of both.
No... Guinness simply stated that they don’t have enough evidence to overturn a record they’d already overturned.... we don’t have any of their reasons, as they’ve refused to supply any...

Twin Galaxies, despite your nonsensical posts, posted al of their evidence in an open forum - and they stand by their decision.

Faced with the option of supporting a decision based on evidence or a decision CHANGED for no discernible reason, I know what I’d choose...
 

ZedRM

Posts: 342   +180
No... Guinness simply stated that they don’t have enough evidence to overturn a record they’d already overturned.... we don’t have any of their reasons, as they’ve refused to supply any...
You need to re-read the statement made by Guinness.
Twin Galaxies, despite your nonsensical posts, posted al of their evidence in an open forum - and they stand by their decision.
They don't have any evidence. They have observations, nothing more.
Faced with the option of supporting a decision based on evidence or a decision CHANGED for no discernible reason, I know what I’d choose...
Interesting statement.
 

Squid Surprise

Posts: 3,209   +2,104
You need to re-read the statement made by Guinness.

They don't have any evidence. They have observations, nothing more.

Interesting statement.
The observations include video EVIDENCE.... whether it conclusively proves that Mitchell's records were legit is obviously a matter of debate - which occurred in an open forum and both Twin Galaxies AND Guinness decided to strip them,

Only after Mitchell lawyered up did Guinness change their mind - and without giving any reasons other than "they didn't have enough evidence to overturn the original record."

Well, if they didn't have enough evidence to overturn it... why did they overturn it originally?

Clearly this is a matter of politics (and money) and the actual facts are no longer relevant.

To be fair, it's a stupid video game record from decades ago... still... since there ARE people who take it seriously, it's a shame to see it handled like this.