Intel Core i9-12900K Review: Alder Lake Arrives

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Shadowboxer

Posts: 2,071   +1,650
I don't see where he is lying Shadowboxer, let's look at the prices again, but I will remove the irrelevant CPUs/SKUs from the list.

Zen 2 MSRP

AMD Ryzen 9 3950X: $749 (about £570, AU$1,070)
  • AMD Ryzen 9 3900X: $499 (about £390, AU$720)
  • AMD Ryzen 7 3800X: $399 (about £310, AU$580)
  • AMD Ryzen 5 3600X: $249 (about £200, AU$360)
Zen 3 MSRP

AMD Ryzen 9 5950X: $799 (around £620, AU$1,100)
  • AMD Ryzen 9 5900X: $549 (around £420, AU$760)
  • AMD Ryzen 7 5800X: $449 (around £350, AU$630)
  • AMD Ryzen 5 5600X: $299 (around £230, AU$420)

That is indeed a $50 MSRP increase SKU to SKU, there is no lie there, that is fact. We compare SKU to SKU, otherwise it is like comparing an 12006K's launch MSRP to an 11400's launch MSRP, that would be incorrect, it is 12600k vs 11600k MSRP. AMD had no equivalents of the 3700X/3600 with the 5000 line, so 5000 does not have those SKU segments, it was not drastically increased MSRP compared to Ryzen 3000 equivalents, it was an $50 MSRP increase over 3000 equivalents.

And we look at MSRP prices, not retailer marked up prices, nor do we look at discount prices, as you said yourself to Steve in this very thread, we shouldn't use deals on Tuff X570 MBs in place of MSRP in these reviews, so then why are we comparing knocked down prices and deals on two year old Zen2 CPUs to new Zen3's launch MSRP? That is like comparing knocked down prices on old 10600k/11600k and saying Intel raised prices drastically because the 12600k is much more expensive by comparison. No, we don't do that, we compare 11600k MSRP launch prices to 12600k launch prices, same goes for AMD. And we don't compare compare retailer mark-ups to MSRP either, that is on the retailer, AMD didn't get any extra cash for retailer above MSRP markups, neither does Intel.

What retailers do with pricing after AMD and Intel have set MSRP has nothing to do with the official MSRP launch prices. So it makes no difference if retailers choose to sell them higher or lower priced even at their launch, it has nothing to do with the official launch MSRP prices set by Intel and AMD. So you cant compare an 3800X that sold somewhere (or even if it was everywhere) for under MSRP at launch for $300 and claim that shows the 5800X was drastically more expensive, because that $300 price had nothing to do with AMDs set MSRP, that's on the retailer, not AMD.

The official MSRP is the offical MSRP, no if's, and's, or buts. As far as AMD and Intel are concerned, the launch MSRP is what they should sell for at launch, any other prices retailers may charge has nothing to do with them, but supply and demand is usually at play here, so when stock is plentiful and demand can be met or exceeded, then prices tend to be lower (like we saw with 3000 series), and the inverse is also true, when supply is short and demand cannot be met (like we saw with 5000 series and now I am seeing it with the Intel 12900k as well), then prices tend to be higher.

But I digress, so official launch MSRP vs official launch MSRP it is, and SKU vs SKU it is, as it really should be of course when looking at launch prices of gen vs gen CPU/SKUs, same goes for Intel. And all publications also compare launch MSRP to launch MSRP when doing the same gen vs gen SKU vs SKU launch price comparison, as can be seen when publications took notice that AMD raised 5000 series prices by $50 per SKU compared to 3000 series, or when Intel does the same, and the same applies when launch MSRP prices are lower than previous gen with publications.

And on a side note, I don't think Steve is wrong for including deals that can be found (even more so when they are common enough), and I think it is also perfectly fine when Steve does the same thing for Intel, and I believe readers may have even taken advantage of some of the deals going around at the time thanks to Steve, and that would be a good thing. It's not about Intel vs AMD, it's about helping the readers, and that is a good thing.

And readers should in addition to looking for the deals shown here, also always look for deals themselves as well regardless of the platform they go with (check local and online, which is what I do), you can usually find good deals somewhere (at least as good as could be expected with the current market and it's numerous issues), so best to always check for oneself as well. Either way, you are of course entitled to your thoughts and opinion, and I will leave you to it.

To claim that Zen 3 only raised prices by $50 is an insulting bare faced lie. For a start the MSRPs you have listed are not correct. So please go back and check those numbers.

Just to be clear, there is about a $50 hike from the already overpriced XT Variants of the 3000 series. An example is the 3600X (MSRP $200), the 3600XT (MSRP $250) and 5600X (MSRP $300).

If you are unable to work out that the 5600X is a $100 more than a 3600X then you have big problems and there isnt much I can do for you...

Oh and here is the proof that the 3600X was only $200 and not the $250 you have falsely put:

https://www.techspot.com/review/1871-amd-ryzen-3600/
 

Strawman

Posts: 512   +266
@Steve

Just received my ddr5 last week, so I was able to test my 12900k. There is something going on with your coolers, my u12a keeps the CPU at 70 on cbr20, peaks at 77 on cbr23 10minute test. That's with the fans at 40% speed mind you. Ι need to run overclocked to 5.2ghz to hit the ~90's that you are getting with huge AIOS.

My guess is contact pressure or something, cause other than that the 12900k is one of the coolest CPU's I ever had.
 

poohbear

Posts: 681   +608
Was trying to find DDR4 vs DDR5 comparison tests and got this link to my favorite tech site! Thanks again for the thorough yet succinct insight on DDR4 vs DDR5 for Alder lake!
 
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