Taiwan says destroying TSMC in the event of a Chinese invasion is unnecessary

midian182

Posts: 8,482   +104
Staff member
In context: Once again, rising tensions between China and the US have put the spotlight on Taiwan and what would happen to TSMC, which manufactures more than half the world's semiconductors, in the event of an invasion. One proposal is to destroy the company's facilities, but the island's security chief said such a move is unnecessary.

Chen Ming-tong, director-general of Taiwan's National Security Bureau, told lawmakers (via Bloomberg) that TSMC's reliance on overseas companies and supplies for its operations means the facilities would be useless if China took over Taiwan.

"If you understand the ecosystem of TSMC, the comments out there are unrealistic," Chen said. "TSMC needs to integrate global elements before producing high-end chips. Without components or equipment like ASML's lithography equipment, without any key components, there is no way TSMC can continue its production."

The Biden administration is reportedly making more contingency plans for a hypothetical invasion of Taiwan by China and the potential impact on the world's chip supply. In July, Commerce Secretary Gina Raimondo warned that the US would face a "deep and immediate recession" if it were ever cut off from the Taiwanese chip manufacturing industry.

The US is said to be considering the evacuation of TSMC chip engineers in the event of a Chinese invasion, something the US National Security Council estimates would impact the world economy by more than $1 trillion. Former US officials have suggested making it clear to China that the semiconductor giant's facilities would be destroyed by the US if the attack occurred, thereby prevented TSMC from falling into Chinese hands.

When asked about the prospect of China taking over TSMC, Chen said, "Those war-gaming plans are just scenarios […] If they understood TSMC's ecosystem better, they would realize that it's not as simple as they think. That's why Intel can't catch up with TSMC."

"Even if China got a hold of the golden hen, it won't be able to lay golden eggs," he added.

This isn't the first time the prospect of TSMC being taken over by China has been addressed. Chairman Mark Liu said in August that the company's sophisticated manufacturing facilities depended on a real-time connection with the outside world, making TSMC useless in China's hands.

June brought news of a top Chinese economist urging China to seize TSMC if the US tightened sanctions, something it has done in the months since then; they include prohibiting Nvidia and AMD from selling high-end accelerators to Chinese customers. The restrictions, which the White House says are in place to prevent China from producing military systems including weapons of mass destruction, contributed to the Chinese semiconductor industry's largest-ever production decline in August.

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defaultluser

Posts: 522   +392
Ive been saying this for years - by the time china resolved the supply issues, tsmc will be a shell of its former self! You have to source chemicals, wafers from SUMCO and immersion euv tools from ASML ( constantly breaking because the light source is nuts)! And finally: when the fabs are done making wafers , you need to ship the chips to 3rd-party facilities o be packaged

assuming we see similar corporation cutoffs as we seen in Russia now, its going to take hall-a-decade to rebuild supply lines!
 
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merikafyeah

Posts: 359   +345
China's inability to get its own semiconductor industry to reach globally competitive capabilities of 10 years ago (let alone the current leading edge of TSMC) speaks volumes for how well a literal hostile takeover of Taiwan (and TSMC) would go.

 

Hodor

Posts: 418   +301
If China takes over TSMC it's possible we'll be able to buy new GPUs on AliExpress at 90% discount.

Sure, those versions won't be functioning all the time, but that's okay, because I don't play games all the time.
 

quadibloc

Posts: 383   +253
My computer runs on a Ryzen 9 3900X processor. That is made on an early 7nm process which does not involve EUV. Recently, a crypto mining chip made in China was found to be made on such a process. But even if the PRC could only make 14nm chips, that's what we were making do with... away back in 2017 or so. Although it still makes sense to prevent China from using the latest and greatest in its military equipment, we shouldn't harbor illusions that sanctions are going to make them incapable of fielding advanced weapons systems.
 

captaincranky

Posts: 19,285   +8,432
If the US actually had good leadership, we would not be having this discussion. Sadly, we're dealing with an administration devoid of brains and ability.
You should cut a big check to Trump's 2024 election "fund". You know what they say, "money talks, and Trump yells over it".

Besides, since he's an "undeclared candidate", he can do whatever he wants with it. Your shekels will go toward a "good cause"....> Fill in the blank <

Sorry, Freudian slip. I meant to say, "money talks, and bullsh!t walks". My bad.
 
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captaincranky

Posts: 19,285   +8,432
Who are we kidding here? This guy's just trying to save his own a**. He doesn't care who owns TSMC, and he's running his mouth to curry favor with the CCP in case they do invade. "In case of emergency or invasion, side with the winner"
 

PeekABo0

Posts: 6   +8
US protecting its assets, if it isn't obvious enough US doesn't care about Taiwan at all, just the semi industry to itself.
 

sorten

Posts: 182   +296
TechSpot Elite
You should cut a big check to Trump's 2024 election "fund". You know what they say, "money talks, and Trump yells over it".

Besides, since he's an "undeclared candidate", he can do whatever he wants with it. Your shekels will go toward a "good cause"....
Most likely his own legal fund. At this point his best defense is to get reelected and test the limits of Presidential power by pardoning himself.
 

captaincranky

Posts: 19,285   +8,432
US protecting its assets, if it isn't obvious enough US doesn't care about Taiwan at all, just the semi industry to itself.
Granted the US does care a lot about semiconductors, otherwise, we wouldn't have passed, "The Chips Act"

However, TSMC is building a fab in the US. IMO, with TSMC as a "US company",That sort of seems like a pretext for a "mutual defense pact"..

If it isn't, hope that they can get it up and running before/if China invades. Then, they can blow up the fab in Taiwan, and keep going on the US, albeit at reduced capacity. But, with the fab in the US, and shipping costs what they are, why would TSMC need to export them?

If you back up a bit, it's pretty much a "heads we win, tails China loses", situation.. Although, we do owe China quite a bit of money. OTOH, Most of our defense production in US based..So, in the event of a conflict, (assuming the TSMC fab is up and running), the first thing a US president should, would, or could, do, is invoke, "the war powers act".
 

captaincranky

Posts: 19,285   +8,432
Most likely his own legal fund. At this point his best defense is to get reelected and test the limits of Presidential power by pardoning himself.
Well, Trump most likely won't .pay his lawyers anyway. He hasn't in the past, nor his contractors, nor his taxes, etc, et al...Then there's the "poor billionaire's" broken airplane to be attended to. :rolleyes:..

So, what do you think about whether or not Taiwan should destroy TSMC's fabs, if China invades?

(Just trying to steer this back on topic)
 

AlaskaGuy

Posts: 744   +612
You should cut a big check to Trump's 2024 election "fund". You know what they say, "money talks, and Trump yells over it".

Besides, since he's an "undeclared candidate", he can do whatever he wants with it. Your shekels will go toward a "good cause"....> Fill in the blank <

Sorry, Freudian slip. I meant to say, "money talks, and bullsh!t walks". My bad.
Trump kept both China and Russia in check.
 

sorten

Posts: 182   +296
TechSpot Elite
So, what do you think about whether or not Taiwan should destroy TSMC's fabs, if China invades?
(Just trying to steer this back on topic)
I don't think it would be necessary, because if that attack occurs then the global economy and China's access to it ends immediately. But I'm sure that smarter people than I will make the final determination. It would be a trivial matter for the US to make TSMC disappear.
 

Bullwinkle M

Posts: 849   +767
So, what do you think about whether or not Taiwan should destroy TSMC's fabs, if China invades?

(Just trying to steer this back on topic)

I don't believe it is relevant whether China can use the equipment at TSMC after an invasion

It should be destroyed regardless

After all, it would cost very little to destroy the facilities and equipment when compared to what the final cost would be if China found a way to use everything intact

Stolen documentation and tortured engineers provide most of what is needed to find a use for such technology
 

umbala

Posts: 797   +1,598
If the US actually had good leadership, we would not be having this discussion. Sadly, we're dealing with an administration devoid of brains and ability.
Yes, bring back the orange bluster machine, those were good times... you know, when the entire world thought America was a laughing stock. Problems like these can only fixed by a psychotic blowhard proclaiming himself to be a stable genius.
 

umbala

Posts: 797   +1,598
Build Back Better legislation didn't get through Congress, so no money has been spent on it.
Don't waste your energy. People like that only believe what Faux News tells them and nothing you say can change their minds. They're the same people who still believe Obamacare was just a tax on white people so that black people can get free health care.
 

captaincranky

Posts: 19,285   +8,432
Trump kept both China and Russia in check.
Yeah right. Trump colluded with Putin. One even might say "kissed his a**".
I believe that Trump also added something north of 7 trillion to the debt, Givin' them rich folks tax cuts and all that.

Trump's "tariffs on China", are coming out of your pocket, every time you walk into Walmart. That's math a 5th grader should be able to solve. Apparently that's not true of a Trump supporter. Sure raise the prices on Chinese crap, and then blame inflation on solely Biden

I don't understand how a rational person could think of Trump as a "winner". "Douche bag" is more like it, a self absorbed psychopathic, malignant narcissistic, pathological liar of a douche bag at that.

If your so obsessed with that pipeline cancellation here's what you can do; buy a kayak, row out to somewhere in the Aleutians, wait for Trump to get reelected and sell the islands back to Russia There's plenty of oil in Russia, you would be as happy as a pig in slop. BTW, your precious oil companies turned in a record 50 billion dollars in profits during the so called, "gas shortage".

BTW, did Trump ever turn in his tax returns? Oh that's right, his primary source of income ATM is political contributions, which I think are tax deductible He's too busy trying to find lawyers to represent him to be bothered with such "trivial matters".

BTW, are you sure you're not in Russia already?.
 

umbala

Posts: 797   +1,598
Meanwhile the US has given over $100 billion in US taxpayer dollars to Ukraine, trillions of US taxpayer dollars spent on the Build Back Better scam while China is making moves on Taiwan and OPEC gave the current US President the middle finger when he begged the Saudis to ramp up production when he's shutting down oil & gas fields along with pipelines here in the US. Lest we forget about the wide open border with Mexico where the Cartels are making bank like never before off of child trafficking.
You covered everything except Hillary's e-mails, the Hunter Biden scandal, Democrats eating babies, Obama's birth certificate, and the border wall.
 

captaincranky

Posts: 19,285   +8,432
It should be destroyed regardless

After all, it would cost very little to destroy the facilities and equipment when compared to what the final cost would be if China found a way to use everything intact
And I agree, as evidenced by my post #9. This a**hole is trying to make himself seem "sympathetic", so he can avoid the torture chamber, should the invasion occur.

"Oh, you don't have to destroy that equipment, the Chinese won't be able to keep it running", my a**.