A grandfather died of a heart attack after minors swatted him over his rare Twitter handle

[captaincranky]

As for the rest of you suburban, middle class, armchair philosophers, and pseudo legal scholars,

I have a question, should we "defund the police", or maybe wake up a social worker in the middle of the night to knock on the door?

Other than the theoretical bullsh!t y'all are pumping out like so much sewage, maybe you should volunteer to be the ones to knock on that door first

You know, just so you're certain SWAT is behaving up to your ethical standards.

In this case the man who died, he.walked out of the house with a rifle, and SWAT held their fire..!. He later succumbed to natural causes, possibly to a preexisting condition

Does that make it right, hell no, but that's what happened.

This is the kind of sh!t storm that happens in the real world, not in your speculative fantasies. I suggest you take time out from mowing the lawn, and read it

Man Accused of Shooting 6 Philly Police Officers to Stay Jailed Until Trial

A man accused of shooting six police officers during an hourslong standoff last year in North Philadelphia will remain in jail as he awaits trial, a judge ruled.

www.nbcphiladelphia.com

 

[captaincranky]

I never said that they should not face consequences, Captain. That, respectfully, is your interpretation of what I said. I just said that the delinquents had no f'ing clue of the consequences, not to mention that they obviously had no understanding of right or wrong for whatever reason, and their sense of value is obviously misplaced.

Like I said, probably in a thread about crypto, that the people of today, (particularly the young), are laboring under the fantasy that what happens on the web is "real", and real life is the "illusion"..

A "reality check", needs to be delivered in the form of the prosecutor in the case needs to to "upgrade" the juvenile's status to that of an adult, and try him for involuntary manslaughter.

And let's face it, if you honestly don't know "right from wrong", by the time you're in your mid teens, you're a certifiable sociopath..

All this crew was thinking is, "we're going to get what we what, by whatever means necessary".

 

[seeprime]

Since I don't live in a cave somewhere in the mountains of Afghanistan, and have seen the cellphone video as many times as you have, I would appreciate if you wouldn;t lecture me about the whole sordid affair, and take this"

BTW, George Floyd's arrest, addiction, and incarceration records are all available online. Is this turd really who you want as "your poster boy"?

to be as it was intended, a rhetorical question.

Your name is well earned!

 

[captaincranky]

Your name is well earned!

I believe computer logic provides for "and" logic outcomes.

People have adopted "or" conclusions such as, "George Floyd is a martyr, and Derick Chauvin is a murderer. (I know I said "and" but the conclusion is really "or", based on the premise one statement is true, while the other, believing that Floyd was a completely innocent victim, is false.

IMO, the background truth lies between those two points of view:
George Floyd was a piece of crap, AND so is Derick Chauvin..

Besides, I shudder what to think it would be like to walk past a mural of Mr. Floyd on a daily basis. My only wish would be that Officer Chauvin had killed someone who was, shall we say, "a bit more photogenic".

If you think this event was justification for nationwide destruction and looting, IMO (again), you're sadly mistaken.

If you want to go through life believing that' it's impossible for black people to be "racist", or not to incite violence to their own benefits, rewards, interests, while advancing their own agenda, be my guest.

See, I'm not that "cranky" after all.

 

[wiyosaya]

Here's another option in the news https://news.yahoo.com/denver-pivot-police-gaining-popularity-122044701.html
Of course, because these SWATTing calls are taken at face value and police, since police, as of yet, still seem to think all calls like this are valid (even though there have been high profile cases that show this vulerability in police tactics), police just go in guns blazing. Under such circumstances, IMO, everyone is a target for some hot officer, guilty or not. Under those circumstances, the chances of a mistake are much, much, higher. But police still fall for bad pranks like this. Which, for me, is a WTF? moment.

 

[Xex360]

That's an argument currently being debated in the US since many police departments have had military equipment donated to them by the US Government. As an example, as I understand it, a SWAT team was sent after a group of Monks who had accidentally overstayed their Visa https://www.ketv.com/article/monks-arrested-in-swat-team-action/7601220
I don't think the problem is unique to the US, though, as SWAT teams have become prevalent all over the world.

Indeed, but I believe they are only called on extreme cases, the regular police is still doing its job.

 

[Norsiiii]

Here's another option in the news https://news.yahoo.com/denver-pivot-police-gaining-popularity-122044701.html
Of course, because these SWATTing calls are taken at face value and police, since police, as of yet, still seem to think all calls like this are valid (even though there have been high profile cases that show this vulerability in police tactics), police just go in guns blazing. Under such circumstances, IMO, everyone is a target for some hot officer, guilty or not. Under those circumstances, the chances of a mistake are much, much, higher. But police still fall for bad pranks like this. Which, for me, is a WTF? moment.

I still haven't seen any suggestions from you as to how exactly the police are supposed to determine whether a legitimate hostage/active situation exists or if it's a prank call without physically turning up at the address in question and operating on the basis that it vey well could be real....

 

[cliffordcooley]

I still haven't seen any suggestions from you as to how exactly the police are supposed to determine whether a legitimate hostage/active situation exists or if it's a prank call without physically turning up at the address in question and operating on the basis that it vey well could be real....

The entire situation can be handled without the first person entering the building.

1. Ask everyone to walk out with their hands up.
2. If they do not comply smoke/pepper spray them out of the building.
3. Then enter with firearms in air to establish no one else is in the building.

I understand the need in operating with caution. That doesn't mean operate without evidence as if everyone is a terrorist. People deserve better until they are proven guilty. If you can't see this. It only means you have not been mishandled yet.

 

[Norsiiii]

The entire situation can be handled without the first person entering the building.

1. Ask everyone to walk out with their hands up.
2. If they do not comply smoke/pepper spray them out of the building.
3. Then enter with firearms in air to establish no one else is in the building.

I understand the need in operating with caution. That doesn't mean operate without evidence as if everyone is a terrorist. People deserve better until they are proven guilty. If you can't see this. It only means you have not been mishandled yet.

Ok, I'm convinced now that you're either a troll, or are about 12 years old.

The idea that you'd simply go straight from yelling "Come out with your hands up!" to deploying smoke or pepper bombs when you get no response is absolutely absurd.

If there were a situation where somebody was having a medical episode such as, idk, a heart attack, maybe, after seeing squad cars pull up and geared up cops yelling "come out with your hands up", they're obviously going to be unable to come out with their hands up, aren't they, Einstein?

They will therefore, by your own genius solution above, end up being smoke bombed, pepper sprayed, and have guns pointed at them ANYWAY when the cops do finally go in to find the bloke collapsed on the floor.

I thought your whole genius idea was meant to stop that from ever happening?

You clearly have never actually bothered to think this through, yet you reckon you know better than police departments world wide...

 

[cliffordcooley]

Ok, I'm convinced now that you're either a troll, or are about 12 years old.

I'm neither and my point was to at least try to open a dialog before stampeding in like bulls in a china shop. It doesn't matter if they are innocent or guilty. Anyone deserves the option to surrender of their own free will. That is before they are forcefully subjugated.

I'm 49 and fighting for my fellow citizens right to be treated fairly. The only thing I see you fighting for is tyranny.

 

[pelopidas]

Well, you actually have a really good idea.

However, (after watching far too many cop shows), my best guess is that the most serious charge which could be levied is, "involuntary manslaughter"..

This what USC Title 18 has to say about that"

https://codes.findlaw.com/us/title-18-crimes-and-criminal-procedure/18-usc-sect-1112.html (8 years max)

Pay particular attention that it is predicated on the fact that any crime committed leading up to the death, must not rise to the level of a >> "felony".

"Turning in a false police report", is a misdemeanor, in my home state, as I suspect it is in many others

Giving A False Report Penalties in Pennsylvania | Worgul, Sarna & Ness, Criminal Defense Attorneys

Charged? Call Worgul, Sarna & Ness, Criminal Defense Attorneys to speak with an experienced Pittsburgh criminal defense lawyer in a free case evaluation: (412) 281-2146.

www.pittsburghcriminalattorney.com

So, 8 years max with the fed, who thankfully requires that at least 85% of the adjudicated sentence be served.

Many, (including myself), may not like or agree with it, but, "so it is written, so shall it be done". (Fingers crossed).

While I agree that this is how the defense attorneys would argue it, it actually is more akin to hiring a hit man. Since this is not the first such story where “swatting” has lead to the death of an innocent it is reasonable to assume that death was the intended outcome, especially since the perp had something to gain from the death. It seems premeditated first degree to me.

 

[JohnMoser]

Floyd is a "poster boy" in spite of his serious imperfections because he was murdered in public by a cop that was asked to take his knee of of Floyd's neck. He declined and proceeded to kill the man, that he previously knew and disliked.

Chauvin is the world's most brilliant murderer. He mysteriously compels violent career criminals to break several laws, in the most stupidly blatant manner, then forces them to resist arrest until they have a heart attack. He's a mad genius.

 

[captaincranky]

While I agree that this is how the defense attorneys would argue it, it actually is more akin to hiring a hit man. Since this is not the first such story where “swatting” has lead to the death of an innocent it is reasonable to assume that death was the intended outcome, especially since the perp had something to gain from the death. It seems premeditated first degree to me.

Your version of this case can't possibly be made.
Primarily because no money. goods, or services, were exchanged between the false callers and the SWAT team. The SWAT team,did not have any direct responsibility for the death of the individual.

And realistically, if they couldn't make 1st degree murder against Derick Chauvin, there is no chance of making it in this case.

I think it's wonderful you have such strong feelings about this instance. Still, the justice system doesn't run on feelings, it runs on facts.,

 

[captaincranky]

Ok, I'm convinced now that you're either a troll, or are about 12 years old.

The idea that you'd simply go straight from yelling "Come out with your hands up!" to deploying smoke or pepper bombs when you get no response is absolutely absurd.

If there were a situation where somebody was having a medical episode such as, idk, a heart attack, maybe, after seeing squad cars pull up and geared up cops yelling "come out with your hands up", they're obviously going to be unable to come out with their hands up, aren't they, Einstein?

They will therefore, by your own genius solution above, end up being smoke bombed, pepper sprayed, and have guns pointed at them ANYWAY when the cops do finally go in to find the bloke collapsed on the floor.

I thought your whole genius idea was meant to stop that from ever happening?

You clearly have never actually bothered to think this through, yet you reckon you know better than police departments world wide...

At the end of the day,, this protracted discussion about, "what SWAT should do, or what SWAT should have done, is pointless.

The SWAT team held their fire, in spite of the fact.this gentleman walked out of his house armed with a rifle. I don't see how you could improve on that response.

The fact the this man died of natural causes, seems to have eluded all involved in the discussion. It is the underlying ills of the social media and gaming community who have been responsible for these incidents, nobody else..

To try and "reeducate", or "restructure" the police reaction to the situation, is absurd. What this is all about is the mentality, or lack thereof, of the individuals who "swatted", this person to begin with.

And as is typical of today's social climate, neither the persons responsible, nor their parents, are not willing to admit to any culpability or incompetence, relating to the commission of this act.

In my home town, "the city of brotherly lover, (and sisterly affection)(**))'" We have a black city council woman railing at our white mayor that, "he is not doing enough to curb gun violence", and, "if this were happening in white neighborhoods, he would take stronger measures". (Methinks, this mouthy b*tch, is simply trying to assure her reelection).

From my point of view, this isn't happening in white neighborhoods, so no action is necessary.. In excess of 90% of this is "black on black crime". You see, while white people might be dealing pounds of coke pout their back doors, and have tons of weapons at their disposal, they simply aren't out in the middle of the night getting into brawls, and killing each other, over the most nonsensical and trivial reasons imaginable.

Our enthusiasm for our sports teams reached a new "high", when an Eagles fan shot a Giants fan dead, while both were waiting in line for a cheese steak..

I could continue, but I think I'll close with our most recent "achievement". We are now #1 in per capita murders, in the 10 largest cities in America. That said, there's no reason to rest on our laurels, we can do "better".

(**) This "and sisterly affection" bullsh!t was forced on us by feminists.

 

[TempleOrion]

At the end of the day,, this protracted discussion about, "what SWAT should do, or what SWAT should have done, is pointless.

The SWAT team held their fire, in spite of the fact.this gentleman walked out of his house armed with a rifle. I don't see how you could improve on that response.

The fact the this man died of natural causes, seems to have eluded all involved in the discussion. It is the underlying ills of the social media and gaming community who have been responsible for these incidents, nobody else..

To try and "reeducate", or "restructure" the police reaction to the situation, is absurd. What this is all about is the mentality, or lack thereof, of the individuals who "swatted", this person to begin with.

And as is typical of today's social climate, neither the persons responsible, nor their parents, are not willing to admit to any culpability or incompetence, relating to the commission of this act.

In my home town, "the city of brotherly lover, (and sisterly affection)(**))'" We have a black city council woman railing at our white mayor that, "he is not doing enough to curb gun violence", and, "if this were happening in white neighborhoods, he would take stronger measures". (Methinks, this mouthy b*tch, is simply trying to assure her reelection).

From my point of view, this isn't happening in white neighborhoods, so no action is necessary.. In excess of 90% of this is "black on black crime". You see, while white people might be dealing pounds of coke pout their back doors, and have tons of weapons at their disposal, they simply aren't out in the middle of the night getting into brawls, and killing each other, over the most nonsensical and trivial reasons imaginable.

Our enthusiasm for our sports teams reached a new "high", when an Eagles fan shot a Giants fan dead, while both were waiting in line for a cheese steak..

I could continue, but I think I'll close with our most recent "achievement". We are now #1 in per capita murders, in the 10 largest cities in America. That said, there's no reason to rest on our laurels, we can do "better".

(**) This "and sisterly affection" bullsh!t was forced on us by feminists.

OMG The amount of toxic bullcrap you spew out on a regular basis is amazing... It's like you have an infinite reservoir of bile, bitterness and miserable resentment; so much like Trump I'm wondering if it's him in disguise LMAO