So you only have PCI slots and want to game?

supersmashbrada said:
so 31 fps would be sitting still or looking at a wall?
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31 look down at the ground, but between 13-20 fighting or looking or walking around. It only drops to 7 when there are a ton of enemies on screen. Overall the game is playable. But lets not discuss this again lol

Hey, electromagnetic what video card are you looking forward to get?
I myself is buying the 8400gs evga version, soon. check it out:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...c=OTC-Froogle-_-Video+Cards-_-EVGA-_-14130451

Its cheap, and the bandwidth on it is 8.6, 512mb , 64bit, and the core is 567 and the memory is 500, with DDR2 and 1000mhz.
 
electromagnetic said:
So you think that PCI has the side show only, do you read other PCI EXPRESS X16 forums ?


http://www.techsupportforum.com/gaming-forum/pc-gaming-support/227987-call-duty-4-lag.html


Why don't you get a pci card and your pci express x16 and find out the truth and not make things up.:mad:

Looking at your system specs you must be rich.
Click to expand...

Okay 1.) I shouldnt have clicked on the link, because I knew it was something of a non factor reference, but I did anyway. 2) The user was using a laptop, but apparently you just googled pci express for an ill forum about pci e, which leads me to 3 things, a.)either you're butthurt over my previous post which wasnt directed to you anyway b.) you failed to read the thread that you just googled(which is funny to me in some aspect because you posted it here trying to pun me or something) or c:) You're 15 and lack the skill there of, and you dont know any better. All in all the pci e info came from the system requirements needed to play cod4. The guy you refer to has a laptop, with 500megs of ram, and a mobile gpu . 3.) Both of these reasons just made the quoted post a non factor.

I would buy a pci card if It were 1999 maybe yeah. But in the meantime you're getting upset at nothing.

Next time dont google information that wont support your ill advised pci frantics

And no I'm not rich. I just decided to get into computers in 2006 versus 1996 and spending 4 times as much for parts purchased at that time.

NO offense the general, I'd just like to see you not post in this section of the forums ever again. We await your pci E days so you can run some benches with current cards and stuff. In the meantime, hf with your purchase from Japan!
 
Telling the General to upgrade is a complete waste of time as I have seen him on at least 5 other forums with everyone telling him the same thing that they are here. He doesn't even want to stick a $5-$10 dollars PIII in his system so his performance isn't as wretchedly slow, well that is his business alone. He provides good updates on the latest PCI cards at times and I value that since I want to stick the most powerful PCI card I can find in this system before I can get the cash together for a dual-core or quad core rig with 2 PCI-e 2.0 slots. You just have to take his posts with a grain of salt and realize there are people like him out there that don't fully understand how a PC works and why PCI is so wretched in comparison with modern PCI-e 2.0 technology.

On a happier note, I for one am sincerely hoping that the Sparkle 9500GT PCI does come out as this would be the clear king of PCI cards ATM. I'm holding off on the 9400GT to see if the 9500GT is around the corner. $100+ dollars for a PCI card is absurd, but you aren't paying for actual performance, you are paying for the fact that there isn't anything better for the expansion slot that people are stuck with because PC manufacturers want to build "budget" PC's.

The term you need to most associate with PCI gaming is "Retro Gaming" as you will never play the latest and greatest at full speed with a PCI card, but you can play games that are only 3 years or older at full speed with say a 9500GT provided your system is half decent as well. There is a huge list of older games I want to delve into not to mention emulation, so I could be using the 9500GT a long long time. PCI cards are a great stopgap solution for people like me that are stuck with Intel Graphics otherwise, so I say keep em' coming even if people like Tha General will use them the rest of their lives. (PCI GPU makers need more people like him to increase their market share!)
 
I dont think we have a problem with his pci or anyone elses pci gaming, we only got bothered when he associated "playable" with an average 14 fps on a modern game. I also agree 100 dollars is too much to pay for a pci card. I could get a core2duo and mobo combo for that much, probably with something else thrown in, ram, hd etc. There are crazy low end deals out there that would blow away a pci setup for the price of a top pci card and a little more added.

He also said he was buying a new machine, with pci yet as another graphic slot. a dual core isnt going to make your pci card much faster at all. Its "pci" itself, that's the bottleneck, wasteful upgrade imo.
 
If I was Tha General, I would make it a goal to make Half Life 2 playable at top speed on his rig and call it a day there. I wouldn't even bother to get a game made past 2004 to try to run on that thing much less post FPS results about it.

PCI cards are not proportionate to performance but again, you aren't paying for PCI vs. PCI-e performance, you are paying for the fact you can't do better on your OEM machine where they didn't think a PCI-E slot would appeal to you, the consumer.
 
I believe there are some dual core rigs out there with no graphics card slot other than PCI simply because they are trying to save money and sell you a budget rig. That was the case in the PIV era as my rig is that way and I believe companies like Dell are still doing this to us. There are no new PC's being built with AGP slots as these have been completely abandoned for the PCI-e standard.
 
I see, does make sense to either put pci e or just pci slots on board or both, which is happening now. Didnt really think about that.
 
Hardware enthusiasts and gaming have always gone hand in hand.

Also, gaming is relative to your viewpoint. if WoW is the only thing you play, you do not need the same hardware requirements as the ones you would need for say Far Cry 2. And you would obviously need at least an HD 4670 to game decently, but since this is not common knowledge we get people on the forums asking about what card or system to purchase.

Fact is, if you are trying to game on a PC that does not meet the minimum system requirements (which are there for a reason), you are simply fighting a losing battle. Of course, the requirements may be a bit too stringent, but they are intended so you can run the game smoothly at the lowest image quality settings at a minimum frame rate of 30FPS, not at a "smooth 7-31FPS".
 
PCIGamer said:
Oh and you are gonna need a better powersupply to run that thing too.
Click to expand...

Nope, i already used a 8400GS in my rig just fine. The Pny version, but i had to take that version back because the card was too big , but the evga 8400gs is the same size as my visiontek2400, the fan on the 8400gs is even smaller then my 2400hd, So the card should work just fine. The watts on it, my guess only uses about 20, the same as the 2400hd. So 90watts should be just fine, even tho when i go out and buy the evga 8400gs, i will look around for a small psu with higher watts that fits in my computer.
 
From Newegg:

System Requirements Minimum of a 350 Watt power supply.
(Minimum recommended power supply with +12 Volt current rating of 18 Amp.)

While I agree that you dont need 18 amps on the 12v rail to power this card you still need more juice than 90watts. An average P3 CPU will need around 30watts of juice on its own. Your hdd, dvd drive, any external usb devices not on their own power need juice too. Not much left on that 90watt psu you have to power that video card.

Good luck using your 90 watt PSU with this card.
 
PCIGamer said:
From Newegg:

System Requirements Minimum of a 350 Watt power supply.
(Minimum recommended power supply with +12 Volt current rating of 18 Amp.)

While I agree that you dont need 18 amps on the 12v rail to power this card you still need more juice than 90watts. An average P3 CPU will need around 30watts of juice on its own. Your hdd, dvd drive, any external usb devices not on their own power need juice too. Not much left on that 90watt psu you have to power that video card.

Good luck using your 90 watt PSU with this card.
Click to expand...

I am pretty sure thats inaccurate, the PNY 8400gs worked just fine and i had the card for a week in my rig and it play games just fine and the temps was on it was just fine.

You said it isn't too much left on my 90watts PSU lol, you do know i have been using this same one since 2000 right? Right now its blowing out cool air, when i game, the air gets cooler. So believe me i am just fine. I don't have alot of junk in my computer and the 8400gs , only needs about 20w. iTS A low profile card, it doesn't require much. I also clean my PSU each year, take it apart and everything. So i will do this again in march. :)
 
Graphic card companies over rate there PSU requirements, and Hardware PC's makers under rate there power supplies so for PCI you probably only need a low power PSU.

Although for PCI Express x16 users is that different ?

I know that as fact.
 
Hey electromagnetic what video card are you buying next? I am buying the evga 8400gs in a few days or about 2 weeks. I am trying to wait until it shows up in the store. Really don't feel like buying online, because if its DOA or something, don't feel like sending it back. I like buying cards in the card, just drive there, buy it and go home , 5 mins tops.

Hey everyone, read this about playing COD4 , I am going to copy and past the info, instead of linking to the site, don't know if posting links to other forums are allowed:
I have COD4 install, so i found this fix, may work on for everyone else.
.......................................

I had to reinstall windows2000 last night , so i have a fresh install right now, everything is working perfectly. IRQ's are separate, and i am in standard PC mode( best for w2k users) (even tho i am wondering should i keep my 2400HD shared with my PCI bridge ? )
Anyways, so i go to play COD4 the demo, these are the settings which i play on:

1280x1024/60hz, 4.3, Glow on, Number of Dynamic Lights low , Hell i even put on Dual Video Cards just for the fun , bullet impacts on, ragdoll, water resolution low, model detail normal, no shadows, shadow map resolution low, texture resolution " extra ", AFX2, trilinear.

So i go to play the game, and its crawling, talking about 2-4fps, never goes any higher. So i say to myself, i don't remember getting this, i use to get 7-31 fps. So i remove a file in the miles folder

mssmp3.asi <--------------------------

Played COD4 again, and now i get 10-30fps.

So there you go folks. Removing that file may help performance, try it out......
 
electromagnetic said:
Graphic card companies over rate there PSU requirements, and Hardware PC's makers under rate there power supplies so for PCI you probably only need a low power PSU.

Although for PCI Express x16 users is that different ?

I know that as fact.
Click to expand...

That's all well and good, but 90W is ridiculously small. An 8400GS is a very lean card, but you're pressing your luck. Also mind you that power supplies lower in sustainable wattage as they age due to the degradation of capacitors.

I love your "you must be rich" comment a while back; seeing as you're spending 3-4x more for a PCI version of a card than the PCIe.

Smart spending.
 
Hi guys, I'm new here, I've read the last 1/3 or so of the pages in this thread, and it's been very helpful to me. A few months ago I bought a Dell E310 for $120 off of craigslist, with a Geforce 5200FX in it. (Awesome deal!) Anyway, after a month or 2 with it I upgraded to 2 gigs of ram and got a EVGA Geforce 6200 PCI. Some things actually ran better on the 5200FX so I was somewhat disapointed with that. Anyway, I just bought a EVGA Geforce 8400GS PCI. I sure hope I see more of a performance increase than I did going from the FX 5200 to the 6200.
 
I imagine you may see some increase in performance. Not much in comparison going from the 5200 to the 6200. Not like "night and day" I should say.
 
I just looked it up on gpureview, and apparently there are 128 bit versions of the FX 5200. I don't know what kind of FX 5200 I had though. I'm guessing I might have had a 128 bit version so when I went to a 64 bit 6200 I noticed some stuff ran better on my older card. On paper though, going from a 5200 to 6200 isn't that much, but from a 6200 from a 8400gs is a pretty big jump. I tried to post links but I can't yet.
 
I know that the 8400GS will play things like Half Life 2 fairly comfortably, but in PCIe. The PCI version is seriously cripped in comparison, so I don't know how it stacks up as far as similar games.

You'd've been better off getting something like a Dimension 8400 second hand.
 
Half Life 2 on an 8400GS PCI on a P4 will net you an average 45fps at anything up to 1280x1024 at high settings, No AA and shadows disabled of course.

Also I had a PNY Geforce 5200FX which was a 128bit version, but it was such a horrible performer in almost everything. Doom 3 for example was a slideshow on that card but runs >30fps on an 8400GS without flinching
 
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