Sony changes PSN terms to block class action lawsuits

[Jos]

This is interesting. In a mandatory PlayStation 3 update, Sony has slipped a change to the terms of service for the PlayStation Network so that users who accept it are basically giving up the right to take part in a class-action lawsuit against them. The new clauses, termed "Binding Individual Arbitration," mandate that any Dispute Resolution Proceedings, whether in arbitration or court, will be conducted on an individual basis only.

Any outstanding class action lawsuits filed against Sony will still stand, including the class action suit filed in April over the PSN security breach. But it seems Sony is protecting itself against further litigation should it be hacked again in the future -- or perhaps if it pull another rootkit fiasco. They are in their legal right to do so, according to some analysts, but the stealthy move can't help their already tainted image in the minds of customers.

Although this could hurt consumers' chances to challenge the company in court in case of any wrongdoing, there's nothing in the terms of service preventing people from suing Sony on an individual basis.

Looking at it from another perspective, as Gamasutra notes, class action suits in the gaming world usually benefit a few (read: lawyers) while members of the class have to make do with the crumbles (I.e. The Hot Coffee class action suit against Take-Two, which netted its members a replacement game disc or from $5 to $35 in cash).

In any case, users can also opt-out of the binding arbitration and class action waiver by contacting Sony in writing within 30 days of agreeing to the new terms. The full list of changes to the agreement is available here (PDF). It's worth noting that PSN users are required to agree to the new terms upon signing in to be able to use the service.

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https://www.techspot.com/news/45505-sony-changes-psn-terms-to-block-class-action-lawsuits.html

 

[ghasmanjr]

I am getting so tired of Sony. Maybe if they had better security systems, they wouldn't have problems with hackers being able to access information. However, this is not the case. If they were a company that believes in ethics (read: taking away features), no one would have a problem with them. Microsoft hasn't had any problems with Live support and no one hates Microsoft enough to sue them. I wonder if there is a connection...

 

[Guest]

Just because something is in the TOS or whatever doesn't mean that it is legal. This will not stand up for **** in court.

 

[matrix86]

Guest said:
Just because something is in the TOS or whatever doesn't mean that it is legal. This will not stand up for **** in court.

Actually, what they're doing here is completely legal.

 

[Guest]

In Canada

Some companies add arbitration clauses to contracts that require you to use a private arbitration process to resolve complaints instead of going to court or seeking assistance from the Ministry of Consumer Services. You are not bound by these clauses, even if you have accepted the agreement.

 

[Zilpha]

Actually, what they're doing here is completely legal.

Well, ish. What I will be interested to see if how much of an outcry this actually incites. It would be interesting to see someone bring a class action lawsuit over this change regarding class action lawsuits. After all, if you don't agree to the ToS, you can still bring one.

Things like class action law suits are in place to protect consumers and I just don't see Sony getting away with it once the attorneys general get involved.

And they WILL get involved.

 

[Guest]

SONY is nothing more than a wolf leading sheep. They have delusional consumer hoards that blindly follow the Word of SONY, and do their masters bidding. I hope people with stop taking SONY's load in the mouth, and bite back by boycotting their products.

 

[Trillionsin]

Guest said:
SONY is nothing more than a wolf leading sheep. They have delusional consumer hoards that blindly follow the Word of SONY, and do their masters bidding. I hope people with stop taking SONY's load in the mouth, and bite back by boycotting their products.

yea.. me too.. while on the other hand i already own this lovely ps3... hmm.. what shall I do? Throw it out the window? Sell it to someone? Ya right... I paid $300 bucks for it.. second hand and it was HOT not to mention.. probably stolen. Anyways... my point is. I'm not going to stop using it because I dont like sony... however this may keep me from buying future products.

Also, what shall i go with instead? Xbox or PC? well that doesnt really matter. Microsoft has me covered both ways. My hopes are that the rumors are true that Windows 8 will play Xbox games.

 

[Trillionsin]

trillionsin said:

Guest said:
SONY is nothing more than a wolf leading sheep. They have delusional consumer hoards that blindly follow the Word of SONY, and do their masters bidding. I hope people with stop taking SONY's load in the mouth, and bite back by boycotting their products.

yea.. me too.. while on the other hand i already own this lovely ps3... hmm.. what shall I do? Throw it out the window? Sell it to someone? Ya right... I paid $300 bucks for it.. second hand and it was HOT not to mention.. probably stolen. Anyways... my point is. I'm not going to stop using it because I dont like sony... however this may keep me from buying future products.

Also, what shall i go with instead? Xbox or PC? well that doesnt really matter. Microsoft has me covered both ways. My hopes are that the rumors are true that Windows 8 will play Xbox games.

Oh yea.. How did I forget to mention Nintendo? The joke of the console video gamers.

 

[natefalk]

Many corporations are already doing this and you probably aren't aware. Most go as far as saying you have to use the corporation's "arbitrator" instead of an actual judge. You can guess how these arbitrators rule in these cases. Even if you go to a judge, there is a good chance that corporate money put him in that seat and he has their best interests in mind... Google "Halliburton Jamie Leigh Jones"... or Tort reform...

 

[Xclusiveitalian]

What this means is Sony can crush each individual one by one with there million dollar lawyers. Gaming is being hurt by all these greedy careless companies, i can only imagine the horrid future that is coming.

 

[Guest]

ohhhh... poor babies crying that you can't sue.... Don't like it? move on, no one forces you to play...

 

[Guest]

This company is still in business? They're getting desperate.

 

[Guest]

@Trillionsin

It's all good. Once upon a time, you bought a SONY product. It was good. It was grand! I don't recommend throwing out your Sony PS3, or Sony TV or any other products that have been purchased. Play til it breaks. When it breaks (and they will break), find a new toy. Just don't buy SONY.

I've moved to PC games, and let's face it... there are not very many "PS3 onry" developers. Most games I have seen or want to play are multi-platform.

My name is Ben. I'm just lazy to sign up.

 

[Vrmithrax]

It would be quite an interesting sociology experiment to compare the individualss deriding Sony's protective move here with the individuals cheering on the hack of PSN... Wanna bet there is a massive amount of crossover between those 2 pools of people?

Seriously, if you were one of those who applauded the illegal PSN hack and the associated damage it did to Sony as a corporation, you should not be allowed to cry foul when Sony decides to try and defend itself from future damages. That is beyond hypocricy. Reap what you sow.

 

[slh28]

I'm no Sony fanboy but some people really need to quit complaining and get out of this stupid suing culture. When I heard about the Sony hacks I immediately cancelled my credit card and anyway, even if your card was stolen and swiped you would have got the money back from the credit card issuer.

And I agree with the above, I bet a lot of people who condoned the hacks are now crying and saying they're entitled to this that and the other.

 

[NTAPRO]

I see nothing wrong with the development of homebrew. Taking advantage of the jailbreak to cheat online is something different.Geohot got sued for doing what he did to the PS3 and his firmware purposely didn't allow backups to be run. PS3 backups were being spread before his jailbreak method. Sony didn't care and he got sued still >_>

 

[Guest]

I am a small zombie in the zombie army of ps3 users, I don't get to buy a couple of games a year and never had payed Sony for streaming media or services offered by the Sony Store. And lately stopped using the psn service because I don't get to play online anymore.
Today I started the console and get the notice that I must agree with the new terms of service to sign to the psn, I agree to them because if you are not logged you cannot see your scores online anymore.
Now I feel that even for a zombie I'm too lame, why should I agree to new terms of service just to receive a free service ?

I know that the console is not free, the games are not for free, and to play online which I don't do anymore is free ( using sony's servers and network ) just agree with any silly stupid condition the come out with ...

I have only one request: please, SONY fix the stupid ps3 browser, so I can browse the REAL network and forget about your PSN service with all your stupid terms of service

 

[gwailo247]

xclusiveitalian said:
What this means is Sony can crush each individual one by one with there million dollar lawyers. Gaming is being hurt by all these greedy careless companies, i can only imagine the horrid future that is coming.

Yeah, but the flip side is that the plaintiff attorneys do 1/x of the work, where x = number of plaintiffs, but they collect the same 50% of the settlement as if they did all the work.

So you have 2 million plaintiffs, the lawyers don't do ****, each plaintiff gets 20 bucks, and the lawyers walk away with 10 million. Then Sony passes the 10 million costs back to the consumer, so you're basically going to pay that 20 back to Sony, and then another $100 on top of that for *your* attorney.

As far as Sony's million dollar lawyers, they're going to crush the single attorney whether he represents one plaintiff or a million.

ALL that class action lawsuits are designed for is to put money in lawyers pockets.

 

[RH00D]

Vrmithrax said:
It would be quite an interesting sociology experiment to compare the individualss deriding Sony's protective move here with the individuals cheering on the hack of PSN... Wanna bet there is a massive amount of crossover between those 2 pools of people?

Seriously, if you were one of those who applauded the illegal PSN hack and the associated damage it did to Sony as a corporation, you should not be allowed to cry foul when Sony decides to try and defend itself from future damages. That is beyond hypocricy. Reap what you sow.

Tell me how text in a TOS is a defense against hackers.
Also, this has nothing to do with "hackers". How about when Sony does ANYTHING that negatively affects a large amount of customers or consumers. They are now defenseless (pretty much). Because we all know 1 person is going to win against a mega-corporation, right Mr. Vrmithrax?

 

[Ghost Fire]

Japanese gaming has become so irrelevant in the last 5ish years anyway. Western gaming and european gaming has been on a steady rise for years now. Japan is too afraid to take risks with games these days. Name 10 games that have come from Japanese developers in the last 5 years that wasn't a sequel or remake. Don't worry, I'll wait.

 

[Zeromus]

I'm not concerned because I do not have a Playstation 3.

 

[Guest]

So basically they're saying "We're inept , DEAL WITH IT!" screw that noise..lol

 

[Guest]

Everyone is railing on Sony here, but I have a feeling that MS and nintendo wont be far behind. As one of the SCOTUS judges that made this bindingly legal here in the us put it

"It's almost malpractice for a lawyer of a company now not to put an arbitration clause in any kind of document, whether it's a consumer contract or an employment agreement. All of those agreements will be enforced and the company [will] no longer face the prospect [of class-action liability], if they write the agreement correctly.

- Supreme Court advocate Tom Goldstein"

Expect this to show up everwhere. itunes, warcraft, windows 8, everywhere.

 

[JohnAus]

Corporate bodies are inhuman money making machines. They dont die, they can change names, assume different identitites and are completely removed from the human race.
This latest attempt at not being responsible, so we humans cannot take class action is another human right taken away from us.
If the corporation isnt human, and this is the only pain we can inflict, and is felt by this inhuman corporation then we musnt let them get away with this.
Any attempt at this type of agrement must be made illegal, if it isnt already illegal.
I havent got one piece of SONY equipment in my home due to other companies filling that space. Overpriced and over rated SONY, and now seen to be unreliable as well, when things go wrong certainly wont fill consumers with confidence. I would like to see myself at the head of that corporation, and it will stop acting like mafiosy.