Thoughts on Vista/What is Your Problem With Vista

[captaincranky]

Hooray for Me......!

yar well i can't complain because i'm a college student and i can get premium for 90 bucks like i mentioned earlier. HA! TAKE THAT CHINESE! I CAN GET IT FOR FORTY BUCKS LESS =D!!

just kidding.

This post is so wrong on so many levels. Just kidding.

 

[link590o]

cranky, the lights are on but nobody's home. and it has been that way for a while. i try to keep it under wraps, but it gets the best of me occasionally.

anyway. i've been looking at vista again, and the reviews are getting me hyped up on it. i want to try it again so bad. i tried it once at a friend's house but thats about it.

but i need like...400 dollars for a new computer.

 

[Kimmers]

Look when it comes down to it most of us know xp like the back of our hands, Visita is going to a be a learning curve how about bashing a system we start offering help. Me personally installing vista has been an adventure I still run a dual system and ill continue to do so until the first service pack comes out.

Why you ask because some of the program that i currently use don't work for vista a major one Etax the australian online Tax lodagment system doesn't work.

Look upon Vista as an adventure, My email program doesn't work propley but thats because the company needs to work on it.

An Idea is contact some companies if programs aren't working asking them question I found that really helpful.

My modem kept restarting on me I contacted my provider and they told me i needed to change the settings simple as that. So in the end it comes down to this Do you want to try, Do you want to find someway around the bugs? Or not?

 

[AlbertLionheart]

Way back when in the days when IT men were IT men and you could tell just by looking at them, we moved from DOS to Windows 3.1
The pub was the forum then, and there were those who hated all this multitasking windows crap and said the speed would fry our brains. Fear of the unknown does not justify wearing blinkers.
We got over that (although I for one am amazed at how fast DOS 6.1 runs on a DualCore chip) so we will get over Vista. I see that MS have slipped out a couple of updates in the last few days but I will wait for the first SP before making a complete change.

 

[Brandon]

Just some opinions from me.

I just some times couldn't understand why people would hate or wait out until a new patch is release or something, especially when it comes to OS? Life is suppose to be full of adventure, just like computers. Maybe through the process of getting around compatibility problems, bugs and etc, that you become smarter and more technical? Just treat it as a learning process, rather than getting all pissed off and clear off vista and install xp.

 

[AlbertLionheart]

I agree, Brandon - however, my PC is my work and I cannot risk screwing up a stable machine just for the sake of Vista. I did build a system based in a E6600 chip with 2 GB RAM and a PCI-E card just to try it out - it was so unstable I took it all to pieces again. Cannot be bothered with it yet - as I said in my last post on this, we will get over it. I don't have time to fix problems (so what the hell am I doing on this forum, I ask myself?) - someone else can do it and I'll ride that one when it works.

 

[link590o]

hey albert, you may not want to take it apart so quickly. i've been told that vista machines, though unstable at first, stabilize over time. i'm not sure what kind of time frame we're talking about, but i know it's not more than half a year. which to me says in a matter of a few weeks to a month. now, i'm not yelling at you to go put it back and whatever, but just know that you shouldn't give up so quick.

and brandon, i admire your "don't knock it till you try it approach". i know of way too many people that are fervently against vista even though they've only read about it and never tried it. it has potential but it seems like people can't get their nose out of the bark and see the rest of the forest. they're so preoccupied with the fact that it has bugs right now that they make it a total write-off. and there's no sense in that. people have no patience these days.

for any further rebuttals i'm going to refer to phantasm's post on page 14.

 

[SNGX1275]

Thats what I did with XP, and to some extent did with Vista. I was running beta builds of Whistler from back before they even added in the bubbly interface. It was fun back then to already have built up a knowledge of how things worked in XP before most people got it. One interesting thing with that was the nvidia infinite loop fiasco that happened with XP never occured until the final release, at least not for me.

With Vista I did run a beta and an RC but didn't really learn that much. Didn't play with it too much. Just got my work done.

 

[Phantasm66]

Ok, Ok, Ok, so maybe everything in Vista land is NOT cool, he he he...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Pill_(malware)

Blue Pill (malware)
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search

Blue Pill is the codename for a somewhat controversial rootkit based on virtualization technology that targets Microsoft's Windows Vista operating system. Blue Pill uses AMD Pacifica virtualization technology, but reportedly could be ported to use Intel Vanderpool. It was designed by Joanna Rutkowska and demonstrated at the Black Hat Briefings on August 3, 2006.

According to the author, by using Pacifica, Blue Pill would be able to trap a running instance of the operating system into a virtual machine, and would then act as a hypervisor, with complete control of the computer. Joanna Rutkowska claims that, since any detection program could be fooled by the hypervisor, such a system would be "100% undetectable".[1]

This assessment, repeated in numerous press articles, is disputed: AMD issued a statement dismissing the claim of full undetectability.[2] Some other security researchers and journalists also dismissed the concept as inaccurate.[3][4] In 2007, a group of researchers led by Thomas Ptacek of Matasano Security challenged Rutkowska to put Blue Pill against their rootkit detector software at this year's Black Hat conference.[5] The deal was deemed a no-go, following Joanna's request for $384,000 in funding as a prerequisite for entering the competition.[6]

The name Blue Pill is a reference to the bluepill from the The Matrix film trilogy.

My new laptop I'm getting (Dell Vostro) has the hardware that supports doing this, I believe.

 

[Brandon]

Right now, because I have the patiences and actually went through all the hell with vista, now that I'm superb happy with my two systems, which are running vista fine. I know there are more programs out there, that might not work with Vista, I chose to stick with it cause i spent thousands to ensure that I'm running on next generation systems instead of staying with the old.

I pretty much agree that if you have important work, dont try vista just yet or run it on another system. However for those who just read and say yucks... and stay away, they are really missing a lot of things cause, i know many would say vista is a copy of apple but these days in software, who doesn't copy? And these people deserve a smack in their heads from me. LOL.

And actually, I'm kinda jealous that so many people can run vista and have super high end computers...hahaha... and that their system is more rock stable than mine.

 

[SNGX1275]

Well Brandon, no matter how good your system is, its almost assured that someone has a better system. I'm pretty happy with my setup, then I saw Tarkus post his specs in the irc channel and he's running a C2D a full 1Ghz faster than I am.

 

[hynesy]

Lol, I hear ya SNGX1275, I thought I had a good computer, then my mate gets some funding from a local university and gets a intel quad core processor put in, I almost shat myself when i saw it.

 

[link590o]

i got really sick of just looking at all the high tech computers my friends had and decided i'd somehow get my own. and it looks like that's finally gonna happen in 4 months time. i made a deal with my parents. since i'm in college, i had the choice of living in an apartment 10 minutes away with free food from the rents, or living on campus and buying a meal plan. i decided to go with the apartment although i wanted to stick with my friends on campus...BUT, they said "well, we'll give you that money that we would've paid toward housing and the meal plan." and they're doing it through a 200 a month allowance.

i may not be in close contact with my friends, but i'm being compensated mightily for it =D. and if i discipline myself a LOT, i can save every penny and buy a super computer. sure it won't be top of the line. like sngx said someone will always have a better one, but mine won't be too shabby either. i'm lookin at an AMD 5400 64 x2 dual core, 8600 gts 512 mb, 2 gigs of RAM, sli capable mobo, 550 watt power supply, and a 160 gig hard drive.

and just to keep this on the vista thread, i'm probably gonna throw vista home premium on there once i save up yet more cash. anybody have any suggestions or thoughts on how its going to run?

 

[SNGX1275]

Well if you are going to run a 22" or smaller monitor you might as well spend a bit more and get the 320meg 8800GTS, it will do (close to) as well as the better 8800s at 1680x1050 and smaller, and then you could just not get a SLI capable motherboard to make up the price difference.

I read an article today on SP1, apparently its going to have quite a few optimizations to increase speed and decrease disk thrashing, but doesn't look like it will be public until 2008 for some reason. I don't quite understand why the delay when its already been 'leaked'. Link

 

[link590o]

well...with shipping payment included, my comp comes out to 858 dollars. so i'd be waiting an extra month for the shipping funds anyhow. and that means that if i went with the 8800 320 mb, it would only increase to 969. and i'd have 1000 at that point. so i'd be good to go.

but in terms of the monitor and different motherboard....i'm delivered because this model doesn't have a motherboard compatible with it that isn't sli capable. so i have to get a sli mobo. not a bad thing, but not good either. and as for the monitor, i won't have the cash for it anyway. not to mention, i'm skimping on buying a new monitor with this computer as well as other peripherals just to save money. i'll be scrapping all kinds of things from this computer so i don't have to buy any extra parts. i'm currently outfitted with...a...17 inch i believe?...yeah i think i have a 17 inch...but in reality it's only a 13 inch when you discount the plastic surrounding the screen.

anyway. it sounds like that might do quite nicely.

from there i just have to wait a few more weeks and then i can order vista premium. =D

 

[scgoodell]

Networking issues

Well heck why not buy another Vista machine? Up until last night I would say fine but the networking issues still is baffeling me. Went to find the printer from the other Vista machine and can't see the printer. After I got all of the machines on the correct workgroup for my home network I can see the machines and drives but can't find the printers. Huh, guess I'll spend another several hours finding the firewall or connection problem. So far the install went OK, direct connection to the printer went excellent, connecting to my XP machine is great. Just connecting another Vista machine on the network seems to be the "fun".

 

[AlbertLionheart]

Which version of Vista are you running on your Vista machines? I hear there is a limit on the networking capacity in the base version - is this true?

 

[hynesy]

There is no limit of networking form Ultimate and business. However when yo network ultimate to a home or business to a home or business to a basic there is again not problems. But there is sharing files problems when your using home trying to access a business shared folder (except the sharing folder which works fine). I know this because I have 4 PC's with vista, 1 with home, 1 with ultimate, 1 with basic and 1 with business.
AlbertLionheart, basically networking between two vista machines, you just need to have the same edition is what is boils down too.
cheers
Hynesy

 

[link590o]

i read something interesting a few minutes ago that brings to light a few of the restrictions Microsoft put in place with Vista apparently.
http://badvista.fsf.org/what-s-wrong-with-microsoft-windows-vista

that article claims that there's all kinds of new DRM software, that you only sort of lease Vista, that the security program lets microsoft delete software it thinks is spyware, and that you are legally consenting to being spied on by Microsoft.

i'm really wondering if half these claims are true and i'm curious to see what you guys make of it. not to mention what you think, and ways to overcome said obstacles if they even exist.

 

[Mirob]

I moved my Vista machine to my kids room and have had zero problems using it to play media over my network--all my ripped DVDs and MP3s play fine as do most of my media players.

i'm really wondering if half these claims are true

Most of what they say is kind of true...but exaggerated.

 

[link590o]

i figured that only some of it would end up being true and most of it exaggerated.

since that's the case, can anyone enlighten me with the true version of these claims? what restrictions are there that i need to watch out for? i already know that different versions aren't very compatible in terms of sharing files and such, and that if you want more than one computer to have it you have to buy another copy. but what else is there?

 

[hynesy]

I don't believe microsoft is viewing your personal information etc like spyware, I think thats just *****ic to say that.
"They decide which programs you can and can't use on your computer
They decide which features of your computer or software you can use at any given moment
They force you to install new programs even when you don't want to (and, of course, pay for the privilege)
They restrict your access to certain programs and even to your own data files"
A quote from the link you gave, I have been running vista since BETA 2 and have not yet experienced one of these problems, why? Because they do not exist. As for the networking with vista, there is only touble between the home and basic editions and the business/ultimate editions.

 

[N3051M]

basically networking between two vista machines, you just need to have the same edition is what is boils down too.

i highly doubt ms would put this kind of crippling restriction on vista..
One common thing i've found in it to share with another Vista machine (so far) is if you have Onecare installed, you need to go to the advanced settings > firewall tab and make sure that sharing with other vista pcs is enabled. in Network and sharing centre >Sharing and discovery, things you want to share needs to be turned on to work. They're in modules kind of things..
With that said, it is true that i don't own multiple vista machine nor haven't been able to poke around with all the different versions of vista.

The article given from the badvista site is exaggerated, and some truth is skewerd or misinterpreted.

Vista enforces new forms of “Digital Rights Management (DRM)”. DRM is more accurately called Digital Restrictions Management, because it is a technology that Big Media and computer companies try to impose on us all, in order to have control over how our computers are used.

DRM has been with us for a while, and in most cases only relate to protecting of things like music, movies, programs from unlawful copying. Google DRM and Vista and it will tell you that its mostly to do with stopping what you copy something whilst inside the OS (like playing a dvd movie on a player and using a capture software to record it to a file in real time). There are pro's and cons on DRM, and its been well discussed over the decades. Legitimate software and media have no quarrels with this problem or vista. Dodgy ones on the other hand... but you shouldn't be using this right?

They force you to install new programs even when you don't want to (and, of course, pay for the privilege)

Haven't seen this happen to me yet. Only things they tell me to install are the regular windows updates (even then i have the choice of installing/not installing what ones i want) and ever since windows 95 thats been around. The only scenario i can think of with this happening is a third-party software taking the lead, like norton internet security (90 day trial preinstalled, then you have to purchase it, but that can also be uninstalled). So that remains Windows Vista to be the 'formentioned "forced install and pay premium for" program..

-They decide which programs you can and can't use on your computer
-They decide which features of your computer or software you can use at any given moment

stuff thats already installed are probably usefull, and some useless to others, like anything else. Everything else can be installed and uninstalled at will, provided that you know where to look, and it meets the requirements of your pc.

They restrict your access to certain programs and even to your own data files

that is utter bull.. shall i say more?

Even when you legally buy Vista, you don't own it.

Thats probably the only truth told in that article. Windows is always in past, present and possibly future sold as a "licence". That means that they provide some support, updates etc to you for free as a service under the licence (usualy), but it also means that since you don't own it, you can't copy and sell it/badge it/etc as your own (copyright) or stuff thats out of the terms and conditions of the licence agreement. Like a contract. Simply put, they made it (with their billions of dollars spent) they can sell it how they wish. Its no more proprietry than dell selling their own inks for thier printers or Apple PCs using Mac OS. You can however, "transfer" the licence when you sell of your PC to someone else.

In terms of MS spying on you, its no different than the tax office getting your details, filling out your credit card application, signing up to a forum or a data miner skimming your details. What you choose to give is what they get. Legitimate companies that require information from you (eg registration) are bound legaly (hopefully in all countries) to not use it for personal/financial gains.

*these are just my understanding of the matters discussed in that article, so in other words its just my opinions. Technology in its nature always looks forward, no matter what the circumstance. Common sense and a bit of looking into however, are always present.. and no, i don't work for ms.

 

[jtickner1]

http://www.bit-tech.net/columns/2007/08/19/chicks_dig_ram/1

 

[link590o]

XDD THAT was amazing sir. the article was fantastic. great punchline at the end. brilliant. and he put my feelings toward vista in words i couldn't hope to find. he and phantasm are on a level beyond all of us.