AMD Zen 5 core architecture could be 40% faster than Zen 4

[DragonSlayer101]

Rumor mill: AMD CEO Dr. Lisa Su confirmed earlier this year that Zen 5-based CPUs for both client and server applications would launch in the second half of 2024. A series of recent leaks have already given some clues about the new core architecture, and a new rumor now suggests that it could represent a massive upgrade over Zen 4.

This latest rumor comes from noted hardware leaker @Kepler_L2, who says that Zen 5 cores will be substantially faster than their Zen 4 counterparts. According to his post on the AnandTech forum, SPEC benchmark tests suggest that Zen 5 cores could be more than 40 percent faster than Zen 4, possibly making the next-gen AMD CPUs a solid upgrade over the current-gen ones.

It is worth noting here that the tipster didn't say whether the figure is based on integer or floating-point metrics. The former would obviously be more useful as it would indicate significantly-improved performance in both single-threaded and multi-threaded workloads. There's no word either on whether the quoted improvement is an average figure or if it's "up to" 40 percent higher. Either way, it's still just a rumor at this stage, so take it with a pinch of salt.

The Zen 5 core architecture is expected to power a range of CPU lineups over the next couple of years, including the Granite Ridge desktop processors that are tipped to hit the market later in 2024 under the Ryzen 9000 moniker. Other expected chip lineups based on Zen 5 are the Strix Point APUs that are also tipped to launch this year, as well as the Fire Range laptop CPUs and Strix Halo flagship APUs that are rumored to be released in 2025.

Finally, the company will also use Zen 5 "Nirvana" and 5C "Prometheus" cores in its next-gen EPYC server processors slated to hit the market later in 2024. According to earlier reports, these chips will be fabricated on TSMC's 3nm process and will enter mass production in Q3 2024.

AMD has officially stated that Zen 5 will offer several upgrades over Zen 4. These include enhanced performance, improved efficiency, a re-pipelined front end, as well as integrated AI and machine learning optimizations.

Permalink to story.

https://www.techspot.com/news/102462-amd-zen-5-core-architecture-could-40-faster.html

 

[Neatfeatguy]

We'll believe it when we see it.

Otherwise I'll assume this "leak" is just like Nvidia when they said that Ada was 4x faster than Ampere*!

*only if DLSS 3.0 was enabled when using Ada and no DLSS of any kind was enabled for Ampere.

Just need to keep future releases in the minds of consumers and shareholders.

Lisa Su (probably): "Look ma! We're relevant!"

 

[bviktor]

We'll believe it when we see it.

Otherwise I'll assume this "leak" is just like Nvidia when they said that Ada was 4x faster than Ampere*!

*only if DLSS 3.0 was enabled when using Ada and no DLSS of any kind was enabled for Ampere.

Just need to keep future releases in the minds of consumers and shareholders.

Lisa Su (probably): "Look ma! We're relevant!"

What are you even on? Intel's been irrelevant since the release of Ryzen. AMD beats them by any metric lol. You have to be the absolute fanboy to still buy anything from them.

 

[opckieran]

What are you even on? Intel's been irrelevant since the release of Ryzen. AMD beats them by any metric lol. You have to be the absolute fanboy to still buy anything from them.

Eh, as an owner of a 1st gen Zen, I'd disagree. Single-core perf was still lacking (compared to Intel at least), as was platform maturity. It wasn't until Zen 3 (maybe 2) when AMD fixed those things that Intel finally became irrelevant.

 

[yRaz]

What are you even on? Intel's been irrelevant since the release of Ryzen. AMD beats them by any metric lol. You have to be the absolute fanboy to still buy anything from them.

Not really, it hadn't been until zen3 that AMD was actually beating Intel. They were winning in the server space because their chiplet design allowed far more cores per socket than Intels monolithic designs, but people forget it wasn't until the zen2 epyc chips that AMD actually started beating Intel in the server space.

The ryzen 1000 and 2000 series chips were great for people who wanted "good enough" performance and were stuck on a budget. It wasn't until the 3000 series where it was good enough to compete with Intel but it was more along the lines of compromising between needing 8 slightly slower cores for your application or 6 slightly faster cores for the same price. It wasn't until the 5000 series that AMD actually started to definitively beat Intel

 

[Neatfeatguy]

What are you even on? Intel's been irrelevant since the release of Ryzen. AMD beats them by any metric lol. You have to be the absolute fanboy to still buy anything from them.

Completely went over your head, but that's okay.

Point was, companies make these claims all the time with some kind of caveat in the fine print, but they still want to make an important sounding leak to help remind consumers and shareholders that what they have down the line is awesome and to keep spending/giving money their way.

As in all leaks, this info is just a general broad painting stroke that means diddly until proven otherwise. As was my comparison for Nvidia saying that Ada was 4x faster than Ampere.

Until we actually get to see reviews on Zen 5, the claim that it is "40%" faster than Zen 4 is just nothing more than a wild claim until proven otherwise.

 

[wiyosaya]

Benchmarks will tell the real truth when Zen 5 hits the market.

Until then we will have to wonder whether Zen 5 will be "The" Intel Killer.

 

[WhiteLeaff]

It sounds like a very big step forward for a 4nm architecture (6% denser than 5nm), I'm very skeptical, but... maybe in some specific case that uses Avx 512 it would be possible.

 

[godrilla]

Funny how these gains matches Arrowlake's improvement rumors over Raptotlake. Although taking these with a truck full of salt is warranted, I wonder how much affect do these rumors have on the competition or the actual company if they a falling short of these figures from both camps.
If the 50 to 60% performance uplift for the halo Blackwell 5090 is also real, enthusiast will probably need the Zen5/ Arrowlake cpu upgrade to mitigate the cpu bottleneck imo..

 

[kiwigraeme]

As Neatfeatguy said , let's wait , we all hope it has some validity, But that 40% is probably edge cases .
Given that AMD is giving us IPC gains every cycle , and will again with Zen 6 , that is so refreshing vs Intels stagnation as top dog . pay another $500 for very modest gains .

 

[daffy duck]

As Neatfeatguy said , let's wait , we all hope it has some validity, But that 40% is probably edge cases .
Given that AMD is giving us IPC gains every cycle , and will again with Zen 6 , that is so refreshing vs Intels stagnation as top dog . pay another $500 for very modest gains .

More and more leaks are saying IPC > 20% and multithreaded ~ 40%. Obviously this depends on workloads and whether it's fp or integer etc, but Zen 5 is looking like a monster upgrade. Don't forget Zen 5 is not a tweaked design like Zen 4, it's a large architectural change from Zen 4 so these numbers don't surprise me. Apparently Zen 5 is already faster in gaming than Zen 4 X3D too.

I was hoping to wait for Arrow Lake but that will be lucky to paper launch this year and not be readily available for nearly 12 months. I have a very old PC I want to upgrade ASAP and Zen 5 is looking the goods.

 

[kiwigraeme]

More and more leaks are saying IPC > 20% and multithreaded ~ 40%. Obviously this depends on workloads and whether it's fp or integer etc, but Zen 5 is looking like a monster upgrade. Don't forget Zen 5 is not a tweaked design like Zen 4, it's a large architectural change from Zen 4 so these numbers don't surprise me. Apparently Zen 5 is already faster in gaming than Zen 4 X3D too.

I was hoping to wait for Arrow Lake but that will be lucky to paper launch this year and not be readily available for nearly 12 months. I have a very old PC I want to upgrade ASAP and Zen 5 is looking the goods.

I wait for new platform to stabilise . I like mid tier motherboards , not for overclocking , but more bandwidth slots - eg M2 slots , plus latest Wifi , BT etc - those things are not cheap ,also for price on new memory requirements to drop , Maybe even wait to Zen 6 quien sabe

 

[Watzupken]

I recalled Jim Keller said that Zen 5 will be a big improvement back in April last year, so looking forward to see what it will bring to the table.

I guess breaking off from Global Foundaries is a great step forward for AMD, in addition to the release of the Zen architecture.

 

[m3tavision]

Completely went over your head, but that's okay.

Point was, companies make these claims all the time with some kind of caveat in the fine print, but they still want to make an important sounding leak to help remind consumers and shareholders that what they have down the line is awesome and to keep spending/giving money their way.

As in all leaks, this info is just a general broad painting stroke that means diddly until proven otherwise. As was my comparison for Nvidia saying that Ada was 4x faster than Ampere.

Until we actually get to see reviews on Zen 5, the claim that it is "40%" faster than Zen 4 is just nothing more than a wild claim until proven otherwise.

These are not wild claims, they are industry speculation based on latest architecture and fabs. They may be off by a few %, but that is not the point. We know Zen5 is going to be powerful, just don't know how efficient...

You claim that it's marketing voodoo means you don't understand the semiconductor industry and it's voodoo to you.

 

[Disiw]

I hope this is true, but I am not expecting this. Several leakers claim this is nonsense and say 10-20% is more likely.

10% would be meh tho. Lets hope 20-30% at least.

 

[Disiw]

I recalled Jim Keller said that Zen 5 will be a big improvement back in April last year, so looking forward to see what it will bring to the table.

I guess breaking off from Global Foundaries is a great step forward for AMD, in addition to the release of the Zen architecture.

GloFo is terrible. Their 12nm is literally much much worse than Intel 14nm.

This is why Ryzen 1000 and 2000 series were mediocre, with low clockspeeds and no OC headroom.

Ryzen 3000/5000 were much better and this was mostly due to TSMC 7nm.

 

[HardReset]

It sounds like a very big step forward for a 4nm architecture (6% denser than 5nm), I'm very skeptical, but... maybe in some specific case that uses Avx 512 it would be possible.

Exactly. It sounds like that is one subtest that relies on heavy AVX loads. I could believe it.

I recalled Jim Keller said that Zen 5 will be a big improvement back in April last year, so looking forward to see what it will bring to the table.

Jim Keller left AMD 2015.

GloFo is terrible. Their 12nm is literally much much worse than Intel 14nm.

GF 12nm is basically tweaked 14LPP that is exactly same process Samsung used for phone SOCs. Not suitable for high performance CPUs. It's somewhat wonder AMD got so much out of it.

 

[trparky]

As a person who has a 7700X in his rig, I’ll believe it when I see it. Otherwise, I’ll wait until the next generation after this new generation to make a drop-in upgrade.

 

[SIlent]

Jim Keller left AMD 2015.

Yes, he left in 2015, but he commented on Zen 5 possible performance uplift last year.

https://www.extremetech.com/computi...re-predicts-zen-5-will-offer-huge-performance
https://www.tomshardware.com/news/jim-keller-shares-zen5-performance-projections-kind-of
https://videocardz.com/newz/amd-zen5-architecture-gets-performance-projections-from-jim-keller

 

[atomsymbol]

We'll believe it when we see it.

If the previously leaked slide about Nirvana (Zen 5) is accurate, then Zen 5 has (compared to Zen 4):

- up to +100% more basic blocks fetched per clock cycle
- +50% more ALUs
- +33% more L1D loads per clock cycle
- +33% higher dispatch per clock cycle
- +50% larger L1D cache
- 16-core CCX => L3 cache size might be different or there is no hyper-threading

If the above is true, then the claims about 40% higher performance in a fairly large subset of benchmarks are also true.

 

[HardReset]

Yes, he left in 2015, but he commented on Zen 5 possible performance uplift last year.

https://www.extremetech.com/computi...re-predicts-zen-5-will-offer-huge-performance
https://www.tomshardware.com/news/jim-keller-shares-zen5-performance-projections-kind-of
https://videocardz.com/newz/amd-zen5-architecture-gets-performance-projections-from-jim-keller

He did but since he doesn't work for AMD, those are just pure guesses and nothing else. Therefore I don't give those comments any value.

 

[Puiu]

I'm more realistically expecting about 20-30% depending on the application and/or game. They might hit 40% in very specific scenarios, but I doubt it will be something the average Joe will benefit from.