European Union will ban new gas-powered car sales by 2035

[PriyaWalia]

In a nutshell: European Union lawmakers recently approved legislation that effectively outlaws the sale of new gasoline- and diesel-powered cars in member nations starting in 2035. The ban is one of the most aggressive actions yet by a major economy to expedite the shift to electric vehicles.

On Tuesday, the European Parliament formally approved a law that forbids the sale of new petrol and diesel cars in the European Union beginning in 2035. The idea is to hasten the transition to electric vehicles and fight climate change. Despite resistance from conservative MEPs, the largest party in the parliament, EU member states have previously approved the legislation and will now formally nod it into law.

The unprecedented regulations mandate that automakers achieve a 100-percent reduction in CO2 emissions from newly sold cars by 2035, thereby banning the sale of new fossil fuel vehicles in 27 nations. The move will further strengthen the European Union's plan to become a "climate neutral" economy with net-zero greenhouse gas emissions by 2050.

The legislation's supporters claimed they would provide European automakers with a concrete timeline for transitioning to zero-emission electric vehicles and encourage investment to fend off competition from China and the United States.

"Let me remind you that between last year and the end of this year, China will bring 80 models of electric cars to the international market," EU vice president Frans Timmermans warned Union members.

Opponents argue the move would put hundreds of thousands of jobs at risk, and neither European industry nor many private motorists are prepared for such a drastic reduction in the production of internal combustion engine vehicles. Germany and conservative MEPs have expressed skepticism about the new regulations citing complications in retooling factories and training the workforce, while international competitors have more flexible goals. Several companies were already vying for a position in the race to become global leaders in electric vehicles, so the European auto industry did not vigorously push against the bill.

Meanwhile, the United States has disclosed a massive plan to subsidize the green transition of its economy with government handouts since the law started its journey through the EU parliamentary process. This action has raised European concerns that its US competitors will siphon off investments and jobs in the electric vehicle and battery manufacturing industries.

People are slowly but surely ditching their gas-guzzling vehicles in favor of electric models as the latter becomes more and more affordable. In fact, 12 percent of all new cars sold in the European Union are electric. Meanwhile, China plans to increase EV usage and decrease gas vehicle sales to a 50/50 split by 2035.

Image credit: Ivan Radic

Permalink to story.

https://www.techspot.com/news/97607-eu-lawmakers-ban-new-gasoline-powered-car-sales.html

 

[Theinsanegamer]

Europe can barely make enough electricity to keep their current grid from collapsing, and germany is still in the process of shuttering their nukes in favor of COAL.

What a "green" future. Totally no alternative actions that would have far greater impact, like not shipping everything from china, no siree.

 

[takaozo]

How on earth will the young lads are supposed to impress girls if no V6,V8 or V12 will be sold?
Oh hold on they don't say anything about motorcycles or tricycles.

 

[dangh]

Imo that's a great idea. Those cars are much quieter, and you can walk on the side of a street without aroma overload. The only issue I have with it is how they see the truck transport addressed, but in next 10 years I'm sure batteries will get much better, and maybe they will do smarter thing and expand railroads to speed up long distance transport.

 

[return]

Manufacturing batteries for these cars create more pollution and waste.

 

[dangh]

How on earth will the young lads are supposed to impress girls if no V6,V8 or V12 will be sold?

Oh no, they will have to actually speak to women and be nice to them!
O tempora, o mores!

 

[Theinsanegamer]

Imo that's a great idea. Those cars are much quieter, and you can walk on the side of a street without aroma overload. The only issue I have with it is how they see the truck transport addressed, but in next 10 years I'm sure batteries will get much better, and maybe they will do smarter thing and expand railroads to speed up long distance transport.

These cars are also far more expensive, the manufacture of their batteries is a filthy, slave filled business that causes pollution far WORSE then CO2, and we've been hearing "oh I hope batteries are better in 10 years" for 15 years now. Dont forget how expensive replacement batteries are, and how they need indoor parking to avoid excessive battery wear (you know, that thing that is infamously expensive in europe?)

 

[takaozo]

Oh no, they will have to actually speak to women and be nice to them!
O tempora, o mores!

Young ones don't interact direct anymore, they use Twiter, Whatsapp or other chat.
Even sitting at the same table. I begin to see this more and more in the last years.

 

[dangh]

These cars are also far more expensive, the manufacture of their batteries is a filthy, slave filled business that causes pollution far WORSE then CO2, and we've been hearing "oh I hope batteries are better in 10 years" for 15 years now. Dont forget how expensive replacement batteries are, and how they need indoor parking to avoid excessive battery wear (you know, that thing that is infamously expensive in europe?)

Crude oil extraction is already slave filled business (who do you think OPEC uses for physical work?), so this isn't much of a difference. Still, should be addressed (but not many people want to address current issue, FIFA in Quatar was a 'success' and noone cared how many died)
Pollution isn't any worse than in the Crude oil processing. And the maintenance of an EV do not require regular oil change, which by itself is quite an advantage.
Batteries now are GREATLY better than 15 years ago - batteries density tripled from 2010, and cost fell down 87% from 2010 to 2019:

Eternally five years away? No, batteries are improving under your nose

Under the hood, lithium-ion batteries have gotten better in the last decade.

arstechnica.com

Cost of batteries replacement went down as well obviously, and will be getting lower and lower as the EV cars get more popular.
And no, I don't see indoor parking infamously expansive here, as for battery wear new EV have liquid cooling system, which helps in extreme temperatures.

 

[m4a4]

Manufacturing batteries for these cars create more pollution and waste.

Yeah, but that's not done in the EU, so it's green and it's fine. /s

 

[wiyosaya]

Manufacturing batteries for these cars create more pollution and waste.

Crude oil extraction is already slave filled business (who do you think OPEC uses for physical work?), so this isn't much of a difference. Still, should be addressed (but not many people want to address current issue, FIFA in Quatar was a 'success' and noone cared how many died)
Pollution isn't any worse than in the Crude oil processing. And the maintenance of an EV do not require regular oil change, which by itself is quite an advantage.
Batteries now are GREATLY better than 15 years ago - batteries density tripled from 2010, and cost fell down 87% from 2010 to 2019:

Eternally five years away? No, batteries are improving under your nose

Under the hood, lithium-ion batteries have gotten better in the last decade.

arstechnica.com

Cost of batteries replacement went down as well obviously, and will be getting lower and lower as the EV cars get more popular.
And no, I don't see indoor parking infamously expansive here, as for battery wear new EV have liquid cooling system, which helps in extreme temperatures.

Yeah, but that's not done in the EU, so it's green and it's fine. /s

You could actually figure this out for yourselves if you had the will to find the research that confers the truth, but I get it. Its easier to repost myths and lies than discern truth. https://www.epa.gov/greenvehicles/e...nergy required to manufacture an EV’s battery. Now I am sure that will meet with your entire skepticism since it is a web site from the Deep State.
So here's another https://www.pcmag.com/opinions/electric-vs-gas-cars-what-are-the-hidden-environmental-costs-of-evs
And another https://climate.mit.edu/ask-mit/how-much-co2-emitted-manufacturing-batteries

Shall I go on? My guess is that the answer is no because of refusal to see anything outside of what fits your world view; therefore, I won't bother. Keep spreading your crap, and have fun while dooing it. (Misspelling intended).

And BTW - here's another battery technology in a trial phase. https://graphenemg.com/energy-storage-solutions/aluminum-ion-battery/ To think battery technology is stagnant and will never move away from Lithium is rather short-sighted, IMO.

 

[dhiaa]

Imo that's a great idea. Those cars are much quieter, and you can walk on the side of a street without aroma overload. The only issue I have with it is how they see the truck transport addressed, but in next 10 years I'm sure batteries will get much better, and maybe they will do smarter thing and expand railroads to speed up long distance transport.

On the topic of noise, your point is inaccurate, because the vast majority of noise cars generate is tire noise, not engine noise. Electric cars will do very little to make cities quieter, the exception possibly being garbage trucks and other heavy transport.

 

[m4a4]

You could actually figure this out for yourselves if you had the will to find the research that confers the truth, but I get it. Its easier to repost myths and lies than discern truth. https://www.epa.gov/greenvehicles/electric-vehicle-myths#:~:text=Some studies have shown that making a typical,additional energy required to manufacture an EV’s battery. Now I am sure that will meet with your entire skepticism since it is a web site from the Deep State.
So here's another https://www.pcmag.com/opinions/electric-vs-gas-cars-what-are-the-hidden-environmental-costs-of-evs
And another https://climate.mit.edu/ask-mit/how-much-co2-emitted-manufacturing-batteries

Shall I go on? My guess is that the answer is no because of refusal to see anything outside of what fits your world view; therefore, I won't bother. Keep spreading your crap, and have fun while dooing it. (Misspelling intended).

And BTW - here's another battery technology in a trial phase. https://graphenemg.com/energy-storage-solutions/aluminum-ion-battery/ To think battery technology is stagnant and will never move away from Lithium is rather short-sighted, IMO.

Typical. I wasn't just talking about CO2 when mining for lithium. Last I checked, the environment isn't only affected by CO2. Not mined in my country, not my problem, right?

My call out was that it's not nearly as green as activists and bandwaggoners like you would like to pretend. Especially when the grids can't handle current expectations without "dirty" energy.

Such hard rules should be made when the tech and infrastructure is better able to handle such impractical expectations, not on promises and fairies and unmaterialized battery tech and rainbows lol

So, try again. You obviously didn't understand the assignment.

 

[AlaskaGuy]

Just when you thought the EU couldn't get anymore 1diotic than it already is.

 

[Dimitrios]

Maybe we should focus on evil greedy soulless leaders around the world that have a fetish for war. With what's going on the last 2-3 years we will be lucky to still have this planet in 10 or so years.

Now I have this odd urge to play that FALLOUT game that's been sitting in my STEAM library for many years.

 

[dangh]

You could actually figure this out for yourselves if you had the will to find the research that confers the truth, but I get it. Its easier to repost myths and lies than discern truth. https://www.epa.gov/greenvehicles/electric-vehicle-myths#:~:text=Some studies have shown that making a typical,additional energy required to manufacture an EV’s battery. Now I am sure that will meet with your entire skepticism since it is a web site from the Deep State.
So here's another https://www.pcmag.com/opinions/electric-vs-gas-cars-what-are-the-hidden-environmental-costs-of-evs
And another https://climate.mit.edu/ask-mit/how-much-co2-emitted-manufacturing-batteries

Shall I go on? My guess is that the answer is no because of refusal to see anything outside of what fits your world view; therefore, I won't bother. Keep spreading your crap, and have fun while dooing it. (Misspelling intended).

And BTW - here's another battery technology in a trial phase. https://graphenemg.com/energy-storage-solutions/aluminum-ion-battery/ To think battery technology is stagnant and will never move away from Lithium is rather short-sighted, IMO.

There are interesting points, like how many CO2 produces mining of Lithium, and what temperature Lithium have to be heated to to shape it. All is true, process is not ecologically - friendly, but neither is the process of collecting and transporting crude oil:
https://innovationorigins.com/en/producing-gasoline-and-diesel-emits-more-co2-than-we-thought/
a tone of mined Lithium creates 15 tons of co2 according to mit article you linked.
As per article above, 1 liter of petrol emits 3.1 kg of CO2.
Batteries in a car takes lets say 200kg of lithium. CO2 cost of that is 3 tones.
3 tones of CO2 is around 1000 liters of petrol.
Batteries will last lets say 10 years of driving. How long will last 1000 liters of petrol? (5l/100km gives you 20 000 km, that is not too much...) I think it is self-explanatory, and thanks for links proving it.

Remember, that a car engine made from steel requires 1400C, it is more than nickel. Overall, while electric cars aren't perfectly clean, they are still significantly more environmental friendly than combustion vehicles.

 

[dangh]

On the topic of noise, your point is inaccurate, because the vast majority of noise cars generate is tire noise, not engine noise. Electric cars will do very little to make cities quieter, the exception possibly being garbage trucks and other heavy transport.

Have you heard some motorcycles outside? or diesel engine in 10 years olg mercedes? Sure, on a highway noise is from the wind and wheels, but in estates your neighbor starting his old mustang at the morning wakes you up not because of the old tires

 

[RudyBob]

Oh I feel so good. The air is fresher, the sun is brighter and my boner is harder. Thanks EU

 

[Entrylevel]

Typical. I wasn't just talking about CO2 when mining for lithium. Last I checked, the environment isn't only affected by CO2. Not mined in my country, not my problem, right?

My call out was that it's not nearly as green as activists and bandwaggoners like you would like to pretend. Especially when the grids can't handle current expectations without "dirty" energy.

Such hard rules should be made when the tech and infrastructure is better able to handle such impractical expectations, not on promises and fairies and unmaterialized battery tech and rainbows lol

So, try again. You obviously didn't understand the assignment.

And it's not as dirty as naysayers would have you believe either. As always, the truth is somewhat more complicated.

And you're right, it's not just about CO2, and one thing we do know is that there are significant number of excess deaths linked to current non-CO2 vehicle emissions (e.g. https://www.gov.uk/government/news/public-health-england-publishes-air-pollution-evidence-review)

There's always a chicken and egg problem with infrastructure: e.g. there's no one building charging infrastructure because there aren't enough cars to justify it, and people aren't buying cars because of range anxiety. Regulation is one lever that governments have to stimulate/accelerate this change, which is exactly what they are trying here - and I don't think the rule is as "hard" as the headlines make it appear.

Also, alongside reducing ICE cars there should be moves to look at better city design, effective public mass transport, green energy production, reducing/more efficient energy consumption, synthetic/alternative combustible fuels, and the consumer behaviours more generally.

Of course electric cars aren't a silver bullet, but they're definitely part of the solution in a way the traditional ICE cars can't be. And remember that this is reporting on a piece of legislation aimed at sales in the EU, so understandably it is only limited to things within their jurisdiction.

 

[3volv3d]

How on earth will the young lads are supposed to impress girls if no V6,V8 or V12 will be sold?
Oh hold on they don't say anything about motorcycles or tricycles.

What with feminism the way it is, who gives a F... if girls are impressed. But you seem to have this backwards, girls are impressed by cars that say money. Have you seen the price of an Electric car ? I think they will be impressed, and can you not change the sound of the engine to sound like a V12, Formula one, or even a choo choo train ?

You could actually figure this out for yourselves if you had the will to find the research that confers the truth, but I get it. Its easier to repost myths and lies than discern truth. https://www.epa.gov/greenvehicles/e...nergy required to manufacture an EV’s battery. Now I am sure that will meet with your entire skepticism since it is a web site from the Deep State.
So here's another https://www.pcmag.com/opinions/electric-vs-gas-cars-what-are-the-hidden-environmental-costs-of-evs
And another https://climate.mit.edu/ask-mit/how-much-co2-emitted-manufacturing-batteries

Shall I go on? My guess is that the answer is no because of refusal to see anything outside of what fits your world view; therefore, I won't bother. Keep spreading your crap, and have fun while dooing it. (Misspelling intended).

And BTW - here's another battery technology in a trial phase. https://graphenemg.com/energy-storage-solutions/aluminum-ion-battery/ To think battery technology is stagnant and will never move away from Lithium is rather short-sighted, IMO.

Don't know who you are quoting, and responding to in regards to the lithium. But would I doubt a govt website, sure I would. Hydrogen cars are doable but doesn't the oil dorks hold the patent so that it can not be viable while they still ruin the planet but make bank ?
And lithium from the sea was destroying eco systems, but then so would making a whole bunch of wind farms in the oceans. So it all comes at cost.

End of the day its a pretty pointless exercise, we will still have too many cars on the roads because you freakin humans won't stop breeding. Luckily America and China are antagonizing each other over some balloons, so maybe there will be some room.

 

[m4a4]

There's always a chicken and egg problem with infrastructure: e.g. there's no one building charging infrastructure because there aren't enough cars to justify it, and people aren't buying cars because of range anxiety. Regulation is one lever that governments have to stimulate/accelerate this change, which is exactly what they are trying here - and I don't think the rule is as "hard" as the headlines make it appear.

I was talking about the grid (since it always seems to be the weak link). Doesn't matter if you have the best charging infrastructure in the world if you can't properly power it.

If gov't was more effective in meeting/anticipating grid demand, we wouldn't have that argument against these rules that will skyrocket EV demand.

Too many cities and areas that championed renewable green energy over common sense have reports of rolling blackouts at some point in the year (California being the easiest one to reference lol).
I can get maybe having that for a season as things are understood, but it's been a problem for years in some areas. It only goes against this mindset when politicians try to push for more reliance on the infrastructure just to pander...

 

[AlaskaGuy]

What with feminism the way it is, who gives a F... if girls are impressed. But you seem to have this backwards, girls are impressed by cars that say money. Have you seen the price of an Electric car ? I think they will be impressed, and can you not change the sound of the engine to sound like a V12, Formula one, or even a choo choo train ?

Don't know who you are quoting, and responding to in regards to the lithium. But would I doubt a govt website, sure I would. Hydrogen cars are doable but doesn't the oil dorks hold the patent so that it can not be viable while they still ruin the planet but make bank ?
And lithium from the sea was destroying eco systems, but then so would making a whole bunch of wind farms in the oceans. So it all comes at cost.

End of the day its a pretty pointless exercise, we will still have too many cars on the roads because you freakin humans won't stop breeding. Luckily America and China are antagonizing each other over some balloons, so maybe there will be some room.

Part of the Climate Cult eh.

And now a word from our EU middle school drop-out Climate Cult spokesperson fresh from her latest gig at Davos.

 

[Entrylevel]

I was talking about the grid (since it always seems to be the weak link). Doesn't matter if you have the best charging infrastructure in the world if you can't properly power it.

If gov't was more effective in meeting/anticipating grid demand, we wouldn't have that argument against these rules that will skyrocket EV demand.

Too many cities and areas that championed renewable green energy over common sense have reports of rolling blackouts at some point in the year (California being the easiest one to reference lol).
I can get maybe having that for a season as things are understood, but it's been a problem for years in some areas. It only goes against this mindset when politicians try to push for more reliance on the infrastructure just to pander...

Honestly that didn't cross my mind, and that's possibly a US problem, rather than one inherent with green energy (which does include Nuclear imho).

Here in the UK for example we have 20%+ energy from wind and the grid is able to compensate for the variability with other sources, and they are actively working to upgrade the grid to cope with new energy sources and different demand profiles (

). We've already started using variable tarifs people can opt in to that encourage people to use energy when there is an excess of wind/solar and cut back when demand is high.

The supply is solid, our (current) government just screws us by prioritising supplier profits over maintianing reasonable bills for the citizens.

 

[Entrylevel]

Part of the Climate Cult eh.

Even if you’re not a fan of the “face” of the current green movement (I personally think it is irrelevant), literally every credible scientist world-wide supports the concept of man made climate change and the serious repercussions it’s going to have on us. I don't really get where you've got the idea it's some sort of cult from?

 

[AlaskaGuy]

Even if you’re not a fan of the “face” of the current green movement (I personally think it is irrelevant), literally every credible scientist world-wide supports the concept of man made climate change and the serious repercussions it’s going to have on us. I don't really get where you've got the idea it's some sort of cult from?

You mean the scientist that didn't get deplatformed by the Climate Cult.