Gamers are ditching Radeon graphics cards over driver issues

ClockRocket

TS Rookie
Thanks for bringing this up! I had a Red Devil 5700 XT for about two months. Luckily, I had an extended return window through Amazon, which let me get out of it without losing any money.

My issue with the card was very different from most. I have an ASUS PCE AC56 WiFi card installed in my desktop. Never had a problem with it in 6 years. When I installed the 5700 XT, it would somehow disable my wifi card. The workaround was to power discharge the PC for around 5-10 minutes and turn it back on. However, if there was a reboot, the wifi would get disabled again. I reinstalled my old GTX 1060, everything was fine. Reinstall the 5700 XT,WiFi stopped working. And it would stop working prior to the driver install, so it wasn't a driver issue.

I am not sure if it was just that card, or if all of the 5700 XTs would do that. But I already dealt with it for 2 months, I wasn't going to roll the dice again. Now I am just waiting patiently for Ampere.
 

Evernessince

地獄らしい人間動物園
Thanks for bringing this up! I had a Red Devil 5700 XT for about two months. Luckily, I had an extended return window through Amazon, which let me get out of it without losing any money.

My issue with the card was very different from most. I have an ASUS PCE AC56 WiFi card installed in my desktop. Never had a problem with it in 6 years. When I installed the 5700 XT, it would somehow disable my wifi card. The workaround was to power discharge the PC for around 5-10 minutes and turn it back on. However, if there was a reboot, the wifi would get disabled again. I reinstalled my old GTX 1060, everything was fine. Reinstall the 5700 XT,WiFi stopped working. And it would stop working prior to the driver install, so it wasn't a driver issue.

I am not sure if it was just that card, or if all of the 5700 XTs would do that. But I already dealt with it for 2 months, I wasn't going to roll the dice again. Now I am just waiting patiently for Ampere.
I had the same problem with an ASUS PCE-AC68 and a 750 Ti. This was on my testing rig. The fix was to use newer broadcom drivers not provided by ASUS. Apparently a windows update caused the issue but ASUS never updated the drivers on it's website where as the chipset manufacturer did.
 

ScarletCat

TS Rookie
My first graphics card back in like 2004 was a AMD card. The drivers were so bad then that I got a Nvidia card and have only been buying Nvidia for the last 16 years...

I believe the brand of my AMD card was XFX.
 

Koguma

TS Rookie
It's kinda funny, but the reason the I left Nvidia years ago was due to fact they just stop supporting features of older cards in newer drivers. Sure, their drivers work better, but for older cards that reason is because they just cut things off they no longer wish to support.
Ever since then, I've switched to AMD. While ATI drivers and cards were generally a dumpster fire, I haven't had huge issues with AMD cards, and definitely not something that DDU wasn't able to solve.

I do agree though that AMD needs to get their **** together on drivers. Some of their long standing bugs are still open. I wouldn't go as far as not recommending their cards though. Know what you're getting and expect to be using DDU at some point.
 

Koguma

TS Rookie
How many of those people have used DDU utility to remove driver remnants from the OS that are quite possibly causing these recurrent issues in the first place?
AMD brought out numerous major driver updates before 2020 update but people apparently expect these driver versions to 'seamlessly' update themselves and function without problems.

Wrong.
Many driver problems stem from outdated drivers and their remnants in the OS.
The recommended course of action is that if you are changing GPU's, you NEED to run DDU to remove old drivers from the OS completely, and then clean install latest ones for the GPU you have in the system.
Similar thing applies when installing major driver updates.
For smaller updates between drivers, DDU removal and clean install is not needed, but for MAJOR driver iterations, it is common sense to run DDU to remove old drivers and their remnants followed by clean installing LATEST drivers.

Also, it doesn't hurt to have latest chipset drivers, and sometimes even that the BIOS is updated (sometimes if you install really new hw on an older mobo without BIOS updates, it can actually cause problems down the line - not always of course).

People were suggesting use of DDU for a LONG time now... whether its for NV or AMD.
I've been using AMD drivers for a long time now like this without problems... and the people for whom I've set up their PC's with AMD gpu's and drivers, they also haven't had problems.
Frankly, I think AMD should just buy DDU and bundle it into their driver installs.
DDU is an absolute necessity with AMD. Unfortunately, that means that NVIDIA has a better driver update system. In essence, that's pretty much all it is.
If you can't be bothered to use DDU then get an NVIDIA, but just so people know, DDU supports NVIDIA as well. They're not 100% immune from driver detritus either. 🤣
 

m3tavision

TS Evangelist
Look at how many brand new nVidia fans have appeared here, because of this article.

So many new faces, that are just badmouthing AMD out of nowhere. As if these people didn't have accounts anywhere, on any forums, until they bought a 5700..? Who are all these people, that everyone is claiming is having a new Adrenalin issue?

Even the people on reddit with legit issues, are finding out it's a hardware conflict, and/or an actual bad card (bad memory). Or they don't cycle their monitor after new freesync updates, etc.
 
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m3tavision

TS Evangelist
To the AMD defence league who are in full damage control mode at the moment *cough* evernessince, *cough* metavision.

If you are still struggling with the really very basic concept that your beloved AMD is letting the industry down.

Are you really going to continue to bury your heads in the sand? Or will you finally admit that there is quite obviously a problem. It’s becoming quite widely reported at this point. AMD themselves even appear to have acknowledged the problems.
How many Adrenalin driver have released in the last 5 weeks, since video...?

20.1.2
20.1.3
20.1.4
20.2.1
 
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treetops

TS Evangelist
The thing is even when you could opt out of radeon settings (wattman). If you ever installed it. It still lingered, despite ddu. According to one of the driver notes. idk if that was ever corrected.

I wonder how many issues would disappear without it. I currently only have a prob in one game. And with radeon settings if I decide to do some high end ocing.

Not to say I have no had other issues in the past. always be sure to check the most recent driver notes and hit up tech support, they actually do help from time to time.
 
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From the article

"the poll suggests that 48% of all AMD users have suffered major issues, while we see less than half that figure for Nvidia users at 22%. "

The poll is the only thing I have a problem with. Everything else is fine and this is an issue that needs to be fixed ASAP. It does hurt AMD's reputation and should never have happened.
I still don't understand how you have issue with the 48% figure when you yourself should have been included in it. You were suggesting using a stable driver that is 2 months old, meaning there are serious problems with drivers that have been releasing in the past 2 months.
The question with the poll was:
"With your CURRENT graphics card, have you experienced any serious GPU driver issues in its lifetime? This might include persistent game crashes, black screens, system hangs, broken features, fan issues, clock speed issues, etc."
Maybe 5% of AMD user might have had game crashes, black screen, system hangs; but pretty much the majority of AMD users are suffering from the broken feature (enhanced sync, freesync, PCIe 4.0, Wattman, etc...), fan issues (widely reported), clock speed issues (low 1080p performances).

48% of users having problems does not mean 48% RMA rate, but it lead to a higher RMA than necessary for sure. If you love reading customers feedback on Newegg/amazon, there are plenty of verified reviews on the premium models of 5700XT that go like "game crash/broken driver, return the card for an 2060S/2070S". Of course users with non-returnable cards will just have to live with their purchases. As AdoredTV pointed out, this is anti consumer behavior from AMD and should be addressed before the next generation of GPU coming out.
Or at least reduce the price the justify the additional headaches, I had no problem buying the R9 290 despite its flaws before.
 
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theruck

TS Addict
The day I swapped my R9 270x for a RX470 I started to have freezes and sudden reboots. it took me like 2 weeks to find the right combination of drivers and software to keep it stable. shame on AMD
 

Evernessince

地獄らしい人間動物園
I still don't understand how you have issue with the 48% figure when you yourself should have been included in it. You were suggesting using a stable driver that is 2 months old, meaning there are serious problems with drivers that have been releasing in the past 2 months.
The question with the poll was:
"With your CURRENT graphics card, have you experienced any serious GPU driver issues in its lifetime? This might include persistent game crashes, black screens, system hangs, broken features, fan issues, clock speed issues, etc."
Maybe 5% of AMD user might have had game crashes, black screen, system hangs; but pretty much the majority of AMD users are suffering from the broken feature (enhanced sync, freesync, PCIe 4.0, Wattman, etc...), fan issues (widely reported), clock speed issues (low 1080p performances).

48% of users having problems does not mean 48% RMA rate, but it lead to a higher RMA than necessary for sure. If you love reading customers feedback on Newegg/amazon, there are plenty of verified reviews on the premium models of 5700XT that go like "game crash/broken driver, return the card for an 2060S/2070S". Of course users with non-returnable cards will just have to live with their purchases. As AdoredTV pointed out, this is anti consumer behavior from AMD and should be addressed before the next generation of GPU coming out.
Or at least reduce the price the justify the additional headaches, I had no problem buying the R9 290 despite its flaws before.
You keep telling me to read the reviews but there's 0% chance you read enough reviews to draw on a conclusion on the 5700 /5700 XT models in general. Unless you are able to read and compile examples as links or all togther, you are submitting nothing more then a mere observation without any hard data to back it up. Anyone can cherry pick a few reviews to fit a narrative. The thing with overall review scores from verified owners is that they are hard data that show an overall overage and give you an idea of the quality of a product. It's a far more valuable metric then an observation.

As a person submitted earlier in this thread, this poll was flawed from how it was conducted, to the questions asked, to the limited audience that could actually take it. It should not be used as a factual basis for anything, period. I should also point out, anyone involved with creating the poll should not vote in said poll (as clearly happened if you look at the article screen shots). Whether they realize it or not, they may be unduly influenced to push for the outcome they expect to happen. After all, they created that poll for a reason and they are much more likely to vote in accordance with that goal, whether they realize it or not. This is just one example. This poll does not measure up to anything that could be considered good data.
 
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We always called them ATI even after the name change because that's what they were when we first started using them. And yes in your own words, you assumed they were for our PCs.
Maybe I did because you did not explitly state where they were used but mentioned your home PC in the same statement, so I assumed the type of system based on that.
Appears to be a case of misunderstanding.
So, to clear things up: were the cards sold directly by ATI / AMD (I.e. branded and not e.g. Sapphire cards) as you mentioned ATI / AMD customer support?
 
To the AMD defence league who are in full damage control mode at the moment *cough* evernessince, *cough* metavision.

If you are still struggling with the really very basic concept that your beloved AMD is letting the industry down.

Watch this;


Are you really going to continue to bury your heads in the sand? Or will you finally admit that there is quite obviously a problem. It’s becoming quite widely reported at this point. AMD themselves even appear to have acknowledged the problems.
What's with the "beloved" crap? It's a company I personally prefer to others but it's still that - a company. And as such, I expect them to provide a product that does its job for a competitive price. I would in no way tolerate the supposed issues described here - the card would be an RMA very quickly.

That said, I do not have these issues and never had them. Neither the person writing this article nor any of the people they know have these problems as stated.

So why should anyone who is not seeing this issue and not knowing anyone who does raise hell with AMD to fix this. Based on what?

If I did I would return the card and let AMD know they need to do better if they wanted my money but my RX 550 worked flawlessly, the iGPU in my Ryzen 2500u does, whatever was in my old Bulldozer laptop did (same for my wife's laptop) and now the RX5500XT in my new PC does.

Maybe I got lucky but that's four out of four going back years, so what should I complain about?
 

Ludak021

TS Enthusiast
Look at how many brand new nVidia fans have appeared here, because of this article.

So many new faces, that are just badmouthing AMD out of nowhere. As if these people didn't have accounts anywhere, on any forums, until they bought a 5700..? Who are all these people, that everyone is claiming is having a new Adrenalin issue?

Even the people on reddit with legit issues, are finding out it's a hardware conflict, and/or an actual bad card (bad memory). Or they don't cycle their monitor after new freesync updates, etc.
You have no idea how hard is to register on TS these days. Hell, I made an account long time ago, and then with new firefox versions that block tracking and intrusive cookies I could no longer log in here. So these new users might be old readers, you don't need account to read stuff here. This article probably provoked some of them to make an account to comment.

As for the other stuff you wrote, I agree. Just keep in mind that there are basic users that buy card install drivers, use the card. It stops working, starts working again, then stops again, then older drivers don't work either, they RMA. They don't need to know where exactly the issue is, not their job.

edit: also pushing 5600xt, that went through factory overclock last minute, out of spec, is being recommended here widely. That certainly doesn't help the issue. (don't ask me about the details, you have an usual hour long video on GN about it)
 

Dynamho

TS Rookie
I recently started using an old R9 270 I had lying around (it never got much use to begin with). As I am going thru various driver updates with it, it seemed like fan was having issues (stuttering?), and I was getting some black screens. Well at some point, my connected flat screen went black and never came back on, even after I disconnected it. Connected another flat screen, went thru some more driver updates and now everything seems fine. Is it possible that the graphics card destroyed the first tv? Can GPU's do that to tv's/monitors?
Yes it can!!!!!!!!
The computer is grounded and TV's/monitors aren't and a high voltage difference will exist between the computer ground and the TV/monitor ground.
HDMI cables are grounded so when you connect it, the computer ground pulls power from the monitor. This means every time you connect or disconnect the HDMI cable, it sparks and at some point could damage the video card or the monitor.
There is two ways to deal with this, 1 unplug everything and then connect the HDMI or 2 ground the monitor/TV.
Grounding a TV is easy, just buy a powerbar with coax connectors and run a cable from it to the antenna connection on the back of the set.
Grounding a monitor is much more complex because it is a two prong powered device.
The goal is to some how run a wire from the monitors frame to the power line ground, but this requires good electronics skills.
So the Tv option is the safest and DIY.
 

poohbear

TS Evangelist
I haven't owned a Radeon/ATI card in well over a decade...maybe 15 years ago for one of my first systems...driver issues were an issue back then, sad to see this continue in 2020. I was really considering Navi for my next upgrade as AMD has come a long way the past 2-3 years. But as awesome as the hardware might be, if the software isn't up to snuff, then there's no point in buying it . :( I love competition, but it's gotta be competitive. C'mon AMD, you can do better!
 

Boshum

TS Booster
Yes it can!!!!!!!!
The computer is grounded and TV's/monitors aren't and a high voltage difference will exist between the computer ground and the TV/monitor ground.
HDMI cables are grounded so when you connect it, the computer ground pulls power from the monitor. This means every time you connect or disconnect the HDMI cable, it sparks and at some point could damage the video card or the monitor.
There is two ways to deal with this, 1 unplug everything and then connect the HDMI or 2 ground the monitor/TV.
Grounding a TV is easy, just buy a powerbar with coax connectors and run a cable from it to the antenna connection on the back of the set.
Grounding a monitor is much more complex because it is a two prong powered device.
The goal is to some how run a wire from the monitors frame to the power line ground, but this requires good electronics skills.
So the Tv option is the safest and DIY.
This happened after everything had already been connected and working.
 

kcwilsonii

TS Rookie
Driver issues have always been AMD's problem. I did the same thing and tried AMD years ago, but regularly ran into driver problems. Switched to NVIDIA and rarely have any problems these days and their driver support is excellent.

Actually looking forward to Intel putting out a discrete GPU. Their stuff tends to be pretty solid hardware and driver wise. NVIDIA has been pricing GPUs too high with little upside to all the money you could spend for several years. Hoping pricing and competition starts bringing better value to dollar spent.
 

Dynamho

TS Rookie
This happened after everything had already been connected and working.
Electronics fail in strange ways, sometimes you get sparks and flames and other times you get intermitent unexplained problems.
The fact is that you at some point conneted a grounded device to an ungrounded device!
The manufatures manuals suggest unpluging everthing before connecting equipment but they don't say why!.
I am a electronics technician and have grounded all of my eletronics to avoid this problem.
If your interested, do a google search for sparking HDMI or sparking USB and you will see the destruction going on when conneting grounded to ungrounded devices.
 

N30phyte

TS Rookie
I'll always be an NVIDIA consumer. I've tried the old ATI Diamond cards and all the red cards in between, but drivers have always been awful. AMD took over and the driver software really didn't get any better. I haven't really had any issues with the hardware at all. AMD really should try some new progressive strategies with their software development team.
Same here, I joined to say this. "AMD" or Radion more accurately, have had terrible drivers since ATI owned it. I had high hopes, as an AMD CPU fanboy for years, that the AMD purchase of the product would yield good drivers given time. That seems not to have been the case, and while I still purchase AMD CPUs, I refuse to install their video cards. It's really sad, because some of their product lines have been far superior to nvidia offerings but for the lack of solid drivers.

The conspiracy theorist in me almost believes that there is code in place either natively in Windows or in some nvidia/intel driver which purposefully destabilizes their cards. I just don't see how they can be so good in other aspects yet consistently botch the drivers, ruining the user experience. The other thought I have is that the driver writers are still the same people they were with ATI, and should have long since been replaced.