Tesla robotaxis crash within days of Austin pilot launch

[integr8d]

This is highly deceptive. I recommend not citing this. Here's why:

They were not Tesla customers as you say. They were "consumers" in general "weighted by education, race, gender, age, income, geography, and political preference". We were not told what the weights were (the report didn't even say they were weighted to match EV buyers).

They were also not shown Tesla's marketing. Tesla's marketing names the feature "Full Self-Driving (Supervised)" while the survey says that the feature is named "Full Self-Driving". So even worse, they're misrepresenting Tesla's marketing, using a different name that probably would be illegal. See for yourself that in this page alone, Tesla names the feature over 10 times as "Full Self-Driving (Supervised)": https://www.tesla.com/fsd

I haven’t check the author of this arti… No. I don’t recognize him… But this site has a particular bent.

Yes, Tesla screwed up with ‘Autopilot’ in the early days. And even then, they screwed only up by using the misconception of autopilot. Actual autopilot only maintains heading and altitude (auto-land is relatively brand new).

FSD, however, is freaking fantastic. It’s like a relatively new driver. You do have to babysit it. But it does so much so well. You just kinda know when to pay attention and when to let it do its thing. And I’m on Gen 3 hardware with a 2022/23 model Y.

That said, I don’t think LIDAR is necessary. I DO however wish they would adopt SWIR cameras in place of RGB (or use both).

 

[Plutoisaplanet]

I haven’t check the author of this arti… No. I don’t recognize him… But this site has a particular bent.

Yes, Tesla screwed up with ‘Autopilot’ in the early days. And even then, they screwed only up by using the misconception of autopilot. Actual autopilot only maintains heading and altitude (auto-land is relatively brand new).

FSD, however, is freaking fantastic. It’s like a relatively new driver. You do have to babysit it. But it does so much so well. You just kinda know when to pay attention and when to let it do its thing. And I’m on Gen 3 hardware with a 2022/23 model Y.

That said, I don’t think LIDAR is necessary. I DO however wish they would adopt SWIR cameras in place of RGB (or use both).

Fyi, before gen 4 they never used RGB outside of the rear camera. In fact they first used used an RCCC, then RCCB color filter in front of its image sensors (red-clear-clear-blue). That improved low-light visibility at the cost of color accuracy and most likely would include some infrared light. But with HW4 upgraded their cameras and switched to a Bayer filter (RGGB, common in cameras) and it appears to have excellent low light visibility without sacrificing color accuracy.

 

[wiyosaya]

Obviously the plan for any autonomous taxi service is to make it cheaper than everything besides public transit while offering privacy. The safety monitors will be removed once Robotaxis are safe enough to constantly operate on their own. If you’re so curious about them, why don’t you learn more about them?

And fyi Tesla plans to start mass production of a $25k cybercab next year.

Maybe so, but this "negative publicity" does nothing for the fElon wet dream of beating everyone to market with a workable self-driving solution. Just the publicity alone is enough to make the intelligent people in the world think twice before going with fElon and Tesla's, so far, sub-par solution.

You can advocate for fElon and Tesla all you want, but the fact of the matter is that so far, Tesla is off to an extremely poor start with this effort to "corner the market", and since fElon is only interested in increasing his already obscene wealth, he and Tesla seem very unlikely to do anything meaningful to resolve the issues.

I feel sorry for you that you bought a Tesla.

By the way, I'll remind you that my 24' Prius Prime, when I put it into the equivalent of Tesla's "Self-Driving" (equivalent of Tesla's Autopilot) mode (which, BTW, comes standard on every Toyota these days - at no extra charge), is far from stupid enough to not slow down and stop when it "sees" stationary objects in its path. All I can say about this WRT Tesla's is WTF???

Based on @ScottSoapbox comments, if fElon was arrogant enough to think that Tesla would corner the market and thus went with an extremely hard to implement Visual solution because its equipment was less-expensive, all that has, so far IMO, done is demonstrate fElon's arrogance. IMO, that a visual solution is, perhaps, exponentially more difficult to implement, that is no excuse. Tesla/fElon obviously have the option to change how their piss-poor solution is implemented, but so far, have stuck to their decision as if they have to stick with it, for some reason, even if its only to save face. I worked for an extremely large global company that refused to change its decisions even if they realized that any such decision was wrong, and now that company is a figment of its former self.

The competition is catching up, and I have no doubt the competition will exceed anything that Tesla, so far, has crapped onto the market. Every day, I'm seeing more and more Priuii plug-ins on the streets and other EVs, too. Obviously, those people had an "opportunity" if you want to call it that, to buy a Tesla, but chose to buy something else.

 

[wiyosaya]

And fyi Tesla plans to start mass production of a $25k cybercab next year.

And fElon said he would be on Mars by now. fElon likes to shoot of his mouth about how he's doing this, how he's doing that, etc., but more often than not, misses his own deadlines.This, as @captaincranky mentioned, only seems to further demonstrate just how FOS fElon is.

 

[Plutoisaplanet]

Based on @ScottSoapbox comments, if fElon was arrogant enough to think that Tesla would corner the market and thus went with an extremely hard to implement Visual solution, all that has, so far IMO, done is demonstrate fElon's arrogance. IMO, that a visual solution is, perhaps, exponentially more difficult to implement, that is no excuse. Tesla/fElon obviously have the option to change how their piss-poor solution is implemented, but so far, have stuck to their decision as if they have to stick with it, for some reason, even if its only to save face. I worked for an extremely large global company that refused to change its decisions even if they realized that any such decision was wrong, and now that company is a figment of its former self.

You don't seem to understand then. Tesla is going with the camera only route because it does scale everywhere. That includes the cost, pre-mapping with LIDAR, and the ability to produce self-driving cars. Remember without a driver, the cost of a self-driving ride will effectively cost the price of the [vehicle + fuel + maintenance] / miles driven. If the cost of the vehicle is low and there is no driver, it will overtake any competition.

The competition is catching up, and I have no doubt the competition will exceed anything that Tesla, so far, has crapped onto the market. Every day, I'm seeing more and more Priuii plug-ins on the streets and other EVs, too. Obviously, those people had an "opportunity" if you want to call it that, to buy a Tesla, but chose to buy something else.

Let's see how many EVs the competition cancels in the US next year or if they "catch up".

And fElon said he would be on Mars by now. fElon likes to shoot of his mouth about how he's doing this, how he's doing that, etc., but more often than not, misses his own deadlines.This, as @captaincranky mentioned, only seems to further demonstrate just how FOS fElon is.

You're talking about a long term prediction, not a deadline lol. Tesla has already started work on the production lines of the Cybercab. But of course someone who says this wouldn't make assumptions:

Just the publicity alone is enough to make the intelligent people in the world think twice before going with fElon and Tesla's, so far, sub-par solution.

 

[captaincranky]

Obviously the plan for any autonomous taxi service is to make it cheaper than everything besides public transit while offering privacy. The safety monitors will be removed once Robotaxis are safe enough to constantly operate on their own. If you’re so curious about them, why don’t you learn more about them?

And fyi Tesla plans to start mass production of a $25k cybercab next year.

As of October 6th, I'll have been here for 20 years. In all that time, I've never been made aware of Musk meeting any of his predicted deadlines, or for that matter, his predicted prices.

As to your "FYI", I don't want or need to know anything more than I do now, about "robotaxis".

But FYI, Tesla is on a downward spiral, brought on by musk's meddling in the 2024 election. But he did prove one thing, that with enough money, you can even get a malignant narcissist, pathological liar, and sociopath elected POTUS.

As for why Musk built a factory in Texas, it's because he was given a sweetheart deal on taxes. Musk doesn't want to pay taxes. He wants you to pay taxes, and give him whatever money you might have leftover.

So, I'd suggest you take off your rose colored tech glasses, and see him for the slime bucket he really is.

AND, FWIW, Tesla sales are off way more in Europe than here in the US. Why? Because apparently, Europeans resent him trying to meddle in their elections, the way he did here. In fact, he came pretty close to being physically thrown out of Germany over election interference.

 

[Plutoisaplanet]

As of October 6th, I'll have been here for 20 years. In all that time, I've never been made aware of Musk meeting any of his predicted deadlines, or for that matter, his predicted prices.

You're obviously not aware of even when someone asks him a question unofficially that he tries to answer versus actual deadlines. Well since you don't be unaware of any, here are one the earliest (2013) and most recent ones (this year) he got right:
500,000 Tesla vehicles produced in 2020: https://www.theverge.com/2014/2/26/...-plans-to-build-battery-producing-gigafactory
Robotaxi launched in June 2025:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1889006561541882170

 

[wiyosaya]

You're obviously not aware of even when someone asks him a question unofficially that he tries to answer versus actual deadlines. Well since you don't be unaware of any, here are one the earliest (2013) and most recent ones (this year) he got right:
500,000 Tesla vehicles produced in 2020: https://www.theverge.com/2014/2/26/...-plans-to-build-battery-producing-gigafactory
Robotaxi launched in June 2025:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1889006561541882170

The threshold is achieving safety far in excess of the average human driver.

So far, that seems to be a high-bar he has not yet met.

I wonder what was so bad about the accidents that even the supervising driver could not prevent the accident from happening. So, right now, the "service" is undoubtedly more expensive than a taxi or a ride-hailing service.

 

[captaincranky]

You're obviously not aware of even when someone asks him a question unofficially that he tries to answer versus actual deadlines.

So then basically what you're saying is, he just makes sh!t up, ad hoc.

 

[wiyosaya]

So then basically what you're saying is, he just makes sh!t up, ad hoc.

Thats the fElon we both know and love!!

Makes sh!t up and leaves himself an out. Safer than a driver. Yeah, right.

 

[captaincranky]

@wiyosaya Even the headlines are baffling and appalling ......

"Tesla robotaxis launch in Austin with $4.20 invite-only service and human "safety monitors"
What's wrong with this picture?

Musk is "inviting" ** people to ride, (and possibly crash), in his robotaxis, and he still has the ballz to charge them.

** In his mind, this is an honor. In "social boxing" context, what this amounts to is, "always lead with your maximum effrontery". It gives me pause to wonder if he put the sink he marched through Twitter with on display at this, "gala".

 

[Plutoisaplanet]

So then basically what you're saying is, he just makes sh!t up, ad hoc.

You mean the process of thinking? You gave new meaning to my words, so you too made sh!t up just now.

So far, that seems to be a high-bar he has not yet met.

I wonder what was so bad about the accidents that even the supervising driver could not prevent the accident from happening. So, right now, the "service" is undoubtedly more expensive than a taxi or a ride-hailing service.

This article says that the Tesla was rear ended in 2/3 accidents. That's pretty difficult to prevent happening. The article also doesn't claim that Tesla was at fault. Either way, Tesla hasn't expanded across the nation yet, so obviously it hasn't met the threshold to expand across the nation. The deadline hasn't been met yet either.

 

[wiyosaya]

You don't seem to understand then. Tesla is going with the camera only route because it does scale everywhere. That includes the cost, pre-mapping with LIDAR, and the ability to produce self-driving cars. Remember without a driver, the cost of a self-driving ride will effectively cost the price of the [vehicle + fuel + maintenance] / miles driven. If the cost of the vehicle is low and there is no driver, it will overtake any competition.

It obviously doesn't scale at creating the software to make it work, so it doesn't scale everywhere.

Let's see how many EVs the competition cancels in the US next year or if they "catch up".

I guess I have to repeat that quote from Babylon 5 "The avalanche has started. It's too late for the pebbles to vote." Kosh - Babylon 5.

Tell that to Rivian about the plant they are building. https://www.gpb.org/news/2025/09/17/rivian-breaks-ground-on-long-awaited-georgia-ev-plant And if you look for it, they plan to make it a global hub.

There's no way that Tesla will be the only player in the EV market.

fElon is probably hyping the robo-crash-taxi because Tesla's sales are tanking - making assumptions that his service will be loved by everyone.

You're talking about a long term prediction, not a deadline lol. Tesla has already started work on the production lines of the Cybercab. But of course someone who says this wouldn't make assumptions:

As I see it, fElon is making assumptions.

 

[wiyosaya]

This article says that the Tesla was rear ended in 2/3 accidents. That's pretty difficult to prevent happening.

Two vague Tesla reports describe rear impacts, one occurring during a right turn and the other after the robotaxi stopped while driving straight for unspecified reasons.

Why are the accounts vague? Could it be that fElon/Tesla want to hide something? Nah!!

 

[captaincranky]

You mean the process of thinking? You gave new meaning to my words, so you too made sh!t up just now.

No, I interpreted what you said, nothing more, nothing less.

"You're obviously not aware of even when someone asks him a question unofficially that he lies to answer versus actual deadlines.

Fixed.

 

[jeffbert]

Seems to me, that the problem with supervisors in robotaxis is that they will eventually lose interest in watching the road, etc. can you think of a more boring job than that?

 

[jeffbert]

Perhaps the supervisors should drive, while the electronics maps where/when the autodrive would have turned, stopped, etc. Then the two could be compared, and the system adjusted until the two are nearly identical. Using various drivers would result in average responses.

Maybe if they were to induce mild shocks in the supervisors, they might be better at paying attention, even after the task becomes tedious.

 

[Plutoisaplanet]

No, I interpreted what you said, nothing more, nothing less.

"You're obviously not aware of even when someone asks him a question unofficially that he lies to answer versus actual deadlines.

Fixed.

Lying means there was intent to deceive, so you'd have to prove that.

Why are the accounts vague? Could it be that fElon/Tesla want to hide something? Nah!!

You can believe that if you want. In fact if you believe it so strongly, why don't you personally sue Tesla? Surely if he's manipulating the stock price, you'd win.

It obviously doesn't scale at creating the software to make it work, so it doesn't scale everywhere.

It is scaling as Tesla has expanded its service area at least four times in 3 months.

Tell that to Rivian about the plant they are building. https://www.gpb.org/news/2025/09/17/rivian-breaks-ground-on-long-awaited-georgia-ev-plant And if you look for it, they plan to make it a global hub.

There's no way that Tesla will be the only player in the EV market.

Nobody said that they'd be the only player in the EV market lol. I said NEXT YEAR we will see how the market shrinks. Why are you answering a question for next year right now? More assumptions.

Anyways, some car companies like Rivian will continue their plans for EVs while others will scale back and cancel EV models. We're already seeing that happen. Three mainstream automakers, Honda, Ford, and Nissan, have done so and that's before the tax rebate ended: https://www.theverge.com/electric-cars/700767/ev-cancel-delay-tax-credit-nissan-honda-tesla

Many automakers created significant discounts BEFORE the rebate even ended for the very same reason. They're trying to clear out inventory because they plan to scale back inventory. By next year, it'll be obvious who intends to make EVs regardless of subsidies and who doesn't.

 

[WaphleStomp]

Everything hyped/excreted from Musk's mouth is crap; none of it is believable. His self-driving cars were provably garbage products from the first generation on - over-hyped and under-performed.
There have been zero claims the technology had been perfected before moving on to taxis; yet, he hyped robotaxis with gusto, and investors licked it up like ice cream on a hot day. Apparently all they care about is taking profit before the fools (us) realise we've been duped, again.
What's the result, more Musk-rement, more dangerous and sub-par products hitting the streets, more garbage heaped on the pile.
Only when the family of a well-known politician is maimed or killed will he be held accountable. But, to what end? He'll settle out of court and require an NDA barring publicising of any details.
But, what do I care, really? I won't buy or use his garbage.
How 'bout this: If he really wants to show how good his stuff is, he should take all his family; himself, his parents, and his children, all at the same time, on a Spaxe-X trip to the ISS - let's see how safe his tech is.

 

[captaincranky]

Seems to me, that the problem with supervisors in robotaxis is that they will eventually lose interest in watching the road, etc. can you think of a more boring job than that?

This is exactly what I've been saying for, in fact, years. The quickest way to cause a driver to fall asleep behind the wheel, would be to give him or her, nothing to do.

 

[captaincranky]

Only when the family of a well-known politician is maimed or killed will he be held accountable. But, to what end? He'll settle out of court and require an NDA barring publicising of any details.

We should be so lucky. Our hopes and "prayers", should go toward having him switch sides and, "thin out the (current) herd".

BTW, "musk-rement", good one.

I have to ask, is that what they were using to glue the body panels on the Cybertruck?

 

[captaincranky]

You can believe that if you want. In fact if you believe it so strongly, why don't you personally sue Tesla? Surely if he's manipulating the stock price, you'd win.

Didn't musk already get spanked by the NYSE for manipulation?

Oh wait, he did.....

Elon Musk has run afoul of the Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) multiple times over the last decade, most notably in 2018 for his "funding secured" tweet regarding Tesla and in 2022 for his late disclosure of a significant stake in Twitter
. The SEC has filed civil securities fraud charges against him in federal court on two separate occasions.