China may be considering restrictions against US chipmakers amid renewed Huawei ban

nanoguy

Posts: 453   +4
Staff member

Early on Friday, the Trump administration renewed the Huawei ban that prevents the company and its subsidiaries from doing business with hardware and software companies in the United States. While the Chinese tech giant has been able to circumvent some of the restrictions by re-releasing old devices as new "editions," that's only a small win in the grand scheme of things.

The amended rules will prevent US silicon giants from selling chips to Huawei. And that extends to companies outside the US like TSMC, who makes chips for Huawei's HiSilicon division. The US Commerce Department has only allowed chips that are currently in production to be shipped to the Chinese company, provided that the shipment is sent within 120 days from today.

Secretary of Commerce Wilbur Ross said in a statement that "Despite the Entity List actions the Department took last year, Huawei and its foreign affiliates have stepped-up efforts to undermine these national security-based restrictions through an indigenization effort."

The new rules are meant to deal with the fact that Huawei still depends on a lot of American technologies, even if indirectly through companies that supply essential hardware and software for its products.

According to the Global Times of China, the country is preparing its own restrictions on US companies as a countermeasure in response to the Huawei ban. That could involve adding companies like Apple, Cisco, and Qualcomm on a so-called "unreliable entity list," which has spurred unrest among investors.

In the meantime, TSMC will be building a $12 billion, 5nm plant in Arizona, a move that's been welcomed by the Trump administration.

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psycros

Posts: 3,089   +3,148
Good. The sooner China turns into another USSR the sooner it can meet the same fate. (Granted, Putin has managed to rebuild much of the Evil Empire but its still nowhere near the threat it used to be.) Bring the tech manufacturing back to the west where everything is actually invented, kick out all the Chinese nationals spying on our universities and corporate labs and stop rewarding companies for sending our prosperity to a nation powered by thievery. Hopefully China will eventually have a new cultural revolution that ends with the CCP being dismantled like the Berlin Wall.
 

Evernessince

Posts: 4,992   +5,115
I'm going to say that Huawei is a small fry in comparison to Apple, Google, ect. American companies stand to loose a lot more. There are no winners in trade wars and America will not develop factories overnight. Continuing to escalate this debacle without providing a clear plan to replace Chinese manufacturing in America is not only foolish, but shortsighted. One potential TSMC fab does not a plan make. Moreover even that single instance is years away, if it ever comes to fruition.
 

OortCloud

Posts: 359   +206
The whole thing is being done to deflect attention away from the utter chaos of Trumps domestic policy - especially the shocking handling of Covid-19. At a time when US needs all the economic stability it can get (check this weeks unemployment figures) why in gods name is he starting a trade war?
 

umbala

Posts: 291   +358
The whole thing is being done to deflect attention away from the utter chaos of Trumps domestic policy - especially the shocking handling of Covid-19. At a time when US needs all the economic stability it can get (check this weeks unemployment figures) why in gods name is he starting a trade war?
It's just the normal Trump distraction tactic he used many times before. When he has a crisis he can't blame or fire his way out of he simply creates a different crisis to try and distract everyone. If things get really bad for him once it's closer to election day I wouldn't be surprised if he tried some crazy cornered-animal style stuff. Maybe start a war, or come up with an excuse why it's not safe to have an election at all, or simply say the system was rigged (like he claimed last time) if he loses, and then refuse to leave office. I am almost certain he will not leave willingly if he loses in November, so there's that to look forward to (assuming Democrats don't screw up royally again like last time).
 

OortCloud

Posts: 359   +206
I am almost certain he will not leave willingly if he loses in November, so there's that to look forward to (assuming Democrats don't screw up royally again like last time).
I'm not from the US but I do love the country and visit regularly.
It's so sad that the it has let itself become like this. Used to be a great country, so optimistic and vibrant, with lovely people, but now the politicians have riven the country down the middle. People like Trump don't give a damn about anybody but themselves and use divisiveness as a tool to gain votes. Set people against each other and sit back and watch the sh1t-show from a gold-plated hotel room.

I just cant believe what is happening - the press conferences are just extraordinary - why is this allowed to carry on?
 

Tantor

Posts: 59   +77
Good. The sooner China turns into another USSR the sooner it can meet the same fate. (Granted, Putin has managed to rebuild much of the Evil Empire but its still nowhere near the threat it used to be.) Bring the tech manufacturing back to the west where everything is actually invented, kick out all the Chinese nationals spying on our universities and corporate labs and stop rewarding companies for sending our prosperity to a nation powered by thievery. Hopefully China will eventually have a new cultural revolution that ends with the CCP being dismantled like the Berlin Wall.
You're mistaken. Neither Russia nor China are communist. Sure, they started out as communist states with total government ownership of all sources of production. Since then they have swung strongly fascist, nationalist, and ethnically elitist. China's desire to bring Taiwan back into the fold is reminiscent of Hitlers efforts to reunite the German states lost after WW1. China is now like Nazi Germany on steroids with a population over 1.2 billion, and one of the the highest average IQs in the world. China produces over 4 million STEM graduates every year. The US only produces 550k.

The Chinese are natural capitalists. Wherever you find Chinese communities, they inevitably rise to the top of the income ladder. They are also naturally imbued with the need for an elite aristocracy and deep culture. Those characteristics are directly opposed to communism. That's why China will never go back to a USSR like state. They don't need to, their natural gifts have transformed communism into a superior system that will naturally grant them world hegemony, unless stopped.


 

tomkaten

Posts: 273   +187
And since Americans will hate losing a pool of 1.5 billion potential customers, I can see some heavy lobbying incoming.

Ban China? Yeah, sounds great in theory, but capitalism doesn't work like that.
 

Shadowboxer

Posts: 570   +333
This already happens, many US tech companies are restricted or banned in China. It’s at the point where the only ones left make things the Chinese can’t clone. Banning these companies will hurt China more than the US.

Although personally I’m hoping the Chinese ban the U.K. too because then I know I definitely wouldn’t have to fly back to Beijing again with my company and I hate that place.
 

candle_86

Posts: 245   +177
The ban is what needs to happen same with canceling all visas for Chinese immigrants, I'd bet at least 75% spy for the state, as no citizen leaves without the blessing of the party. China will collapse under these rules, manufacturing has already begun to move to places like India and Vietnam.

Without access to American designs China will fall behind quite rapidly, the last Chinese innovation was black powder in 600 AD, since then they buy, borrow, or steal every invention, loosing access to advanced technology will grind their economy to a halt, and cripple their military, which will strengthen world peace and end their threats to seize Taiwan and the South China Sea islands.

This isn't some manufactured crisis either, this is America asserting their authority and fixing the imbalance created by Nixon when he opened up trade with China. It also removes technology from a country that cares about human rights as much as North Korea. Remember China is no one's friend, even their citizens are arrested and murdered for practicing any religion that doesn't worship the party and hold Xi as the supreme authority above God in any faith. The government that forces Children labor, that forces people to work 16 hour days 7 days a week, and the same government that actively spies, and has compromised every developed nation's infrastructure.

Is this really a country we want to have access to advanced technology that they can use to further suppress human rights, and threaten their neighbors with seizing their territory and enslave their people.
 

meric

Posts: 234   +158
I'm going to say that Huawei is a small fry in comparison to Apple, Google, ect. American companies stand to loose a lot more. There are no winners in trade wars and America will not develop factories overnight. Continuing to escalate this debacle without providing a clear plan to replace Chinese manufacturing in America is not only foolish, but shortsighted. One potential TSMC fab does not a plan make. Moreover even that single instance is years away, if it ever comes to fruition.
Thanks for this "sane" approach. Let's hate China all the way, but economic precautions/alternatives is another type of issue which should be addressed no matter what our opinions are.
 
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cliffordcooley

Posts: 12,318   +5,703
Continuing to escalate this debacle without providing a clear plan to replace Chinese manufacturing in America is not only foolish, but shortsighted.
One thing that has been made clear over the years. This debacle is the only thing that has made them think about replacing Chinese manufacturing. Halting to escalate this debacle and their decision is likely to halt as well. I don't care if we have to do without for a while if it forces them to make change.
 
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neeyik

Posts: 898   +832
Staff member
Moreover even that single instance is years away
Indeed. As example, TSMC have only just started turning out 5 nm chips from the facility in Taiwan, and that started construction in 2016. It'll be another 9 months or so before any level of usable volume will come out of that plant, too.

And while it makes sense for TSMC to invest in more plants around the world, for security reasons, they're far more likely to just by up existing facilities, which typically doesn't generate any extra jobs.
 

Ludak021

Posts: 158   +121
Good. The sooner China turns into another USSR the sooner it can meet the same fate. (Granted, Putin has managed to rebuild much of the Evil Empire but its still nowhere near the threat it used to be.) Bring the tech manufacturing back to the west where everything is actually invented, kick out all the Chinese nationals spying on our universities and corporate labs and stop rewarding companies for sending our prosperity to a nation powered by thievery. Hopefully China will eventually have a new cultural revolution that ends with the CCP being dismantled like the Berlin Wall.
You misunderstood - The Evil Empire is USA.
 

Digitalzone

Posts: 125   +63
I'm going to say that Huawei is a small fry in comparison to Apple, Google, ect. American companies stand to loose a lot more. There are no winners in trade wars and America will not develop factories overnight. Continuing to escalate this debacle without providing a clear plan to replace Chinese manufacturing in America is not only foolish, but shortsighted. One potential TSMC fab does not a plan make. Moreover even that single instance is years away, if it ever comes to fruition.
It won't be overnight but we better start soon. There are other countries to choose, 40 million of Americans are on food stamps. Just the fact that Europe and US are completely dependent on importing breathing masks from China shows how deep in * we are.
 
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EClyde

Posts: 2,167   +840
The whole thing is being done to deflect attention away from the utter chaos of Trumps domestic policy - especially the shocking handling of Covid-19. At a time when US needs all the economic stability it can get (check this weeks unemployment figures) why in gods name is he starting a trade war?
No. Trump warned everyone about China loooong time ago
 

PEnnn

Posts: 379   +311
US farmers have become reliant on government handout ($40 billion in 2 years) and have become welfare queens because of Trump's China trade policies. (Funny how Socialism is OK in this case!!)

The guy has absolutely no clue about anything resembling trade policies. And now US tech companies and consumers will be suffering because he (and some simpletons here) thinks US tech companies will just return to the US any day now, because he got himself in a tech fight!

Electing a clueless greenhorn has consequences.
 

Nobonita Barua

Posts: 22   +21
Apparently our previous presidents didn't or we wouldn't be so dependent on China.
So dependent or china?
In 1950 US economy was 300 billion.
In 2000 US economy was 10 trillion. An addition on near about 9.5 trillion.
From 2000-2020 US economy added almost 12 trillion, almost the same amount China did to their GDP.
Apparent China never needed US. And to be honest, and hope I am not too harsh, the people of USA isn't familiar with the concept of working & think they should be paid for preserving their lifestyle & partying. In 50 years (1950-2000) they barely added 9.5 trillion. I wonder what they have been doing for 50 years, sleeping & partying?
 

Nobonita Barua

Posts: 22   +21
"Secretary of Commerce Wilbur Ross said in a statement that "Despite the Entity List actions the Department took last year, Huawei and its foreign affiliates have stepped-up efforts to undermine these national security-based restrictions through an indigenization effort.""
I think you will find world completely disinterested in so called national security of particular country. Why don't they simply stop selling chips around the globe? Would be far better.
 
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cliffordcooley

Posts: 12,318   +5,703
Apparent China never needed US. And to be honest, and hope I am not too harsh, the people of USA isn't familiar with the concept of working & think they should be paid for preserving their lifestyle & partying.
Thank you for your honesty. I now know to completely disregard your whole comment. The US is not lazy. From that comment, I doubt you know anything about the US workforce. The only reason you are saying that is because we are free from slave labor. The only thing I get from your comment is you are sympathetic to countries that do have slave labor.
 
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