Comcast tells the FCC that it doesn't want to reveal its hidden broadband fees upfront

[DragonSlayer101]

What just happened? In an effort to end broadband bill shock for customers, the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) is introducing new rules that would require internet service providers (ISPs) to include details about the actual price of their service and information about data caps and performance. However, in a filing with the FCC earlier this month, Comcast expressed its reservations about the new rules, and argued that implementing the proposed labels will impose "significant administrative burdens" on the company and add "unnecessary complexity" to its operations.

The letter complains that itemizing the additional charges and government taxes would require separate labels and force the company to create 251 such labels to comply with the new rules. Comcast also claimed that it would have to generate a number of new notices periodically due to changes in state and local fees every year, but the exact number was redacted from the public posting.

The letter, signed by Comcast's VP of regulatory affairs, Jordan Goldstein, also noted that Comcast wasn't the only internet service provider complaining about the changes. As noted by the company, five major cable and telecom industry trade groups also petitioned the agency to cancel its new labeling policy before it goes into effect. To further its argument against the proposed changes, Comcast also claimed that the existing rules actually benefit consumers by helping ISPs streamline the labeling process.

As reported by Ars Technica, the new broadband labels were passed by the U.S. Congress in 2021 before the FCC approved them in November 2022. They will, however, only go into effect after a federal Office of Management and Budget (OMB) review due to requirements in the US Paperwork Reduction Act. Once they are approved by the OMB, medium and large ISPs will be required to comply with the new rules within six months, while smaller providers with 100,000 or fewer subscribers will get a full year to get in line.

The new pricing information requirements are similar to what the FCC had introduced in 2016 before they were nixed by former FCC Chairman, Ajit Pai. If the new rules come into effect, home broadband providers will have to clearly mention a number of details upfront, including the base pricing, monthly data allowance, overage charges (if any), equipment fees, other monthly fees (if any), one-time fees, and early termination fees for those on contract. The labels should also include information on speed, latency, packet loss, and network management practices.

Permalink to story.

https://www.techspot.com/news/99083-comcast-tells-fcc-doesnt-want-reveal-hidden-broadband.html

 

[Puiu]

They can put these taxes on your bill, but they can't copy paste them somewhere else? So much BS

When I bought my internet plan, where I live in Romania, they price on the offer included all taxes. I didn't have to guess how much I had to pay every month.

 

[wiyosaya]

I'm glad I do not have to rely on Commie Cast. Congress should stick their middle finger up at them and say, TS.

And with companies, such as Commie Cast demanding that customers, I.e., their prey, accept only e-mail versions of their bills, the review for compliance with the "paperwork reduction act" should not apply.

 

[bviktor]

One of the many reasons why people are switching to things like Google Fi.

It's only a matter of time before they'll be having their own infrastructure as well.

 

[Neatfeatguy]

FCC: Broadband providers - new rules means you need to label more.

Comcast: But moooom! We don't want to!

 

[punctualturn]

This mess can be fixed easily, last mile un-bundling and we will be back in business.

 

[p51d007]

LOL, Ok, here's what will happen.
They will be forced to show the fees, then, they will have to have another fee,
for showing you the fees!

 

[wiyosaya]

One of the many reasons why people are switching to things like Google Fi.

It's only a matter of time before they'll be having their own infrastructure as well.

Exactly. The company I am with has its own infrastructure and has been working diligently over the past several years to build it out.

 

[brucek]

This article needs to better differentiate between prices Comcast chooses to charge and gets to keep, vs. fees - essentially taxes - that local and state governments decide Comcast will collect from its customers and forward on to them.

There are many reasons to dislike Comcast and cable companies, but on the specific issue of ever-changing and ever-growing local fees, that's on the taxing or regulatory authority that imposes them.

 

[waclark]

This article needs to better differentiate between prices Comcast chooses to charge and gets to keep, vs. fees - essentially taxes - that local and state governments decide Comcast will collect from its customers and forward on to them.

There are many reasons to dislike Comcast and cable companies, but on the specific issue of ever-changing and ever-growing local fees, that's on the taxing or regulatory authority that imposes them.

Exactly. You gotta love the government hitting you up for fees and taxes and then making you spend money to report those fees to the customer. For all I care, they can just lump all that together and list it as a single line item, Gov Taxes $X. I don't need an itemized list; I should be able to go to my local Gov entity and look that up if I care too.

I do think the price should be clearly stated, including any and all fees/taxes.

 

[Soulburn74]

Its bullshit like this, one of the reasons why we can't have nice things. "we don't want to" is not a good enough answer. Why can't they be like T-Mobile, and just give me the final price. I don't need to know all the break down of fees, I just want to know my total bill upfront when I sign up.

Tangent: another reason why I hate internet and phone service providers even more than extra fees: don't get me started on "unlimited" (Its only unlimited because we say it is, and get away with it because of the fine print at the bottom, showing how its really not unlimited, but somehow we get away with saying it is as long as we put that small print there.....). If you have multiple different 'unlimited' plans doesn't that in it of itself prove its not really unlimited?

 

[Kashim]

Why can't they be like T-Mobile, and just give me the final price. I don't need to know all the break down of fees, I just want to know my total bill upfront when I sign up.

But that's their lame excuse. They can't show you the final price because of ever changing government fees in different areas. It's too much "work" for them to figure out your particular total in that particular region of the country at that particular time. So it's not really THEIR fault, it's the government's fault for charging so many different fees that keep changing and your fault for wanting to know exactly how much you will be charged. The whole thing is absurd. The bottom line is, they prefer not to show you the actual total because it's higher than their advertised prices.

 

[Puiu]

This article needs to better differentiate between prices Comcast chooses to charge and gets to keep, vs. fees - essentially taxes - that local and state governments decide Comcast will collect from its customers and forward on to them.

There are many reasons to dislike Comcast and cable companies, but on the specific issue of ever-changing and ever-growing local fees, that's on the taxing or regulatory authority that imposes them.

Not the point. The price you pay should include all taxes. That's it. It eliminates all problems with hidden fees that Comcast changes willy-nilly anyway.

The fees changing makes no difference. They can just put an * next to the billboard/flyer price that says: "according to taxes on x date" and the real price that you get quoted should reflect the taxes on the day they make the offer to you personally. (they can already do this, they just don't want the prices to look "big")

Or they could simply show their price and a + xx$ in taxes under in a smaller font. But you should be able to know the final monthly price before you sign any contract.

PS: Comcast has been raising their own fees by a lot this year (by about 15 to 25% and you are forced to pay them), not the government fees. But the "advertised" price remained the same. (how convenient, right)

 

[waclark]

Not the point. The price you pay should include all taxes. That's it. It eliminates all problems with hidden fees that Comcast changes willy-nilly anyway.

I'm pretty certain that when I subscribed with Comcast they told me what my monthly cost would be, with taxes and fees. I don't recall them breaking them out as line items, but my bill is what they told me it would be.

The fees changing makes no difference. They can just put an * next to the billboard/flyer price that says: "according to taxes on x date" and the real price that you get quoted should reflect the taxes on the day they make the offer to you personally. (they can already do this, they just don't want the prices to look "big")

That's just one disgruntled customer away from a law suit.

Or they could simply show their price and a + xx$ in taxes under in a smaller font. But you should be able to know the final monthly price before you sign any contract.

PS: Comcast has been raising their own fees by a lot this year (by about 15 to 25% and you are forced to pay them), not the government fees. But the "advertised" price remained the same. (how convenient, right)

I haven't seen any significant increases from Comcast in a couple of years. If there were any increases, I'd say it's been maybe a couple of bucks here or there and most likely changes in fee/taxes. Comcast typically increases my speed without increasing my price.

 

[Puiu]

I'm pretty certain that when I subscribed with Comcast they told me what my monthly cost would be, with taxes and fees. I don't recall them breaking them out as line items, but my bill is what they told me it would be.

That's just one disgruntled customer away from a law suit.

I haven't seen any significant increases from Comcast in a couple of years. If there were any increases, I'd say it's been maybe a couple of bucks here or there and most likely changes in fee/taxes. Comcast typically increases my speed without increasing my price.

The price hikes have been in the news multiple times. And yes we are talking about several "buks" that add up to tens or hundreds (depending on your contract and region) per year.

From an article written in January:

"The most egregious Comcast fees are the broadcast-TV fee, which is rising 21% to $23.20 from $19.15; and its regional-sports fee, which will jump 15% to $17.25 from $15, according to customer bills. The regional sports fee was $3 a month back in 2016, according to PennLive."

----> just those two fees (there are others too, like the rental fees) add up to an extra 6.3$ per month. just "few bucks" right? but they do it fairly often

Do you know how much the broadcast fee was in 2014 when they first introduced it? 1.5$... the inflation in the US must have been crazy in the past decade

PS: regional prices differ from region to region, but all went up by a similar amount. (just so you know why the price is not the same as the one in your bill)

 

[Kam7r]

In the EU , or at least in France, all of those "hidden fees" must be signaled up front... srly I don't know what you're doing in the US it seems everything is made to fck over the common dude... and data caps don't even exist here ... and never existed in the 1st place ... last time I saw it , I was a kid and the cap was on 56k modems...

 

[Neatfeatguy]

I'm pretty certain that when I subscribed with Comcast they told me what my monthly cost would be, with taxes and fees. I don't recall them breaking them out as line items, but my bill is what they told me it would be.

That's just one disgruntled customer away from a law suit.

I haven't seen any significant increases from Comcast in a couple of years. If there were any increases, I'd say it's been maybe a couple of bucks here or there and most likely changes in fee/taxes. Comcast typically increases my speed without increasing my price.

In the past 2 years my cost of cable (internet only) went from $50 to $64. That's almost a 30% hike in price.

To make the price more "palatable", just before every price hike they've made your connection speeds faster! I went from around 150mbps to around 220mpbs in that two year span. It's blazing fast! Holy crap, it's so fast! (if you can't tell, I'm laying on the sarcasm real thick here). I'd be content if they just double the upload speed so I'd go from around 6mbps to 12mbps, that would make a world of difference for me.

With those paltry speed increases, the other big thing that customers got was:
Comcast removed the unlimited data that they put in place with the (stupid f'ing forced) covid lockdowns. For nearly 2 years every Comcast/Xfinity customer had unlimited data cap. With that, they put back in place the 1.2TB data cap. When that data cap was removed for those couple of years there was zero slowdowns/drops during that whole time. Comcast can clearly handle allowing unlimited data for all their customers without breaking a sweat.

 

[waclark]

The price hikes have been in the news multiple times. And yes we are talking about several "buks" that add up to tens or hundreds (depending on your contract and region) per year.

From an article written in January:

"The most egregious Comcast fees are the broadcast-TV fee, which is rising 21% to $23.20 from $19.15; and its regional-sports fee, which will jump 15% to $17.25 from $15, according to customer bills. The regional sports fee was $3 a month back in 2016, according to PennLive."

----> just those two fees (there are others too, like the rental fees) add up to an extra 6.3$ per month. just "few bucks" right? but they do it fairly often

Do you know how much the broadcast fee was in 2014 when they first introduced it? 1.5$... the inflation in the US must have been crazy in the past decade

PS: regional prices differ from region to region, but all went up by a similar amount. (just so you know why the price is not the same as the one in your bill)

I went back and checked my prices back to 2021. My Internet cost actually went down to $75, due to a 2 year promotion, then back to the normal $93 afterwards but my speeds went from 600mbps to 800mbps. So, I can't say I'm too unhappy about that. Furthermore, compared to Cox, who is my ISP in AZ, the cost is nearly the same for similar services, so I don't feel like I'm paying more than normal.

As for TV fees and sports fees, how much of that is due to sports and broadcast TV raising rates? Per the article you referenced

“TV networks and other video programmers continue to raise their prices, with broadcast television and sports being the biggest drivers of increases in customers’ bills,”

And also
[QUOTE} Our national average increase of 3.8% is about half of the most recent rate of inflation.[/QUOTE]

So, it seems like you're blaming Comcast for increases they don't control. And yes, inflation has been high in the US over the past couple of years. Since 2014, cumulative inflation is about 28.5%.

 

[waclark]

In the past 2 years my cost of cable (internet only) went from $50 to $64. That's almost a 30% hike in price.

To make the price more "palatable", just before every price hike they've made your connection speeds faster! I went from around 150mbps to around 220mpbs in that two year span. It's blazing fast! Holy crap, it's so fast! (if you can't tell, I'm laying on the sarcasm real thick here). I'd be content if they just double the upload speed so I'd go from around 6mbps to 12mbps, that would make a world of difference for me.

I haven't had that experience at all. As noted in another post, my cost actually went down due to a promo but after that they went back to the normal cost. My speeds did go up 30% from 600 to 800 mbps. And, by the way 200mbps isn't slow. It's more than sufficient for most people. At no time were there unexpected charges on my bill. They said it would be $93 and it was, fees and all.

With those paltry speed increases, the other big thing that customers got was:
Comcast removed the unlimited data that they put in place with the (stupid f'ing forced) covid lockdowns. For nearly 2 years every Comcast/Xfinity customer had unlimited data cap. With that, they put back in place the 1.2TB data cap. When that data cap was removed for those couple of years there was zero slowdowns/drops during that whole time. Comcast can clearly handle allowing unlimited data for all their customers without breaking a sweat.

You still have unlimited data. You don't have unlimited speed. I work from home, have multiple computers and users in the home, stream all TV and music content and I've been under 300G/mo for the past 6 months (and beyond). I feel that 1.2T is more than sufficient for my use and I have a 1-month grace period if I do go over.

 

[Puiu]

I went back and checked my prices back to 2021. My Internet cost actually went down to $75, due to a 2 year promotion, then back to the normal $93 afterwards but my speeds went from 600mbps to 800mbps. So, I can't say I'm too unhappy about that. Furthermore, compared to Cox, who is my ISP in AZ, the cost is nearly the same for similar services, so I don't feel like I'm paying more than normal.

As for TV fees and sports fees, how much of that is due to sports and broadcast TV raising rates? Per the article you referenced


And also
[QUOTE} Our national average increase of 3.8% is about half of the most recent rate of inflation.

the majority of those costs are 100% controlled by Comcast. this is a known fact. it's also why they can increase it whenever they want and it's not included in the advertised price but hidden away.

"Since 2014, cumulative inflation is about 28.5%." - thanks for proving my point. the price increases makes no sense. even with the services becoming more expensive and inflation.... things don't add up. these "fees" went up by a factor of not a percentage.

And Comcast receives money from the government to do precisely what many of the fees are for (like improving your internet speed).

TL;DR:
- they have a monopoly
- they can control the price with hidden fees
- they receive money from both you and the government for improving the "infrastructure" and they also charge exorbitant amounts of money for people who are "outside" of the service area
- they lie about the technical details of their services and statistics so they can keep getting money from the government

What exactly are you defending here?

 

[wiyosaya]

Do you know how much the broadcast fee was in 2014 when they first introduced it? 1.5$... the inflation in the US must have been crazy in the past decade

Most ISP/Cable providers in the US have their own "inflation" , however, they are also widely known as having customer service.

When my current ISP finally came to my neighborhood with Fiber, I jumped. No hidden fees, great customer service, no need to reset my cable modem because my internet crapped out. Just good service, fantastic speeds, and no Spectrum BS customer service. In fact, I could not wait to get rid of Spectrum because of the customer service I got from them over the years which included slamming my mother onto their phone service.

 

[Neatfeatguy]

I haven't had that experience at all. As noted in another post, my cost actually went down due to a promo but after that they went back to the normal cost. My speeds did go up 30% from 600 to 800 mbps. And, by the way 200mbps isn't slow. It's more than sufficient for most people. At no time were there unexpected charges on my bill. They said it would be $93 and it was, fees and all.

You still have unlimited data. You don't have unlimited speed. I work from home, have multiple computers and users in the home, stream all TV and music content and I've been under 300G/mo for the past 6 months (and beyond). I feel that 1.2T is more than sufficient for my use and I have a 1-month grace period if I do go over.

Every speed increase they claim is free. Then 2-3 months later an increase in cost to plans is pushed out to customers. It's not free. If it was free, the pricing wouldn't just magically go up (even if it's a few dollars) soon after the "free" speed increase was given out.

No, you don't have unlimited data at the price you're paying. You're allowed to go over, but you pay an extra $10/50GB, capped at $100.

200mbps+ is more than enough bandwidth for my household, I never had a complaint about it. The upload speed is pretty crummy, though and that needs a slight bump.

If you live alone or with 1 (maybe 2) other people the 1.2TB data cap is pretty sufficient for covering daily use/needs. However, when you have 4+ people and half or more are kids, all they do is stream. Roughly 1GB of data is used for streaming 720p content for 60 minutes. If you're going 1080p it's roughly 2GB for 60 minutes (more or less, depending on your overall fps).

Kids are at home during the summer so they're watching shows, playing games and blah, blah, blah. Wife gets home, she watches a few shows after work and blah, blah, blah. Pretty soon it's very easy to hit upwards of 40GB+ a day.
40GB, 30 days = 1.2TB
As you can see, hitting that data cap is very, very easy. But folks like you chime in because you know what's best and claim that it's plenty for you so it should be more than enough for others. Get off your soapbox and stop trying to preach that what's good enough for you is good enough for all.

If you want to support the shady tactics of the corporate cable company, that's on you, but I'll call it like I see and it's outright bull$hit. Their data caps are nothing more than a limitation to punish people that exceed it and charge them more or entice those that do normally get close to or exceed it to pay more for their "unlimited" plans that require you to rent their equipment and pay more in the end.

 

[Greggs]

It was the absurd sports fee and broadcast TV fee that went up every year that finally got me to cut the cable cord. Neither of these two fees are mandated and if they reflect the costs of providing service they should be included in the advertised price, especially if Comcast charges the same fee nationwide. All cable providers share these same costs it's not like one network is unfairly singled out. Further I had no need for either service, I didn't want sports channels and broadcast TV is free OTA I can record with my TiVo.

Even worse RCN charges $7 I believe for a "Network Management Fee" which is beyond BS. I guess I'm lucky three ISPs service my residence at least. The best part of 5G home internet is giving consumers more broadband options, even if speeds aren't up to par - yet. In my case it adds TMobile and Verizon as options.

 

[captaincranky]

Comcast seems to be operating under the misconception that Trump's flunky, Ajit Pai, is still in charge of the FCC.

LOL, Ok, here's what will happen.
They will be forced to show the fees, then, they will have to have another fee,
for showing you the fees!

Indeed. In fact Verizon wants to charge me for not doing something They want $4.00 for giving me an unlisted number..Oh, and $2.00 to connect me to a long distance carrier.Which BTW, I can do without. If someone doesn't have a toll free number, they won'y be hearing from me anyway.

 

[waclark]

Every speed increase they claim is free. Then 2-3 months later an increase in cost to plans is pushed out to customers. It's not free. If it was free, the pricing wouldn't just magically go up (even if it's a few dollars) soon after the "free" speed increase was given out.

No, you don't have unlimited data at the price you're paying. You're allowed to go over, but you pay an extra $10/50GB, capped at $100.

Per Comcast "https://www.xfinity.com/support/articles/exp-unlimited-data" They have an ulimited data option, yes there is a fee for that, but it's there.

200mbps+ is more than enough bandwidth for my household, I never had a complaint about it. The upload speed is pretty crummy, though and that needs a slight bump.

If you live alone or with 1 (maybe 2) other people the 1.2TB data cap is pretty sufficient for covering daily use/needs. However, when you have 4+ people and half or more are kids, all they do is stream. Roughly 1GB of data is used for streaming 720p content for 60 minutes. If you're going 1080p it's roughly 2GB for 60 minutes (more or less, depending on your overall fps).

Kids are at home during the summer so they're watching shows, playing games and blah, blah, blah. Wife gets home, she watches a few shows after work and blah, blah, blah. Pretty soon it's very easy to hit upwards of 40GB+ a day.
40GB, 30 days = 1.2TB
As you can see, hitting that data cap is very, very easy. But folks like you chime in because you know what's best and claim that it's plenty for you so it should be more than enough for others. Get off your soapbox and stop trying to preach that what's good enough for you is good enough for all.

I work from home, my wife, works from home, we stream TV as we subscribe to YouTube TV. We also have Disney, Hulu, Netflix, Prime etc. I have multiple internet connected smart devices. I game, for the most part online games. We stream music and so on. I'm not saying you can't get to 1.2TB of data in a month, but we aren't anywhere close to that. Even when my daughter and grandson lived with us, we didn't come close to that. Even if we doubled our usage, we wouldn't hit the cap. My point is that not everyone needs 1.2T of data and if you do, then perhaps you should pay for that. Just because you run over your limits doesn't mean the vast majority of people do. As for insulting me, well, maybe you should do some research and learn that the average data usage in the US is about 1/2 TB and pre-pandemic was closer to 1/3 TB. So, maybe what you're complaining about isn't really an issue for most people so perhaps you should stop preaching to the rest of us that 1.2TB isn't enough when the data says otherwise (https://www.allconnect.com/blog/rep...7,in 2022, more than double the previous year.)

If you want to support the shady tactics of the corporate cable company, that's on you, but I'll call it like I see and it's outright bull$hit. Their data caps are nothing more than a limitation to punish people that exceed it and charge them more or entice those that do normally get close to or exceed it to pay more for their "unlimited" plans that require you to rent their equipment and pay more in the end.

So raising prices is a "shady" tactic? Have you ever run any sort of business, successfully? Cost go up, you should know that given the crazy inflation we've seen over the past 2 years. I can't speak to your personal experiences, but mine, as I stated, are that my speeds went up but my bill hasn't, outside of promos. As I said, I don't use broadcast TV from Comcast and that appears to be where some cost increases are coming from.