Fake MSRP: AMD's Radeon 9070 XT $600 Launch Price Was a Fantasy

[Puiu]

Got my PNY 5070 for $550 when no one wanted them. Plenty fast, efficient, and quiet (for now). Thought the 5070 Ti would've been the pick of the litter, but not at $900+.

Don't honestly know what's going on with the 9070 XT. Scalped one at launch but why would I run a more expensive card with fewer features at 300W+? As the article suggests, if the Ti's are starting to show up from $830-870, how can the XT be justified >$750?

It's a moot point because of how volatile prices are right now.

But in general, it's because it's much faster in raster and trades blows in ray-tracing. Prices do vary a lot depending on the country. If it's close enough then it's worth buying the faster card. the 5070 isn't exactly known for its good value

 

[redgarl]

"A quick check of Newegg Canada shows the RTX 5070 Ti at CA$1,250 and the RTX 5070 at CA$820. The cheapest RX 9070 XT is CA$1,100, or a 12% discount versus the 5070 Ti but 34% more than the 5070. This mirrors, or even worsens, the situation in Germany."

No, it is not. I cannot believe you call yourself a journalist if you cannot even do a simple search at the two canadian retailers which are MemoryExpress and CanadaComputers.

The real market price is around 950 CAD, which is about 680 USD for the cheaper models. With everything happening with the tariffs here, it is not bad at all.

In the meantime, the cheapest 5070 is around 820 CAD because it is on sale.

 

[BogdanR]

it's 900$ only in the US

Actually you can get a 9070XT for $659.99 at Micro Center. The whole article is misleading at best.

 

[BogdanR]

The real market price is around 950 CAD, which is about 680 USD for the cheaper models. With everything happening with the tariffs here, it is not bad at all.

100% with you in both of your posts, however as I mention somewhere above, let’s not forget CanadaComputers has already restocked twice with 9070XT cards selling for cad 889.00 ($635).
Tim did not bother to search Micro Center in the US either. The cheapest 9070XT there is $659.99.

This whole article looks more like a hit piece than actual journalism.

 

[NumberNine]

Prices won't come down until people stop paying them. Whatever it takes to make that happen... it won't happen before.

You really think these companies are going to rake in those fat covid dollars for years and then suddenly accept LESS?

No no no my friend, that's now this works at all. Even with all supply shortages resolved, the prices won't drop until it is unavoidable and if they do decline even a few dollars, oh it's gonna be the end of the world according to the poor CEOs.

They're not reacting to a situation, they're creating and perpetuating it. Prices are high because they want them to be.

 

[CMP01]

Yes, and...?

I mean, if you can be this deep into the field and not see the difference yet between AMD and Nvidia in this then...

Or, we could have a round-up article looking at where and how this all began, with Nvidia, and backdating to Ampere where the change started with far more sus strategy behind to boot.
Any news on this front should lead with something like "AMD cards are now just as prone to Nvidia ones where outside scalping applies, and it should be no surprise..." (they got 'good enough' while Nvidia effectively doubled down on what they've seen they can get away with)

Ultimately, even if it were a straight case of AMD and/or partners effectively playing foul, you really can't blame them coming from their position for dipping a toe in what Nvidia has had carte blanche up to it's neck in for far longer.

 

[Strawman]

Another article by Tim, another occasion to do some free AMD bashing. He will never dare say the same thing about Nvidia. With missing ROPs, burning 12VHPWR connectors, broken drivers, marketing tactics for the 5000 series and ridiculous pricing, how can anyone in their right mind, even able to think that the biggest focus facing the GPU market right now should be the price of the 9070 XT?

Tim can say whatever he wants, but he refuse to look at the numbers because they are depicting another picture.

Fact - In Canada, right now, at Canada Computers, in-store, the 5070 NON-TI is retailing for the same price as the 9070 XT, from the cheapest to cheapest model on shelves.

Fact - You can get a 9070 XT in Canada around 900 CAD to 950 CAD EASILY!

Fact - I purchased my 9070 XT at 620 USD, even if he wants to say it never was a reality.

Fact - The whole dGPU is facing factors outside of the realm of the semiconductor industry.

Checking pcpartpicker canada, your "facts" seem to be way off. Cheapest 9070xt is 999$, 5070 is 789.

You purchased your for 620 because amd offered rebates the first week to pretend that their MSRP is lower than it actually is.

 

[BogdanR]

Checking pcpartpicker canada, your "facts" seem to be way off. Cheapest 9070xt is 999$, 5070 is 789.

You purchased your for 620 because amd offered rebates the first week to pretend that their MSRP is lower than it actually is.

Nope.
I can go out right this minute and pick a 949.00 CAD 9070XT card from CanadaComputers. The same brick and mortar retailer had until last week a pretty good supply of 9070XT cards selling at 889.00 cad. Oh, and CanadaComputers expects to restock them shortly for the same price.
So, nope.

 

[Sleepybp]

I think the real reason is the rx9070 is such a better offering than similar priced rtx 5070 which only has 12GB ram. The buyers have voted the 9070 is much better and NVidias greed to not sell a 16GB 5070 for this price point is what pushes all buyers to the 9070.

Do not forget who is the dominant supplier of volume for GPU- it is Nvidia by 10X.
You can’t expect AMD to pickup the entire mid-range market of demand when historically 90% of buyers only buy NVidia. The Nvidia buyers have enabled this and are to blame.

This would be like blaming RC cola for running out of supply if Coke decided to double their price.

 

[Strawman]

Nope.
I can go out right this minute and pick a 949.00 CAD 9070XT card from CanadaComputers. The same brick and mortar retailer had until last week a pretty good supply of 9070XT cards selling at 889.00 cad. Oh, and CanadaComputers expects to restock them shortly for the same price.
So, nope.

What do you mean "nope". They weren't offering rebates the first week of sales ?

 

[BogdanR]

What do you mean "nope". They weren't offering rebates the first week of sales ?

Nope, it means your analysis is wrong. Nice try. You know VERY well what I mean.

Sure AMD allegedly offered rebates initially. In the March launch whoever was lucky enough could land himself a 9070XT for 839.00 cad. They sold like hotcakes and that was that.

However, I could go right now and pick a 9070XT for 949.00 cad, So the cheapest available now is NOT 999. Last week the cheapest was 889.00 cad and those have been restocked twice already as they sell rather well. Canada Computers expects them back in stock at the same price of 889.00 cad. That is 6% over MSRP. And even at 949.00 cad, the price is 10% over MSRP. Same with the 5070Ti.

So get your numbers right, OK?

 

[ScottSoapbox]

What I don't understand about all of this is how the laws of supply and demand are just kicked to the curb in all of these articles. First and foremost, is that the reason for the excessive prices is because that's what people are willing to pay. If it were too expensive, they would not sell and prices will drop. Second, while both companies attempt to set the MSRP, as near as I can tell, there is no enforcement mechanism. They either sell the chips to the board partners or they don't.

The only solution I can see it to flood the market with cards, which will never happen either,as both companies have experienced being left with tons of inventory and fire sale prices right before the next launch.

LIke it or not, everyone is managing the channel to prevent a glut and maximize prices. Until buyers decide that these prices are too high, I'm afraid this model is here to stay.

I agree with everything you said, but there is one extra wrinkle: The supply and demand of the Fab capacity.

If TMSC had double the capacity right now, we'd have better GPU supply - not a glut for the reasons you state - but better supply with lower prices.

The issue is limited fab supply is making it an AI or GPU money rather than an AI and GPU money situation for Nvidia, AMD, and Intel. It's not completely "or" of course but the trade off is there. The companies will do their best to keep prices and margins as high as possible (with ample supply) but they also want total revenue as high as possible and that pushes them towards more units which tends to push prices down.

 

[EdmondRC]

This is why they say "starting at $599" because that's the opening bid.

 

[SRB]

I agree with everything you said, but there is one extra wrinkle: The supply and demand of the Fab capacity.

If TMSC had double the capacity right now, we'd have better GPU supply - not a glut for the reasons you state - but better supply with lower prices.

The issue is limited fab supply is making it an AI or GPU money rather than an AI and GPU money situation for Nvidia, AMD, and Intel. It's not completely "or" of course but the trade off is there. The companies will do their best to keep prices and margins as high as possible (with ample supply) but they also want total revenue as high as possible and that pushes them towards more units which tends to push prices down.

Yes, I didn't get into the whole AI thing, and the excess of cards I referred to happened a lot more often before crypto. Having said that, there is one more thing that the author mentions, and without realizing it, put his finger on a HUGE problem that the tech press created: DLSS, Multi frame gen, etc. If you'll note the author automatically gives Nvida a cushion of a higher price to make AMD look worse due to these "improvements". Nvida gives everyone slight core count upgrades and then plugs their exclusive software as the reason the cards are better. And with the press help, it worked great. At least AMD is trying to work out some actual new hardware instead of the smaller, faster, bigger same thing we've been doing a la Intel.

 

[godrilla]

"With GeForce availability improving, we're hopeful this will spark real competition in the upper mid-range. Ideally, prices across the board will begin to fall."

Sadly, this doesn't look likely, with Nvidia raising the MSRP of 50xx series GPUs by 5-15% or so. https://www.tomshardware.com/pc-com...and-tsmc-price-hikes-filter-down-to-retailers

If you had stock that is anticipated to collect dust due to market rejection at current 1.5 to 1.75% above msrp for the 5090 wouldn't you announce price hikes too?
Reference picture of stock MSI 5090 entry level card.

 

[p51d007]

What I don't understand about all of this is how the laws of supply and demand are just kicked to the curb in all of these articles. First and foremost, is that the reason for the excessive prices is because that's what people are willing to pay. If it were too expensive, they would not sell and prices will drop. Second, while both companies attempt to set the MSRP, as near as I can tell, there is no enforcement mechanism. They either sell the chips to the board partners or they don't.

The only solution I can see it to flood the market with cards, which will never happen either,as both companies have experienced being left with tons of inventory and fire sale prices right before the next launch.

LIke it or not, everyone is managing the channel to prevent a glut and maximize prices. Until buyers decide that these prices are too high, I'm afraid this model is here to stay.

Sometimes I think some of these MFG's use the "DeBeers" diamond approach to releasing
a new card. RESTRICT supply, in hopes demand is high, so they can keep the price higher
than it really should be.
Diamonds are not "rare", but DeBeers restricts most of the release to the general public,
which keeps the price insane.

 

[Strawman]

Nope, it means your analysis is wrong. Nice try. You know VERY well what I mean.

Sure AMD allegedly offered rebates initially. In the March launch whoever was lucky enough could land himself a 9070XT for 839.00 cad. They sold like hotcakes and that was that.

However, I could go right now and pick a 9070XT for 949.00 cad, So the cheapest available now is NOT 999. Last week the cheapest was 889.00 cad and those have been restocked twice already as they sell rather well. Canada Computers expects them back in stock at the same price of 889.00 cad. That is 6% over MSRP. And even at 949.00 cad, the price is 10% over MSRP. Same with the 5070Ti.

So get your numbers right, OK?

And what is the walk in price of the 5070ti compared to the 9070xt in Canada and the US? Cause you are focused on the prices, which are kinda irrelevant to the article. The article is making it comparative - basically it's saying that the 9070xt should be 20% cheaper than the 70ti but it isn't. Which is absolutely 100% true in EU for example

 

[n3o127]

Debate this all we will, if sales dip (due to overpriced or whatever), nVidia and AMD simply cut production and move it to more profitable parts to sell -- Both as much a part of driving prices up as consumers willing to buy everything and anything they put on the market including doing business with scalpers. nVidia and AMD, if they really wanted to, they would have little problems producing more founder cards and direct list them for MSRP to hold the market in check -- but why would they when they can sell in the current markets as they are and as much as they opt to produce.

 

[EvilRebar]

Yes, and...?

I mean, if you can be this deep into the field and not see the difference yet between AMD and Nvidia in this then...

Or, we could have a round-up article looking at where and how this all began, with Nvidia, and backdating to Ampere where the change started with far more sus strategy behind to boot.
Any news on this front should lead with something like "AMD cards are now just as prone to Nvidia ones where outside scalping applies, and it should be no surprise..." (they got 'good enough' while Nvidia effectively doubled down on what they've seen they can get away with)

Ultimately, even if it were a straight case of AMD and/or partners effectively playing foul, you really can't blame them coming from their position for dipping a toe in what Nvidia has had carte blanche up to it's neck in for far longer.

So if AMD does something you don't like, it's Nvidia's fault? It's a vendor, not a religion.

 

[EvilRebar]

The root issue is that fab space can be used for gaming GPUs at decent margins or AI parts at HUGE margins. So gaming GPUs get a bit of capacity instead of all the capacity that Nvidia and AMD can buy.

It's a new world, and nothing will ever match the value of the 1080Ti again.

 

[BogdanR]

And what is the walk in price of the 5070ti compared to the 9070xt in Canada and the US? Cause you are focused on the prices, which are kinda irrelevant to the article. The article is making it comparative - basically it's saying that the 9070xt should be 20% cheaper than the 70ti but it isn't. Which is absolutely 100% true in EU for example

Now I know you’re simply trolling for an answer… sorry, I’m not playing this game, I have better things to do.
Cheers!

 

[PaladinNH]

I'll likely regret the 5070's 12GB down the line. Even if the 9070 XT can be found for $660 (it's sold out in my area/Boston) and offer better raw performance, it's going to run 100W hotter and lack DLSS. I have yet to test KCD2, but Expedition 33 is only using 6GB at 4K/DLSS. I think AC: Shadows was using 8-10. But as I'm hearing that people are still using cards with 8-10GB and having no problem, I'm probably okay for most titles with 12GB over the next 1-2 years. My target for the time being is 4K/120Hz in single player/DLSSQ, so I'd love a (good) 5070 Ti @$750 for the extra 20-30% performance, but for now the 5070 @$550 seems to be the next best thing.

 

[EvilRebar]

I'll likely regret the 5070's 12GB down the line. Even if the 9070 XT can be found for $660 (it's sold out in my area/Boston) and offer better raw performance, it's going to run 100W hotter and lack DLSS. I have yet to test KCD2, but Expedition 33 is only using 6GB at 4K/DLSS. I think AC: Shadows was using 8-10. But as I'm hearing that people are still using cards with 8-10GB and having no problem, I'm probably okay for most titles with 12GB over the next 1-2 years. My target for the time being is 4K/120Hz in single player/DLSSQ, so I'd love a (good) 5070 Ti @$750 for the extra 20-30% performance, but for now the 5070 @$550 seems to be the next best thing.

You can always turn textures down from insane to high. You can't juice AMD cards with better RT or DLSS.

 

[Trunks0]

"A quick check of Newegg Canada shows the RTX 5070 Ti at CA$1,250 and the RTX 5070 at CA$820. The cheapest RX 9070 XT is CA$1,100, or a 12% discount versus the 5070 Ti but 34% more than the 5070. This mirrors, or even worsens, the situation in Germany."

No, it is not. I cannot believe you call yourself a journalist if you cannot even do a simple search at the two canadian retailers which are MemoryExpress and CanadaComputers.

The real market price is around 950 CAD, which is about 680 USD for the cheaper models. With everything happening with the tariffs here, it is not bad at all.

In the meantime, the cheapest 5070 is around 820 CAD because it is on sale.

Yeah... that was the worst part of the article, and HU video, for me as a Canadian. He used a US retailer's Canadian website for Canadian pricing... that was just ultra poorly researched. Not that the problem isn't still real... but that was so bad it makes me question the rest of the data.

 

[No Thank You]

Have we forgotten what MSRP stands for? Or at least what the S stands for? Unless the price is stipulated in the AIB contract they're free to set whatever price they want.

And as long as there's so many suckers willing to pay the inflated prices there's no reason at all for the AIBs to pay any attention to what the MSRP is. Why would you charge $500 for a product when it'll sell out at $750, $1000, or even $1500? This is exactly why people keep scalping the cards as well.

Have a little self control. Stop buying overpriced cards. If they can't sell at the inflated prices they'll drop the prices until the cards sell, or they'll have no sales until they do.