Sony fails to stop $7.9 billion lawsuit over PlayStation Store prices

[RudyBob]

I'm buying a Corvair and if that don't work out I will get a Wrangler and do a bunch of J turns at high speed.

 

[AMN3S1AC]

People also willingly fall for ponzi schemes, willingly hand over property to scammers, and willingly follow cult leaders. Does that mean those things should also be legal, in your eyes? If not, why?

These are situations where people do not get what was advertised....(investment returns, salvation from the cult)....but buying from Sony digital store is clear. I know the price and what I am getting. Also, these prices are easily known before someone makes a purchase, so, like all other consumers, do your research before you buy. That is why I now stay clear of Apple, Nintendo, and Sony, as I have no interest in being part of their community.

 

[AMN3S1AC]

The problem I see with this analogy is that, the drinks are made by third party's. Sony brand the store (PS Store) and make the special cups (PS5) but the coffee itself (third party developers) isn't made by Sony.

Overall I understand the argument that you can just go to another platform such as Xbox, Nintendo or the PC. But at the same time, I do think we need regulations that state companies cannot be the sole app store for their respective platforms.

Back in the old days, You could go to Argos, Game, Amazon, Tesco's, so many places sold games and competed on price. With the advent of single store platforms, you no longer get that competition and it only gets worse.
Access to your game hinges on said company keeping their servers on forever (hint, they won't) and you paid more for it even though it was a download and not physical media that needed to be made and shipped.
There's no longer a second hand market or even a way to give your game away to a friend.

There's far more downsides to these closed ecosystems to the consumer than their is upsides is what I'm getting at, there's definitely an argument to be made it's anti-consumer.

So, why choose to buy into a closed ecosystem?
Why do we need a lawsuit because of consumer ignorance. As a PC gamer primarily, I game on Linux (Steam OS) and Win10/11. I have access to multiple storefronts with great prices. Those who buy a PS know that this competition is not available, and in a strange way, its kind of why owning a PS is almost seen as a status symbol, like having a new iphone.

 

[holydiver]

Who is this clown who sues Sony? Don't get me wrong, I'm not a huge fan of large corporations. But is he going to sue Nintendo, Microsoft and Valve too? After all, they all have similar prices and commissions. What a clown attorney.

 

[Puiu]

Who is this clown who sues Sony? Don't get me wrong, I'm not a huge fan of large corporations. But is he going to sue Nintendo, Microsoft and Valve too? After all, they all have similar prices and commissions. What a clown attorney.

I think the bigger problem is the walled garden part of the system where you can't buy digital things without using Sony's store.

The lawsuit is going to fail, they have no case, but I can see Sony being forced by the EU to allow installs from outside the store akin to what they did with sideloading on iOS.

 

[Burty117]

So, why choose to buy into a closed ecosystem?
Why do we need a lawsuit because of consumer ignorance. As a PC gamer primarily, I game on Linux (Steam OS) and Win10/11. I have access to multiple storefronts with great prices. Those who buy a PS know that this competition is not available, and in a strange way, its kind of why owning a PS is almost seen as a status symbol, like having a new iphone.

Ok, I completely understand that viewpoint, however, imagine if Microsoft locked down Windows so only their app store would allow programs? And for some unknown reason, everything is more expensive on there than they are today.

Imagine if Valve properly locked down Steam OS and the device so you couldn't get into anything or install any other OS.

You're already using more open platforms and here's something to think about, why didn't Valve lock down the Steam Deck? Why hasn't Microsoft locked Windows down to just a single App store?

 

[AMN3S1AC]

Ok, I completely understand that viewpoint, however, imagine if Microsoft locked down Windows so only their app store would allow programs? And for some unknown reason, everything is more expensive on there than they are today.

Imagine if Valve properly locked down Steam OS and the device so you couldn't get into anything or install any other OS.

You're already using more open platforms and here's something to think about, why didn't Valve lock down the Steam Deck? Why hasn't Microsoft locked Windows down to just a single App store?

Where do we draw the line? Is it only tech companies, or do all companies everywhere have to sell all 3rd party products for the same price? Does a cafe have to sell bottles of Evian water for the same price as the local supermarket?

The thing about consumer choice, is that there will always be alternatives, because the vast majority of consumers are looking for value. Whenever a company gets so that it becomes a problem for its users, a new company will offer a fresh outlook.

Companies like Valve exist as the antithesis of Sony et al, but if Valve turned to the dark side, a new Valve would pop up....such has always been the case in every industry.

A lawsuit is not required to change Sony's habits, it is consumer power. Don't buy their walled off consoles, and they will soon change their tune. Further, Sony's recent business model has almost made PS their most valuable brand, and thus, along with Nintendo, rely on software sales to subsidise the big budget adventure exclusives that all Sony fans seem to rave about.

Also, if this happens, and they are forced to lower the 3rd party prices, watch as their first party titles receive a timely price hike. The consumer never wins unless they simply walk away.

 

[Burty117]

Where do we draw the line? Is it only tech companies, or do all companies everywhere have to sell all 3rd party products for the same price? Does a cafe have to sell bottles of Evian water for the same price as the local supermarket?

Before I read on, you've not understood what I've said or the reality of the situation. The entire point is to allow more competition so prices AREN'T the same. Right now, they are bloated on platforms that force you to buy from a single store.

The thing about consumer choice, is that there will always be alternatives, because the vast majority of consumers are looking for value. Whenever a company gets so that it becomes a problem for its users, a new company will offer a fresh outlook.

That's the thing, the alternatives to a games console is... another games console? With the exact same limitations?

Companies like Valve exist as the antithesis of Sony et al, but if Valve turned to the dark side, a new Valve would pop up....such has always been the case in every industry.

Based on the fact literally everyone who's tried to compete with Valve (Ubisoft, EA, Activision, CD Projekt Red, Epic Games as examples) have all fallen flat and failed miserably.

I highly doubt if Windows suddenly started forcing everyone to use their app store, or Valve locked down SteamOS, that suddenly competition would appear out of nowhere. We've been waiting for developers to take Linux seriously for 20 years now. It still hasn't happened.

A lawsuit is not required to change Sony's habits, it is consumer power. Don't buy their walled off consoles, and they will soon change their tune. Further, Sony's recent business model has almost made PS their most valuable brand, and thus, along with Nintendo, rely on software sales to subsidise the big budget adventure exclusives that all Sony fans seem to rave about.

Also, if this happens, and they are forced to lower the 3rd party prices, watch as their first party titles receive a timely price hike. The consumer never wins unless they simply walk away.

A lawsuit isn't required I agree, anti-consumer rights should be enforced and just like how Apple are being forced to open up iOS, so should the console manufacturers.

When I purchase a games console, I expect it to work for life, until the hardware physically fails. Yet we're much closer to this stuff being bricked by servers going offline.

As I mentioned in my post, things used to be much better for gaming and consoles in particular, multiple outlets sold games, they competed on price, those games still work today, PS1, PS2, Xbox, GameCube, Wii, GameBoy, DS, the list goes on, they all work still today and I was able to purchase the games from competing stores.

Today's hellscape is way worse, manufacturers forcing you to use a single store, then arbitrarily turning off online services so everything you've purchased (and paid over the odds for) simply vanishes.

At least forcing them to open up the software so third party stores are involved, you have a much higher chance of everything working or being able to store or backup your games (however these stores want to compete).

 

[AMN3S1AC]

Before I read on, you've not understood what I've said or the reality of the situation. The entire point is to allow more competition so prices AREN'T the same. Right now, they are bloated on platforms that force you to buy from a single store.

That's the thing, the alternatives to a games console is... another games console? With the exact same limitations?

Based on the fact literally everyone who's tried to compete with Valve (Ubisoft, EA, Activision, CD Projekt Red, Epic Games as examples) have all fallen flat and failed miserably.

I highly doubt if Windows suddenly started forcing everyone to use their app store, or Valve locked down SteamOS, that suddenly competition would appear out of nowhere. We've been waiting for developers to take Linux seriously for 20 years now. It still hasn't happened.

A lawsuit isn't required I agree, anti-consumer rights should be enforced and just like how Apple are being forced to open up iOS, so should the console manufacturers.

When I purchase a games console, I expect it to work for life, until the hardware physically fails. Yet we're much closer to this stuff being bricked by servers going offline.

As I mentioned in my post, things used to be much better for gaming and consoles in particular, multiple outlets sold games, they competed on price, those games still work today, PS1, PS2, Xbox, GameCube, Wii, GameBoy, DS, the list goes on, they all work still today and I was able to purchase the games from competing stores.

Today's hellscape is way worse, manufacturers forcing you to use a single store, then arbitrarily turning off online services so everything you've purchased (and paid over the odds for) simply vanishes.

At least forcing them to open up the software so third party stores are involved, you have a much higher chance of everything working or being able to store or backup your games (however these stores want to compete).

The alternatives to a game console would be pc gaming, where there is competition for prices, with multiple stores offering great prices all year round. If people choose to enter a walled garden that is on them.

The reason other store fronts are less popular than Steam is because Valve is doing it correctly. There is no desire for alternatives just now, but if Valve change their policies, then there will be a change in attitudes and the natural flow away from them will occur.

Anyone who buys a console knows exactly what they are buying into. You can't tell a store what to sell and how much to sell it for, it is their shop. All you can do is choose to shop elsewhere. As gamers, we are in a good position where you have many choices where you can spend your money.

 

[holydiver]

I think the bigger problem is the walled garden part of the system where you can't buy digital things without using Sony's store.

The lawsuit is going to fail, they have no case, but I can see Sony being forced by the EU to allow installs from outside the store akin to what they did with sideloading on iOS.

Nintendo and Valve does the same thing, can't install anything without the Nintendo store or without Steam. Clown show.

 

[Puiu]

Nintendo and Valve does the same thing, can't install anything without the Nintendo store or without Steam. Clown show.

And yet I still like what Valve is doing. It's also why I use GOG and other stores much more than Valve's.

Unlike Nintendo or Epic, I'm not forced to buy from Valve's digital store.

 

[3volv3d]

These aren't hidden costs, people know the price before they buy, and can easily compare to other platforms to see the differences. The percentage taken by Sony is up to them, if people don't like it, then don't buy a playstation.

I understand your point, however when a company as many are, are being douche bags, they need a smack and getting in line.
Costs for digital should be half what they are for physical yet they didn't just charge physical they upped prices.
I don't buy from Sony unless it's on sale and I want it digital to load faster.
But I still want to see something done about companies that rip people off.

 

[Puiu]

I understand your point, however when a company as many are, are being douche bags, they need a smack and getting in line.
Costs for digital should be half what they are for physical yet they didn't just charge physical they upped prices.
I don't buy from Sony unless it's on sale and I want it digital to load faster.
But I still want to see something done about companies that rip people off.

"Costs for digital should be half what they are for physical yet they didn't just charge physical they upped prices." - and how did you reach this figure? O_o

 

[McMurdeR]

Why can't they charge the prices they want? They are allowed to be more expensive, as is any other shop that sells third party products and services. We, as consumers, can decide where we go. People know, or should know, about pricing and availability of dlc etc before they buy a console. Why we feel the need to reward ignorance is beyond comprehension.

They can choose to price higher but they're not allowed to control prices, there's a difference. The challenge for Sony here is that they have to be able to show that the free market is dictating these prices, otherwise there might actually be difficult questions to answer. It gets complicated with regard to exclusives that are only available on their own store-front. This is one reason why Sony complained to various competition authorities about Microsoft's acquisition of Activision.

 

[bviktor]

"For the players"

Also love how you are obliged to waive your refunds right upon purchases. How's that even legal?