Testing Intel Whiskey Lake CPUs: Core i7-8565U Review

Julio Franco

TechSpot Editor
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kmo911

TS Booster
We gonna needing those RTX AMD RX inside these ROGs to get more FPS ingame better cooling and DOCS with cooling inside.
 

144hzGamer

TS Addict
I wonder why Intel doesnt release a 4c/8t chip clocked at 3,2ghz and 30w. It would still be very portable but wouldnt reach its power limit all the time like these chips. It sucks that the option is eithet ULV 15w chip or 8300h 4c/8t 3,9ghz 45w chip.
 

xxLCxx

TS Addict
Did you test it with all (current - as there's more to come) Spectre mitigations enabled? If not, that'd seem rather pointless... ;-)
 
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I wonder why Intel doesnt release a 4c/8t chip clocked at 3,2ghz and 30w. It would still be very portable but wouldnt reach its power limit all the time like these chips. It sucks that the option is eithet ULV 15w chip or 8300h 4c/8t 3,9ghz 45w chip.
Intel released those processors 3 quarters ago: Coffee Lake-U (28W)

Core i7-8559U 4C8T base 2.7 turbo 4.5
Core i5-8269U 4C8T b2.6 t4.2
Core i5-8259U 4C8T b2.3 t3.8
Core i3-8109U 2C4T b3.0 t3.6

And most importantly all have Intel's best IG: Iris Plus 655 with 128MB eDRAM, making the iGPU on par with AMD's integrated Vega 8 or so. I don't know why more laptop SIs don't use these chips. Probably because of 28W when 15W makes for a lighter cooler & laptop and most people are ignorant of GPUs anyway.

Currently the biggest customers of these chips are Intel themselves with the current 4x4" NUCs and Apple with the 13" MacBook Pro.
 

Dimitrios

TS Guru
I wonder why Intel doesnt release a 4c/8t chip clocked at 3,2ghz and 30w. It would still be very portable but wouldnt reach its power limit all the time like these chips. It sucks that the option is eithet ULV 15w chip or 8300h 4c/8t 3,9ghz 45w chip.
Intel released those processors 3 quarters ago: Coffee Lake-U (28W)

Core i7-8559U 4C8T base 2.7 turbo 4.5
Core i5-8269U 4C8T b2.6 t4.2
Core i5-8259U 4C8T b2.3 t3.8
Core i3-8109U 2C4T b3.0 t3.6

And most importantly all have Intel's best IG: Iris Plus 655 with 128MB eDRAM, making the iGPU on par with AMD's integrated Vega 8 or so. I don't know why more laptop SIs don't use these chips. Probably because of 28W when 15W makes for a lighter cooler & laptop and most people are ignorant of GPUs anyway.

Currently the biggest customers of these chips are Intel themselves with the current 4x4" NUCs and Apple with the 13" MacBook Pro.
Yeah but GPU drivers makes a big difference in performance.
 
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Yeah but GPU drivers makes a big difference in performance.
I agree, paper stats don't mean anything. I was referring to tests done on working hardware. Here's a benchmark which is appropriate for the hardware being compared, Sky Diver:

https://www.3dmark.com/compare/sd/5308916/sd/5367222

The Vega 8 is about 13% faster than the Iris Plus 655 when comparing only the Graphics tests, though on the Combined test the Intel APU is very slightly faster. IMO Sky Diver's Combined (CPU+GPU at the same time) tests seems to lean more heavily on the CPU than the typical gaming load so the overall FPS in games is probably comparable.
 
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MaikuTech

TS Evangelist
I'm sorry but someone explain to me why Intel is becoming retarded at naming their core architecture ?
"Whiskey Lake" ? Yeah makes me feel far less likely to buy it.
 
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GreenReaper

TS Member
I'm sorry but someone explain to me why Intel is becoming retarded at naming their core architecture ?
"Whiskey Lake" ? Yeah makes me feel far less likely to buy it.
I know, right? It's not like they were drunk when making it, but it doesn't sound good; more out-of-touch with the current generation, which has been turning away from alcohol.
 

Ryan Weiss

TS Rookie
The article mentions using Intel's Extreme Tuning Utility to "overclock" the i7-8565U processor, however, I've heard this processor is locked and not overclockable, and when I try to open the XTU on my Lenovo T490, it says it's incompatible with this system. Any ideas? Is there some workaround to overclock this processor?
 
The article mentions using Intel's Extreme Tuning Utility to "overclock" the i7-8565U processor, however, I've heard this processor is locked and not overclockable, and when I try to open the XTU on my Lenovo T490, it says it's incompatible with this system. Any ideas? Is there some workaround to overclock this processor?
XTU is not for overclocking in non-K parts. Instead it's used mostly for power management in thermally constrained systems like laptops. Watch any Jarrod's Tech videos and he almost always undervolts the laptops he's testing to enable higher performance.

I do this with laptops and NUCs as well for the same power control reasons as all these are thermally constrained. These chips in laptops/USFFs most often benefit from undervolting:

Any i5, i7, or i9 Kaby Lake or newer
Many/most? quad core i5s and i7s Sandy Bridge or newer
Any i5, i7, or i9 Haswell and newer when running 3D graphics on the iGPU

I have over a dozen systems with these specs and use cases and I undervolt all of them for a modest increase in performance. How does that work?

The cooler in all these cases is not good enough to keep the processor (and iGPU) running at top Turbo speeds, so the machine needs to clock these parts down to maintain temps under 100°C. They're still running above base clocks so they meet their specs but there is more performance to be had if you can generate less heat.

You do that by undervolting both the CPU and iGPU in XTU. In general a 0.1v undervolt can take a 22W job and turn it into a 16-17W job. This usually enables higher clocks on the CPU which is directly traceable to higher multicore performance. For the iGPU, undervolting both it and the CPU can shift 4-5W more performance that the CPU no longer needs over to the iGPU in a 28W chip. So the lower CPU power draw allows the iGPU to increase its power draw from 15W to 21W. This means somewhat higher framerates, every one of which is needed in a low performance iGPU.

It will also let a CPU run cooler and lower power in a non-thermally constrained system if you're interested in that. Eg: my desktop i5-8400 runs Handbrake h.265 jobs at 72W at the all-core turbo limit of 3.8GHz. You'll notice that's 7W above its official 65W limit. I unlocked that wattage limit in XTU but still wanted to run it cooler if possible. So I use a .07v undervolt and it runs the same job under 63W. 9W savings for nothing, it runs a few degrees cooler and, if my mobo didn't allow breaking the 65W limit, that detail would be moot as I'm now under the 65W spec.
 
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Ryan Weiss

TS Rookie
XTU is not for overclocking in non-K parts. Instead it's used mostly for power management in thermally constrained systems like laptops. Watch any Jarrod's Tech videos and he almost always undervolts the laptops he's testing to enable higher performance.

I do this with laptops and NUCs as well for the same power control reasons as all these are thermally constrained. These chips in laptops/USFFs most often benefit from undervolting:

Any i5, i7, or i9 Kaby Lake or newer
Many/most? quad core i5s and i7s Sandy Bridge or newer
Any i5, i7, or i9 Haswell and newer when running 3D graphics on the iGPU

I have over a dozen systems with these specs and use cases and I undervolt all of them for a modest increase in performance. How does that work?

The cooler in all these cases is not good enough to keep the processor (and iGPU) running at top Turbo speeds so the machine needs to clock these parts down to maintain temps under 100°C. They're still running above base clocks so they meet their specs but there is more performance to be had if you can generate less heat.

You do that by undervolting both the CPU and iGPU in XTU. In general a 0.1v undervolt can take a 22W job and turn it into a 16-17W job. This usually enables higher clocks on the CPU which is directly traceable to higher multicore performance. For the GPU, undervolting both it and the CPU can enable 4-5W more performance to the iGPU in a 28W chip (ie: changing from 15W to 21W power usage which means somewhat higher framerates, every one of which is needed in a low performance iGPU).

It will also let a CPU run cooler and lower power in a non-thermally constrained system if you're interested in that. Eg: my desktop i5-8400 runs Handbrake h.265 jobs at 72W at the all-core turbo limit of 3.8GHz. You'll notice that's 7W above its official 65W limit. I unlocked that wattage limit in XTU but still wanted to run it cooler if possible. So I use a .07W undervolt and it runs the same job under 63W. 9W savings for nothing, it runs a few degrees cooler and, if my mobo didn't allow breaking the 65W limit, that detail would be moot as I'm now under the 65W spec.
Thanks for the breakdown. I'm vaguely familiary with this concept, but I'm mostly wondering why XTU doesn't open for me on this Intel i7-8565U processor I have, saying system is unsupported :\. Suppose I'll reach out to their support and see if anything happens.
 
Thanks for the breakdown. I'm vaguely familiary with this concept, but I'm mostly wondering why XTU doesn't open for me on this Intel i7-8565U processor I have, saying system is unsupported :\. Suppose I'll reach out to their support and see if anything happens.
Ah I thought it was blocking you from overclocking but didn't realize it wasn't opening at all. Sorry, I have no idea why it isn't working. I've even used it on a MacBook Pro running Win10 and thought it might not work because it was Apple hardware, but it works the same there as on a Dell or a NUC.
 

Ryan Weiss

TS Rookie
Ah I thought it was blocking you from overclocking but didn't realize it wasn't opening at all. Sorry, I have no idea why it isn't working. I've even used it on a MacBook Pro running Win10 and thought it might not work because it was Apple hardware, but it works the same there as on a Dell or a NUC.
Heh, alright, well thanks. Will try and figure it out.
 

Macabre

TS Rookie
I'm vaguely familiary with this concept, but I'm mostly wondering why XTU doesn't open for me on this Intel i7-8565U processor I have, saying system is unsupported :\. Suppose I'll reach out to their support and see if anything happens.
Did you manage to solve it? I get the same error on Dell Inspiron 13 7380 (i7-8565U) with the latest XTU version (6.5.1.321) from May (quite after the Whiskey Lake release). I want to undervolt it because CPU fan works at 100% (loud as jet elevation, all the time). I realized that this is a common problem with Dell notebooks. I set it on Quiet Mode in Dell Power Manager, but with a barely noticeable difference in the noise.
 
I'm getting the same error on a Dell Latitude 7490 with a bog-standard i5-8250U, so it's not even the Whiskey Lake processor. Maybe something about the MoBo or BIOS is preventing it from installing on these machines.

This stinks, looks like we're out of luck on random newer machines as all my older Dell laptops work great with XTU.
 
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aerosplat

TS Rookie
I'm getting the same error on a Dell Latitude 7490 with a bog-standard i5-8250U, so it's not even the Whiskey Lake processor. Maybe something about the MoBo or BIOS is preventing it from installing on these machines.

This stinks, looks like we're out of luck on random newer machines as all my older Dell laptops work great with XTU.
I just purchased an HP Envy 13-aq0045cl and have found that the processor long term power limit (PL1) is being dynamically set on this machine. It starts out at 13.5W upon a fresh boot, then gradually drops to around 6W. At 6W, the processor power at idle is hovering around PL1 so that, if you do anything at all (run a browser, open MSWord, browse in Windows Explorer), the processor goes into its PL1 exceedance mode and the clock drops, frequently below 500MHz. If you've got music streaming, it will start stuttering horribly.

I too have tried Intel XTU and the installer reports that I've got an unsupported platform. Intel's own website lists the processors that will work with XTU and the i7-8565U isn't one of them. I would REALLY like to know the secret of getting Intel XTU to work with the i7-8565U!
 

aerosplat

TS Rookie
I finally got Intel XTU running on the HP Envy 13-aq0045cl, but I had to drop back a version from most current. After some testing, I've discovered that this HP Envy 13 will run just fine (perfectly acceptable core and package temperatures) if PL1 is forced to 15W (overriding the wandering PL1 enforced by "something"), but it's difficult to achieve a persistent 15W PL1 (Intel XTU settings will go into effect for a few seconds then something reverts PL1 back to its reduced value). When used for simple tasks (web browsing, audio/video streaming, Microsoft Office), this HP Envy likes to push PL1 down to around 6W and, as you can imagine, the i7-8565U goes way below its base speed of 1.8GHz with a 6W PL1, usually to less than 500MHz under CPU load. I've engaged with HP Support to attempt to talk to someone who can explain this PL1 behavior, but the support reps have been working hard to block this pursuit.

Has anyone seen this "descending PL1" behavior on any other platforms? If so, has anyone figured out how to stop it permanently?
 
If I come across a machine with this chip or another in a similar situation, I'll test out an older version of XTU. Did you find it on Intel's site? If not I probably have an older installer around here somewhere. I'll have access to the Dell again next week and I'll try that out.

FWIW, Intel's website docs state the 8565 has a configurable TDP-Down of 10W and only 800 MHz. It's possible HP is enforcing that in BIOS.
 

Makzimuz

TS Rookie
I finally got Intel XTU running on the HP Envy 13-aq0045cl, but I had to drop back a version from most current. After some testing, I've discovered that this HP Envy 13 will run just fine (perfectly acceptable core and package temperatures) if PL1 is forced to 15W (overriding the wandering PL1 enforced by "something"), but it's difficult to achieve a persistent 15W PL1 (Intel XTU settings will go into effect for a few seconds then something reverts PL1 back to its reduced value). When used for simple tasks (web browsing, audio/video streaming, Microsoft Office), this HP Envy likes to push PL1 down to around 6W and, as you can imagine, the i7-8565U goes way below its base speed of 1.8GHz with a 6W PL1, usually to less than 500MHz under CPU load. I've engaged with HP Support to attempt to talk to someone who can explain this PL1 behavior, but the support reps have been working hard to block this pursuit.

Has anyone seen this "descending PL1" behavior on any other platforms? If so, has anyone figured out how to stop it permanently?
XTU version 6.4.1.23 works with Lenovo S730 (i7 8565U), link https://www.techspot.com/drivers/driver/file/information/16919/
 

aerosplat

TS Rookie
I cracked it! The "Intel Dynamic Platform and Thermal Framework" driver provided by HP is the culprit. As you're likely aware, Intel provides a template of this driver to the various PC manufacturers and they, in turn, supply tuned versions with their hardware. It turns out that, for some odd reason, the HP-tuned version recommended for the Envy 13-aq0045cl pursues a steady-state (warmed up) TDP of only six to eight Watts unless the customer adds some forced convection cooling (blasts a fan directly on the laptop to aid in cooling). It's not that the machine gets too warm without HP's IDPFT values; I think it's just that HP's IDPTF tuning is a bit off for this machine.

Bottom line - It's possible to override HP's IDPFT values and force a 15W max TDP, required to get HP's advertised performance from this machine, without creating any problems for core or package temperatures. Problem solved!