Next-gen AMD APUs will have DDR5 support and Navi 2 graphics

mongeese

Posts: 425   +65
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In brief: An update to the Linux source code has confirmed that the next-generation of AMD Ryzen APUs, code-named Van Gogh, will have support for DDR5/LPDDR5 memory and will use Navi 2 integrated GPUs.

Although little is known about the Van Gogh architecture, we do know that it will use Zen 2 processor cores built on TSMC’s 7nm process, like current Ryzen 3000 offerings. It’s expected to be designed for low-power laptops but it could also make a desktop appearance.

Barring any surprises, Van Gogh will be the first series of major consumer processors to include support for DDR5 memory, and its laptop and mobile counterpart, LPDDR5. The JEDEC council, who ratify memory technology standards, only finalized the DDR5 specification in July.

DDR5 memory will be about twice as fast as DDR4 memory -- although SK Hynix has suggested that they’re working on 8400 MT/s sticks already, which are almost thrice the default speed of DDR4. Other benefits of DDR5 include quadrupling in density, a doubling in prefetch length, a slight reduction in minimum voltage, and the option to treat a single stick as being in a dual-channel configuration.

APUs are particularly sensitive to memory speed because the integrated GPUs doesn’t have access to dedicated VRAM, so the upgrade to DDR5 should yield a significant increase to graphics performance. That, and the benefits of Navi 2, should make these APUs excellent for casual gaming and other video tasks. The low-end GPU may become an endangered species as Van Gogh and its competitors, Intel's Tiger Lake and Alder Lake, become more prevalent.

Van Gogh’s predecessor, Renoir (a.k.a. Ryzen 4000), launched in January, so AMD might release this next generation APU at a similar time next year, though before that happens we should see how they do with Zen 3 and Big Navi in the next few weeks.

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Squid Surprise

Posts: 3,559   +2,451
Let’s hope there are some laptops that actually use it.... the 4000 series is in virtually none.... and despite superior performance, no high-end models...
 

Irata

Posts: 981   +1,445
TechSpot Elite
Um, Van Gogh is not Renoir‘s successor. It‘s a 4C max APU for premium thin and light laptops.

Cezanne will be Renoir‘s successor, featuring Zen 3 CPU cores but most likely still Vega graphics.

Note: Van Gogh looks a lot like a halved / shrunk XBox Series S SOC.
 
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Shadowboxer

Posts: 978   +579
Let’s hope there are some laptops that actually use it.... the 4000 series is in virtually none.... and despite superior performance, no high-end models...
Who cares? There’s probably lots of other components in a laptop that should be made by someone else. We could test all the RAM or SSDs OEMs use and probably find that they should be using a part from other manufacturers.

Let the fanboys argue this one. Personally I’d rather have a good laptop with an Intel cpu than a **** laptop with an AMD cpu.
 
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Squid Surprise

Posts: 3,559   +2,451
Who cares? There’s probably lots of other components in a laptop that should be made by someone else. We could test all the RAM or SSDs OEMs use and probably find that they should be using a part from other manufacturers.

Let the fanboys argue this one. Personally I’d rather have a good laptop with an Intel cpu than a **** laptop with an AMD cpu.
Well that’s the thing.... the AMD CPU is vastly superior to the Intel one... but because it isn’t in any laptops, we aren’t getting the best performance possible in one!
Wouldn’t you like to have a powerful gaming laptop that can ALSO do workstation tasks?
Looks like this CPU could make it possible - but only if laptop manufacturers decide to use it.
 

Shadowboxer

Posts: 978   +579
Well that’s the thing.... the AMD CPU is vastly superior to the Intel one... but because it isn’t in any laptops, we aren’t getting the best performance possible in one!
Wouldn’t you like to have a powerful gaming laptop that can ALSO do workstation tasks?
Looks like this CPU could make it possible - but only if laptop manufacturers decide to use it.
Well, it’s definitely superior, I’m not sure about vastly. The thing is for most users the ultimate performance isn’t the most important thing. I’ve just handed in a Ryzen laptop at work and received a new laptop that looks very similar but has Intel. I did this because I needed a laptop with 32GB of RAM and this model is the only one our supplier does with more than 16. And for me the new laptop performs vastly superior to my old one despite the weaker CPU.

Seriously only fanboys complain about this, it’s like kicking off because the manufacturer of your cars turbocharger isn’t the best tested.
 

Irata

Posts: 981   +1,445
TechSpot Elite
Well, it’s definitely superior, I’m not sure about vastly.
....
Seriously only fanboys complain about this, it’s like kicking off because the manufacturer of your cars turbocharger isn’t the best tested.
Did you read any of Techspot‘s Renoir reviews ?

As for your analogy, a better one would be car manufacturers putting inferior yet more expensive tires on your car because they received a nice kickback from the manufacturer, resulting in all around worse performance for a higher price.
 

Shadowboxer

Posts: 978   +579
Did you read any of Techspot‘s Renoir reviews ?

As for your analogy, a better one would be car manufacturers putting inferior yet more expensive tires on your car because they received a nice kickback from the manufacturer, resulting in all around worse performance for a higher price.
I did read it but I don’t care that much. I just needed a laptop to be able to run big Genesys reports. Yes it definitely would be better if it had an AMD CPU. But am I going to get my pitchfork out that my supplier only supplies laptops with >16GB of RAM made by Intel? No! In the same way that I’m not kicking off that my supplier doesn’t use the fastest available RAM or the best possible monitor.

I guess I’m not much of a laptop enthusiast. In fact I find my iPad is far better for my personal use than any laptop regardless of whether it has a CPU made by AMD or Intel.
 

Evernessince

Posts: 5,461   +6,133
Who cares? There’s probably lots of other components in a laptop that should be made by someone else. We could test all the RAM or SSDs OEMs use and probably find that they should be using a part from other manufacturers.
People who don't want the market to turn back into a monopoly, people who want more performance for less money, people who want more performance without a 20 minute battery life, people who want workstation performance in an ultra-light form factor, people who want good performance at a budget price, people who want insane professional performance in a laptop.

I don't think I've ever seen someone say "who cares about 60% extra performance at the same price". According to your own words, you use a laptop for work and AMD Ryzen mobile processors directly benefit that group of people. It's not even close, AMD's mobile processors are FAR better for professional work.

Most enthusiasts understand the importance of a competitive market. Even if you "don't care", you should at least acknowledge the importance of AMD being able to get into laptops. This isn't all about you.
 

Puiu

Posts: 4,139   +2,752
TechSpot Elite
Who cares? There’s probably lots of other components in a laptop that should be made by someone else. We could test all the RAM or SSDs OEMs use and probably find that they should be using a part from other manufacturers.

Let the fanboys argue this one. Personally I’d rather have a good laptop with an Intel cpu than a **** laptop with an AMD cpu.
That's a weird way of looking at things. So you don't want competition? You want Intel to continue buying off OEMs so they don't have to improve their products for years?

There is nobody who would say no to huge performance upgrades. (maybe hardcore "fanboys")
 

Squid Surprise

Posts: 3,559   +2,451
Well, it’s definitely superior, I’m not sure about vastly. The thing is for most users the ultimate performance isn’t the most important thing. I’ve just handed in a Ryzen laptop at work and received a new laptop that looks very similar but has Intel. I did this because I needed a laptop with 32GB of RAM and this model is the only one our supplier does with more than 16. And for me the new laptop performs vastly superior to my old one despite the weaker CPU.

Seriously only fanboys complain about this, it’s like kicking off because the manufacturer of your cars turbocharger isn’t the best tested.
That’s my point though! You needed a 32gb ram laptop - and your only choice was an Intel one.... wouldn’t it have been nice to have the choice of an amd laptop which would have been faster, cheaper and have better battery life?
 

daimag

Posts: 15   +2
DDR5 and DDR4 they both have same pin count. Will AMD release AM4 platform CPU that use Zen3 + DDR5 enabled IO die in 2021?
 

texasrattler

Posts: 1,013   +452
DDR5 and DDR4 they both have same pin count. Will AMD release AM4 platform CPU that use Zen3 + DDR5 enabled IO die in 2021?
I thought AMD said this was there final year for am4 socket and the change would happen in 2021? Granted all this was pre covid stuff so I dont know if this changed or will be.
 

Rayneofpayne

Posts: 248   +232
I thought AMD said this was there final year for am4 socket and the change would happen in 2021? Granted all this was pre covid stuff so I dont know if this changed or will be.
I thought AMD said this was there final year for am4 socket and the change would happen in 2021? Granted all this was pre covid stuff so I dont know if this changed or will be.
DDR5 and DDR4 they both have same pin count. Will AMD release AM4 platform CPU that use Zen3 + DDR5 enabled IO die in 2021?
It's too early for that, DDR5 would have to have been ready and on the market for consumers considering release/reveal is what a few days away, zen 3 is DDR4, 2021 in the fall they will release AM5 with DDR5, PCIe5, USB 4, The only DDR5 I currently know of are server, high end computing ECC modules that are expensive AF in custom solutions.
 
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MaxSmarties

Posts: 400   +219
Correct, the 4000 series is for laptops only and it seems AMD might skip the 4000 series for desktop to not cause confusion.
To not cause further confusion, you mean...
They did a mess with name scheming so far. I really hope zen 3 desktop will be 5000 serie
 

hahahanoobs

Posts: 3,080   +1,232
Well that’s the thing.... the AMD CPU is vastly superior to the Intel one... but because it isn’t in any laptops, we aren’t getting the best performance possible in one!
Wouldn’t you like to have a powerful gaming laptop that can ALSO do workstation tasks?
Looks like this CPU could make it possible - but only if laptop manufacturers decide to use it.
LMAO. Your marketing needs a lot of work.

I'd like a 200mph supercar that can go off road.

That's a niche market if you didn't get my point.

PS, if you read into WHY AMD isn't in more laptops, it will make sense why they aren't. Creating wacky scenarios in an attempt to get people to buy AMD is sad to watch.
 

Squid Surprise

Posts: 3,559   +2,451
LMAO. Your marketing needs a lot of work.

I'd like a 200mph supercar that can go off road.

That's a niche market if you didn't get my point.

PS, if you read into WHY AMD isn't in more laptops, it will make sense why they aren't. Creating wacky scenarios in an attempt to get people to buy AMD is sad to watch.
I’m not marketing anything.... just giving facts... if you have some evidence that Intel cpus outperform the 4000 series of AMD, please provide some.

As for the reasons AMD CPUs aren’t in many laptops - that’s because laptop makers need to optimize their builds to a specific cpu architecture- and Intel has been king for so many years, it’s hard to justify the gamble of supporting AMD... but now that AMD has proven that they are more than a match for Intel in the mobile space, it SHOULD change.

This has nothing to do with “niche markets” by the way. There’s no reason that an AMD powered laptop couldn’t be mainstream - they’re cheaper, more power efficient, and faster.... why wouldn’t you want one?
 
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hahahanoobs

Posts: 3,080   +1,232
I’m not marketing anything.... just giving facts... if you have some evidence that Intel cpus outperform the 4000 series of AMD, please provide some.

As for the reasons AMD CPUs aren’t in many laptops - that’s because laptop makers need to optimize their builds to a specific cpu architecture- and Intel has been king for so many years, it’s hard to justify the gamble of supporting AMD... but now that AMD has proven that they are more than a match for Intel in the mobile space, it SHOULD change.

This has nothing to do with “niche markets” by the way. There’s no reason that an AMD powered laptop couldn’t be mainstream - they’re cheaper, more power efficient, and faster.... why wouldn’t you want one?
You def didn't do any research as to why OEM's are hesitant to use AMD.
Nor have you acknowledged the 4000 series shortage AMD is experiencing.
Performance crowns don't decide who gets the most shelf space. Once you get away from that mindset, it'll start to make sense.
 
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Evernessince

Posts: 5,461   +6,133
You def didn't do any research as to why OEM's are hesitant to use AMD.
Nor have you acknowledged the 4000 series shortage AMD is experiencing.
Performance crowns don't decide who gets the most shelf space. Once you get away from that mindset, it'll start to make sense.
Could you please provide a source for that 4000 series claim. I have not heard of this yet.
 
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Evernessince

Posts: 5,461   +6,133
XMG said that in mid-August I believe. They said they had something like 1500 units backlogged because they couldn't get the 4000 series processors.
Ah, thanks for that. According to what I'm seeing, that's due to a threefold increase in renior sales over last quarter:


That's a pretty insane increase in sales.