AMD's 5000-series Zen 3 chip appears in database, could beat Intel's Core i9-10900K

midian182

Posts: 6,075   +50
Staff member
Highly anticipated: We’re just over a week away from the highly anticipated Zen 3 announcement. As is so often the case in the run-up to product unveilings, leaks are hitting the internet thick and fast. The latest has two big reveals: The CPUs will use the 5000-series moniker, rather than the expected 4000-series; and there’s a Ryzen 7 5800X that could beat Intel’s flagship Core i9-10900K.

The CPU was discovered on the Ashes of Singularity benchmark database by regular leaker Tum_Apisak. Like the Ryzen 3800X and Ryzen 7 3800 XT, the chip features 8-cores/16-threads, but there’s no clock speed reveals.

Tum_Apisak tweeted a results comparison between the Ryzen 7 5800X and Intel’s gaming king, the 10-core/20-thread Core i9-10900K. With both systems using an RTX 2080, AMD’s chip scores 5,800 at 4K ‘crazy’ settings, while Intel’s hits 5,900. In another run, the Ryzen processor reaches 5,900. It’s worth noting that the Ryzen system is using 32GB of RAM while the Intel setup has 16GB.

When looking solely at the framerates, the Ryzen 7 5800 XT offers around 14 percent better performance in the Medium and Heavy Batch runs and up to 22 percent in the normal batch run, beating Intel's offering by an average of 16 percent.

We’re expecting a number of upgrades in Zen 3, the most significant being the increase to instructions per clock (IPC). There’s also a clock speed boost and numerous other improvements that come from the new architecture.

Naming Vermeer the 5000 series will help avoid the confusion that came with Zen 2, which saw the desktop CPUs use the 3000 name while the mobile chips are called the 4000 series. It’s likely that both desktop and mobile Zen 3 processors will go with the 5000 moniker.

Being the internet, you can never 100 percent trust benchmark entries like these, but given the closeness to the Zen 3 announcement, they’re probably the real deal. Assuming this is the case, and despite Ashes of Singularity being heavily optimized toward AMD technology, Intel will be worried about team red stealing its gaming CPU crown.

AMD will take the wraps off the next generation of Ryzen processors at an event taking place on October 8 at 12 PM ET.

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Burty117

Posts: 3,869   +1,762
Why do companies struggle to name anything? What was wrong with calling the Zen2 laptop CPU's something in the 3000 range? Just add a different letter at the end or change a number, so 3800x meant 8 cores desktop, then 3870L , 70 for laptop variant and L for low power variant and a H for a high power variant?

Am I missing something?
 

nonamepew

Posts: 8   +41
Ashes benchmark is too much dependent on the hidden parameters like RAM frequency. Some other guy did the same benchmark on a 10900 which beat this leaked score of 5800X but with some crazy high RAM frequency (4400 mhz or something around that).

I will wait for the benchmarks to derive any conclusions. But I hope that it beats Intel to shut the mouths of Intel fanboys crying about those "3 MOAR FPS!!" on Intel systems.
 

mAdmAnDingo

Posts: 51   +44
If accurate, then this looks very very good for Zen3 and AMD. And considering all the supposed improvements to Zen3 that AMD has done, I would not be surprised if this did turn out to be accurate. All the changes AMD has made with Zen3 micro-architecture could very likely bring these kinds of improvements. Either way, I am quite excited for Zen3, and its release can't come soon enough (will be picking up an 4950X for work, keeping my 3700X as a dedicated gaming PC).

I do want Zen3 to bring very stiff competition to Intel's lineup (as they did with Zen2, and then some), it would be excellent for both AMD and Intel fans, AMD fans will have another stellar product with Zen3 (just as we had with Zen2), and it would lower 10th gen prices and force Intel to really raise their game with their 11th gen (a good thing for Intel fans).

Which in turn will force AMD to raise their game even further with Ryzen 6000/Zen4 (a good thing for AMD fans), wash rinse repeat. That is the competitive market that would be most beneficial to all of us as consumers. Both AMD and Intel one upping each other with every new release, constantly moving tech forward and lowering prices. A man can dream. A market that is never stagnant, and is always pushing forward with ever better tech at competitive prices. It is already happening somewhat, but I want it to intensify and become a permanent cycle.

But, I suspect Zen3 will be another excellent seller for AMD, and I have a feeling RDNA2 is also going to be an very competitive product. Which would be fantastic, we will have excellent competition on the CPU and GPU front this holiday season, I really would love AMD to bring as much competition to NVIDIA as they have to Intel. This could very well be AMDs most competitive lineup in years (and that is saying something, considering how great Zen2 was price/performance wise, and Zen2 is barely over 1 year old now and still selling very well).

Even RDNA1 was a very competitive price/performance GPU, but it was aimed at the mid/high end range of GPUs, whereas RDNA2 does have a firmly high end GPU in its lineup. So I am quite excited, it is a great time to be an enthusiast, and anyone who has been holding out on upgrading and waiting for Zen3 and/or RDNA2, looks to be getting some really great products. We will see once we have reviews come release of course, but I have a good feeling about them.

And it is quite crazy to think how competitive the CPU/GPU markets have become in just a few short years (since AMDs comeback in 2017 or so). No matter which product a person wants to purchase or which company company they support/prefer (AMD/Intel/Nvidia), prices are lower and performance is higher than ever before. I prefer AMD myself, that is just my own personal preference. But the market is definitely the most competitive it has been in years, and here is hoping it will only become even more so for us enthusiasts with AMDs upcoming slate of products. And if it isn't clear, I am for us, the enthusiasts. So I want every company to be on top form competing with each other for our hard earned money. I may prefer AMD, but I still recognize and understand the importance of competition in the market place, the last three years have proven exactly that.

And for anyone keen to try, 1usmus "CTR" all core OC+undervolting tool is out and is available for download. There is a guide that should be followed if one does wish to give it a shot.
 
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Burty117

Posts: 3,869   +1,762
But I hope that it beats Intel to shut the mouths of Intel fanboys crying about those "3 MOAR FPS!!" on Intel systems.
This still makes me laugh in the comments section to this day. I built a 3600 system for my GF's place and I currently have a 8700k overclocked to 5GHz at home under water and I gotta say... I notice absolutely no difference!
 

Nobina

Posts: 2,666   +2,293
This still makes me laugh in the comments section to this day. I built a 3600 system for my GF's place and I currently have a 8700k overclocked to 5GHz at home under water and I gotta say... I notice absolutely no difference!
I upgraded to R5 3600 from i5 4460 and the difference is definetely there but still not huge. Some people upgrade their high end CPUs every release which is so ridiculous.
 

veLa

Posts: 1,009   +549
AMD's naming schema is so frustrating.

Zen 1 is Ryzen 1000 series (good so far)
Zen+ is Ryzen 2000 series (uh)
Zen 2 is Ryzen 3000 series (no...)
Zen 3 is Ryzen 5000 series (what?)

So why could Zen+ just be Zen 2 and so forth. Oh, and don't even get me started on the mobile side of things.
 

zamroni111

Posts: 117   +50
Why do companies struggle to name anything? What was wrong with calling the Zen2 laptop CPU's something in the 3000 range? Just add a different letter at the end or change a number, so 3800x meant 8 cores desktop, then 3870L , 70 for laptop variant and L for low power variant and a H for a high power variant?

Am I missing something?
Because Zen+ laptop apu uses 3000 series naming
 

Lionvibez

Posts: 2,000   +1,321
Ashes benchmark is too much dependent on the hidden parameters like RAM frequency. Some other guy did the same benchmark on a 10900 which beat this leaked score of 5800X but with some crazy high RAM frequency (4400 mhz or something around that).

I will wait for the benchmarks to derive any conclusions. But I hope that it beats Intel to shut the mouths of Intel fanboys crying about those "3 MOAR FPS!!" on Intel systems.
True when the intel rig has 32GB of ram it performs much better.

Going to wait for more numbers this benchmark appears to be sensitive to the amount of ram and if its tuned.

I like the naming scheme since we are already using 5's for the 570/550 chipset so why not on the CPU.
 
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Puiu

Posts: 4,072   +2,622
AMD's naming schema is so frustrating.

Zen 1 is Ryzen 1000 series (good so far)
Zen+ is Ryzen 2000 series (uh)
Zen 2 is Ryzen 3000 series (no...)
Zen 3 is Ryzen 5000 series (what?)

So why could Zen+ just be Zen 2 and so forth. Oh, and don't even get me started on the mobile side of things.
it's still hellalalala better than what Intel is doing. :)

The average Joe doesn't know what Zen is so the numbering there doesn't really matter, that's more for us nerds and I like that they are skipping the 4000 series for desktop CPUs.
 

Irata

Posts: 870   +1,237
TechSpot Elite
I upgraded to R5 3600 from i5 4460 and the difference is definetely there but still not huge. Some people upgrade their high end CPUs every release which is so ridiculous.
Upgraded from one of the higher clocked 4T Trinity or Kaveri APU to a Ryzen 2700X and that was a huge difference, so well worth it. Not sure if I'll try to snag a 3900x when they can be had cheap or if I'll go for a 5000 series.

Either way, a GPU upgrade comes first (that was the original plan when building the system earlier this year) as the CPU isn't exactly slow, but I'm really looking forward to Zen 3's launch and the first reviews.
 

Aryassen

Posts: 82   +81
I am very eagerly waiting for the arrival of Zen 3, but took a pinch of salt (coffee tastes funny now...crap...aaaanyway).
Will wait for the independent (and transparent!) reviews before getting expectation up, but sure it looks promising. Just one more week to go! :)
 

Hardware Geek

Posts: 264   +250
I'm still hoping they release the renoir apu for enthusiasts instead of this oem crap, but the closer we get to zen 3, the less optimistic I am that we'll see the retail release they promised. Perhaps it will be released as a budget option after the zen 3 release. I'm hoping to build a renoir desktop to tide me over until the zen 4 release and then pick up a cheap zen 3 to upgrade. I rarely game anymore and really don't have a good excuse to buy anything right now, but the itch to build a new system is getting harder and harder not to scratch.
 

jpuroila

Posts: 234   +127
AMD's naming schema is so frustrating.

Zen 1 is Ryzen 1000 series (good so far)
Zen+ is Ryzen 2000 series (uh)
Zen 2 is Ryzen 3000 series (no...)
Zen 3 is Ryzen 5000 series (what?)

So why could Zen+ just be Zen 2 and so forth. Oh, and don't even get me started on the mobile side of things.
Because Zen+ isn't actually a different architecture, it's just Zen with minor tweaks to the cache and higher clocks. Better to call it Zen+ than pull Intel and sell the same architecture under 5 different names. The better naming scheme would've been to add 50 to Ryzen 1000-series names or something(so 2600>1650, 2700x>1850x(since it was the Zen+ flagship like 1800x was Zen flagship) and so on).
 

emmzo

Posts: 220   +156
Why not wait for reliable benchmarks? At this point is just wishful thinking and AMD wet dreams.
 

Lew Zealand

Posts: 1,591   +1,624
TechSpot Elite
Ashes of the Benchmark is not representative of PC gaming so this is useless. Show me Gears 5, SotTR, RDR2 and then we'll have something to talk about. After a decade of being behind in gaming, even with Zen 2 closing the gap to a hair, I won't believe AMD has overtaken Intel in gaming until I see Orange Bar afterimages from staring at Steve's graphs too long.
 

Adhmuz

Posts: 2,060   +854
Why do companies struggle to name anything? What was wrong with calling the Zen2 laptop CPU's something in the 3000 range? Just add a different letter at the end or change a number, so 3800x meant 8 cores desktop, then 3870L , 70 for laptop variant and L for low power variant and a H for a high power variant?

Am I missing something?
Do you not have your decoder disk? I thought everyone had one of those to decipher the numbering on Intel and AMD CPUs. I'll try to get one sent out to you ASAP to help with this number scheme malarky.
 

mrvco

Posts: 92   +82
Interesting, but not so relevant. I have a B550 mobo sitting here waiting for me to buy the CPU and RAM for my gaming PC refresh. Needless to say, the CPU won't be from Intel for this iteration, the only real decision is whether to go Zen2 now and upgrade to Zen3 later or wait and go straight for Zen3 (99% sure it will be the former).
 
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sreams

Posts: 53   +62
AMD's naming schema is so frustrating.

Zen 1 is Ryzen 1000 series (good so far)
Zen+ is Ryzen 2000 series (uh)
Zen 2 is Ryzen 3000 series (no...)
Zen 3 is Ryzen 5000 series (what?)

So why could Zen+ just be Zen 2 and so forth. Oh, and don't even get me started on the mobile side of things.
"Zen", "Zen+", Zen 2", etc. are internal names. They do not factor into the product names that the public sees. Everything was fine through the 3xxx series. But yes, the 5xxx series jump seems to have come from the poor choice AMD made in using 4xxx for mobile.
 

ET3D

Posts: 1,717   +363
AMD's naming schema is so frustrating.
Still miles better than Intel's.

I see that a few people have a problem with AMD's naming, and I'm not sure why. They tend to be simpler than most, and it's been shown in the past that actually naming anything in a technical manner just doesn't work well. (For example, Vega with its number of cores, with Vega 8 on Renoir being faster than Vega 11 on Picasso.)
 

veLa

Posts: 1,009   +549
it's still hellalalala better than what Intel is doing. :)

The average Joe doesn't know what Zen is so the numbering there doesn't really matter, that's more for us nerds and I like that they are skipping the 4000 series for desktop CPUs.
Is it really better though? The entire naming scheme is ripped off of Intel. Ryzen 3 vs Core i3, Ryzen 5 vs Core i5, Ryzen 7 vs Core i7, and Ryzen 9 vs Core i9. I'm not exactly sure if that's better. I know there's more to it than that, but it's the gist.

Like you said, we aren't average joes.

Because Zen+ isn't actually a different architecture, it's just Zen with minor tweaks to the cache and higher clocks. Better to call it Zen+ than pull Intel and sell the same architecture under 5 different names. The better naming scheme would've been to add 50 to Ryzen 1000-series names or something(so 2600>1650, 2700x>1850x(since it was the Zen+ flagship like 1800x was Zen flagship) and so on).
I've tried to come up with a better response for you, but all I can do is say, I know and understand that, and I still maintain that I would rather have Zen 2 not correspond to 3000. Even then, we have APUs with the 3000 series branding that are in fact Zen+ products, and 2000 series APUs that are actually Zen 1. So yeah, it's the lack of consistency that I find frustrating, and I've been an AMD guy since my first Athlon T-Bird!

At least I can be grateful that the 2700X didn't end up as the 1800XT, am I right?

"Zen", "Zen+", Zen 2", etc. are internal names. They do not factor into the product names that the public sees. Everything was fine through the 3xxx series. But yes, the 5xxx series jump seems to have come from the poor choice AMD made in using 4xxx for mobile.
And like the guy above you, I totally get that, but for the sake of simplicity and numbers that correspond logically, I'm still not a fan of the naming scheme that we've landed with.
 

DonquixoteIII

Posts: 6   +6
I will be waiting for October 8th's announcement to see what the roadmap for the Zen 3 Threadripper will look like. I fear bad news, but may be surprised. However, it should be noted that AMD has never mentioned HEDT and Desktop in the same sentence. And they have always said that that the October 8th announcement was about desktops. If there is no mention of Epyc or Threadripper CPUs it would not surprise me.

If only all CPU makers would see PCI/e through my crystal ball...